Journey of Water featuring Moana coming to Epcot

[lazyboy97o]

And again, what empty space? The empty block building that had no purpose and sat there reminding us over and over of what will never be? Or the potential of some new space that has potential tie in and opens up to better landscape and tie into the world of Nature?

Glass isn't half full, it isn't half empty. I just took my drink of what was given

The big empty space that was to sit between the Journey of Water and the Festival Center, which too many remain empty space. Journey of Water and the Festival Center were not taking up the entire footprint of CommuniCore West. It was walkways and landscape with some hills, but is consistently overblown as potential that would extend beyond to create a unified World Nature.

 

[Incomudro]

I want to see if JoW provides a cooling effect, as in relief for the guests when the temps are 80+ / 90+ plus sun relief for the eyes.

There likely will be a cooling effect in the form of shade.
Maybe even some misting from the water features when the wind blows, whether intentional or not.

 

[J4546]

Im still very much looking froward to this!

 

[GimpYancIent]

Im still very much looking froward to this!

I am looking forward to it also but I believe from a completely different view point. The sooner the construction walls are gone is what I want.

 

[Bocabear]

And again, what empty space? The empty block building that had no purpose and sat there reminding us over and over of what will never be? Or the potential of some new space that has potential tie in and opens up to better landscape and tie into the world of Nature?

Glass isn't half full, it isn't half empty. I just took my drink of what was given

The concrete building was not empty... The Innoventions end had rotating exhibits over the years and while I agree it should have been more, it was not empty...There was also a massive very crowded and well used Starbucks, a huge Meet & Greet location, and Club Cool. Was the building used and filled to it's potential? Heck no, but it could have been...and should have been. Imagine if World Showplace were relocated to Innoventions, freeing up both the space and budget to have a real Attraction in the UK Pavilion... Not tearing down the building might have also allowed the budget to include a second floor over the Innoventions end with a roof garden... You could have entered JOW through the central breezeway portal through the building allowing for a little covered space in Florida's frequent rainstorms... It seems like the central core could have been refreshed and modernized, and a new Event space plus JOW without changing the integrity of the original layout...and it still would have felt fresh and new and modern...

 

[rreading]

For me, it's the loss of FoN (especially) and symmetry that bother me most.

I agree...but to me it's (way) more the idea of the FoN than the actual FoN itself. The show was no WOC; even during a "performance" I could barely get my family to stop walking past it to get to the next thing. But it still appreciated it being there and appreciated it as part of the park's symmetry.

But I still think that the changes will be for the better

 

[ppete1975]

The whole think reminds me of what happened when oklahoma wanted to modernize its downtown area. They hired an amazing architect IM Pei (who only recently passed away at the age of 102). His plan the Pei plan, called to demolish most of downtown okc and replace with parks, a galleria mall a convention center among other things. So they did it. They demolished amazing classic buildings, the buildings you see in movies of marble and gold. They had everything to dust and ready to build... then the oil crash. (among countless other things) Now the money was no longer flooding the coiffeurs. So for 30-40 years you had a ghost town of dirt. Only now is it becoming even a shadow of what pie had envisioned.

My cliff noted point? Covid hit disney right when things were about to get good, and now we wont see what we wanted, and it will take a along time before it will be even close to what we were hoping. Luckily its a theme park and they cant leave it for 30-40 years... they will at least plant trees and grass.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Spatial organization. The difference between a random suburban sprawl and a designed space. CommuniCore was the organizing element that gave Future World a spatial definition. You didn’t have random buildings plopped down wherever, they were organized. Now the new neighborhoods are just random buildings plopped down. There is no clear delineation of the different lands. People can’t nearly draw the boundaries and even Disney can’t get it right or consistent. You could look at an aerial or even figure-ground of EPCOT Center and understand that Future World and world Showcase were distinct without any other knowledge. That can’t be done with the neighborhoods. In order to know where you are will require signage because there will be nothing in how space is built that distinguishes the new lands. They’re the stuff sort of in this area.

I'll agree that the new neighborhoods are messy. But, the original placement of the pavilions is the very definition of 'plopping down' buildings. They each had their own architectural ecosystem totally set apart from their neighbors. They didn't form a distinct 'neighborhood' on their own except maybe united by corporate-park-landscaping.

 

[rreading]

BTW, even as someone who things JoW looks like a solid addition, I would totally agree that it is taking far too long to build, will likely cost way too much and will probably use space more inefficiently than it should. I don't think anyone is really suggesting everything about this project is positive, only that it's more harshly criticized than it deserves.

Agree that it's talking a long time but honestly if something costs a lot/takes a long time because they're doing a really good job then I don't care what it costs. Sure - maybe it's going into the price of my ticket...but it's actually not (ticket prices are way more complicated than how much money they've spent lately).

The hope is that there's something worth waiting for

 

[rreading]

Spatial organization. The difference between a random suburban sprawl and a designed space. CommuniCore was the organizing element that gave Future World a spatial definition. You didn’t have random buildings plopped down wherever, they were organized. Now the new neighborhoods are just random buildings plopped down. There is no clear delineation of the different lands. People can’t nearly draw the boundaries and even Disney can’t get it right or consistent. You could look at an aerial or even figure-ground of EPCOT Center and understand that Future World and world Showcase were distinct without any other knowledge. That can’t be done with the neighborhoods. In order to know where you are will require signage because there will be nothing in how space is built that distinguishes the new lands. They’re the stuff sort of in this area.

It was well-organized. But it took up a lot of space and (imho) did not provide space for useful or interesting content. Thus it was a well-designed hinderance to getting to what we wanted to do.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

Agree that it's talking a long time but honestly if something costs a lot/takes a long time because they're doing a really good job then I don't care what it costs. Sure - maybe it's going into the price of my ticket...but it's actually not (ticket prices are way more complicated than how much money they've spent lately).

The hope is that there's something worth waiting for

The end product will ultimately decide if this is worth the time or not. My biggest fear is after all this time we end up with a scaled back water fountain and rather than lush landscaping they simply pave over the area because it’s cheaper.

I love the concept art, now we wait and see if that’s actually what we get.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Agree that it's talking a long time but honestly if something costs a lot/takes a long time because they're doing a really good job then I don't care what it costs. Sure - maybe it's going into the price of my ticket...but it's actually not (ticket prices are way more complicated than how much money they've spent lately).

The hope is that there's something worth waiting for

I really want to believe it’s taking long because they are doing a really good job, but I think it’s taking longer because they don’t want to put the money out to finish faster or finish it at all.

EPCOT is making a LOT of money with the almost year round food festivals.

The construction walls actually help funnel folks to the food booths to buy their $7 samples….

 

[Incomudro]

The end product will ultimately decide if this is worth the time or not. My biggest fear is after all this time we end up with a scaled back water fountain and rather than lush landscaping they simply pave over the area because it’s cheaper.

I love the concept art, now we wait and see if that’s actually what we get.

Disney's been doing a great job with rock work and natural looking areas, as in Pandora and Galaxy's Edge.
I'm going with that for my belief that this area is going to be beautiful.

 

[Stupido]

Disney's been doing a great job with rock work and natural looking areas, as in Pandora and Galaxy's Edge.
I'm going with that for my belief that this area is going to be beautiful.

I mean, I agree, all new construction has (mainly) been overwhelmingly beautiful, but I think part of that is Disney realizing how big aesthetics have become in today's culture, and the never ending hunt to find the perfect instagramable spot. I do think a big part of that is Disney wanting to give guests plenty of spots to photograph and share as free marketing.

If kids could turn a purple wall into a viral sensation, why not give them more to play with?

 

[J4546]

i really liked the concept art with the pink ribbon pathway and the tiered center spine area....I hope they do all of that still

 

[lazyboy97o]

I'll agree that the new neighborhoods are messy. But, the original placement of the pavilions is the very definition of 'plopping down' buildings. They each had their own architectural ecosystem totally set apart from their neighbors. They didn't form a distinct 'neighborhood' on their own except maybe united by corporate-park-landscaping.

That is exactly why CommuniCore was so important. It was the organizing center. The pavilions weren’t plopped down, they were organized around the CommuniCore.

It was well-organized. But it took up a lot of space and (imho) did not provide space for useful or interesting content. Thus it was a well-designed hinderance to getting to what we wanted to do.

There is nothing Disney is doing that could not have been done (and generally bigger too) in the CommuniCore West facility. The spaces were designed to be flexible. Even being covered in trees would have been possible.

 

[Nonja]

I'm so looking for this. Anything is better than an ugly plaza and an empty and ugly building left to rot.

But hey, is so fun to watch desperate old-Epcto fanboys still triyng to find ways to defend they way it was lmao

 

[UNCgolf]

I'm so looking for this. Anything is better than an ugly plaza and an empty and ugly building left to rot.

But hey, is so fun to watch desperate old-Epcto fanboys still triyng to find ways to defend they way it was lmao

No one is defending it because it needs no defense. That's like suggesting someone is defending the Beatles or Citizen Kane.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

No one is defending it because it needs no defense. That's like suggesting someone is defending the Beatles or Citizen Kane.

I’d argue it’s more like defending one of the horrible solo albums based on the fact the Beatles were great.

I love the Beatles, but the individual members put out some pretty bad stuff since then (also some really good stuff). I’d say the same about Epcot, the original stuff was great but there was a lot of bad since then.

We may dream of a new classic Beatles album but I’d happily take a good new McCartney album over a lot of the crap we got in the 80s.

 

[UNCgolf]

I’d argue it’s more like defending one of the horrible solo albums based on the fact the Beatles were great.

I love the Beatles, but the individual members put out some pretty bad stuff since then (also some really good stuff). I’d say the same about Epcot, the original stuff was great but there was a lot of bad since then.

We may dream of a new classic Beatles album but I’d happily take a good new McCartney album over a lot of the crap we got in the 80s.

Yeah, but nobody was claiming the EPCOT that existed 5-10 years ago was good.