Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I'll bet you that's not close to the only reason. They had SO MANY complaints every day about Genie. You can say all you want about how you could get this or that, but the reality is most didn't have 25+ times of experience using it. There were more than a few people who didn't get more than one thing really worth it out of Genie (worth it meaning like sure, I could get Nemo seating or Dino, but who cares, it's like a 5 minute wait anyways). Go ahead and bash away at people for not doing research or not using it correctly, the reality is most people didn't use it to maximize everything, and they let the kids working guest services know all about it. A LOT. They made the 3 pass system specifically to ensure people A.) Knew the minimum they were getting and B.) made sure they got three they would at least want.

Realizing of course that their target for this are most assuredly NOT people who hang out in parks all the time.

I mean…does that have to even be said out loud? It’s not your playground…it’s their bank

 

[JIMMYEDDIE]

I'll bet you that's not close to the only reason. They had SO MANY complaints every day about Genie. You can say all you want about how you could get this or that, but the reality is most didn't have 25+ times of experience using it. There were more than a few people who didn't get more than one thing really worth it out of Genie (worth it meaning like sure, I could get Nemo seating or Dino, but who cares, it's like a 5 minute wait anyways). Go ahead and bash away at people for not doing research or not using it correctly, the reality is most people didn't use it to maximize everything, and they let the kids working guest services know all about it. A LOT. They made the 3 pass system specifically to ensure people A.) Knew the minimum they were getting and B.) made sure they got three they would at least want.

i never bashed people about research........Genie+ was VERY simple........

How is this so complicated (and what they should have done)

1) pre book ur first ride 7 days out for length of stay
*clear advantage for resort guests, along w ILL selections (could have done deluxe only to incentivize those rooms sales) and i would have added a VQ selection for deluxe guests only, making this an awesome on site perk)
*yielding up to 4 pre selected top tier rides with the ability to get other Top tier rides after using ur first or waiting for 120 min rule if you toured the parks at any other time than rope drop

2) book next ride every 2 hours and get to choose from almost the entire ride selection at every park (because inventory was not sucked up by pre bookings)

helps sell rooms while preserving inventory, spontaneity while eliminating 7am

what is the flaw in this?

 

[JIMMYEDDIE]

We'll agree to disagree. I'm not engaging your one-man crusade in this thread.

fair enough

 

[Dranth]

Dude....as long as you know/knew to book at 7am (and now would be pre book ur first ride only eliminating 7am) and then book 2 hours later (from the pool, from the golf course, from ur bed, from the park, from ANYWHERE) then Gennie+ was 1,000x better


thats not too hard to get

What you are failing to acknowledge is that most people are happier with a "worse" system as they don't care about potential use, only what fits their needs best. Throw in that G+ got to eat all the hate from being the first paid system and here we are.

Mathematically, the new system is the same for power users that rope drop and worse for everyone else and we have years of Thrill Data historical sell out times to prove it. That could easily change as Disney irons out kinks in the new system and makes adjustments but for some groups yes, it will always be worse.

All that aside, if having three preselects is more valuable because it prevents concern or anxiety then it doesn't matter that you may have been able to get more with a different system (quality and quantity wise). Peace of mind is what is being sold with this new system, not that it is better for getting more short lines.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Peace of mind is what is being sold with this new system, not that it is better for getting more short lines.

I think that is what has been pitched for all of the systems Disney has had. They hav never been about skipping "all" lines, it's not an Express Pass, it is about letting users pick a few longer lines to skip but standby would still be bulk of what they use.

Power users have been able to leverage the systems to get more out of it (and I would say G+ enabled this over use the most) but they are the exception to the rules of what Disney is aiming for. And letting people have 3 set ahead of time better enables this "peace of mind" for majority of users

 

[JIMMYEDDIE]

What you are failing to acknowledge is that most people are happier with a "worse" system as they don't care about potential use, only what fits their needs best. Throw in that G+ got to eat all the hate from being the first paid system and here we are.

Mathematically, the new system is the same for power users that rope drop and worse for everyone else and we have years of Thrill Data historical sell out times to prove it. That could easily change as Disney irons out kinks in the new system and makes adjustments but for some groups yes, it will always be worse.

All that aside, if having three preselects is more valuable because it prevents concern or anxiety then it doesn't matter that you may have been able to get more with a different system (quality and quantity wise). Peace of mind is what is being sold with this new system, not that it is better for getting more short lines.

Well paying for an inferior product makes no sense to me and i truely believe that once people use this they will agree

i am willing to put $ on it that this gets changed before November

 

[JIMMYEDDIE]

What you are failing to acknowledge is that most people are happier with a "worse" system as they don't care about potential use, only what fits their needs best. Throw in that G+ got to eat all the hate from being the first paid system and here we are.

Mathematically, the new system is the same for power users that rope drop and worse for everyone else and we have years of Thrill Data historical sell out times to prove it. That could easily change as Disney irons out kinks in the new system and makes adjustments but for some groups yes, it will always be worse.

All that aside, if having three preselects is more valuable because it prevents concern or anxiety then it doesn't matter that you may have been able to get more with a different system (quality and quantity wise). Peace of mind is what is being sold with this new system, not that it is better for getting more short lines.

So toss out all common sense for a false sense of comfort? im not buying it

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I think that is what has been pitched for all of the systems Disney has had. They hav never been about skipping "all" lines, it's not an Express Pass, it is about letting users pick a few longer lines to skip but standby would still be bulk of what they use.

Power users have been able to leverage the systems to get more out of it (and I would say G+ enabled this over use the most) but they are the exception to the rules of what Disney is aiming for. And letting people have 3 set ahead of time better enables this "peace of mind" for majority of users

None of these systems have ever been about “maximizing use”

It’s a silly idea to even float.

It was always about reducing time in queues so you’re in a better mood and SPEND more.

That used to be of mutual benefit…much less so as time goes on

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Well paying for an inferior product makes no sense to me and i truely believe that once people use this they will agree

i am willing to put $ on it that this gets changed before November

No way in hell…

And you’re supposed to pay for $500 lunches and merch…not cost account your ride pass each day. They staff and open the parks in the morning for the former…not the latter

 

[Dranth]

Again you are not comparing apples to apples here. LLMP availability at 4pm is for people who already have 2 better LLs booked between 4pm and park close, this is picking up a 3rd one.

Just want to point out that this isn't entirely true either. Anyone who couldn't schedule before 4pm because good times were gone or don't show up until later could very well be stuck with worse options they can't change to what they want due to restrictions like the tiers.

That didn't happen under G+ which is one reason I don't like the new one as much.

They’ll miss out like they did with Genie+. Rides with drops like Tiana, Slinky, and Remy were absolutely not available easily with Genie either. I’m not buying into the revisionist history of Genie+. No line skip system has been kind to the guest who has not learned how to manipulate it.

Small push back on some of this. Most days you could still get SDD, it just may have a late time.

Just for a quick example, looking at the last Wednesday of July 2023 vs. 2024, SDD lasted until 11:29AM last year. Today it was gone at 8:02 AM. That means under G+ you could still get it for your second pick 2 hours after park opened even if you hadn't been to the park yet vs. new system where it was gone before the park even opened.

I know we don't have a lot of data on the new one yet and I am sure Disney is tweaking things but so far, that discrepancy has been pretty consistent for most of the T1 rides. The T2 ones are far worse because now you have to pick some up front vs. before were only people who wanted them grabbed them, when they wanted them.

Remy was more of a choice. It was easy to get, you just weren't going to get it and FEA if you waited till 2 hours post open on most days. If you went early you could get both no problem outside of the busiest days.

Finally, Tiana didn't exist under G+ but Splash never really ran out in my experience though I do tend to go in the cooler months so maybe it did during the summer.

 

[Splash4eva]

I think that is what has been pitched for all of the systems Disney has had. They hav never been about skipping "all" lines, it's not an Express Pass, it is about letting users pick a few longer lines to skip but standby would still be bulk of what they use.

Power users have been able to leverage the systems to get more out of it (and I would say G+ enabled this over use the most) but they are the exception to the rules of what Disney is aiming for. And letting people have 3 set ahead of time better enables this "peace of mind" for majority of users

I want to compare this logic and reasoning to those who would say i wanna buy the dining plan even if its more expensive so i dont have to worry when i go on vacation. People would rather 3 lesser rides and a worse system than what we had…. Dammmm Disney must love these customers they have lining up

 

[Disstevefan1]

to try and sell hotel rooms but it will 100% backfire because it actually PENALIZES resort guests who dont rope drop, which is 90% of resort guests.......

you will see...this wont last 3 months

Disney does not problem with simply changing rules at a drop of a hat.

The will be tweaking this over and over and the guest experience will suffer not only by changes that do not help but just the changes that happen on the fly that confuses folks.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I want to compare this logic and reasoning to those who would say i wanna buy the dining plan even if its more expensive so i dont have to worry when i go on vacation. People would rather 3 lesser rides and a worse system than what we had…. Dammmm Disney must love these customers they have lining up

Probably the most cogent take here today

 

[DisneyHead123]

I want to compare this logic and reasoning to those who would say i wanna buy the dining plan even if its more expensive so i dont have to worry when i go on vacation. People would rather 3 lesser rides and a worse system than what we had…. Dammmm Disney must love these customers they have lining up

The dining plan I didn't quite understand, unless you wanted to gift it to someone.

This, however, does make more sense for large groups who need very specific rides at very specific times. The odds of getting the exact ride you wanted at the exact time you wanted, during peak park hours, were pretty slim with the old system.

 

[Dranth]

Well paying for an inferior product makes no sense to me and i truely believe that once people use this they will agree

i am willing to put $ on it that this gets changed before November

I agree, it is worse. It is the worst system they have ever had for the way I like to vacation, but it is what they are offering currently. All of us can either make the best of it and use it, go and don't use it, or not go at all. Personally, I will go and try it and if it is great, wonderful, if not I will be politely letting them know how much worse it is and I hope everyone else who feels the same does as well. That is how things change.

As for changes, I doubt they will make too many outward changes by November as I am sure they want a good chunk of data to pore over before doing anything on that front. I do think we will see them play with overall capacity, when it is released, how much is reserved for day of, etc. Mainly backend updates.

 

[JIMMYEDDIE]

Disney does not problem with simply changing rules at a drop of a hat.

The will be tweaking this over and over and the guest experience will suffer not only by changes that do not help but just the changes that happen on the fly that confuses folks.

My point exactly.

Why they did this version knowing that FP+ tiering was universally hated and now throw in it costs money and there are fewer rides to choose from and they thought this would work?

How do they keep getting it wrong.

Genie + only lasted 2 1/2 years.

MDE was over $1b project and was scraped well before its intended life cycle.

This is the worst of them all.

Disney,
Please hire more informed people and get this right for once and for all.

 

[Disstevefan1]

In my opinion its all about MONEY.

Disney doesn't care about the guest experience, they will tweak the system such that they can get the most people to purchase it.

My hope a side effect of the changes they they may improve the guest experience, but we must realize, the guest experience is NOT the priority for Disney.

The priority for Disney is MONEY when it comes to their them parks.

 

[JIMMYEDDIE]

I agree, it is worse. It is the worst system they have ever had for the way I like to vacation, but it is what they are offering currently. All of us can either make the best of it and use it, go and don't use it or not go at all. Personally, I will go and try it and if it is great, wonderful, if not I will be politely letting them know how much worse it is and I hope everyone else who feels the same does as well. That is how things change.

As for changes, I doubt they will make too many outward changes by November as I am sure they want a good chunk of data to pore over before doing anything on that front. I do think we will see them play with overall capacity, when it is released, how much is reserved for day of, etc. Mainly backend updates.

Let's see what resort bookings are. This is not helping and i think it's actually hurting.

 

[JIMMYEDDIE]

In my opinion its all about MONEY.

Disney doesn't care about the guest experience, they will tweak the system such that they can get the most people to purchase it.

My hope a side effect of the changes they they may improve the guest experience, but we must realize, the guest experience is NOT the priority for Disney.

The priority for Disney is MONEY when it comes to their them parks.

Agree. But high guest satisfaction = more
Money.

 

[Dranth]

Let's see what resort bookings are. This is not helping and u think it's actually hurting.

I think it is a worse system to get more/better short lines vs. G+. My point is that more/better selections are not as important as other factors for many guests.

On the booking front, I expect it will help because paying for an overpriced room with more benefits is better than paying for the same overpriced room with less benefits. I don't think it will move the needle much, but it will help a little.