Is attendance really down at WDW this or…

Tha Realest

Tha Realest

Well-Known Member
PREMiERdrum said:
This practice changed with the more recent rounds of room renovations. There were some - ahem - interesting discoveries at a few key moderates.

Power isn't cut and HVAC remains active, albeit a bit more restrained.
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Do tell.

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Drdcm

Drdcm

Well-Known Member
jpeden said:
If you take the promo off there are more resorts well under this, including Riverside, Coronado, and French Quarter.

But as was noted earlier they’re taking resort sections offline to make it look more full to try and drive people into what I can only assume they hope are FOMO bookings.
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That’s interesting. It only shows me the correct standard rate if I go in, select the specific resort, and select room only. Otherwise it tells me a standard and package rate all over $700
 
Willmark

Willmark

Well-Known Member
PREMiERdrum said:
They were hoping to discount their way out of it. It was too little too late, as I said, so this "solution" is super obvious to guests and shareholders alike.

A broken pricing model and failure to read the market brought them here. Arrogantly clinging to these factors will keep them here.
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Great thoughts here and building off them.

History is littered with companies harmed by hubris, Disney is no different.

While I don't think they will fail per se, they are unlikely to regain their "undisputed crown" as it were. What do I mean? For one the fan base is fractured, you aren't getting everyone back (rightly or wrongly). Throw in any other number of factors from inflation, to value, to everything in between, you name it and here Disney finds itself.

Without getting too political: a theme park on Disney's right is only a matter of time IMO. Proposerous? Never going to happen? Person X saying: "I'd NEVER go to such a place!" Respectfully to said person: that is prescisely my point. You would never go there but others will, the reverse is likewise true on a long enough timeline.

Another example: the Boy Scouts. Setting aside all of their own issues one of the biggest they faced? The Mormon Church split from them after being one of the biggest donors and having a huge number of troops within the organization. They went off and formed Trail Life USA as an alternative. That is no different than a established website that loses a number of posters who branch off and form their own site because of the old site not being "home" anymore. I was a mod and Admin for various sites for years, I've seen it happen. The split of Trail Life USA and a future not-Disney park in the fan base is not if but rather when IMO. Granted a website/forum is far smaller in scale but the idea is the same. America and the fans of Disney are growing apart, not together. I don't see that changing anytime soon.

Can't happen to Disney? Sure it can. I can very easily see the park that is being announced in Oklahoma succeeding. Why? Because this isn't even ten years ago. There is no stuffing the genie back in the bottle as customers further fragment. It will appeal to some folks if for no other reason then it's not Disney.

IMO its but one part of a larger whole. Again ten years ago fans were largely in unison with the same common dreams and ideas. And that manifested itself in Disney or a Disney vacation. That cut across all lines.

I don't think that is the case any longer.
 
PREMiERdrum

PREMiERdrum

Well-Known Member
Willmark said:
Great thoughts here and building off them.

History is littered with companies harmed by hubris, Disney is no different.

While I don't think they will fail per se, they are unlikely to regain their "undisputed crown" as it were. What do I mean? For one the fan base is fractured, you aren't getting everyone back (rightly or wrongly). Throw in any other number of factors from inflation, to value, to everything in between, you name it and here Disney finds itself.

Without getting too political: a theme park on Disney's right is only a matter of time IMO. Proposerous? Never going to happen? Person X saying: "I'd NEVER go to such a place!" Respectfully to said person: that is prescisely my point. You would never go there but others will, the reverse is likewise true on a long enough timeline.

Another example: the Boy Scouts. Setting aside all of their own issues one of the biggest they faced? The Mormon Church split from them after being one of the biggest donors and having a huge number of troops within the organization. They went off and formed Trail Life USA as an alternative. That is no different than a established website that loses a number of posters who branch off and form their own site because of the old site not being "home" anymore. I was a mod and Admin for various sites for years, I've seen it happen. The split of Trail Life USA and a future not-Disney park in the fan base is not if but rather when IMO. Granted a website/forum is far smaller in scale but the idea is the same. America and the fans of Disney are growing apart, no together. I don't see that changing anytime soon.

Can't happen to Disney? Sure it can. I can very easily see the park that is being announced in Oklahomla succeeding. Why? Because this isn't even ten years ago. There is no stuffing the genie back in the bottle as customers further fragment. It will appeal to some folks if for no other reason then it's not Disney.

IMO its but one part of a larger whole. Again ten years ago fans were largely in unison with the same common dreams and ideas. And that manifested itself in Disney.

I don't think that is the case any longer.
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Exactly right.

Exposing one's mortality is dangerous when they lack humility.
 
crispy

crispy

Well-Known Member
EPCOT-O.G. said:
Lack humility, you say?

View attachment 736366View attachment 736367
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Pure hubris. I think Disney fans overlooked how Disney overpriced everything for years. Then they started cutting. They just assumed that everyone would continue to buy whatever junk they threw at them.

This is silly, but I think one of the biggest wake-up calls for me was when one of the Disney influencers did a review praising a bag of tortilla chips and a tub of fake cheese like it was a gourmet meal because it came from Disney. Disney invested more into creating a fake image than in their parks. Disney may be too big to fail, but it's not too big too splinter. Sometimes a slow death is worse than a big dramatic fall.
 
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G

Gearbm95

Member
Willmark said:
Great thoughts here and building off them.

History is littered with companies harmed by hubris, Disney is no different.

While I don't think they will fail per se, they are unlikely to regain their "undisputed crown" as it were. What do I mean? For one the fan base is fractured, you aren't getting everyone back (rightly or wrongly). Throw in any other number of factors from inflation, to value, to everything in between, you name it and here Disney finds itself.

Without getting too political: a theme park on Disney's right is only a matter of time IMO. Proposerous? Never going to happen? Person X saying: "I'd NEVER go to such a place!" Respectfully to said person: that is prescisely my point. You would never go there but others will, the reverse is likewise true on a long enough timeline.

Another example: the Boy Scouts. Setting aside all of their own issues one of the biggest they faced? The Mormon Church split from them after being one of the biggest donors and having a huge number of troops within the organization. They went off and formed Trail Life USA as an alternative. That is no different than a established website that loses a number of posters who branch off and form their own site because of the old site not being "home" anymore. I was a mod and Admin for various sites for years, I've seen it happen. The split of Trail Life USA and a future not-Disney park in the fan base is not if but rather when IMO. Granted a website/forum is far smaller in scale but the idea is the same. America and the fans of Disney are growing apart, not together. I don't see that changing anytime soon.

Can't happen to Disney? Sure it can. I can very easily see the park that is being announced in Oklahoma succeeding. Why? Because this isn't even ten years ago. There is no stuffing the genie back in the bottle as customers further fragment. It will appeal to some folks if for no other reason then it's not Disney.

IMO its but one part of a larger whole. Again ten years ago fans were largely in unison with the same common dreams and ideas. And that manifested itself in Disney or a Disney vacation. That cut across all lines.

I don't think that is the case any longer.
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That park in OK is never going to be built, and if it was it wouldn’t be a national attraction. No offense, but there’s not much to do in OK compared to FL or CA.
 
John park hopper

John park hopper

Well-Known Member
HauntedPirate said:
The government has changed how inflation is calculated (and reported) to show inflation to be lower than it actually was/is. By the pre-1990 method of measuring inflation, it was close to 15% last year and still around 8-9% today. If you go back to the way it was calculated prior to 1980, it was closer to 18% last year. What sounds better: "Inflation was 8.1% last month" or "Inflation was 15.7% last month"?
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Thank you for showing that, many people don't have a clue how the inflation rate has been manipulated to show a much lower rate. The government did this to make it look better than what it really is.
 
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Willmark

Willmark

Well-Known Member
Gearbm95 said:
That park in OK is never going to be built, and if it was it wouldn’t be a national attraction. No offense, but there’s not much to do in OK compared to FL or CA.
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There wasn’t much to do right where WDW is now before it existed either.

My point is the days of WDW having an exclusive hold over customers they previously enjoyed are over or close to it.

That’s what I’m trying to say with avoiding politics.
 
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AEfx

AEfx

Well-Known Member
Gearbm95 said:
That park in OK is never going to be built, and if it was it wouldn’t be a national attraction. No offense, but there’s not much to do in OK compared to FL or CA.
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Why does anything else need to be there? Orlando was a bunch of swampland before Disney came.

If they build an full resort that you can spend a week at, then it doesn't matter if it's in the middle of nowhere or not.

Willmark said:
There wasn’t much to do right where WDW is now before it existed either.

My point is the days of WDW having an exclusive hold over customers they previously enjoyed are over or close to it.
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I agree, and even more so because Disney has so lacked in achievement for truly impressive attractions for such a long time, that they no longer are the undisputed champion on that level, either. The majority of the most impressive rides at WDW were built 30-50 years ago.

It makes me think of "WWWD" (What Would Walt Do) - while this is often brought up with a lot of naivety, and and arguments about it usually are actually contrary to what we actually know about the man, indulge me for a moment. Can you imagine if Walt really was frozen, and they woke him up in the middle of Disneyland today. He starts walking around, thinks the place is in pretty decent shape. Checks out some of the newer attractions. Then he says, "BTW guys, what year is it?" and they tell him 2023...I daresay he would go batcrap crazy, "You have had 60 years to innovate and advance and...THIS?? is what you have come up with? I thought it was 1975..."
 
D

DisneyHead123

Well-Known Member
Willmark said:
My point is the days of WDW having an exclusive hold over customers they previously enjoyed are over or close to it.

That’s what I’m trying to say with avoiding politics.
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I think things will get better in terms of polarization. The success of the Barbie movie this summer seems to imply the country is already grudgingly agreeing on a sort of middle ground that most can feel relatively good about.

That said, I still agree with you - not because of cultural divide but because of supply and demand. The demand for Disney has gone up so exponentially it would defy the laws of the free market if imitators didn’t crop up. Granted, there are other theme parks, but they tend to be garbled collections of rides. In terms of heavy theming and a resort feel, they have few true competitors. And there’s also a big market for a Disney-like experience at a truly middle class (not upper middle class or lower upper class and so on - solid middle class) price point. I keep saying, we’re in an experience economy now. I don’t see that changing anytime soon. Theme-park-resort-hybrids are an experience that’s in huge demand.
 
TheMaxRebo

TheMaxRebo

Well-Known Member
Looking at reported wait times again compared to past years and noticed that they seem to be a bit higher (or towards the upper end) earlier in the day and dropping during the afternoon before spiking in the evening

Also fits with an anecdote I heard reported from a CM that seeing lots of people returning ECVs around 3pm and then coming back to get them again at 7pm

1691592696954.png
 
Willmark

Willmark

Well-Known Member
AEfx said:
Why does anything else need to be there? Orlando was a bunch of swampland before Disney came.

If they build an full resort that you can spend a week at, then it doesn't matter if it's in the middle of nowhere or not.



I agree, and even more so because Disney has so lacked in achievement for truly impressive attractions for such a long time, that they no longer are the undisputed champion on that level, either. The majority of the most impressive rides at WDW were built 30-50 years ago.

It makes me think of "WWWD" (What Would Walt Do) - while this is often brought up with a lot of naivety, and and arguments about it usually are actually contrary to what we actually know about the man, indulge me for a moment. Can you imagine if Walt really was frozen, and they woke him up in the middle of Disneyland today. He starts walking around, thinks the place is in pretty decent shape. Checks out some of the newer attractions. Then he says, "BTW guys, what year is it?" and they tell him 2023...I daresay he would go batcrap crazy, "You have had 60 years to innovate and advance and...THIS?? is what you have come up with? I thought it was 1975..."
Click to expand...
In a lot of ways Disney is coasting on its reputation that took time to build.

Their precipitous drop in trust rankings shows they are destroying in but a few years.
 

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