Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[Splash4eva]

I wouldn’t frame expecting a paid service to be providing the same base options to all guests as entitled. Entitled is expecting something more than what you’re paying for. LLMP and LLSP are being advertised as a way to plan before you’re here (I took that verbiage straight from Disney parks blog).

Entitled when it comes to LLMP would be expecting money back when you miss out on an attraction due to availability, or thinking you shouldn’t have to pay the advertised prices for a multitude of reasons, but being disappointed you aren’t getting what they advertise is completely fair IMO.

They are pretty clear on who is getting what right now at this moment… are people whining who go to parks later who were planning on stacking Genie+ attractions for later in day and no longer could now bc the system was abruptly changed….

 

[Splash4eva]

If folk are paying the exact same price for a product but getting a much worse product than others is that entitled? I wonder how you'd feel if US guests were put to the back of the queue. There are of course a million more important things to worry about in the world but having paid many thousands of pounds for a holiday only to have the company you've bought it from change the terms at the last minute I think international guests are entitled to feel a bit miffed.

Again NO is forcing anyone to pay for the product & lets face it this product was NOT the product almost anyone booked their trip expecting

 

[ConfettiCupcake]

They are pretty clear on who is getting what right now at this moment… are people whining who go to parks later who were planning on stacking Genie+ attractions for later in day and no longer could now bc the system was abruptly changed….

I think there’s a difference in a system change for EVERYBODY and a system change for certain groups. It stinks when Disney makes a disappointing change but when everybody’s playing by the same rules what can you do.

But yes people are complaining about that and people are still complaining about the loss of paper fastpass which is a 10+ year old gripe lol.

 

[Splash4eva]

I think there’s a difference in a system change for EVERYBODY and a system change for certain groups. It stinks when Disney makes a disappointing change but when everybody’s playing by the same rules what can you do.

But yes people are complaining about that and people are still complaining about the loss of paper fastpass which is a 10+ year old gripe lol.

Valid point lol

 

[Mark Dunne]

You heard wrong. This idea that UK guests are the ones keeping WDW afloat is absurd.

For context, a current 6 day adult ticket starting on a Saturday in late July is $684, one park per day, and no add-ons.

International not just uk . Thats what I said , of course the uk doesnt keep WDW afloat , but all international guest must make a huge impact in there profits . Hey listen we fall for Disneys GP, we often buy ILL, cost us a small fortune , but we think ‘’ o well we’re not able to come throughout the year ‘’ so we do buy into it, I wish it to be free for all, after all we love Disney and what it offers, just wish it was cheaper

 

[GoofGoof]

International not just uk . Thats what I said , of course the uk doesnt keep WDW afloat , but all international guest must make a huge impact in there profits . Hey listen we fall for Disneys GP, we often buy ILL, cost us a small fortune , but we think ‘’ o well we’re not able to come throughout the year ‘’ so we do buy into it, I wish it to be free for all, after all we love Disney and what it offers, just wish it was cheaper

I believe in pre-Covid days WDW was around 20% International visitors and 80% domestic. I have not seen stats recently but it seems like travel patterns are mostly back to normal by now. I also don’t have a nation breakdown but I do know Canada was #1 for international and they are exempt from this exclusion. That being said international is a significant piece of their customer base. The demographic of those guests is different as well. Longer stays and different spending. If there are no international guests WDW wouldn’t close their doors but it would certainly be detrimental to profits. I don’t think it will come to that. Disney’s will find a work around to whatever the issue is and if they don’t or can’t someone else will eventually. It’s probably the biggest issue for people visiting in the next few months if it takes longer to hash this all out.

 

[projectgamma]

Hi everyone,
I just came to vent a little about how I feel about this LLMP and LLSP. Please forgive me in advance for this rant/venting. My main problems with this setup are as follows:

1. As with every iteration, the main problem with the Disney version of skip-the-line services at WDW is that certain rides can't handle both standby and the Fastpass/genie+ like Peter Pan's flight(PPF) due to no proper capacity for the rides themselves. The ride just wasn't built to handle both. I was laughing that PPF was considered tier one. The main reason why the standby line was mostly over 60 -75 minutes was because they always overbooked the genie+
/FastPass for it. If making it tier 1 solves the problem, forget I said anything. I have my doubts, that it will though and I honestly wish they would not include the low-capacity rides onto any skip-the-line list. It artificially inflates standby way too much for these kinds of rides.

2. VQ and the advance LLSP: The way the virtual queues are set to drop will not work as they are managed now. Most days they are gone within seconds shortly after the 7 am and 1 pm drops. The only way most people can get on day one is to buy the Individual lightning lines for them. I have seen too many families get turned away because they still don't know about VQ and they in turn brought the lightning lanes for them after the fact. If all are sold out in advance, then those that didn't know about the VQ can't experience the attractions without buying the LLSP the day of. While the easiest way is to remove the VQ, that won't theoretically work for guardians. Cosmic Rewind was not designed with a queue that can handle the capacity of guests. I doubt it ever leaves the VQ, at this point. If they keep the VQ's setup, the only working solution is to get rid of the drops and have a permanent rolling entry VQ that resets each. That way everyone can experience them and they could still sell out of the LLSP in advance.

3. I feel sorry for all the international visitors who can't book in advance when staying onsite. It makes no sense, but this is going to be a trainwreck for them if they don't come up with a solution. I can't believe Bob Iger was even knighted in the UK and yet he can't work out how to help them.

Edit: sorry if I was a little carried away.

 

[Mark Dunne]

Hi everyone,
I just came to vent a little about how I feel about this LLMP and LLSP. Please forgive me in advance for this rant/venting. My main problems with this setup are as follows:

1. As with every iteration, the main problem with the Disney version of skip-the-line services at WDW is that certain rides can't handle both standby and the Fastpass/genie+ like Peter Pan's flight(PPF) due to no proper capacity for the rides themselves. The ride just wasn't built to handle both. I was laughing that PPF was considered tier one. The main reason why the standby line was mostly over 60 -75 minutes was because they always overbooked the genie+
/FastPass for it. If making it tier 1 solves the problem, forget I said anything. I have my doubts, that it will though and I honestly wish they would not include the low-capacity rides onto any skip-the-line list. It artificially inflates standby way too much for these kinds of rides.

2. VQ and the advance LLSP: The way the virtual queues are set to drop will not work as they are managed now. Most days they are gone within seconds shortly after the 7 am and 1 pm drops. The only way most people can get on day one is to buy the Individual lightning lines for them. I have seen too many families get turned away because they still don't know about VQ and they in turn brought the lightning lanes for them after the fact. If all are sold out in advance, then those that didn't know about the VQ can't experience the attractions without buying the LLSP the day of. While the easiest way is to remove the VQ, that won't theoretically work for guardians. Cosmic Rewind was not designed with a queue that can handle the capacity of guests. I doubt it ever leaves the VQ, at this point. If they keep the VQ's setup, the only working solution is to get rid of the drops and have a permanent rolling entry VQ that resets each. That way everyone can experience them and they could still sell out of the LLSP in advance.

3. I feel sorry for all the international visitors who can't book in advance when staying onsite. It makes no sense, but this is going to be a trainwreck for them if they don't come up with a solution. I can't believe Bob Iger was even knighted in the UK and yet he can't work out how to help them.

Edit: sorry if I was a little carried away.

Again this is very kind of you to think like this, I feel in this Disney community that we all love and share, the one thing we all wish for each other I hope, is that it needs to be fair to all , cos if they don’t change this, I feel sorry for the desk clerks at the resorts , it won’t be my family , I’ll just take a manager cast member to one side and calmly make a claim it’s not fair, but others may be far more hot headed , and really kick up a stink, again CEO’s making decisions , knowing they won’t be on the front line to fend off the upset Disney vacationer. I didn’t realise we knighted the guy! I’ll have a chat with king Charlie , see what he can do for us

 

[Ayla]

Again this is very kind of you to think like this, I feel in this Disney community that we all love and share, the one thing we all wish for each other I hope, is that it needs to be fair to all , cos if they don’t change this, I feel sorry for the desk clerks at the resorts , it won’t be my family , I’ll just take a manager cast member to one side and calmly make a claim it’s not fair, but others may be far more hot headed , and really kick up a stink, again CEO’s making decisions , knowing they won’t be on the front line to fend off the upset Disney vacationer. I didn’t realise we knighted the guy! I’ll have a chat with king Charlie , see what he can do for us

I'm a middle child and learned as a child life isn't fair.

 

[projectgamma]

Again this is very kind of you to think like this, I feel in this Disney community that we all love and share, the one thing we all wish for each other I hope, is that it needs to be fair to all , cos if they don’t change this, I feel sorry for the desk clerks at the resorts , it won’t be my family , I’ll just take a manager cast member to one side and calmly make a claim it’s not fair, but others may be far more hot headed , and really kick up a stink, again CEO’s making decisions , knowing they won’t be on the front line to fend off the upset Disney vacationer. I didn’t realise we knighted the guy! I’ll have a chat with king Charlie , see what he can do for us

Trust me I understand. I am an annual passholder. I don't really mind the changes coming except for the VQ and LLSP; and the lower capacity rides being on LLMP.

 

[osian]

I'm a middle child and learned as a child life isn't fair.

And that some people have no empathy for others. I've learned that too.

 

[Mark Dunne]

Again NO is forcing anyone to pay for the product & lets face it this product was NOT the product almost anyone booked their trip expecting

Yes, but we are prepered to wake up at 7.00 each morning, trying to plan our day , that’s what we had when I booked , it’s not great getting up at 7.00 am when you’ve flown from across the pond and arrived late afternoon, just to plan your day , but that’s all you could do if you were at a Disney resort, but this new excluding abroad travelers from ILL & LL ,& VQ until we land, is not right.

 

[SirLink]

I'll say this and the whole international thing. Disney and internet are a bit like oil and water they don't mix. They still haven't caught on to folks using VPNs on the phone to book experiences. They still believe that international phones call their local Disney TA to book those experiences.

 

[Splash4eva]

Yes, but we are prepered to wake up at 7.00 each morning, trying to plan our day , that’s what we had when I booked , it’s not great getting up at 7.00 am when you’ve flown from across the pond and arrived late afternoon, just to plan your day , but that’s all you could do if you were at a Disney resort, but this new excluding abroad travelers from ILL & LL ,& VQ until we land, is not right.

& ive mentioned that. How almost everyone who has a tripped booked had their plans altered no matter where you are from. My cousin and his wife die hard Disney fans semi retired the fans Disney loves stays Deluxe pays every up charge BUT avoids parks during the day so he can no longer stack and good chance be shut out of every too attraction sans the one booked either way he will only have 3 vs 5 attractions booked he thought prior to booking. So almost everyone has been effected in one way or another and are not getting the trip they planned for when booking…

 

[Purduevian]

So looking at tiering each category of LL... what does everyone think?

Tier	MK Tier 1	MK Tier 2	EPCOT tier 1	EPCOT tier 2	DHS tier 1	DHS tier 2	AK
A	Tiana	HM, Pirates	Remy	MS, SSE	Slinky	TOT, TSMM	Navi
B	Jungle Cruise, Pan	Pooh, Buzz, small world,	Frozen	Livin with the land, Nemo	MMRR, MFSR	Alien, Indy	Safari, Everest
C	Space	Dumbo, Speedway, Mermaid, Barnstormer		Figment	RNRC	ST	Dinosaur, FotLK, Kali
D	Big Thunder	Mad Tea, Carpets, Philharmagic, Monsters Inc	Soarin	Pixar, Crush		BatB, Disney Jr, Frozen, Muppet,	Feathered, Nemo, Bug,

 

[Mark Dunne]

Lol, no. Don’t get me wrong, I hope they fix this, I really do. But Disney is likely calculating that this isn’t actually going to turn off a ton of international tourism. I think they may be right. Most international tourists are not like you. They’re first time visitors. They may not even know that multipass exists. In any event the idea that the parks would all close without international guests is laughable and belied by 50 years of history including eras with much lower international travel than today.

 

[Mark Dunne]

Look at Disney then and now, then you had 2 parks DL & WDW MK, then expanded to build Epcot,then more and more built , it’s such a huge entrainment juggernaut now, back then for sure international guest prob didn’t make up much at all, but with the expanse of overseas parks, worldwide merch, streaming, I’d say Disney needs all the visitors they can get, from all over the world, to keep this behemoth moving , as fans we don’t want to see them get so big and complacent , that they forget the people that make magic happen, us! Without our money they can’t create, add new attractions, resort hotels, etc, I suppose that’s what I’m trying to get across, just make good for everyone .

 

[C33Mom]

So looking at tiering each category of LL... what does everyone think?

Tier	MK Tier 1	MK Tier 2	EPCOT tier 1	EPCOT tier 2	DHS tier 1	DHS tier 2	AK
A	Tiana	HM, Pirates	Remy	MS, SSE	Slinky	TOT, TSMM	Navi
B	Jungle Cruise, Pan	Pooh, Buzz, small world,	Frozen	Livin with the land, Nemo	MMRR, MFSR	Alien, Indy	Safari, Everest
C	Space	Dumbo, Speedway, Mermaid, Barnstormer		Figment	RNRC	ST	Dinosaur, FotLK, Kali
D	Big Thunder	Mad Tea, Carpets, Philharmagic, Monsters Inc	Soarin	Pixar, Crush		BatB, Disney Jr, Frozen, Muppet,	Feathered, Nemo, Bug,

The first few parks seem generally correct to me, but I can’t imagine putting Navi at the top of any list ever, let alone ahead of the other rides at AK.

 

[GoofGoof]

The first few parks seem generally correct to me, but I can’t imagine putting Navi at the top of any list ever, let alone ahead of the other rides at AK.

based purely on wait time….similar to Pan at MK. No sane adult can argue Pirates or HM are lesser than Peter Pan but from a standby wait they are.

 

[Jumping Fountains]

No no no, Disney is intentionally leaving revenue on the table for no other reason than to screw UK guests, don't you see?

Honestly, I don't even understand what conspiracy is being alleged here. "Disney screws XYZ category of guest to maximize their profits" is a conspiracy that's at least plausible. But in this case people are saying "Disney screws UK guests to... minimze?... their profits."

I can’t speak for the affected parties, but they’re probably upset in part because it doesn’t seem like the company is even saying that it’s committed to changing/solving the issue. I haven’t been following the messaging super-closely though.