It seems like more competition in the Orlando theme-park space is bad for the consumer.

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Your general point about prices is noted, but just FYI, there is a significant difference between NFL and MLB pricing due to several factors (general popularity, huge difference in number of games in a season, etc.). A crappy seat at a Patriots game could cost three hundred dollars or more, but a crappy seat at a Red Sox game will usually run you 20 to 30 bucks.

I was at a Dodgers vs. Red Sox game at Fenway in July. It was about as cheap of a seat as possible and it still was $57. Maybe the prices were higher when they were still in the playoff hunt?

Here’s the psa for the 1000th time:

Sporting events, concerts and broadways shows do NOT compare economically with travel to Orlando. There are minimum total costs for 5-7 days in Florida that are not involved in a 3 hour event.
Carry on

 

[The_Jobu]

I can't foresee the surviving company having much more room to actually gouge the customer any further;

Chapek: hold my $8 soy milk with food colouring

 

[Benjamin_Nicholas]

Here’s the psa for the 1000th time:

Sporting events, concerts and broadways shows do NOT compare economically with travel to Orlando. There are minimum total costs for 5-7 days in Florida that are not involved in a 3 hour event.
Carry on

But they all compete for the same dollar, in the same realm. Entertainment. Period.

Sporting events: A lot of folks travel long distances to see games.
Concerts: A lot of people travel all over the world to see artists.
Broadway: I know dozens of people who go to NYC for weekends and full-weeks to gorge on plays/musicals.

This is business 101. They compare and compete.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

But they all compete for the same dollar, in the same realm. Entertainment. Period.

Sporting events: A lot of folks travel long distances to see games.
Concerts: A lot of people travel all over the world to see artists.
Broadway: I know dozens of people who go to NYC for weekends and full-weeks to gorge on plays/musicals.

This is business 101. They compare and compete.

But all of those travel to capture the LOCAL markets...hence eliminating the travel costs for most of the patrons.

And you must have slept through half of the first day of business 101...or like most of the armchair economists around here: don’t understand its application off the pages of the textbook.

 

[bUU]

And you must have slept through half of the first day of business 101...or like most of the armchair economists around here: don’t understand its application off the pages of the textbook.

Coming from you that means nothing. Benjamin_Nicholas is far closer to correct, in this case, than you are.

The market is not "entertainment" - that's a sector and far too broad to justify a claim of competition, legally. By contrast, the market is "destination resort". As such, WDW competes with Beaches resorts and Wisconsin Dells and, yes, Universal Orlando, for the typical American's vacation dollar.

Incidentally, we didn't cover competition in Business 101. That was typically part of the sophomore year syllabus: Market equilibrium, market efficiency, elasticity of demand, competition, monopoly, the role of costs and profits on pricing, etc. I just checked a few college curriculae and that hasn't changed over the last thirty years.

 

[beertiki]

Because $4 for a bottle of water in 105 heat index weather isn’t price gouging.
And the $10 I had to pay for children’s acetaminophen to help my sick daughter wasn’t price gouging.

I understand what you’re saying, but defending Disney via technicalities doesn’t exactly progress the discussion.

It is not price gauging when you can get a FREE cup of ice water at any quick service. As far as your acetaminophen, I would guess most people travel to Disney with some type of pain reliever and a few band aids at the minimum. Forgetting a few basic first aid items is no different than forgetting a bathing suit, and you will have to pay a lot more for it at the gift shop.

 

[Walt Disney1955]

Here’s the psa for the 1000th time:

Sporting events, concerts and broadways shows do NOT compare economically with travel to Orlando. There are minimum total costs for 5-7 days in Florida that are not involved in a 3 hour event.
Carry on

Who here said it is the same? I just said that like it or not whether it is theme parks or, the example I used, sporting events, they have all gotten too priced out for the average family. Different scales.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Who here said it is the same? I just said that like it or not whether it is theme parks or, the example I used, sporting events, they have all gotten too priced out for the average family. Different scales.

Because Disney pricing...which is designed around longterm clientele and repeat visits in the tens of millions...is always falsely compared to broadway and events to justify their 10 years of batpoop increases in pricing.

Complete red herring in the context of the business model

 

[NickMaio]

Pandora wouldn’t have happened if not for
Universal. That’s a pretty direct example for you. Investment’s seen a particular uptick since Universal started pulling in numbers and that’s not exactly a coincidence. I don’t know what you aren’t understanding.

Totally agree.
WDW has been resting and following for a looooooong time now.
They really need to step it up. Smugglers run has not had the impact they hoped for.

 

[Tom Morrow]

Totally agree.
WDW has been resting and following for a looooooong time now.
They really need to step it up. Smugglers run has not had the impact they hoped for.

Too much credit is given to Universal for Potter. Hogsmeade shook the industry in 2010 and Diagon Alley again in 2014. In between that and everything else after, Universal has failed to meet that level of detail and immersion. Everything At UOR post-Diagon has been mediocre to terrible, with the exception of Hagrid's.

It's true that from the mid 00's to the mid '10's, WDW more or less stagnated. But over the '10's we have seen major additions and/or overhauls to MK, DAK, and DHS, with Epcot's turn beginning now. We've seen Disney Springs completely remodeled, renovated, and doubled in size. They opened three huge new lands, three years in a row. New attractions for 2017, 2018, 2019, with Rise of the Resistance, Mickey and Minnnie's Runaway Railway, TRON, Guardians, Ratatouille, and more still on the way for the coming years. We've seen new hotels and infrastructure improvements all around. We've seen the installation of a new mass transit system.

But I guess none of that matters because Universal released three mediocre screen rides in a row? In other words, suggesting that WDW is still stagnating is pretty ludicrous.

 

[NickMaio]

Too much credit is given to Universal for Potter. Hogsmeade shook the industry in 2010 and Diagon Alley again in 2014. In between that and everything else after, Universal has failed to meet that level of detail and immersion. Everything At UOR post-Diagon has been mediocre to terrible, with the exception of Hagrid's.

It's true that from the mid 00's to the mid '10's, WDW more or less stagnated. But over the '10's we have seen major additions and/or overhauls to MK, DAK, and DHS, with Epcot's turn beginning now. We've seen Disney Springs completely remodeled, renovated, and doubled in size. They opened three huge new lands, three years in a row. New attractions for 2017, 2018, 2019, with Rise of the Resistance, Mickey and Minnnie's Runaway Railway, TRON, Guardians, Ratatouille, and more still on the way for the coming years. We've seen new hotels and infrastructure improvements all around. We've seen the installation of a new mass transit system.

But I guess none of that matters because Universal released three mediocre screen rides in a row? In other words, suggesting that WDW is still stagnating is pretty ludicrous.

I never suggested that WDW is STILL stagnating. It seems highly coincidental that Pandora went into development after Wizarding World. Uni blazed the path for truly immersive theme park experience.
Plain and simple. That is what I was agreeing with. Everything that WDW has been doing is in response to the threat of loss of market share.
Calling the 3 rides in the Potter parks mediocre is a real joke. You really need to be a WDW fan to believe this.

 

[HongKongFu]

Hogsmeade shook the industry in 2010 and Diagon Alley again in 2014. In between that and everything else after, Universal has failed to meet that level of detail and immersion. Everything At UOR post-Diagon has been mediocre to terrible, with the exception of Hagrid's.

Without doing research I quickly came up with:

Kong......some of it is stellar and some is just passable and some is laughably horrendous.

Fast n Furious...... some of it approaches ridicule and some of it is ridiculous and some is head shakingly embarrassing to the point I hoped nobody saw me emerging from the exit.

Race through NY......walking up those steps to the lounge was the absolute worst decision in a long career of themeparking around the world. My life is that much worse for it.

 

[Tom Morrow]

I never suggested that WDW is STILL stagnating. It seems highly coincidental that Pandora went into development after Wizarding World. Uni blazed the path for truly immersive theme park experience.
Plain and simple. That is what I was agreeing with. Everything that WDW has been doing is in response to the threat of loss of market share.
Calling the 3 rides in the Potter parks mediocre is a real joke. You really need to be a WDW fan to believe this.

The three rides I’m referring to are Kong (mediocre), Fallon (bad), and Fast & Furious (objectively one of the worst attractions ever made).

 

[BoarderPhreak]

There has been theme park competition in Florida for MANY decades. Back in the day it was basically Cypress Gardens (1936), Gatorland (1949), Busch Gardens (1959), the Magic Kingdom (1971) and Sea World (1973). EPCOT Center (1982), Disney-MGM Studios (1989) and Universal (1990) all came pretty late to the party.

 

[HongKongFu]

. They opened three huge new lands, three years in a row.

Nope, let's not do that.

Pandora and Toy are not huge. Really? You call those huge?

On a side note Toys shows cheapness everywhere so I wouldn't be too proud to put that on the list of accomplishments

 

[Lilofan]

But they all compete for the same dollar, in the same realm. Entertainment. Period.

Sporting events: A lot of folks travel long distances to see games.
Concerts: A lot of people travel all over the world to see artists.
Broadway: I know dozens of people who go to NYC for weekends and full-weeks to gorge on plays/musicals.

This is business 101. They compare and compete.

My family and I would drive several hours for crawfish and boudin.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Nope, let's not do that.

Pandora and Toy are not huge. Really? You call those huge?

On a side note Toys shows cheapness everywhere so I wouldn't be too proud to put that on the list of accomplishments

Yep...I’ve never seen lands so “bigly huge”

 

[NickMaio]

The three rides I’m referring to are Kong (mediocre), Fallon (bad), and Fast & Furious (objectively one of the worst attractions ever made).

Navi River Journey......Bells Dress Up......and the 7 dwarfs " blink and it's all over coaster"....Alien tea cups (I mean saucers).....Slinky Barnstormer............At least Kongs Que, story and set up is amazing.
WDW has its share.
In pour house we eat, sleep, and breathe WDW. You can hear WDW theming / ride music playing at almost any given time. We LOVE WDW.
However, we have not been impacted by a WDW ride in a long time. Our potter experience has always left our jaws dropped.
Pandora was ok - however it was ONE movie - - really hard to get into vs the 7 that Potter brought us.
I know, I know its a future play - but with so many cool and heart warming IP's that Dis has in it's vault, I still think they chose poorly.

 

[NickMaio]

With Epic Universe coming - WDW better kick it into high gear.
I honestly don't care how many hoity toity shops they put in Downtown Disney.
The biggest land expansion in WDW and DL history and it only has two rides ???
But I can drop 200 on a saber and 20-30 on a bubbly drink - - 50-100 for a droid?

I know they want our money - - but our family needs more to do to get us there.

 

[HongKongFu]

.....At least Kongs Que, story and set up is amazing

And that is exactly what I meant by parts of Kong are stellar.