If Disney wants to "lower Attendance" then Build a 5th Park..

[Queen of the WDW Scene]

Since you state you would not go it's a win - win for you because the other parks will be way less crowded. You will have more of the other parks to yourself.

I do not disagree with that but I'm just expressing why Disney wouldn't make out as well doing it that way.

 

[Djsfantasi]

Im not waiting another 8 years for Disney to build a new 5th gate, they wont-not if the can continue to charge for every breath visitors take, and the not already money pinching ideas not implemented already. While reviewing my December reservation, I noticed that housekeeping choices were none- and every other day. Soon they will charge even more, for guests to clean their own rooms,, just because.

Housekeeping changes are due to Covid. By minimizing your contact with Mousekeepers (and vicey versey, they good to avoid an embarrassing and costly outbreak.

 

[RollerCoaster]

They still have loads of room in the existing parks to add things that would take the stress off overall. But, they can't. They no longer even have the imagineers that a capable of creating that many new things. Even if you advocated for them to build a nostalgia park by rebuilding attractions that once existed the don't have the people that have a single clue with the ability to even recreate 50 year old technology. They cost to much to have on staff. Maybe someday, if they keep going, but first they need to fill the parks they have.

What in the world! Disney's Imagineering department has plenty of talent and bodies to create more attractions than the parks can handle. This has nothing to do with staffing numbers but instead is purely budget-driven.

 

[RollerCoaster]

If Disney really wanted to spread out the crowds (as they should) they should expand existing parks and open up way more people eater shows and attractions. They haven’t even reopened all the shows from before the pandemic and they seem to like replacing/redoing existing rides moreso than designing and expanding with new ones. Their thought process behind that other than cost is mind boggling

If they want immediate relief they should maintain the status quo and not reimplement FastPass in the new form of Genie+ and Lighting Lane.

The virtual queue stuff is directly responsible for how crowded the walkways, restaurants, stores, and stand-by queues are. However, they drive in-park spending.

 

[RollerCoaster]

But they want their guests to go to all the parks which means all of the parks need things that interest everyone in the party.
If they built a Star Wars park I wouldn't go. Having Star Wars represented in a park that I already like aspects of makes me more likely to also give the Star Wars section a chance.

If they built an all-around great theme park you would go even if you weren't a Star Wars fan. It's a childish argument to make that you wouldn't go when you don't even know what they would build. The majority of the population enjoys the StarWars films and most are not super fans.

 

[Queen of the WDW Scene]

If they built an all-around great theme park you would go even if you weren't a Star Wars fan. It's a childish argument to make that you wouldn't go when you don't even know what they would build. The majority of the population enjoys the StarWars films and most are not super fans.

And it's a childish argument for a Star Wars fan to just assume everyone else in the world is or should be and tell me that I'd go.

 

["El Gran Magnifico"]

I'd rather they focus on improving the existing parks before making a go at a new one. There are still areas in each park that can be built on. Additionally, there are attractions that have outlived their shelf lives. Might be an unpopular opinion but I think things like The Tomorrowland Speedway needs to go or at the very least be modernized. Same with TSI, Dinosaur, Dinorama, the unused pavilion space at EPCOT, the area to the north BTMRR (where several rides have always been speculated to go) etc. Each park still has space.

Disney also has a lot of things it can work to improve on. There's a lot they can do at FW in Pioneer Hall area, maybe a Boardwalk revamp and extend some of that space slightly past ESPN Club.

 

[drizgirl]

I'd rather they focus on improving the existing parks before making a go at a new one. There are still areas in each park that can be built on. Additionally, there are attractions that have outlived their shelf lives. Might be an unpopular opinion but I think things like The Tomorrowland Speedway needs to go or at the very least be modernized. Same with TSI, Dinosaur, Dinorama, the unused pavilion space at EPCOT, the area to the north BTMRR (where several rides have always been speculated to go) etc. Each park still has space.

Disney also has a lot of things it can work to improve on. There's a lot they can do at FW in Pioneer Hall area, maybe a Boardwalk revamp and extend some of that space slightly past ESPN Club.

They don't want to add a new park. And they don't want to do more than fiddle at the edges (replacing rides rather than add new ones) in the existing parks.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

The theme parks are once again packed, even during COVID.

View attachment 585610

View attachment 585611


It's not just attractions that are crowded. It's walkways, buses, bathrooms, restaurants, and stores. Jamming more attractions into overstressed infrastructure does not solve the problem, which is that people need to feel they are not being crushed together throughout the entire day:

View attachment 585613

Was this today? We did Labor Day weekend and it was weird. Friday morning was completely dead. We walked on things all morning. Then at lunch time, it was like a switch flipped and the place was a zoo for the rest of Friday and all day Saturday and Sunday.

 

[Goofyernmost]

What in the world! Disney's Imagineering department has plenty of talent and bodies to create more attractions than the parks can handle. This has nothing to do with staffing numbers but instead is purely budget-driven.

Then why are they paying all those talented people. If it is all budget driven they don't need most of them or, at the very least there aren't as many as before when they were always creating new stuff.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

What in the world! Disney's Imagineering department has plenty of talent and bodies to create more attractions than the parks can handle. This has nothing to do with staffing numbers but instead is purely budget-driven.

You need to understand the culture at Imagineering.

A ride might cost a reasonable, sane company with appropriate controls $300m. Imagineering demands a budget of $400m. Finance says they can have $375m and people call that a $25m budget cut.

 

[Gottliebjess]

I'd rather they focus on improving the existing parks before making a go at a new one. There are still areas in each park that can be built on. Additionally, there are attractions that have outlived their shelf lives. Might be an unpopular opinion but I think things like The Tomorrowland Speedway needs to go or at the very least be modernized. Same with TSI, Dinosaur, Dinorama, the unused pavilion space at EPCOT, the area to the north BTMRR (where several rides have always been speculated to go) etc. Each park still has space.

Disney also has a lot of things it can work to improve on. There's a lot they can do at FW in Pioneer Hall area, maybe a Boardwalk revamp and extend some of that space slightly past ESPN Club.

Why don’t they make Speedway Candy Crush from Wreck-It-Ralph. It fits into the Tomorrowland and it’s a good transitional piece for Tomorrowland and Fantasy Land?

 

[RollerCoaster]

Then why are they paying all those talented people. If it is all budget driven they don't need most of them or, at the very least there aren't as many as before when they were always creating new stuff.

I think you should visit the parks more often. Clearly, you've missed what they've built in the past 20 years.

Pandora, Galaxy's Edge, Toy Story Land, Mickey & Minnie's Runaway Railway, Cars Land, Avengers Campus, Fantasyland Redo at Magic Kingdom, Seven Dwarfs Mine Train, Soarin', Disney's California Adventure Park, Little Mermaid Dark Ride, the 20-years of tinkering and changes at Disney's California Adventure Park, Guardians of the Galaxy Mission Breakout, Frozen Ever After, and Disney Springs. Let's not forget the upcoming Guardians Coaster at EPCOT, TRON at Magic Kingdom, and the Rat Ride in France.

They're creating plenty of new stuff. You're just not giving them credit because you don't like what they're building.

 

[jloucks]

If Disney truly wants to " lower attendance" to avoid over crowding in the parks.. Build a 5th Park for the "overflow.." and not price us out of the parks on a whole.. because right now.. I am coming to the park One More Time.. and after that.. Disney can kiss my grits.. i just hope that I can have a great time and not be totally ticked off the whole time I am there..
but this theory of over crowding.. Fine.. you have more money then anyone.. Build a 5th park. and since you have so much money.. DO IT IN A YEAR and not drag your butt about it..
but do not tell us that this is about "overcrowding".. it does not fly with anyone.

"Induced Demand"

Long story short as to why an additional park or two, or three would not help. In fact, if would only make the Orlando area even more attractive and increase demand. ....and create larger crowds.

The ONLY thing that will decrease demand is price.

....or maybe a new super nasty Covid strain.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

A 5th park probably wouldn’t have a big impact on crowding because it would just encourage most guests to add another day to their trip. It may spread out the locals more but tourists flying across the country aren’t going to skip another park to see it, they’ll just add another day.

Even if they did skip another park to do it it won’t be MK, the park that desperately needs fewer people. HS and AK might see small decreases but they are the thinnest parks already and would benefit more from expansions than fewer people.

 

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[Goofyernmost]

I think you should visit the parks more often. Clearly, you've missed what they've built in the past 20 years.

Pandora, Galaxy's Edge, Toy Story Land, Mickey & Minnie's Runaway Railway, Cars Land, Avengers Campus, Fantasyland Redo at Magic Kingdom, Seven Dwarfs Mine Train, Soarin', Disney's California Adventure Park, Little Mermaid Dark Ride, the 20-years of tinkering and changes at Disney's California Adventure Park, Guardians of the Galaxy Mission Breakout, Frozen Ever After, and Disney Springs. Let's not forget the upcoming Guardians Coaster at EPCOT, TRON at Magic Kingdom, and the Rat Ride in France.

They're creating plenty of new stuff. You're just not giving them credit because you don't like what they're building.

Pandora is nice and it only took them 5 years to make it happen and the imagineer no longer is with Disney. Galaxy's Edge is very well done front to back, give them a few points. Toy story land OK for the landscaping, but only one new attraction (small coaster, no frills) and another borrowed from California. Mickey & Minnie, quite a good one. The mine train is good but a spectacular coaster, not even close. Soarin goes back to the DL 50th in 2005 and was built in California first. Everyone seems to agree that the original was great and the new one created by the new imagineers, Meh! Little Mermaid has a spectacular queue, the ride just barely worthy of praise and is also in Disneyland. Disney California Adventure had to be almost completely rebuilt and as you say that took 20 years. Guardians I have never seen simply because it isn't open yet, along with Tron (already in China I think) and both are coasters. The Galaxy in California destroyed a spectacular attraction known as the Tower of Terror. I've never seen it and will never see it. The rat ride has been in Paris for years. Not a lot of use of all those highly paid imagineers really. So that is about 9 or 10 new attractions in as many years. Not to huge a production record. Disneyland was built in one year and all of Epcot in 3 years. I think that Frozen is a major improvement over Maelstrom and Disney Springs was designed by almost any Shopping area could do without any input from an Imagineer. It's just really nothing but stores, but whoever came up with the tethered balloon should get a creative ability award.

A question though when did I say I didn't like what they are building? There is not a ride in Disney that I won't ride except Space Mountain which hurts my back, but coasters are not my favorites and I don't think they should be. We can go to six flags if we just want coasters. If a coaster has a real story, like Big thunder or the Mine train I am more likely to support it. But, I am not going to give a lot of creative credit until I see if they are really deserving.

 

[RollerCoaster]

"Induced Demand"

Long story short as to why an additional park or two, or three would not help. In fact, if would only make the Orlando area even more attractive and increase demand. ....and create larger crowds.

The ONLY thing that will decrease demand is price.

....or maybe a new super nasty Covid strain.

Actually, if you look at the history of Walt Disney World your statement is not true.

When Disney has built new parks in the past the actual demand has been far less than projected. The new parks didn't significantly increase the length of stay or generate as much attendance as Disney projected. I feel the reason is the new parks have largely been incomplete. Universal's Islands of Adventure was the last theme park built in Orlando that basically offered a complete experience on day one. You can't say that for the Disney's MGM-Studios or Animal Kingdom and I would argue that even today both parks are still very light on rides, shows, and attractions.

Outside of Japan and maybe Shanghai the best example of a complete park built by Disney is in fact California Adventure. While far from perfect, the park opened with a full slate of attractions. I've long felt it is the most underrated Disney theme park and today offers a better experience than any of the Orlando parks, except Magic Kingdom.

So building something new doesn't equate to larger crowds.

I still stand with what I stated that virtual queues are largely to blame for the overcrowding within the Disney parks.

 

[AshaNeOmah]

Disneys ideal guests are families with household incomes of $200k-$300K. People who are uber-wealthy aren’t going to Disney. It’s no surprise that virtually everything Disney offers in terms of up charge events, merchandise, food, hotels, DVC, etc is catered to this demographic. These are the people that will spend a week or two in Disney, drop $15K and do it again next year. It’s the reason why all the deluxe resorts are fully open and the moderates and values are only partially. It’s the reason why they know Genie++++++ and new AP prices are going to work for them. They know exactly who’s spending the money, what they’re willing to tolerate, and what they want in terms of services/options for their trips to Disney.

While I think you're probably right, that's 6% or less of US households. It just sounds like a failing strategy.

 

[vfr1952]

If Disney truly wants to " lower attendance" to avoid over crowding in the parks.. Build a 5th Park for the "overflow.." and not price us out of the parks on a whole.. because right now.. I am coming to the park One More Time.. and after that.. Disney can kiss my grits.. i just hope that I can have a great time and not be totally ticked off the whole time I am there..
but this theory of over crowding.. Fine.. you have more money then anyone.. Build a 5th park. and since you have so much money.. DO IT IN A YEAR and not drag your butt about it..
but do not tell us that this is about "overcrowding".. it does not fly with anyone.

And stop building hotels/resorts/vacation club villas. They keep building more rooms to accommodate more visitors. Of course, the parks are crowded!