Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[LittleBuford]

This is somewhat off-topic, but can those who’ve been visiting the parks report on whether the makeshift signage for Genie+ (stickers over the old FP+ signs) has been replaced by something less shoddy-looking?

 

[Jrb1979]

Genie+ isn't an issue because it hinders people's ability to plan. It's an issue because everyone and their cousin is purchasing it and resort guests only have a 2 hour head start in reserving just *one* attraction when they used to have *three* for free.

I won't be surprised that Disneys idea to fix it will be even more complex. The easiest solution is to limit how many people can buy it. They try so hard to make everyone happy that this is the end result. It's obvious to me they don't have enough capacity for everyone to have Genie+.

 

[Disney Glimpses]

There's an easy way they could "fix" that and reduce demand.

Many people would be mad. Many people that still ended up with it may be happier. Probably some bad PR in there too. If that bad PR is worse than the bad PR about G+ would be the question.

They really, really should just offer it only to resort guests and honor day tickets purchased with it already. And then do a single ILL at each park (7DMT, FOP, ROTR, GOTG).

 

[ChrisM]

They really, really should just offer it only to resort guests and honor day tickets purchased with it already. And then do a single ILL at each park (7DMT, FOP, ROTR, GOTG).

But wasn't one of the foundational reasons for G+ so that non-resort guests wouldn't get shut out of attractions if they didn't pre-plan their FP+?

 

[Disney Glimpses]

But wasn't one of the foundational reasons for G+ so that non-resort guests wouldn't get shut out of attractions if they didn't pre-plan their FP+?

No. The foundational reason for Genie+ was part of the effort to remove the need to plan every aspect of your vacation (6 months [dining] and 2 months [FP+]) in advance. They wanted to offer the ability for people to visit with minimal advance planning. The fee was designed to essentially target vacationers only; keep the local APs who are unlikely to pay the fee out of the FP queues. The miss was on demand in all 3 categories (resort, off site, local AP). Demand exceeded even their wildest expectations.

 

[crazy4disney]

Easy solution in my mind, that would help a LOT:

• 1st G+ can be made for resort guests 1 week before trip
• Allow people to pick times on all attractions
• Introduce the modify button
• Remove, ILL and add them to the G+ inventory (this would increase inventory, only 1 of SDD or RotR could be chosen as your first pick). This would also make it more worth it at EPCOT and AK

Raise the price to say $20-$25 include all rides and simply use the old FP+ system problem solved & heck if they want to be really greedy charge an extra $5 for the ability to book extra rides during the day.

 

[Jrb1979]

No. The foundational reason for Genie+ was part of the effort to remove the need to plan every aspect of your vacation 6 months (dining) and 2 months (FP+) in advance. They wanted to offer the ability for people to visit with minimal advance planning. The fee was designed to essentially target vacationers only; keep the local APs who are unlikely to pay the fee out of the FP queues. The miss was on demand in all 3 categories (resort, off site, local AP). Demand exceeded even their wildest expectations.

That to me says they didn't price it high enough and the big one they didn't follow what other parks do in limiting sales of Genie+

 

[CuteAsMinnie]

IMO it's due to lack of availability on purpose. From what many have said that used the LL waits are short. In the FP days you sometimes had waits of 30 minutes or more.

IMO the only way to fix Genie+ is charge more for it so less people buy it.

In our dozens upon dozens of times using FP+, we never waited more than 10 minutes in a FP queue. Ever.

Charging more for an inherently dysfunctional product will not fix it.

 

[LittleBuford]

But wasn't one of the foundational reasons for G+ so that non-resort guests wouldn't get shut out of attractions if they didn't pre-plan their FP+?

I really think the idea that FP+ shut out non-resort guests is inaccurate, or at least overstated. In my experience as such a guest, the system worked very well indeed. Sure, those who booked two months early enjoyed an advantage, but it was perfectly possible to make really good use of FP+ even at the very last minute.

 

[Disney Glimpses]

That to me says they didn't price it high enough and the big one they didn't follow what other parks do in limiting sales of Genie+

Correct and the plan was to never limit it. They wanted guests to be able to walk in at 2pm and still use it. They thought $15 achieved that. Anyone with 2 brain cells knew it was too cheap.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Correct and the plan was to never limit it. They wanted guests to be able to walk in at 2pm and still use it. They thought $15 achieved that. Anyone with 2 brain cells knew it was too cheap.

Right, but they can’t just double the price now. People will just pay $30 and still complain, so they need to go a different route to make the benefits exclusive to certain classes of guest while disincentivizing other classes. There are various options for that.

 

[Jrb1979]

Correct and the plan was to never limit it. They wanted guests to be able to walk in at 2pm and still use it. They thought $15 achieved that. Anyone with 2 brain cells knew it was too cheap.

It's due to FP+. In so ingrained into everyones head that you need Genie+ stemming from the FP+ days. They need to visit Universal and other parks to see how skip the line systems work well.

 

[Vacationeer]

What if they increased the price and gave onsite a 90 minute cool down window and offsite 120min? Something like $30 per guest/day. Allowing only onsite purchase could upset offsite guests too much. This way there’s some incentive to make to the onsite jump but still an option that includes everyone. I’m not sure if $30/day is enough to reduce usage so the system works better for users while making standby better for non-users. Maybe. WDW trained guests to fork over $100s on dessert parties or after hours just to get some advantage so $15 was nothing compared to those prices.

For return of good will, I wish WDW would offer 2 VQ rides for everybody‘s reserved park and the catch is we can only choose one per day. No more ILL and raise G+ to $30 with the onsite 90 minute and offsite 120 minute cooldowns. Obviously I don’t really know what I’m doing but with the PR around the Genie system they seem to be having a hard time too, lol.

 

[mmascari]

Correct and the plan was to never limit it. They wanted guests to be able to walk in at 2pm and still use it. They thought $15 achieved that. Anyone with 2 brain cells knew it was too cheap.

That sounds like a pretty simple fix then.


It sounds like they knew it would not be a functional happy thing if there was to many people using it.

There's only 2 ways to reduce the number of people using it:
1 - Just limit the number sold for a day. Once capacity is reached, just stop selling it. Just like park reservations run out.
2 - Raise the price, then raise it some more, then do it again. Shift the price until the demand curve hits the supply curve at the point where supply isn't to many for it to work.

It seems they ruled out the first and aren't doing the second. The only solution that leaves is redesigning the entire thing to work with more people using it. Something that's much harder then the other two solutions.

If they want that 2PM guest to be able to buy it that day, because supply isn't limited, the only fix is pricing it so high that demand is curtailed.


I'm not saying I want to pay $50 per person per day for G+. But, at least the people paying that would get something of value then. Assuming $50 is high enough.

Do they limit the number of VIP tours they sell per day? Or, is it just demand limited because of the cost?

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

Right now, some roads to/from Epcot are closed. I don't know which ones, but that will impact current driving times of passenger vehicles.

I tried to account for that and chose what is normal timing. (or was prior to construction)

Still, I can say, having stayed both on and offsite, the difference in how long it takes to get to the parks can be minimal, especially if we look at driving from an offsite hotel vs. taking a bus/pair of monorails from an onsite hotel. And also what = offsite hotel. Bonnet Creek is 'offsite' but located within WDW's property. WDW's transportation times vary widely.

I have stayed at BC. From BC, Epcot is a short walk (about 5min), HS a little further, still doable, but not instant. That walk is more like 15-20 minutes. Google puts it as 22min , but I think that is a little too high.

I have driven from a number of offsite hotels to the entrance of HS in less than 20minutes. (including walking time to the actual park gate).

So there are a number of variables and variations....

 

[Disney Glimpses]

Do they limit the number of VIP tours they sell per day? Or, is it just demand limited because of the cost?

Yes, very limited in fact. They are sold out until July and even then still pretty limited. That's another issue here, that's a business they do not want to cannibalize.

All that being said, the silver lining to all of this is that it is all changing, dramatically.

 

[Jrb1979]

Yes, very limited in fact. They are sold out until July and even then still pretty limited. That's another issue here, that's a business they do not want to cannibalize.

All that being said, the silver lining to all of this is that it is all changing, dramatically.

I will be very disappointed if they go back to giving on-site guests better access. My biggest issue with Disney is how they want to make everything so complex for your average guest.

 

[Thepuma]

No. The foundational reason for Genie+ was part of the effort to remove the need to plan every aspect of your vacation (6 months [dining] and 2 months [FP+]) in advance. They wanted to offer the ability for people to visit with minimal advance planning. The fee was designed to essentially target vacationers only; keep the local APs who are unlikely to pay the fee out of the FP queues. The miss was on demand in all 3 categories (resort, off site, local AP). Demand exceeded even their wildest expectations.

No to both of you....Genie+ was introduced for one reason...and one reason only...To make more money. If it wasnt then G+ would be free.

Don't get fooled into thinking Disney did this for any other reason, because there is NOTHING good about it, its inferior in every way to FP+ and ironically we have to pay for this inferior product.

Only at Disney.

 

[G00fyDad]

No to both of you....Genie+ was introduced for one reason...and one reason only...To make more money.

Don't get fooled into thinking Disney did this for any other reason, because there is NOTHING good about it, its inferior in every way to FP+ and ironically we have to pay for this inferior product.

Only at Disney.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[Thepuma]

Raise the price to say $20-$25 include all rides and simply use the old FP+ system problem solved & heck if they want to be really greedy charge an extra $5 for the ability to book extra rides during the day.

I think similar, but I actually think they need to go down the Universal Express pass route and charge something like $100 for a day's G+...that would definitely decrease people using it and therefore more availability ..while also making Disney more money...win win.