Lightning Lane Premier Pass

C33Mom

Well-Known Member
Some Disney math food for thought. With the way this doesn’t include repeats and also has you paying for LLs that you’d never need, how many of the heavy hitters can you cram into the 7 hour minimum VIP tour? Can you Disney math your way to the VIP tour actually being better value if you were considering this for multiple parks and have a large enough group? Hmm.
Edit - I must be very bothered with the way Premier Pass forces you to indirectly pay for attractions like Laugh Floor and Magic Carpets, that I’m mathing my way to a plaid.
As a fellow black belt in Disney Math, this is where I came out. If you want to stroll the parks aimlessly, take a lot of rest/shopping breaks, and ride everything with a LL (whether it even needs a LL), PP might make sense…but if you value your time and calculate “minute actually saved per dollar” or “thrills per dollar”, I think you come out way ahead on VIP tour, especially as a party of 8 or more. The one pass per ride *and* no park hopping makes this inferior to LLMP (even before adjusting for cost!) for people who want thrill rides, like to park hop, and know what they are doing.
It's safe to say that if a person looks at this and has to calculate things like "cost per ride" to determine its value, then they are not the target demographic of this pass….
This is a pass for a subset of people for whom "money is no object" when it comes to skipping lines without the hassle of pre-planning.
I don’t think it’s for someone who says money is no object (that’s VIP or C33), I think it’s for someone who says “I can afford $1000-3000 to make my day simpler, and I don’t really care if it’s much better than the product that costs 10% as much but only gets me 85% of the benefit with a little extra work.”
I think this is forgetting that there are people that could afford VIP, but choose not to because that sort of day/style doesn't appeal to them. It seems like it is trying to get those that can afford it but maybe did not want that, and this is more their style.
I was so excited to hear this product released because my husband does not want a plaid spending the day with our family but once I realized it only gets you on each ride once I lost interest—but it’s probably a much better product for people who actually want to do everything at a slow and unstructured pace.
The only thing is ILL did NOT incentivize them to build new, it incentivized them to replace so that they can charge money for a new ride without needing to hire staff to run the new and old ones.
I tentatively disagree. We’re seeing a big new building push because Disney knows folks like me will pay $25/person/ride to do the fun new thing for a year or two. It also probably helps sell after hours and holiday parties. I’ll fully disagree when these new D and E tickets come into existence.
The price point is not wildly different from after hours events at 3/4 of the parks. This is more of a mainstream kind of splurge product IMO.
I agree, it’s the kind of thing your average GF, Poly, or BCV guest can splurge on occasionally and perhaps the kind of thing a very wealthy person does every time without thinking about it, just in case they need it.
But then again no matter how you slice it I’d probably feel pretty dumb spending all that money and eliminating a night from my vacation to ride 7DMT, Tron and a bunch of rides I have at Disneyland that I visit 20+ times a year. I’d probably just end up buying the single use LL’s for 7DMT/ Tron and LL multi pass and call it a day.
I think you made a good economic argument for it, but as a fellow DLR person, I think you landed at the same place I did. If you’re savvy about LLMP and willing to rope drop, I’d rather spend the same amount of money on two days enjoying the best/unique rides instead of one day doing every ride. Also, if you’re a coaster person you might want to do LLSP for Cosmic Rewind on your extra day or use the park hop functionality of LLMP to visit DHS and do RnRC, or start in AK on Everest before booking a coaster elsewhere, etc.
 

freediverdude

Well-Known Member
I have a very rich friend (generational wealth rich) who stopped going to WDW when they started charging for what used to be FP. He didn't like being nickel and dimed.

The only hotel he ever stayed at on his trips was Grand Floridian and the go to dinner option was Victoria & Albert's. This was a family who spent a ton of money on trips to WDW.

I think you will find that the uptake for this product will be more people who aren't rich and can barely afford it than the people who could throw $100 bills on their way down Main Street, USA and not miss it.
Exactly what I was thinking. This won't be for the rich who don't care, this will be for the people who want to say they bought so and so at Disney and maxing out their credit cards to do it, the lifestylers. But I think even they are starting to realize they're being taken advantage of.
 

BrianLo

Well-Known Member
Ok so hear me out… if I’m coming to WDW on a “once in a lifetime” trip mayyyybe buying this for the MK day is worth it if you re going to stay at a Deluxe anyway? We re a family of four so that would be $1600 but if this means I can eliminate one hotel night now you can deduct $600- $800. Not to mention the couple hundred you’d save from not having to buy Tron and 7DMT single use LL’s. Now deduct 3 meals, snacks etc. You could come out spending only a few hundred bucks more. Of course all dependent on being able to eliminate one hotel night. Which would probably make sense and give me more time at Universal. I wouldn’t need it for AK. Wouldn’t need it for Epcot. I’d probably just buy single use LL’s for Cosmic Rewind. As a Disneyland MK, I definitely wouldn’t need it for DHS where I can only count three Must Do’s + Sci Fi Dine In.

For people who understand what they are doing (you), you really won’t come out ahead of just booking it yourself, availing yourself to early entry and the advanced LLMP window.

I see it as Disney essentially just tripling the fee for people who are overwhelmed and don’t want to figure it out. There’s already other line skip options that WDW offers, this is the expensive I don’t want to think option.
 

BrianLo

Well-Known Member
I haven’t really weighed in, but I don’t see this offering as some catastrophic shift. It’s priced exorbitantly because Disney needs the price to be a barrier. It isn’t a deal. It’s an exorbitant payment for convenience. A poor man’s VIP tour, or one that works better for small family groups. It’s meant for 1% of guests to engage in.

The nice thing is Disney still has options and I don’t think LLMP is suddenly going to be less viable. No one is leaving the standby pool for this offering, after all.

The fact that they are testing this with deluxe guests only, says to me they are actually worried they haven’t priced it high enough to be a complete deterrent to their crazy fan base.

If this becomes the only option to engage in rides without a 2 hour waits, then Disney has become Universal Japan. Aka over-attended and under capacity.
 

BrianLo

Well-Known Member
Not sure about DL but at WDW there has also been:
Pandora - opened 2017
Toy Story Land with Slinky - opened summer 2018
Guardians - opened 2022

I think guardians is perceived as a universe of energy replacement and Toy Story a backlot tour sub. But Pandora is unequivocally an expansion. Particularly since FOTLK was relocated and harmbe market/tiffins added. Plus the unused night show venue.

There’s also the cars show and 50% TSMM and Soaring bumps. Misadventure Falls and some of Disney Springs.

Attendance is still technically down from a decade ago, so I don’t think the parks are necessarily breaking at the seams either. Even if they needed to engage in a lot of fixing last decade.
 

nickys

Premium Member
I think guardians is perceived as a universe of energy replacement and Toy Story a backlot tour sub. But Pandora is unequivocally an expansion. Particularly since FOTLK was relocated and harmbe market/tiffins added. Plus the unused night show venue.

There’s also the cars show and 50% TSMM and Soaring bumps. Misadventure Falls and some of Disney Springs.

Attendance is still technically down from a decade ago, so I don’t think the parks are necessarily breaking at the seams either. Even if they needed to engage in a lot of fixing last decade.
I thought it was referring to new rides, not net gains.

Because MMRR is also a reskin, GE replaced Backlot & LMA…… Even Pandora replaced Camp MMBy that token the only true addition is Tron which technically was an MK expansion (the water retention pond got moved iirc).
 

BrianLo

Well-Known Member
Yes and no, I think the knowledge they can directly monetize a new ride is incentivizing them to do beyond big thunder and Disneyland Forward.

I do completely agree with you. We can see in their choice of rides. 6/8 of them I can foresee spending time being ILL/LLSP or becoming the new defacto LLSP. The secondary Cars one is probably going into LLMP with perhaps only the carousel not being a revenue driver.

Likewise at DCA all three are really ILL/LLSP candidates with the fourth Avengers one surely being added to the multipass.

The D23 announcement slate was unusually “perceptually” E ticket heavy and it’s exactly because the way their revenue functions it rewards those additions. But it also means the company isn’t blinking when thinking of dropping things like the rivers or muppets.

The only weird fan fave attraction this is probably doing favours for is Jungle Cruise.

I thought it was referring to new rides, not net gains.

Because MMRR is also a reskin

Maybe I’m misinterpreting Vegas, but they said MMRR at Disneyland, not DHS.
 

JD80

Well-Known Member
ILL hasn't been around enough to go through a full design and build cycle to prove any theories in any direction.

We do know for sure that ILL money goes in to ROI calculations for any attraction being built.
 

MickeyLuv'r

Well-Known Member
Idk that people were necessarily over the moon about the club level FP, however I think that was received differently because FP+ as a whole was free and this was just more of it (not a vastly superior product/experience). If memory serves, the club level extras allowed for 90 days vs the 60 days, but the real reason for purchase was it increased the prebooked to 6.
The paid FP program was also widely criticized.
 

Vegas Disney Fan

Well-Known Member
Not sure about DL but at WDW there has also been:
Pandora - opened 2017
Toy Story Land with Slinky - opened summer 2018
Guardians - opened 2022
Pandora and Slinky were before GE though, I should probably put Guardians in the new ride category, since it’s so vastly different (and better imho) from EEA, but I still think of it as a replacement.

When I say no new rides since GE in nearly a decade I’m also factoring in what’s in the construction pipeline, I don’t expect either US park to have anything new until probably 2027 or 2028 at the absolute earliest.

I hate LL but I hate the lack of construction even more, one new ride, per park, per decade is ridiculous.
 

nickys

Premium Member
Pandora and Slinky were before GE though, I should probably put Guardians in the new ride category, since it’s so vastly different (and better imho) from EEA, but I still think of it as a replacement.

When I say no new rides since GE in nearly a decade I’m also factoring in what’s in the construction pipeline, I don’t expect either US park to have anything new until probably 2027 or 2028 at the absolute earliest.

I hate LL but I hate the lack of construction even more, one new ride, per park, per decade is ridiculous.
Yes those rides opened before GE but they still opened within the last decade.
 

Disstevefan1

Well-Known Member
A 2 year waiting list means the hotel is underpriced. Disney wouldn't make that mistake
You are right. In reality right now, folks are now booking deluxe rooms to have the opportunity to purchase LLPP.

This is interesting. Let’s say the family of 4 from Denver books GF to be able to purchase LLPP.
Disney makes money on the room PLUS multiple days of LLPP for the family of 4.

Making money on top of money, and the LLPP money is 95 percent profit.
 

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