Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[GoofGoof]

What is available for how long under G+ is highly dependent on the crowd level and the park.

According to Touring Plans data for yesterday here is when genie+ ran out:

EPCOT: Remy and Frozen were gone shortly after 7am with Soarin gone right at 11am when people could book their 2nd choice

DHS: SDD was gone shortly after 7am, TSMM around 9am, Smugglers right at 11am, Mickey Train and ToT both just after 1.

AK: Na’vi was gone before open, EE 11am, safari just after 11

MK: BTMRR before 11, Pan just after 7am, Space before 8am, jungle cruise 9:30am, Pirates around 7am

Keep in mind these are when they ran out completely so for example BTMRR at 10:15am had a return time near park closing. Not a problem if you are there all day in same park. Not ideal if you hop.


I think the point is that at a crowded time when more people bought G+ rides sell out quicker. It’s tough to get 3 meaningful reservations a day and you have no control over return windows. The big question will be how quickly will the advance reservations sell out? Probably very quickly.

 

[flynnibus]

Which means that their website will now be less useful than it was 11 years ago...

I doubt that there are technological limitations as to why they couldn't make LL selections available on the website like they did for FP+, and they do for dining reservations, so they either don't want to do it, or don't want to spend the money to do it...

All this reeks of a simple decision to be 'app only' and consequences of that..

Instead of a project plan that said "lets build agent bookings, then build the website to allow self-service, and then build the app for self-service..." - Someone probably stood up and said "we should just force everyone to use the app, it will be cheaper and drive adoption and reduce staffing". Then they do that.. and later realize there might be some app payment ecosystem constraints they didn't account for and can't serve that international market on launch due to it.

Everyone going down regulatory, privacy, GDPR, FP+ history are all barking up the wrong tree. This is likely a TOOLING problem - not a regulatory one. Disney has been able to sell you products online forever. The problem is they need the platform they are using to support international and they need to deal with more elements.

 

[GhostHost1000]

What is available for how long under G+ is highly dependent on the crowd level and the park.

According to Touring Plans data for yesterday here is when genie+ ran out:

EPCOT: Remy and Frozen were gone shortly after 7am with Soarin gone right at 11am when people could book their 2nd choice

DHS: SDD was gone shortly after 7am, TSMM around 9am, Smugglers right at 11am, Mickey Train and ToT both just after 1.

AK: Na’vi was gone before open, EE 11am, safari just after 11

MK: BTMRR before 11, Pan just after 7am, Space before 8am, jungle cruise 9:30am, Pirates around 7am

Keep in mind these are when they ran out completely so for example BTMRR at 10:15am had a return time near park closing. Not a problem if you are there all day in same park. Not ideal if you hop.


I think the point is that at a crowded time when more people bought G+ rides sell out quicker. It’s tough to get 3 meaningful reservations a day and you have no control over return windows. The big question will be how quickly will the advance reservations sell out? Probably very quickly.

It’ll be interesting to see. Being able to select times you want I think will help things. Also means attractions may open up throughout the day as people may modify/change too

 

[JD80]

All this reeks of a simple decision to be 'app only' and consequences of that..

Instead of a project plan that said "lets build agent bookings, then build the website to allow self-service, and then build the app for self-service..." - Someone probably stood up and said "we should just force everyone to use the app, it will be cheaper and drive adoption and reduce staffing". Then they do that.. and later realize there might be some app payment ecosystem constraints they didn't account for and can't serve that international market on launch due to it.

Everyone going down regulatory, privacy, GDPR, FP+ history are all barking up the wrong tree. This is likely a TOOLING problem - not a regulatory one. Disney has been able to sell you products online forever. The problem is they need the platform they are using to support international and they need to deal with more elements.

Are you an expert?

 

[flynnibus]

Are you an expert?

I have a daytime job that includes building software+hardware products for global companies as part of a multi-billion dollar business unit and have been doing it for over 25yrs. I know a thing or two about decisions get made..

 

[Splash4eva]

But the last few weeks have been relatively slow. Actually, this year so far has been relatively slow. Perhaps the parks will continue to be somewhat slow and it will not be an issue.

I have been at WDW when the parks were busy, and SDD/Remy were both gone within seconds. When Remy ran out, FEA next went quickly.

Drop times are almost perfectly accurate for inventory on the rides you and others have mentioned…

 

[GoofGoof]

It’ll be interesting to see. Being able to select times you want I think will help things. Also means attractions may open up throughout the day as people may modify/change too

Yeah I think the answer on which system will be better will ultimately be….it depends. On a day when the vast majority of meaningful slots were sold out before you could make a second selection Genie+ disappointed but on days where many rides remained open later into the day it could have been a much better option.

What you do get with the new system is the ability to select a return time vs getting next available and for on property guests a pretty good chance you get what you want 7 days ahead.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

That's not true. Sdd was available until about 11am when I was there last week.

Mid June with temps pushing 100 degrees is not an accurate barometer of the average Disney day.

 

[doctornick]

I’m not sure I understand the idea that “you’ll only be able to get one Tier 1 ride” with the new system - it should be exactly the same day of availability for additional Tier 1 as G+. Thought exercise: assuming that everyone buying G+ used it exclusively to get what is a Tier 1 ride at 7am. The availability for a second Tier 1 ride at 9am or after using the first LL would be exactly the same availability as what would be available to book with the new system day of after using one of the 3 pre-books.

The lack of re-rides should I think make a big difference with availability (as well as not everyone purchasing) compared to FP+ day of availability. Though admittedly countered by taking the ILL rides out of the pool.

But the day of availability would be the same as with G+. What would be less available is day of spots for Tier 2 (“lesser”) rides which should be easy to get regardless. And everyone purchasing would have two of them regardless.

 

[gerarar]

About the use of VPN with international guests.

Each My Disney Experience account has some metadata on it that's basically stuck to it.

For example, my personal MDE account has some region and countryCodeDetected metadata with value "US". These are most likely assigned at time of account creation.

And fyi I am currently in Banff, Alberta, Canada for vacation, yet the app knows that my account is US-based. I created a new dummy account and the properties above were assigned "CA" which sorta confirms my theory.

You can also add an (optional) home address to your MDE account, but not sure if this overrides these metadata values in your account.

So going back, the new lightning lane reservation system may use a combination of your MDE account's region metatdata, current geo-location, etc. Thus VPN might not work as some hoped for..

 

[doctornick]

So personal opinion: I had no intention of ever getting G+ but am very happy with these changes and it would make me at least strongly consider purchasing Multi LL the next time I come.

Why? Many reasons:

1. I like to pre-plan and have some semblance of the day mapped out. Having three rides locked in advance- especially by being able to pick specific times - is great.

2. We always stay on property (DVC) so I’m thankful to get some resort benefit back. On property should have perks given the cost.

3. Hate having to get up earlier than needed on vacation. Virtual queues suck but at least that’s just you get it or you don’t and not having to make plans on the fly. Also only at two parks not all of them. All for more sleeping in.

I pretty much loved FP+ so while I’m not happy with paying (or no re-rides) this at least tips the value equation back to being more worthwhile for us.

 

[croboy82]

Something similiar has been happening with Disney Cruise Line for a while too.

I am an international guest and I was able to book my Cruise trip on the website without problems last year. However when it came to add additional things (like water package in your room) I wasn‘t able to book that on the website or the app.

I had to make an international call and they explained to me they can‘t use international cards for such services. Which is weird since they used the same card for the trip.

So maybe there is another solution inhouse for such upcharges that prevents them from doing so also for this new Genie thing. Maybe they are even using another company / provider or whatever.

 

[Jon81uk]

That wouldn’t get around the prebooking of the LLs though.

Once paid for it should become like FastPass+ and you just book it. There was no issue doing FP+ in advance from the UK, it’s the payment that’s the issue not the booking.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

What is available for how long under G+ is highly dependent on the crowd level and the park.

According to Touring Plans data for yesterday here is when genie+ ran out:

EPCOT: Remy and Frozen were gone shortly after 7am with Soarin gone right at 11am when people could book their 2nd choice

DHS: SDD was gone shortly after 7am, TSMM around 9am, Smugglers right at 11am, Mickey Train and ToT both just after 1.

AK: Na’vi was gone before open, EE 11am, safari just after 11

MK: BTMRR before 11, Pan just after 7am, Space before 8am, jungle cruise 9:30am, Pirates around 7am

Keep in mind these are when they ran out completely so for example BTMRR at 10:15am had a return time near park closing. Not a problem if you are there all day in same park. Not ideal if you hop.


I think the point is that at a crowded time when more people bought G+ rides sell out quicker. It’s tough to get 3 meaningful reservations a day and you have no control over return windows. The big question will be how quickly will the advance reservations sell out? Probably very quickly.

Yeah but nothing is ever actually "gone." You can always get everything if you have the patience to refresh.

 

[GigglesMcSnort]

About the use of VPN with international guests.

Each My Disney Experience account has some metadata on it that's basically stuck to it.

For example, my personal MDE account has some region and countryCodeDetected metadata with value "US". These are most likely assigned at time of account creation.


And fyi I am currently in Banff, Alberta, Canada for vacation, yet the app knows that my account is US-based. I created a new dummy account and the properties above were assigned "CA" which sorta confirms my theory.

You can also add an (optional) home address to your MDE account, but not sure if this overrides these metadata values in your account.

So going back, the new lightning lane reservation system may use a combination of your MDE account's region metatdata, current geo-location, etc. Thus VPN might not work as some hoped for..

Nah, they've already said it will work for international guests once they get to the US, so that it's based on location. Anyhow, if account metadata did matter, we wouldn't be able to use the feature once in the park either, so that would be a non-starter in any case.

And location can be changed with a VPN (and if required, GPS location spoofing, although that's not needed for anything else that's currently geo-restricted).

 

[UK Disney]

Once paid for it should become like FastPass+ and you just book it. There was no issue doing FP+ in advance from the UK, it’s the payment that’s the issue not the booking.

I have made complete payments here in the UK through the app (Rose & Crown) without a VPN or any intricate GPS workaround. However, the VPN was necessary for the dessert parties.

 

[doctornick]

Yeah but nothing is ever actually "gone." You can always get everything if you have the patience to refresh.

While technically true I think a key thing here is also party size. For a smaller party size, it’s just way easier to check and find things that open up. I tend to travel with a large group (7-9 people) and it is harder to get LLs that open up for everyone because there’s just not that block all together available ( and they can often disappear between seeing it and confirming).

That’s another reason I prefer pre-booking while more availability overall exists to choose from.

 

[Tha Realest]

Something similiar has been happening with Disney Cruise Line for a while too.

I am an international guest and I was able to book my Cruise trip on the website without problems last year. However when it came to add additional things (like water package in your room) I wasn‘t able to book that on the website or the app.

I had to make an international call and they explained to me they can‘t use international cards for such services. Which is weird since they used the same card for the trip.

So maybe there is another solution inhouse for such upcharges that prevents them from doing so also for this new Genie thing. Maybe they are even using another company / provider or whatever.

There’s an irony of how international regulatory issues may be creating issues for a cruise line to collect money from certain well-heeled guests, especially when you consider the whole “flag of convenience” scheme they do to skirt certain wage/labor laws

 

[Splash4eva]

Mid June with temps pushing 100 degrees is not an accurate barometer of the average Disney day.

Is this Bob Iger’s burner account?

 

[LSLS]

I’m not sure I understand the idea that “you’ll only be able to get one Tier 1 ride” with the new system - it should be exactly the same day of availability for additional Tier 1 as G+. Thought exercise: assuming that everyone buying G+ used it exclusively to get what is a Tier 1 ride at 7am. The availability for a second Tier 1 ride at 9am or after using the first LL would be exactly the same availability as what would be available to book with the new system day of after using one of the 3 pre-books.

The lack of re-rides should I think make a big difference with availability (as well as not everyone purchasing) compared to FP+ day of availability. Though admittedly countered by taking the ILL rides out of the pool.

But the day of availability would be the same as with G+. What would be less available is day of spots for Tier 2 (“lesser”) rides which should be easy to get regardless. And everyone purchasing would have two of them regardless.

I'm far from an expert on Genie+ as I've never come close to needing it with how dead it's been when we have gone, but, wasn't it if I sign up at 7am, I could get Remy at 9:00, Frozen at 4:00, and Soarin at 6:00? Now, I get to plan 3 days out, but I get Remy at 9:00, then I need to take like the Seas at 10:00 and Figment at 11:00. And now, everyone else buying is doing the same thing, meaning by the time 9:15 rolls around and I've used Remy up, all the LL for Frozen and Soarin are gone (because everyone else needed to select Tier 1's as well).