Hurricane Irma

[Master Yoda]

In 2001 I moved into a brand new building/midrise East Ft Laud... they boasted "hurricane proof windows", extremely safe building codes! In 2004 I moved to a brand new condo/mid/highrise in East Boca Raton.. they boasted "hurricane proof windows" extremely safe building codes!! Windows and glass doors were extremely heavy. I felt safe staying in an evac zone.

Obviously my neighbors experienced what that "hurricane proof glass" actually was. It shattered when a palm branch hit it. Several stories up.

I do think even those buildings are more safe than the ones built previously, as in @JoeCamel's photo. But they are definitely not resilient. I hope people realize that and don't feel safe enough to stay.

Do the ones built post 2005 have a different standard of windows?



I spent most of the day searching for flights out of Key West or any of the 3 SoFla airports. Coworker walks in my office and says "These people should expect their homes to be flattened and should not rebuild. Stupid to live in that area. No one should live in a place that connects 100 miles by bridges. Worst idea ever. It shouldn't be part of the USA."

(Oops, meant to quote your previous post on this one)

I think the change happened in the 2008 code.

 

[JoeCamel]

Opinions please, I have family in Disney right now, including a baby. They are having a wonderful time, are totally caught up in enjoying their vacation, and don't seem to be at all aware of the coming danger. They are scheduled to fly back home to Baltimore from Orlando via Southwest Airlines on Saturday evening. Are they okay to just keep their heads in the bubble, or should those of us at home paying attention to this storm be insisting they leave early. I appreciate your thoughts on this. I've been reading along here but I'm having trouble understanding the timeline of the storm. Thank you.

They are OK

 

[Princess Leia]

As someone who has lived in Canada all of his life, after reading everything on this thread, I don't think I'll worry/complain as much anymore when we get the huge snowstorms that dump 1-2' of snow on us. Stay safe everyone.

I agree. I'm used to the crazy amounts of snow some winters have brought, but I cannot fathom 50 inches of rain (Harvey) or 175 mph winds (Irma).

Also, Irma and Harvey sound like the names of the little old neighbors down the street who sit out on their porch and give you cookies, not the names of criminals who break into your house, throw your things in every direction, and dump water everywhere.

 

[21stamps]

I think the change happened in the 2008 code.

So basically, a very slim minority of condo owners actually have the new windows.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

Reports of gusts of 225mph.

That's the highest I've ever heard of.

 

[Laketravis]

At the time of Wilma, impact resistant windows were only required at 30' or below, but the big problem was the impact windows themselves.

The test a window had to pass at the time to meet the qualifications of an impact resistant window was not an accurate analog. Because of this tempered glass often passed and could be classified as "impact resistant". While tempered glass is stronger than non-tempered, when it fails, it fails catastrophically.

The test was revised along with the code requiring an impact resistant window to remain intact after it has shattered. To date, I only know of laminated windows that can live up to the test.

However, I have little doubt many older buildings still claim "impact resistant windows" even though they don't meet the current definition.

The highest recorded wind speed in Port Aransas when Harvey made landfall Friday night was 132 mph. This past weekend I saw homes built in the last 4-5 years still standing with minimal damage. Steel roofs intact, windows intact, siding intact. Some hardiboard trim ripped off but that's about it. The older homes were decimated, literally flattened. One of the newer hotels on the island closest to the surf suffered extensive exterior damage and the first floor interior was pretty much wiped out from the storm surge:

It was the RV parks and mobile homes that you can't find a trace of anymore.

 

[JoeCamel]

In 2001 I moved into a brand new building/midrise East Ft Laud... they boasted "hurricane proof windows", extremely safe building codes! In 2004 I moved to a brand new condo/mid/highrise in East Boca Raton.. they boasted "hurricane proof windows" extremely safe building codes!! Windows and glass doors were extremely heavy. I felt safe staying in an evac zone.

Obviously my neighbors experienced what that "hurricane proof glass" actually was. It shattered when a palm branch hit it. Several stories up.

I do think even those buildings are more safe than the ones built previously, as in @JoeCamel's photo. But they are definitely not resilient. I hope people realize that and don't feel safe enough to stay.

Do the ones built post 2005 have a different standard of windows?



I spent most of the day searching for flights out of Key West or any of the 3 SoFla airports. Coworker walks in my office and says "These people should expect their homes to be flattened and should not rebuild. Stupid to live in that area. No one should live in a place that connects 100 miles by bridges. Worst idea ever. It shouldn't be part of the USA."

(Oops, meant to quote your previous post on this one)

Pretty sure if this comes through as forecasted 7 mile will be gone.

 

[Souvenir]

As it stands now, impacts to Florida will be Sunday. The mixture willl be a lot clearer towards the end of the week, so for now, I would leave them to their vacation.

They are OK

Thank you for the replies.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

Pretty sure if this comes through as forecasted 7 mile will be gone.

Again. Sigh.

 

[21stamps]

Reports of gusts of 225mph.

That's the highest I've ever heard of.

I think the Labor Day hurricane had 200+ miles gusts.. I don't think many people alive have seen anything like that since. The Keys can't withstand that, not even in 2017.

 

[Master Yoda]

So basically, a very slim minority of condo owners actually have the new windows.

Most likely.

There are ways you can tell if you have laminated impact windows.

http://www.storm-solutions.net/blog/how-do-i-know-if-my-windows-are-impact-resistant

 

[Master Yoda]

I think the Labor Day hurricane had 200+ miles gusts.. I don't think many people alive have seen anything like that since. The Keys can't withstand that, not even in 2017.

Nothing in the current code goes that high. The Keys peak out at 180 mpg 3 second gust.

Designing to 200 mph is possible, but your house will basically be a concrete dome with no windows.

 

[LAKid53]

I agree with everything but the Beer. Get plenty of that too. You can make many friends when you say "we need to drink the beer before it gets warm".

But don't get beer in lieu of water.....

The after storm block parties can be fun. Lots of grilled steak, chicken, hot dogs....and warm beer....

 

[LAKid53]

Or we could stop allowing buildings there. That is a subject for another time but it needs to be raised.

But no one wants to live in Mayo. They all want that house/condo on the beach....

 

[21stamps]

Most likely.

There are ways you can tell if you have laminated impact windows.

http://www.storm-solutions.net/blog/how-do-i-know-if-my-windows-are-impact-resistant

This sounds exactly like what we told that we had. My neighbors glass shattered within the glass, but then completely gave out after struck again. I have no idea what it was.

Nothing in the current code goes that high. The Keys peak out at 180 mpg 3 second gust.

Designing to 200 mph is possible, but your house will basically be a concrete dome with no windows.

How much of Key West or any of the Keys do you think is built under the current code?

As someone knowledgeable about structures, do you think the homes/apartments and condos in the Keys can survive this? As well as Pigeon Key, and the Seven Mile Bridge?

 

[shipley731]

I agree with everything but the Beer. Get plenty of that too. You can make many friends when you say "we need to drink the beer before it gets warm".

My husband recommends scotch as one doesn't need ice...

 

[LAKid53]

Closed door single car garage for me so having the door up would be very much on my mind.

Recently replaced my old 1980s wooden door with a new steel, insulated one that means code. My problem? Windows, lots of them. Fortunately, the clerestory windows are small.

 

[LAKid53]

Where required, Large Missile Impact Resistant glass is only required up to 30’-0” with Small Missile Impact Redistance above that. There is no such thing as hurricane proof. There are also wind pressure requirements but they still have a limit.

Quite frankly, the only really good solution is hurricane shutters. Not cheap and a pain to put up and take down. Spent many a week or two after a storm was predicted to hit Miami waiting for my dad to take down the shutters.

 

[Master Yoda]

This sounds exactly like what we told that we had. My neighbors glass shattered within the glass, but then completely gave out after struck again. I have no idea what it was.


How much of Key West or any of the Keys do you think is built under the current code?

As someone knowledgeable about structures, do you think the homes/apartments and condos in the Keys can survive this? As well as Pigeon Key, and the Seven Mile Bridge?

No clue. I an in North Florida so i don't often see much south of Flagler county. The closest I got to having to deal with designing with wind speeds that high was when I did the trusses some of the buildings for the expansion at Castaway Cay back in 2008-2009.

 

[LAKid53]

My husband recommends scotch as one doesn't need ice...

My dad would agree with your husband...