Mickey and Minnie's Runaway Railway confirmed

[Epcot_Imagineer]

The problem with all of these VQ's is that you need the guests to not be on the streets... If your two biggest rides have all of the guests on the streets, instead of in a queue line, then capacity is going to start being a real issue.

 

[peter11435]

He said 6-6:30, which is the usual suggestion for a good shot to get in. You're being unfair.

I know what he said. Getting there at 6-630 gives you absolutely no advantage over some one who gets their at 6:59. None. You need to be in the park when it opens, no earlier. Everyone in the park at 7am has equal opportunity regardless of arrival time. I’m not being unfair I’m being factual.

 

[SJN1279]

I’m excited to hear the ride’s theme song, because the initial statement was that it was going to be very catchy, and on the level of Disney’s best.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

I think I mentioned this in a Rise of the Resistance thread, but I can't explain how put off I'd be if Disney opens this ride with the Boarding Group system.
The intersection of circumstances at which Rise sits with regards to opening really doesn't apply to any other attraction. No matter how convenient the Boarding Group system seems to be for Rise, it's nowhere near necessary for Runaway Railway and we shouldn't be encouraging Disney to make a habit of using this system. The idea of using it here, at Ratatouille, and at Guardians (and, presumably then, TRON), as has already been hinted at on these boards, is tremendous and would completely change the WDW-going experience.

The equity that has already been chipped away at by My Disney Experience would suffer a devastating blow - think of having to get up at 6AM every day of your trip just for the chance to get on WDW's newest rides. How is that an appealing sentiment? This is without any indication yet of how long Boarding Groups will be enacted for Rise, and therefore no idea how long they would choose to enact Boarding Groups for any/every other new attraction.

I recall some poster(s?) saying back at opening that the system wouldn't even last this long, and yet here we are with no sign of when they will simply open the line to guests. At this point I can't imagine it will be soon, since they seem to be happy with the way it's working out over at Rise despite the ride's lack of reliability. Wasn't that at least part of the point? To be able to dump the line when the ride goes down while affecting a minimal amount of guests? If every new ride needs that then there's a greater issue at hand.

The bonus for Disney is that it gets guests out of a 10hr queue and back into the parks where they'll actually be spending money . . . which was also the point of Fastpass, but at least you didn't have to wake up before dawn every day to use it.

All this is said by someone who was able to get on Rise twice this week at DHS by waking up early for the virtual queue and was very, very pleased with the attraction. The system was nice enough and it did work, but if every new ride starts using this I shudder to think of what it will turn WDW into. It's fine as a unique exception to the rule, and Rise is exceptional enough - on many fronts - to warrant it. But let's not do Disney the favor of letting them think this could or should be the way they open every new major attraction. That would be such an ugly turn for the resort.

I'm all for Disney looking at ways to reduce the amount of time guests spend in line, but this ain't it. Let this be a one and done for Rise of the Resistance, and let's hope it's done with sooner rather than later.

I agree with ALL of this.

I still don’t understand why in the world they’d consider BGs for MMRR. Are they envisioning it being equally unready for prime time as ROTR, and needing it just because so many will be in the park because of rise??

Outside of them expecting it to be embarrassingly glitchy (is that the case??), I can’t imagine what would justify a BG over a FP at opening.

What am I missing?

 

[Goofyernmost]

So the 3 other times you rode 7DMT with no wait and not at rope drop, what magic times of the day / year were they?

They where when I was smart enough to seek it out while others were standing in the sun watching the 3 o'clock parade and other times during the night parade (when it existed) and now the castle projections. And yes, I still got to see the parade and/or the projections another day. The wonders of park hoppers. And to make matters worse, I rode Smugglers Run in September shortly after it opened at about 7:30 in the evening, while Fantasmic was being shown, and it took about 15 minutes to ride. I've seen Fantasmic also, different time and date. Just about every attraction has lighter times. During traditional mealtimes, parades, shows, etc. One just needs to know when they are and take the chance. It doesn't always work out, but most of the time it does.

 

[RobWDW1971]

I’m excited to hear the ride’s theme song, because the initial statement was that it was going to be very catchy, and on the level of Disney’s best.

For a minute, I thought I was on the ROTR thread and when you said catchy theme song all I could think of was:

 

[UNCgolf]

You don’t need to be in the park at 6. Just in before 7. And nobody is being forced even then. If you want to ride you need to do what it takes. Do you have any suggestions for a better system or just criticism?

This attitude of "You need to do what it takes" is the problem. That should never be the case for a ride Disney wants to be their headliner; there are a lot of people who are essentially blocked out from having a chance to ride it for various reasons.

Some sort of random lottery would probably be a better system. Something that doesn't require you to be in the park at 7 AM and furiously hoping you can get a boarding pass before they're all gone within a couple of minutes. I'd have to think more about the specifics.

The current system makes it easier for locals to ride than anyone who's there on vacation, which is not how it should work.

EDIT: Here's a simple tweak that would be significantly better -- distribute the boarding groups in waves. Distribute the first 50 at 7 AM, and then distribute the next 50 at 10-11 AM, and the remaining groups/backups at 2-3 PM depending on how things are going for the day.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Na'vi River Journey is underbuilt in basically every way. And I say that as someone who actually likes it.

I don't disagree that the ride is too short, but what's there isn't underbuilt from a layers of detail standpoint. I would look at something like Frozen Ever After as being underbuilt intra scene.

 

[larryz]

I'm no insider, but I do know a bit about developing software such as the VQ/BG system. It wouldn't surprise me if ROTR uses the VQ for the last time on March 3, then MMRR picks it up on March 4.

We'll be watching...

 

[peter11435]

This attitude of "You need to do what it takes" is the problem. That should never be the case for a ride Disney wants to be their headliner; there are a lot of people who are essentially blocked out from having a chance to ride it for various reasons.

Some sort of random lottery would probably be a better system. Something that doesn't require you to be in the park at 7 AM and furiously hoping you can get a boarding pass before they're all gone within a couple of minutes. I'd have to think more about the specifics.

The current system makes it easier for locals to ride than anyone who's there on vacation, which is not how it should work.

EDIT: Here's a simple tweak that would be significantly better -- distribute the boarding groups in waves. Distribute the first 50 at 7 AM, and then distribute the next 50 at 10-11 AM, and the remaining groups/backups at 2-3 PM depending on how things are going for the day.

What ever it takes is always the case with new headliner attractions. Remember the 4-6 hour waits for FOP. That excludes many people too. It’s actually a lot easier to get to the park before 7am one day while on vacation than it is to devote half a day To standing in line during your limited vacation.

 

[UNCgolf]

I don't disagree that the ride is too short, but what's there isn't underbuilt from a layers of detail standpoint. I would look at something like Frozen Ever After as being underbuilt intra scene.

That's fair -- the moment to moment detail is impressive, which is why I like it. It's just too short and has no context at all.

Also agree on Frozen Ever After; there's very little to that ride.

 

[RSoxNo1]

That's fair -- the moment to moment detail is impressive, which is why I like it. It's just too short and has no context at all.

Also agree on Frozen Ever After; there's very little to that ride.

I'd call them both C ticket rides for different reasons even though they generate D/E wait times.

 

[UNCgolf]

What ever it takes is always the case with new headliner attractions. Remember the 4-6 hour waits for FOP. That excludes many people too. It’s actually a lot easier to get to the park before 7am one day while on vacation than it is to devote half a day To standing in line during your limited vacation.

I agree on the incredibly long lines; that's not good either. Even though it randomly popped into my head not long ago, the boarding group waves now seems like a perfect solution to me. That fixes both issues, IMO, as well as giving Disney a little more leeway with the attraction's downtime. If the morning is especially slow, they could distribute less groups in the afternoon wave, or make them all backup groups, etc.

I'm sure there are problems with that idea that I haven't yet thought of, though.

 

[UNCgolf]

I know what he said. Getting there at 6-630 gives you absolutely no advantage over some one who gets their at 6:59. None. You need to be in the park when it opens, no earlier. Everyone in the park at 7am has equal opportunity regardless of arrival time. I’m not being unfair I’m being factual.

Also, I said 6-6:30 because I was thinking of it from the perspective of a Disney resort guest using Disney transportation. You'd probably need to be at a bus stop by 6 AM to ensure you can make it inside the park by 7 AM, considering you never know how long it's going to take for a bus to arrive.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

I agree with ALL of this.

I still don’t understand why in the world they’d consider BGs for MMRR. Are they envisioning it being equally unready for prime time as ROTR, and needing it just because so many will be in the park because of rise??

Outside of them expecting it to be embarrassingly glitchy (is that the case??), I can’t imagine what would justify a BG over a FP at opening.

What am I missing?

If I had to guess, it would either be for the function of A) Attempting to relieve Rise of a little bit of pressure, if they were to make you choose which Virtual Queue to enter, or B) For the function of getting guests out of whatever length queue they anticipate would form for Runaway Railway and back into the shops, restaurants, etc. where there's actually the potential to spend money.

Guests in line for rides aren't spending money - which was the original impetus for Fastpass. Never mind the fact that most guests use Fastpass as a means to get on more rides rather than spend more time parting with their dollars. Think of all the money I wouldn't have spent on food, drink, and gifts this Wednesday if I'd been stuck in a 5 hour line for Rise instead of floating around while we inch towards my Boarding Group.

This almost makes me wonder if that's what's driven the trend of shorter rides with lower capacity? You can design a ride that handles 3,000 people an hour, but then that's 3,000 more people that hour who aren't buying souvenirs. So if you design for lower capacity, you're pushing more people into the queue, which either self-regulates because guests think the line is too long, or it gets navigated with Fastpass and gives you that time back in the hopes that you find a store to browse with your extra time. Or a bar to hit up in the case of Epcot over the last 20 years.

But maybe my foil hat is too tight.

 

[larryz]

I know what he said. Getting there at 6-630 gives you absolutely no advantage over some one who gets their at 6:59. None. You need to be in the park when it opens, no earlier. Everyone in the park at 7am has equal opportunity regardless of arrival time. I’m not being unfair I’m being factual.

If you arrive at the park at 6:59, by bus or Skystopper, you will NOT be in the park at 7:00, when the BG switch goes on. 10 minutes later, you're out of luck for that day.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

If I had to guess, it would either be for the function of A) Attempting to relieve Rise of a little bit of pressure, if they were to make you choose which Virtual Queue to enter, or B) For the function of getting guests out of whatever length queue they anticipate would form for Runaway Railway and back into the shops, restaurants, etc. where there's actually the potential to spend money.

I do get this IF they have two VQs going at once... some say they’re not equipped right now to do this, so let’s all hold our breath for Disney IT if they add it.

I wonder how that setup would compare experience wise to a setup where they just opened MMRR with FP, switched over to FP for Rise, and added FP for MFSR simultaneously?? Maybe if ROTR gets a tad more reliable by March??

Or a scenario where they keep the VQ for ROTR, and simultaneously add FP for MMRR and MFSR in the same tier??

 

[peter11435]

If you arrive at the park at 6:59, by bus or Skystopper, you will NOT be in the park at 7:00, when the BG switch goes on. 10 minutes later, you're out of luck for that day.

Correct. Which is why I repeatedly stated “in the park” before 7.

 

[peter11435]

If I had to guess, it would either be for the function of A) Attempting to relieve Rise of a little bit of pressure, if they were to make you choose which Virtual Queue to enter, or B) For the function of getting guests out of whatever length queue they anticipate would form for Runaway Railway and back into the shops, restaurants, etc. where there's actually the potential to spend money.

Guests in line for rides aren't spending money - which was the original impetus for Fastpass. Never mind the fact that most guests use Fastpass as a means to get on more rides rather than spend more time parting with their dollars. Think of all the money I wouldn't have spent on food, drink, and gifts this Wednesday if I'd been stuck in a 5 hour line for Rise instead of floating around while we inch towards my Boarding Group.

This almost makes me wonder if that's what's driven the trend of shorter rides with lower capacity? You can design a ride that handles 3,000 people an hour, but then that's 3,000 more people that hour who aren't buying souvenirs. So if you design for lower capacity, you're pushing more people into the queue, which either self-regulates because guests think the line is too long, or it gets navigated with Fastpass and gives you that time back in the hopes that you find a store to browse with your extra time. Or a bar to hit up in the case of Epcot over the last 20 years.

But maybe my foil hat is too tight.

Your foil hat wouldn’t fit a mouse.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

Your foil hat wouldn’t fit a mouse.

We talking this size mouse, or this size mouse?

I don't tend to dabble in conspiracy theories, and I know that correlation does not equal causation, but this was the first time the thought occurred to me and I just wondered about it out loud. Hence the concern over the foil hat!