Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[Dranth]

If Guest Satisfaction scores for FP+ were low, just imagine how low they were for G+ to make WDW go back to something so similar to FP+.

G+ had the additional burden of being the first paid system and you combine that with a lot of people having some serious rose-colored glasses about FP+ and here we are.

I am willing to bet that now, with us having essentially a paid FP+, it will get even worse GS scores than before and worse than G+. It will take a bit for people to realize that are now paying the same amount to have an even more rigid experience with less available options and a worse system for anyone who doesn't rope drop (which are the majority of guests).

The one advantage is not having to get up assuming you don't want to try for a VQ.

 

[ConfettiCupcake]

G+ had the additional burden of being the first paid system and you combine that with a lot of people having some serious rose-colored glasses about FP+ and here we are.

I am willing to bet that now, with us having essentially a paid FP+, it will get even worse GS scores than before and worse than G+. It will take a bit for people to realize that are now paying the same amount to have an even more rigid experience with less available options and a worse system for anyone who doesn't rope drop (which are the majority of guests).

The one advantage is not having to get up assuming you don't want to try for a VQ.

I wonder if we’re all overestimating how much use the average guest actually makes of these systems. Maybe the 3 pre-booked, no matter their quality, at times of people’s choosing is a better experience for the general guest population than Genie+ was. They might have data showing that the 3 is enough to satisfy the average guest, and they are also happier not having to strategize as much on the fly. I always come back to the 2-3 attraction disclaimer with Genie+, despite most users online understanding it was easy enough to get more than that.

I’m thinking all that combined with losing the 7 am booking on the vacation has Disney banking on this as an improvement in terms of GS.

 

[Vacationeer]

GSAT for FP+ had a wide gap between onsite and offsite. Onsite may have had a few gripes but generally those people enjoyed FP+ and it was part of a recipe that had them repeatedly visiting. Offsite had major gripes because they’d be locked out the big rides for pre-booking (7DMT, FoP, etc).

Different comments from Disney made it sound like G+/ILL intended to help level that playing field. With the 7 and 3 day advanced booking windows it looks like they changed their mind to some extent.

 

[JIMMYEDDIE]

G+ had the additional burden of being the first paid system and you combine that with a lot of people having some serious rose-colored glasses about FP+ and here we are.

I am willing to bet that now, with us having essentially a paid FP+, it will get even worse GS scores than before and worse than G+. It will take a bit for people to realize that are now paying the same amount to have an even more rigid experience with less available options and a worse system for anyone who doesn't rope drop (which are the majority of guests).

The one advantage is not having to get up assuming you don't want to try for a VQ.

Couldn't agree with this more. This new system is extremely restrictive to the vast majority of guests and I think a vastly inferior product. To me it's the worst form of line skip they have had, below paper fastpass because you have to pay for this.

This new system is terrible.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

G+ had the additional burden of being the first paid system and you combine that with a lot of people having some serious rose-colored glasses about FP+ and here we are.

I am willing to bet that now, with us having essentially a paid FP+, it will get even worse GS scores than before and worse than G+. It will take a bit for people to realize that are now paying the same amount to have an even more rigid experience with less available options and a worse system for anyone who doesn't rope drop (which are the majority of guests).

The one advantage is not having to get up assuming you don't want to try for a VQ.

I wouldn't say the only advantage is not waking up at 7 (which isn't exactly a small issue for some people on vacation). FP+ and LLMP both allow you to have a more efficient route around the parks due to planning return times, whereas G+ was often having g people cross back and forth based on what return times were available. Stacking and going to the parks later had that issue less if you were repeatedly checking return times to modify and get times that worked better - but that's a lot of "on the fly" planning, which many people found more annoying than pre-booking. There is no way for Disney to please everyone since both systems have different pros and cons for different people, but Disney obviously feels that this system will please more people (or be less annoying to more people, if you prefer).

 

[DCLcruiser]

I think 7/3 day window is a lot better than 60/30. While I plan vacations far in advance, not everyone does. This levels the playing field a lot more for people who stay offsite. Granted the top Tier 1 will still be gone, but at least you aren't really out of luck buying tickets 20 days before the trip.

 

[easyrowrdw]

G+ had the additional burden of being the first paid system and you combine that with a lot of people having some serious rose-colored glasses about FP+ and here we are.

I am willing to bet that now, with us having essentially a paid FP+, it will get even worse GS scores than before and worse than G+. It will take a bit for people to realize that are now paying the same amount to have an even more rigid experience with less available options and a worse system for anyone who doesn't rope drop (which are the majority of guests).

The one advantage is not having to get up assuming you don't want to try for a VQ.

It's not rose-colored glasses. I used it for years and it was great for my family and friends. I didn't imagine those trips. It obviously didn't work for enough people and Disney decided to change it. So be it. But the people who liked it aren't any more delusional than the people who disliked it.

You might be right about how this plays out though. I think the availability is going to be the biggest factor. Removing even more attractions from the slate could be a big problem. On the other hand, if the DAS situation is brought under control Disney might be able to have more slots available. I'm less optimistic today than I was yesterday, but it's only been one day so we'll see.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

I think 7/3 day window is a lot better than 60/30. While I plan vacations far in advance, not everyone does. This levels the playing field a lot more for people who stay offsite. Granted the top Tier 1 will still be gone, but at least you aren't really out of luck buying tickets 20 days before the trip.

I think this also encourages more late-planners to stay on-site. If you booked a room less than 60 days out, you were at a disadvantage. Less than 30 days really put you at a disadvantage. So this 7-day vs. 3-day window gives an advantage back to staying at a WDW hotel without discouraging guests who are making travel plans last-minute.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

It's not rose-colored glasses. I used it for years and it was great for my family and friends. I didn't imagine those trips. It obviously didn't work for enough people and Disney decided to change it. So be it. But the people who liked it aren't any more delusional than the people who disliked it.

You might be right about how this plays out though. I think the availability is going to be the biggest factor. Removing even more attractions from the slate could be a big problem. On the other hand, if the DAS situation is brought under control Disney might be able to have more slots available. I'm less optimistic today than I was yesterday, but it's only been one day so we'll see.

The easiest (and most likely, in my opinion) near-term fix would be to add LL availability back for any character meet-and-greets that had LL previously. Adding more inventory with DAS better controlled is certainly another option, as you pointed out. I wouldn't be surprised if either - or both - happen by the end of the year.

 

[Doberge]

This system is worse for locals, worse for off-site guests, and worse for many on site guests go into parks later in the day (stacking).

The only people who could benefit are on site guests that go to parks in the morning. And even then today wasn't great for booking 4th and subsequent FPs.

All that so people wouldn't have to wake up at 7 to book something and maybe could save a few steps walking. We'll still be on phones a lot refreshing and looking for better times for 4th and subsequent booking, so the whole "be on one's phone less" is mostly nonsense.

 

[georgep148]

I remember someone here saying that with LLMP, the tier system would disappear morning of, allowing you to modify tier 2 LLs to tier 1s. When I tried that this morning it blocked me saying we already had a tier 1 booked. That said, after we used our tier 1 LL at 9am, and then a tier 2 shortly after, I was able to hold two additional tier 1s at the same time. What I can’t figure out is whether it requires you to use your tier 1 LL before you can book further tier 1s, or whether using ANY LL allows you to get another tier 1, because I figure a lot of people will have tier 1s booked later in the day and that would feel very restrictive.

 

[GoofGoof]

Well with Genie+ I could get every Tier 1 ride......Wit this I dont think I will be able to

…..Based on availability. Nothing different now. If available you can end up with every tier 1 ride.

 

[Purduevian]

5pm sell out check:
MK: Barnstormer (in and out), Big thunder, Buzz, HM, JC, Pooh, Pirates, SM, Tiana, Speedway. Mermaid is past 9 and small world is past 8
EPCOT: Frozen, MS, Remy, SE. Turtle is out past 7pm
DHS:Alien, BatB, Jr!, Indy, MMRR, RNRC, SDD,TSMM, ToT
AK: Feathered, FotLK, Nemo, Kali, Safari, Navi.

Note most of the shows are just done for the day.

 

[virk4]

I thought I was good at this, but I find what appears to be conflicting information. My question is:
I'm an AP holder staying at the Boardwalk, and I have a park reservation.....when can I make LL reservations?

 

[Chip Chipperson]

This system is worse for locals, worse for off-site guests, and worse for many on site guests go into parks later in the day (stacking).

The only people who could benefit are on site guests that go to parks in the morning. And even then today wasn't great for booking 4th and subsequent FPs.

All that so people wouldn't have to wake up at 7 to book something and maybe could save a few steps walking. We'll still be on phones a lot refreshing and looking for better times for 4th and subsequent booking, so the whole "be on one's phone less" is mostly nonsense.

It's certainly more than "a few steps" when backtracking in a theme park the size of WDW's 4 parks and I would argue that a paid system shouldn't create more physical exertion than a free one even if you want to downplay the impact. G+ was inefficient in terms of navigating through the parks in any logical way.

As for being on your phone: of course we'll still need our phones for additional LL picks, just like FP+. But it's still less than was necessary for G+ by 3 picks per day and I see that as an improvement.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

I’d 100% take a ride when you want over a scheduled times system at Disney, but since that’s not likely to come to Disney for a price less than a VIP guide I personally prefer the pre-booked schedule of times of your own choosing over the next available time assigned like Genie did. With Genie, if you could predictably modify your time out to something useful for you without keeping a sharp eye on it, it probably didn’t really need a LL anyways.

To me the spreadsheet style touring is the lesser of two evils.

I never felt like FP+ required “spreadsheet planning”, our goal with FP was always to get 3 longer line rides in the early afternoon when the parks were packed, that was very simple. A FP between 11-12, we’d leave an hour open for lunch, a FP from 1-2, and a FP from 2-3, that’s all the planning that was necessary to guarantee the afternoon was enjoyable (even when the parks were insanely busy) before we’d take our afternoon pool break back at the hotel. We’d have a list of a half dozen rides we’d choose from and whatever we couldn’t get we’d ride in the morning or at night when the lines were slower. Easy.

I’m sure it was more stressful for people who were trying to “maximize” FP but for people like us 3 rides was all it took to make the parks enjoyable and worth every penny we spent on our vacation.

 

[Dranth]

…..Based on availability. Nothing different now. If available you can end up with every tier 1 ride.

Except now you don't get a chance at that availability unless you use an early LL. That doesn't even include the extra inventory already being gone from T2s.

If the various posts from today are any indication of how this is going to work, much of the MK was gone before noon and that wasn't the case with G+. Being able to hold 3x the available inventory at once reduces availability much quicker.

 

[DCBaker]

I thought I was good at this, but I find what appears to be conflicting information. My question is:
I'm an AP holder staying at the Boardwalk, and I have a park reservation.....when can I make LL reservations?

Since you are staying on-site, you can book starting 7 days before the first day of your resort stay.

 

[GoofGoof]

Except now you don't get a chance at that availability unless you use an early LL. That doesn't even include the extra inventory already being gone from T2s.

If the various posts from today are any indication of how this is going to work, much of the MK was gone before noon and that wasn't the case with G+. Being able to hold 3x the available inventory at once reduces availability much quicker.

It’s hard to judge this based on day 1 of operations. We don’t know if they released full capacity or refilled with full drops during the day. I assume we’ll need a few weeks to see how this is going.…and by we I mean someone smarter than me on the ground running the numbers.

That being said, the system for sure benefits guests at the parks early. For example, rides may have sold out by noon today but that doesn’t mean I couldn‘t still be holding 3 at noon plus have already used multiple LLs from 9-12. But, with genie+ at noon if I was not yet in the park I couldn’t be holding more than 2 reservations. 1 made between 7am and open and one made 2 hours after open at 11am.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I thought I was good at this, but I find what appears to be conflicting information. My question is:
I'm an AP holder staying at the Boardwalk, and I have a park reservation.....when can I make LL reservations?

Per what Disney has said you will be able to book 7 days out from your Boardwalk checkin date