Lightning Lane Premier Pass

MrPromey

Well-Known Member
Honestly we are putting our universal trip off because of the 1 day Epic thing. We are only interested in going when we can go to Epicfor 2 days, because I honestly don't see how we're supposed to enjoy.That part can only one day right now.

Even then it's at best a five day trip? 4 for the parks and 1 for Volcano Bay.
If you really want two days, money's not a huge concern, and you don't want to wait, is there anything stopping you from buying two three-day packages back-to-back?

From how I read that, other ticket options will be made available closer to opening though availability may be a problem for when you want to go by then if enough people buy in during this first round of ticket offerings.
 

KrzyKtty

Well-Known Member
If you really want two days, money's not a huge concern, and you don't want to wait, is there anything stopping you from buying two three-day packages back-to-back?

From how I read that, other ticket options will be made available closer to opening though availability may be a problem for when you want to go by then if enough people buy in during this first round of ticket offerings.
Honestly, what was stopping me instead I didnt think of it 😁. And because I didn't think of it, we already booked a cruise lol.
 

Disstevefan1

Well-Known Member
The only thing is ILL did NOT incentivize them to build new, it incentivized them to replace so that they can charge money for a new ride without needing to hire staff to run the new and old ones.
IgerClownWhardhat.jpg
 

JMcMahonEsq

Well-Known Member
In my experience, Disney never makes ticket structure changes with an eye to benefit the people buying.

I have yet to see how this is any exception.

After the COVID break, they came back with Genie+ just different enough from FP+ they could pretend it wasn't just an un-bundled version of the old thing that was now being sold back at higher prices.

Some people apparently loved it, many thought it was a step back in regards to features.

Either way, according to @lentesta 's numbers, average usage was less than 3 LLs per purchase which would suggest the people now paying for it were unable to get the same degree of benefit, on average, than the free system that came before it.

Some people did but based on the statistics, the majority were getting a worse service for paying more money.

Now they've essentially morphed that back to something closer to FP+ by allowing pre-booking but only up to 7 days in advance for resort guest and 3 for people not staying on property - again, seeming to fall short of the older, free* service.

I know you know they didn't make this change because they wanted to get less money or wanted to benefit people more. By directly monetizing FP+ they've been able to get away with increasing base ticket prices while reducing what you get for them and then increasing the price of the previous FP+ benefit by multiples way higher than they'd have been able to get away with on the ticket price alone all while providing two separate products with less flexible features that a lot of guests seem to find more limiting than what came before.**

While it's sometimes possible to save money with à la carte options, unless you're willing to go for the rock-bottom minimum being offered (admittedly, this is sometimes enough for some but usually not for the majority) it's intended to drive people to spend more which is why businesses change to this model to begin with.

I mean, you may like that checked luggage is now separate with most airlines because maybe doing that has slowed ticket price increases (although realistically, probably not by much if at all) and the result of this change was a worse flying experience for everyone as carry on space became a problem that resulted in issues for just about everyone boarding in terms of time and hassle and now there are airlines charging for carry ons since the charging for checked has caused people to find ways of not checking bags and they aren't making the money with that trick they once were.

I guess if you're only flying for a day or are okay with layering five days of cloathing before boarding, you can get around this and still save money, but it's not a winable situation for most.

I can think of quite a few examples beyond Disney and flight where these practices don't seem to have benefited the majority of consumers. I can't think of many where businesses chagning this practice has worked out in favor for the majority but I'm open to being swayed if you've got some good examples.

Either way, to each their own, I suppose.

*Not free as in beer, of course.

**I really haven't heard much about the newest iteration but since it's basically rolled back to FP+ but gimped, it suggests they got enough direct guest feedback on the old program to make the change, even though I know you were a fan of that paid system as it was, yourself.
No for profit business makes changes to benefit anyone but their bottom line. Even if changes are made to increase customer satisfaction, that is only the side effect. The reason for the change is to 1) attract new customer; 2) retain customers that might be leaving; 3) Increase the spending of existing customers.

As to a la carte pricing, or budget pricing, I like both. I am fortunate to be in a financial position that while i am not hanging out at my private island, or owning my own plane, as a general rule when planning a Disney Trip, prices of things are not a consideration. That being said, I know that isn't the case for everyone. I would rather prices for entry/minimum experience be low enough such that more people can experience them, and then I can pay for upgrades/extras that i want. Same thing for flights or other services/commodities.

As to this particular change for WDW, its not going to effect, let alone benefit the majority of its guests. And its not intended to. Not every offering is going to be target or appreciated by every customers, certainly not with a business with such wide ranges of customers as WDW. Nor honestly unless buiness is going really bad would I expect many changes to work out in favor of the majority. A change is being made because there is money to be made from it, or there is money being lost without it. If WDW is making changes that are effecting its majority of customers, its either to raise costs (which most would argue doesn't favor customers) or it means they are losing the majority of their customers, and message board ancedotes to the contrary, park attendance and WDW revenue doesn't seem to point to their being in jeoparty of losing there majority customer base.
 

MrPromey

Well-Known Member
So did Six flags, Carowinds, and Universal. So did most of the economic society. Everything's about nickel and dimming, and capitalism runs on a economic caste. I'm just pointing out that feelings and nostalgia aside, Disney is a Corporation like any other.

If Disney was still running their park like they did 15 years ago in light of current economic conditions and competition, they would be loosing enough potential profit where their shareholders could take them to task.
I don't know what changed with Six Flags and Carowinds but a trip to Universal Florida today seems pretty much like it did pre-2020 except with the regular price increases there have always been and Velosicoaster being added, Vilancon taking over Shrek 4D and Kidzone being reworked to Dreamworks unless I'm missing something?

I don't stay on property there a whole lot so maybe something with the resorts changed that I missed?
 

Jrb1979

Well-Known Member
I don't know what changed with Six Flags and Carowinds but a trip to Universal Florida today seems pretty much like it did pre-2020 except with the regular price increases there have always been and Velosicoaster being added, Vilancon taking over Shrek 4D and Kidzone being reworked to Dreamworks unless I'm missing something?

I don't stay on property there a whole lot so maybe something with the resorts changed that I missed?
What they are saying is all parks have a system similar to Universal's express pass. Disney is just the last to do it.

As much people hate it, Disney really isn't that much different than most other parks now in terms of operations.
 

KrzyKtty

Well-Known Member
I don't know what changed with Six Flags and Carowinds but a trip to Universal Florida today seems pretty much like it did pre-2020 except with the regular price increases there have always been and Velosicoaster being added, Vilancon taking over Shrek 4D and Kidzone being reworked to Dreamworks unless I'm missing something?

I don't stay on property there a whole lot so maybe something with the resorts changed that I missed?
I was more talking about fifteen years ago rather than five years ago. I agree not much has changed over the last five or so.
 

Vegas Disney Fan

Well-Known Member
The only thing is ILL did NOT incentivize them to build new, it incentivized them to replace so that they can charge money for a new ride without needing to hire staff to run the new and old ones.
Yes and no, I think the knowledge they can directly monetize a new ride is incentivizing them to do beyond big thunder and Disneyland Forward.

With the exception of Tron and Ratatouille, and MMRR at DL, we haven’t gotten anything new stateside since Galaxy’s Egde, nearly a decade of reskins and updates. Suddenly they’re announcing entire lands and expansions, I think (hope) being able to show their stockholders that spending a half billion dollars on a ride can directly results in $250,000 a day in ILL income (10,000 sold at $25) will open the floodgates, at least encourage them to open a new ride in every park every half decade since that would be the break even point. Honestly I’d be fine with that scenario, a new ride being ILL for a few years and then going into free rotation when the next ride opens and becomes the next ILL wouldn’t bother me one bit. Disney has been stagnant for far too long, they need an incentive to build again.

Maybe the optimist in me is just grasping for any positive outcome because everything about Disney has been negative since basically 2019 and my inner pixie duster can’t take it anymore.
 
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MrPromey

Well-Known Member
What they are saying is all parks have a system similar to Universal's express pass. Disney is just the last to do it.

As much people hate it, Disney really isn't that much different than most other parks now in terms of operations.
Except Disney's is completely different in that they have a commonly overloaded lower tier that negatively impacts what was at one time just called the "line" and they're sticking this option on top of that with no return windows, essentially putting no guardrails on how people use it other than that they can only do it once per attraction.

Or to put it another way, most of the time, Unviersal's line wait times for most attractions are reasonably low, even with Universal Express.

Disney's wait times on the current system that's supposedly better because it is more managed is often not able to provide reasonable wait times for the "standby" line due to there not being enough popular attraction capacity to handle both the standby and number of people buying into G+/multipass and now they are adding an unmanaged teir with no return times, no buffer period between uses and guaranteed access to every attraction which ensures MUCH higher usage from that group.

If only a very small handful of people decide to do this, it might not be noticeable but in this "test" rollout, they're making it potentially available to tens of thousands of guests, daily. If any decent number of them decides to pony up, how are we expecting that to impact the current situation?

It's not quite the same thing.
 
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MrPromey

Well-Known Member
I was more talking about fifteen years ago rather than five years ago. I agree not much has changed over the last five or so.
Apologizes.

Since the person you were responding to, was specifically talking about the effects of changes over the last five years to diminish the Disney experience and monetize so much in such a short window of time, I thought that is what your response to them was related to.
 

KrzyKtty

Well-Known Member
Apologizes.

Since the person you were responding to, was specifically talking about the effects of changes over the last five years to diminish the Disney experience and monetize so much in such a short window of time, I thought that is what your response to them was related to.
Oh I get it. I was more responding to their last sentence where they reference ten to fifteen.
 

Vclguy90

Well-Known Member
I often hear people say "other parks have been charging for line skipping for a while and now Disney is finally due." Eh, I would say Disney created and pioneered the system of line skipping. Others, profited off their adopted system and now Disney wants a piece of the pie. The noun for that is "sellout."
 

Jrb1979

Well-Known Member
I often hear people say "other parks have been charging for line skipping for a while and now Disney is finally due." Eh, I would say Disney created and pioneered the system of line skipping. Others, profited off their adopted system and now Disney wants a piece of the pie. The noun for that is "sellout."
There system has never been as effective as other parks. Too many people have it and not enough capacity for it too work.
 

roj2323

Well-Known Member
So they took the things that were "the Disney Difference" and monetized them. A this rate I full expect them to start charging bus and Monorail fare. Disney 20 years ago is not the Disney of today and if they keep going the direction they are, I think we will see the company struggling in a real way within the next decade.
 

mickEblu

Well-Known Member
Ok so hear me out… if I’m coming to WDW on a “once in a lifetime” trip mayyyybe buying this for the MK day is worth it if you re going to stay at a Deluxe anyway? We re a family of four so that would be $1600 but if this means I can eliminate one hotel night now you can deduct $600- $800. Not to mention the couple hundred you’d save from not having to buy Tron and 7DMT single use LL’s. Now deduct 3 meals, snacks etc. You could come out spending only a few hundred bucks more. Of course all dependent on being able to eliminate one hotel night. Which would probably make sense and give me more time at Universal. I wouldn’t need it for AK. Wouldn’t need it for Epcot. I’d probably just buy single use LL’s for Cosmic Rewind. As a Disneyland MK, I definitely wouldn’t need it for DHS where I can only count three Must Do’s + Sci Fi Dine In.
 

Disgruntled Walt

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
No
Ok so hear me out… if I’m coming to WDW on a “once in a lifetime” trip mayyyybe buying this for the MK day is worth it if you re going to stay at a Deluxe anyway? We re a family of four so that would be $1600 but if this means I can eliminate one hotel night now you can deduct $500-$800. Not to mention the couple hundred you’d save from not having to buy Tron and 7DMT single use LL’s. Now deduct 3 meals, snacks etc. You could come out spending only a few hundred bucks more. Of course all dependent on being able to eliminate one hotel night. Which would probably make sense and give me more time at Universal. I wouukdnt need it for AK. Wouldn’t need it for Epcot. I’d probably just buy single use LL’s for Cosmic Rewind. As a Disneyland MK, I definitely wouldn’t need it for DHS where I can only count three Must Do’s + Sci Fi Dine In.
Yeah, I could see what you're saying. But dang, that's a lot of money.
 

mickEblu

Well-Known Member
Yeah, I could see what you're saying. But dang, that's a lot of money.

But then again no matter how you slice it I’d probably feel pretty dumb spending all that money and eliminating a night from my vacation to ride 7DMT, Tron and a bunch of rides I have at Disneyland that I visit 20+ times a year. I’d probably just end up buying the single use LL’s for 7DMT/ Tron and LL multi pass and call it a day.
 

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