How Disney can get Marvel for WDW

[Jon81uk]

Isn't the Uni announcement August 1 the Nintendo park?

It’s not a Nintendo park.

See https://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads...expansion-complex.939736/page-38#post-8799391
and

Universal Orlando to reveal 'Major News' at press conference next week

https://www.wesh.com/article/universal-orlando-new-theme-park-rumors/28521885

forums.wdwmagic.com

 

[LAKid53]

Was there some sort of clause in the contract requiring attractions of a certain quality?

Pretty much the only condition for keeping the license is: "Each THE MARVEL UNIVERSE shall be operated and maintained in a first class manner consistent with the highest standards of the theme park industry "

There is some debate as to whether this simply means keeping what they have now in good condition or if it implies upgrades.

 

[drizgirl]

Well, I did learn in another thread today that all you have to do is not kill people. So maybe Uni is good to go?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Well, I did learn in another thread today that all you have to do is not kill people. So maybe Uni is good to go?

It was never in question. If that deal is broken...it will only be if universal acquired rights they’d rather retrofit IOA with. But that’s probably priority #6,568 on their list.

And the other false pretense is Disney wants to acquire and pay for more marvel rides. No they don’t. Why would they when they get free revenues and advertising from the characters up the road?

They can build guardian rides instead...other properties if they want. Best of both worlds

 

[drizgirl]

It was never in question. If that deal is broken...it will only be if universal acquired rights they’d rather retrofit IOA with. But that’s probably priority #6,568 on their list.

And the other false pretense is Disney wants to acquire and pay for more marvel rides. No they don’t. Why would they when they get free revenues and advertising from the characters up the road?

They can build guardian rides instead...other properties if they want. Best of both worlds

Totally agree.

 

[SpoiledBlueMilk]

But Marvel did not license the brand to Universal they licensed the comic book representations of characters. There is no way Disney could call Universal for breach of contract because they didn't update the attractions to look like something they are expressly forbidden to use.

Ah - didn't realize that.

Oh well. Listen - can't fault a guy for trying. I'd really like Disney to get all of the characters.

 

[MurphyJoe]

I could only see Uni doing a deal for one thing- an absolute boat load of money.

Which is the reason I don't see this happening anytime soon. Universal's asking price would probably be equal to the cost of tearing out MSHI and building a new section up to their modern immersion standards. Disney would be directly funding their competition in the same target demographic as the Marvel properties. Plus, even with a deal signed, Disney would still take years to build and roll out anything substantial at WDW to see a return on their purchase. Universal, on the other hand, would have hundreds of millions of dollars to work with up front; I wouldn't be shocked to learn that Universal has multiple possibilities already sketched out to select from and develop if they sold the license back. There's not really a situation here in which Disney comes out ahead vs the current arrangement in which they get to cash checks from their competition.

 

[imperius]

When Disney finally opens a better Marvel based attraction then Spider-Man should we talk about Disney obtaining the rights from Universal.

 

[chriskbrown]

It's a very interesting situation - a classic standoff. Universal will not likely make a formal investment in Marvel IP, certainly things like Hulk or Capt. America. Disney can make investments world wide and has everywhere but WDW (see Iron Man ). Now for Disney to get IP rights to Marvel characters in WDW would be so expensive that the ROI is pretty hard to make work. Universal in all cases would make the costs so high as they would want Disney to pay for re-imaging their attractions. Locally, Cedar Fair bought out Carowinds - the Paramount IP with rides like TopGun went away and in some cases rides (some which were really tired) went away. Some of the Paramount based rides that stayed are nice but lost some of their appeal as the story is now bland/missing.

 

[marni1971]

I think you can make a layman's argument that the quality of the Marvel IP in the Universal parks aren't up to snuff with what Marvel is doing in their film properties....

Nope. Comcast are actually exceeding the terms of the contract.

 

[Bender123]

Nope. Comcast are actually exceeding the terms of the contract.

I don't think people realize exactly how desperate Marvel was when they selling off their rights to everything...The contract terms insanely one sided for Uni.

 

[lazyboy97o]

It's a very interesting situation - a classic standoff. Universal will not likely make a formal investment in Marvel IP, certainly things like Hulk or Capt. America. Disney can make investments world wide and has everywhere but WDW (see Iron Man ). Now for Disney to get IP rights to Marvel characters in WDW would be so expensive that the ROI is pretty hard to make work. Universal in all cases would make the costs so high as they would want Disney to pay for re-imaging their attractions. Locally, Cedar Fair bought out Carowinds - the Paramount IP with rides like TopGun went away and in some cases rides (some which were really tired) went away. Some of the Paramount based rides that stayed are nice but lost some of their appeal as the story is now bland/missing.

Universal has made investments into Marvel Super Hero Island. Both major attractions have been updated since Disney acquired Marvel. The character costumes were also updated after the acquisition. There was also a lot of post-acquisition work on an Iron Legion attraction.

Cedar Fair buying Paramount is not really the same. Cedar Fair had the option to license the Paramount name and properties but chose not to do so because they viewed themselves as being in the amusement park business and not the theme park business.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I don't think people realize exactly how desperate Marvel was when they selling off their rights to everything...The contract terms insanely one sided for Uni.

It was not so one-sided for Marvel at the time. The terms make it undesirable for Universal to replace Marvel with another licensed property. This, along with the fixed fees, meant that a Marvel barreling towards bankruptcy had a predictable, minimum revenue stream from Universal.

 

[Bender123]

It was not so one-sided for Marvel at the time. The terms make it undesirable for Universal to replace Marvel with another licensed property. This, along with the fixed fees, meant that a Marvel barreling towards bankruptcy had a predictable, minimum revenue stream from Universal.

Exactly the point. Marvel wanted money, not theme park rights.

 

[chriskbrown]

Universal has made investments into Marvel Super Hero Island. Both major attractions have been updated since Disney acquired Marvel. The character costumes were also updated after the acquisition. There was also a lot of post-acquisition work on an Iron Legion attraction.

Cedar Fair buying Paramount is not really the same. Cedar Fair had the option to license the Paramount name and properties but chose not to do so because they viewed themselves as being in the amusement park business and not the theme park business.

They have updated Hulk and Spiderman is an incredible ride. But Black Panther is a great example - huge opportunity for something with this IP - who will blink first.

Cedar Fair has turned Carowinds from an ok park into a destination park with an amazing set of new coasters, rides and food.

 

[capsshield]

No one knows exactly which characters are in the contract, but several things can be deduced.
1. lots of characters are not in the contract
2. Characters that became Avengers after the contract was signed have appeared in the park (Dr. Strange)
3. That means that perhaps all characters that joined a family after a date like 1999 are open game (exact date is a guess)
4. Since IOA was built, the standards of a great land have changed. Pandora, Galaxy's Edge, Potter's two lands, New Fantasy Land, and I suspect the new Epic park as well. Even in IOA's park Marvels land is extremely weak compared to the theming used in the other lands.
5. Of course Universal has maintained that area but it can be argued that it does damage to the brand due to cheap theming. Two of the rides are cheap carnival attractions at best, and painted plywood showing a characters use really stretches the inclusion clause.
6. I believe Disney could force Universal to change character depictions to match the latest costume changes and keep them current and in line with the latest publications if they provide new art.
7. Disney knows how much money the characters bring in to Universal and knows that that amount is less than what Universal would currently accept as payment.
8. I doubt Universal likes Disney having their nose in their books, but Disney loves it.
9. The Marvel Branch could create a whole new line or Universe for Disney to Exploit and already has several it could use.
10. There's no way Marvel would have let them have every character so you can bet each family is listed in a clear defined list

So will we see Marvel Characters and rides in the World absolutely. Phase 4 is full of open for use characters and I suspect phase 5 will be as well.
Luke Cage, Iron Fist, Jessica Jones, Daredevil, Blade, Ghost Rider, Dr. Strange, Shang Chi, Guardians, Eternals, New Universe, Kazar, Shield, Adam Warlock, Squadron Supreme, the Champions, The Defenders, The Elders, The Howling Commandos, The Runaways and more to name a few.

It will take time and money to build those brands, but they have already started. You can also bet that they know exactly which characters from in use families they can and can not use.

 

[britain]

Exactly. It may sting to not have the ‘premiere’ Marvel characters in any WDW attractions, but as Guardians of the Galaxy showed us, there are lots more characters to popularize in a movie and then make their way to the parks.

 

[SamN'Dean]

When Disney finally opens a better Marvel based attraction then Spider-Man should we talk about Disney obtaining the rights from Universal.

Thank you! Exactly!
Just look at all the disappointment on the DL threads about Disney's Marvel land, and it doesn't look to get better soon.

To think- that Uni might lose Marvel, and have to give up that great Spiderman ride? It gives me CHILLS!!

 

[marni1971]

To think- that Uni might lose Marvel, and have to give up that great Spiderman ride? It gives me CHILLS!!

They won’t and they won’t.

Things will only change if Comcast decides it wants to sell but Steve Burke immensely enjoys how things are at the moment.

 

[Jedi Stitch]

The original contract literature I had read boiled down to Uni had marvel set up in east coast parks, so Disney was not allowed to go full marvel. West coast was more open. Uni had not established a marvel presence other than characters and marvel mania restaurant. Once, marvel mania was tossed out of uni city walk it created a loop hole Disney could use. GoG was also a newer Marvel entity that was not specifically mentioned such as the more famous IP's. So Disney is taking the little parts they can and going with it.
Don't forget the Kirby Law suit changed things up. Stan Lee was representing as Marvels soul owner, but Jack Kirby and his estate were partners with Stan Lee, and the law suit enforced Kirby's stake, so all the contracts no mater the billions spent and earned, have to be looked over as Kirby's interest was never addressed. Again more loop holes to go after.