If Walt Disney died in 1986 instead of 1966 how do things change?

Riviera Rita

Well-Known Member
Do you think Roy would have put another solid business head to take over from him if Walt had lived? Roy was well aware of Walt's lack of financial acumen and would have made sure none of the business side would have been put on Walt's plate as time passed.
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
🤣 I hear ya. You know it's strange. I'm in my upper 40s, but I've actually come to terms with my eventual fate (whenever that should happen) which absolutely no one in history has figured out how to avoid. Some have tried through ceremonies, incantations, mummification, what have you, but none have succeeded. Anyway, after decades of fearing that inevitable end, I think when my number is called I'll be okay with it now. Eternal peace. 😁 Although I'm in no rush.
That's good, but when you are in your mid 70's it takes on a whole new texture. I try not to think about it that much and I'd say that 70% of the time it never crosses my mind, but that other 30% I could do without.
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Do you think Roy would have put another solid business head to take over from him if Walt had lived? Roy was well aware of Walt's lack of financial acumen and would have made sure none of the business side would have been put on Walt's plate as time passed.
Walt was pretty good at the business end too, but his emphasis was on creating stuff and his ego sometimes got in the way of reality. He felt that everything he touched was going to be a colossal success. Most of it was but he quickly forgot those that fell flat. It was Walt that did most of the leg work getting the money to build Disneyland and it was a pretty complex agreement especially the roll that ABC played in it.
 

Pepper's Ghost

Well-Known Member
That's good, but when you are in your mid 70's it takes on a whole new texture. I try not to think about it that much and I'd say that 70% of the time it never crosses my mind, but that other 30% I could do without.
I started typing "I totally understand...", but obviously I won't for another 25+ years. Depending on how well one has taken care of himself/herself, there are plenty of good years left. 😁

I wonder what's worse... dying "too soon", or living past what you were able to save up for retirement? Interesting question IMO. I think that some people unfortunately live "too long". If you have the means or family to take care of you, that's excellent, but at people's most vulnerable time at extremely advanced ages, many are treated in the most inhumane way. I've seen it from a distance. It's terrible. Not sure what bucket I'll fall in, but I think I'd rather "die too young", perhaps be missed, and have something to pass on, than to live too long and be treated like a burden. *shrugs* We'll see as I approach those times though. I always tell my older siblings that I hope I'm the first to go... for so many reasons.
 

Walt Disney1955

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
I'd like to think you'd be correct. If Walt was as stubborn as reported tho, I'm sure he'd have pushed forward. That said, if he did listen to reason, maybe we'd have a better EPCOT theme park than we have now. I love the concept, but I wonder if they'd have "finished it". Now it's an unfinished world fair with IPs encroaching, and a hodge podge of rides with a different themes in a Future World that is a complete mess.
Who really knows what EPCOT looks like, had it become a theme park under Walt instead of the City of Tomorrow. Maybe better than we see, who knows. You never want to bet against Walt of course. The reason why I say this is because he wins against the entire field since his death. Take the rides he approved before he died and the ones that were there before. Since then how many original non-IP rides have been added? Honestly nothing in almost 20 years at all of WDW. The guy with the big imagination probably wins here. But do the banks let him do this? And while I know he never cared much about the shareholders but do they stop him from things too?
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
I started typing "I totally understand...", but obviously I won't for another 25+ years. Depending on how well one has taken care of himself/herself, there are plenty of good years left. 😁

I wonder what's worse... dying "too soon", or living past what you were able to save up for retirement? Interesting question IMO. I think that some people unfortunately live "too long". If you have the means or family to take care of you, that's excellent, but at people's most vulnerable time at extremely advanced ages, many are treated in the most inhumane way. I've seen it from a distance. It's terrible. Not sure what bucket I'll fall in, but I think I'd rather "die too young", perhaps be missed, and have something to pass on, than to live too long and be treated like a burden. *shrugs* We'll see as I approach those times though. I always tell my older siblings that I hope I'm the first to go... for so many reasons.
You, my friend, just hit on my deepest fear. I didn't get a lot of years to save up for retirement. Most of my work life 401's never even existed and only major companies had pension plans and there weren't many of those in Vermont. I have had a lot of non-life threatening medical problems, but a couple of more serious ones that I recovered from so other than those mediocre problems I am relatively healthy. That said, all the crap of the last 6 years has whittled away at my savings/retirement to the point where I am starting to get scared of the future and what it means for me if all I have left is SS. On top of that I have to listen to the rich people crap about how I don't need it and should just pull myself up by my bootstraps. Meanwhile we keep paying them to do nothing and they will retire with massive income paid for by us. It all seems so hopeless. I, like you said, would rather die young than be dependent on my children to keep me alive.

I did everything I could to unintentionally die young, but here I am almost 3/4 of a century old and in spite all odds am still upright and taking nourishment. This is without a doubt the scariest part of life that I have ever experienced and that's including a year in a war.
 

Pepper's Ghost

Well-Known Member
Who really knows what EPCOT looks like, had it become a theme park under Walt instead of the City of Tomorrow. Maybe better than we see, who knows. You never want to bet against Walt of course. The reason why I say this is because he wins against the entire field since his death. Take the rides he approved before he died and the ones that were there before. Since then how many original non-IP rides have been added? Honestly nothing in almost 20 years at all of WDW. The guy with the big imagination probably wins here. But do the banks let him do this? And while I know he never cared much about the shareholders but do they stop him from things too?
Another interesting subject. What was the last non-IP ride that's been built. I honestly don't know. Everything I can think of going back at least 15 years is an IP of some kind. Do we have to go back to Expedition Everest? That's 17 years old this year. SoC was before that, but another fantastic ride. Mission Space is about 20 years old. 2 of those 3 were fantastic rides and none IP focused. I say "were" because SoC is gone and Everest isn't the ride it was designed to be. I personally like Mission Space, but I never rode Horizons so I don't hold the same resentment so many others have.

Can anyone think of a recent original ride without the use of Star Wars, Avatar, Tron, etc.? I can't.
 

Pepper's Ghost

Well-Known Member
You, my friend, just hit on my deepest fear. I didn't get a lot of years to save up for retirement. Most of my work life 401's never even existed and only major companies had pension plans and there weren't many of those in Vermont. I have had a lot of non-life threatening medical problems, but a couple of more serious ones that I recovered from so other than those mediocre problems I am relatively healthy. That said, all the crap of the last 6 years has whittled away at my savings/retirement to the point where I am starting to get scared of the future and what it means for me if all I have left is SS. On top of that I have to listen to the rich people crap about how I don't need it and should just pull myself up by my bootstraps. Meanwhile we keep paying them to do nothing and they will retire with massive income paid for by us. It all seems so hopeless. I, like you said, would rather die young than be dependent on my children to keep me alive.

I did everything I could to unintentionally die young, but here I am almost 3/4 of a century old and in spite all odds am still upright and taking nourishment. This is without a doubt the scariest part of life that I have ever experienced and that's including a year in a war.
Based on my original post, I can understand because I've thought about it. Hopefully your family will step in whether you like it or not. 😁 You should celebrate relatively good health, and going forward your family should be taking YOU to WDW! 😁 You took them (however often) for the first 15 to 20 years of their lives. They should start taking you for the next 25+ years of yours and of course any other needs you have.
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Based on my original post, I can understand because I've thought about it. Hopefully your family will step in whether you like it or not. 😁 You should celebrate relatively good health, and going forward your family should be taking YOU to WDW! 😁 You took them (however often) for the first 15 to 20 years of their lives. They should start taking you for the next 25+ years of yours and of course any other needs you have.
First off, I have to express how much^ I love your optimism! I wonder which rides I could go on at 100. I suspect that Haunted Mansion would be a little to close to reality to be entertaining, especially if they're still at 999 haunts when I get there. 😄😇
 

Walt Disney1955

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Another interesting subject. What was the last non-IP ride that's been built. I honestly don't know. Everything I can think of going back at least 15 years is an IP of some kind. Do we have to go back to Expedition Everest? That's 17 years old this year. SoC was before that, but another fantastic ride. Mission Space is about 20 years old. 2 of those 3 were fantastic rides and none IP focused. I say "were" because SoC is gone and Everest isn't the ride it was designed to be. I personally like Mission Space, but I never rode Horizons so I don't hold the same resentment so many others have.

Can anyone think of a recent original ride without the use of Star Wars, Avatar, Tron, etc.? I can't.

I was going to think about Everest as well. Certainly the last big notable attraction built without an IP attached to it. Is it actually the last? Can't be, can it? Mickey and Minnie's railroad I guess you can say is at least not based on a movie and just a pure Disney attraction. It isn't like I mind the rides based on the movies, some of them are great, it is just that it ought to be a part of the park, not all of the new ideas.
 

Touchdown

Well-Known Member
Epcot would have bankrupted the company. There was a fundamental flaw in the planning that could not have been fixed, mainly the idea that citizens of Epcot were only supposed to live there for a few years. Even though not everyone does, everyone hopes that when they move they will be there for a prolonged time, especially if children are involved. Financially living in Epcot would be a financial cost.

Additionally how exactly are are you supposed to foster a feeling of community when you are only there for a short time? Walt Disney was an amazing person but he was an entertainer he was not a civil engineer. Epcot, for the first project in his life, has nothing to do with entertainment he was totally out of his depth. There is absolutely a reason Roy scrapped it.
 

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