Rumor Hollywood insiders say there's growing tension at Disney as CEO Bob Chapek chafes at Bob Iger's 'long goodbye'

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Do they really want to go back to cramming as many people as possible in though? Or do they want to use the reservation system to find the sweet spot of tickets sold vs operating costs. Is it worth trying to get more people in if the labour hours are fitting in the correct percentile?

See…the mistake is ever believing that they “crammed” people in prior. They had a plan that included growth until 1998. And it flipped on its ears after to make each spot in the parks “high demand”. The pattern of rot is pretty easy to sniff out since. Long gaps on reinvestment, lowering employee numbers and standards, streamlining things like dining and shopping so it’s far less appealing and provides less diversions that spread Crowds.

The example i always use is that being in Epcot on 12/31/99 was FAR more comfortable to me than days in the middle of the week at magic kingdom around Mardi Gras (the purple people) in 2018. The shift in travel loads and pattern regarding “strategic planning” needed far more that was ever done. Ironic.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Merchandise/F&B sales are a factor too, though, and the more people there are in the parks the more opportunities they have to sell those items. Those are generally very high margin sales too.

That’s where all the profits come from…in truth.

Trying to sell tickets at profit is stupid…and is the culmination of now decades of missteps due to cost cutting.

 

[Lilofan]

See…the mistake is ever believing that they “crammed” people in prior. They had a plan that included growth until 1998. And it flipped on its ears after to make each spot in the parks “high demand”. The pattern of rot is pretty easy to sniff out since. Long gaps on reinvestment, lowering employee numbers and standards, streamlining things like dining and shopping so it’s far less appealing and provides less diversions that spread Crowds.

The example i always use is that being in Epcot on 12/31/99 was FAR more comfortable to me than days in the middle of the week at magic kingdom around Mardi Gras (the purple people) in 2018. The shift in travel loads and pattern regarding “strategic planning” needed far more that was ever done. Ironic.

Interesting walking through the traffic overflow backstage areas to get from World Showcase to Future World on NYE . A different view of the parks for sure. Families camping out their spots at Epcot for midnight fireworks at 3pm? No thanks.

 

[JoeCamel]

That’s where all the profits come from…in truth.

Trying to sell tickets at profit is stupid…and is the culmination of now decades of missteps due to cost cutting.

Right, get 'em in the door before you empty their wallet

 

[drizgirl]

Merchandise/F&B sales are a factor too, though, and the more people there are in the parks the more opportunities they have to sell those items. Those are generally very high margin sales too.

Especially when you consider Chapek’s background.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Right, get 'em in the door before you empty their wallet

It worked for 40 years before spray tan Bob…

…but to be fair…the world did change a little after the internet

 

[Lilofan]

Right, get 'em in the door before you empty their wallet

Wallets are not needed much when magic bands were invented. The shocker is when the credit card bill comes next month.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Wallets are not needed much when magic bands were invented. The shocker is when the credit card bill comes next month.

That never actually happened. It was part of the failure of MDE.

Bob promised it…of course. The consensus was it was a big part of rasulo/staggs being pushed out. Iger was embarrassed that the $1 bil he told the board it would cost (ultimately chump change) never materialized in backend profits. Which just kinda showed how silly he was: people already spent like crazy and at a premium in Orlando for decades prior…why would a band double those amounts? You can only eat so much salt and fat….and stuff so many Mickey plushes (which you can buy online and have delivered for free in 4 days) into your suitcase.

The problem was they said “new revenues” without constructing or putting on anything that actually would drive those revenues. Just food booths.

 

[HauntedPirate]

That never actually happened. It was part of the failure of MDE.

Bob promised it…of course. The consensus was it was a big part of rasulo/staggs being pushed out. Iger was embarrassed that the $1 bil he told the board it would cost (ultimately chump change) never materialized in backend profits. Which just kinda showed how silly he was: people already spent like crazy and at a premium in Orlando for decades prior…why would a band double those amounts? You can only eat so much salt and fat….and stuff so many Mickey plushes (which you can buy online and have delivered for free in 4 days) into your suitcase.

The problem was they said “new revenues” without constructing or putting on anything that actually would drive those revenues. Just food booths.

It’s as if the Bob’s, and many others, didn’t understand that the theme parks were somewhat unique and called for a different kind of handling. The typical business school/MBA schlop they tried to implement doesn’t always apply and was destined to fail. Somewhat.

 

[castlecake2.0]

See…the mistake is ever believing that they “crammed” people in prior. They had a plan that included growth until 1998. And it flipped on its ears after to make each spot in the parks “high demand”. The pattern of rot is pretty easy to sniff out since. Long gaps on reinvestment, lowering employee numbers and standards, streamlining things like dining and shopping so it’s far less appealing and provides less diversions that spread Crowds.

The example i always use is that being in Epcot on 12/31/99 was FAR more comfortable to me than days in the middle of the week at magic kingdom around Mardi Gras (the purple people) in 2018. The shift in travel loads and pattern regarding “strategic planning” needed far more that was ever done. Ironic.

Makes sense, would be curious how much it would cost to reopen all the lost venues from over the years compared to the billions spent on MDE and how much better it probably would have improved spreading crowds. Like I said before, imagine a “secret” TikTok menu over at Aunt Polly’s, people would (literally) eat that up, and requires what, two or three CPs a day to operate?

 

[mgf]

Has this been posted in this thread yet? I didn't spot it.

Seems knives are out: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/b...k-missteps-fuel-confidence-crisis-1235122002/

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Has this been posted in this thread yet? I didn't spot it.

Seems knives are out: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/b...k-missteps-fuel-confidence-crisis-1235122002/

The was the follow up to the original hatchet piece from Eisners niece…I believe

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

It’s as if the Bob’s, and many others, didn’t understand that the theme parks were somewhat unique and called for a different kind of handling. The typical business school/MBA schlop they tried to implement doesn’t always apply and was destined to fail. Somewhat.

But in classic TWDC fashion…they don’t admit defeat. Instead they yell “SQUIRREL!” To divert attention, sit paralyzed for 5 years and do nothing…except sell trinkets to celebrate it

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Let s keep in mind that parks and resorts are just one part of TWDC. Some predict the sky is falling in parks and resorts and that may lead to Chapek leaving. I'm curious how the numbers pan out in future Wall Street quarterly public earning calls with Chapek, CFO Christine and the Wall Street analysts as Chapek discusses TWDC business in addition to parks and resorts. If he can pull magic out of a hat and exceed Wall Street revenue estimates and impresses the street and company shareholders , he's not going anywhere for the moment.

P&R are 33% (ballpark) of their overall revenues and drive up to 60% of the profits.

So when people say “the sky is falling” in parks…it’s actually falling. Hypothetically.

People get tied up in nonsense. Like Disney +…which is a darling that only costs them money for some time to come. But it’s more fun to talk about what you hope is the next thing…than concentrate on boring old numbers.

 

[MrPromey]

That never actually happened. It was part of the failure of MDE.

Bob promised it…of course. The consensus was it was a big part of rasulo/staggs being pushed out. Iger was embarrassed that the $1 bil he told the board it would cost (ultimately chump change) never materialized in backend profits. Which just kinda showed how silly he was: people already spent like crazy and at a premium in Orlando for decades prior…why would a band double those amounts? You can only eat so much salt and fat….and stuff so many Mickey plushes (which you can buy online and have delivered for free in 4 days) into your suitcase.

The problem was they said “new revenues” without constructing or putting on anything that actually would drive those revenues. Just food booths.

It's interesting to look at how they've jumped from one failed short-term "solution" to another.

Beginning with FP+ the plan was to find ways to stack more bodies in existing places without adding capacity. That obviously had a physical and psychological limit. Shockingly, both of those limits appear to be far beyond what would seem sane (outside of NYE) but they've clearly started to bump up against the psychological one with more and more people finally admitting lack of enjoyment in the parks due to crowd levels.

One would think the solution there would be to finally start adding desirable capacity to handle these crowds and improve guest satisfaction but that costs money and require vision that looks more than three months into the future so instead of that, they decided they'd pivot into a resort for the wealthy and still pack the parks but only with people willing to drop lots of money (that would be the per-guest spending we're always hearing about) which allows them to increase profits without having to worry about adding that desirable capacity as long as they can trick people into thinking it is worth it.

So once they've tapped that group for all they can, what will be their new solution for growth, I wonder?

Seems like they may hit that cap faster than they're anticipating with the current global market.

Mind you, they've started adding attractions but not of the capacity levels needed and the emphasis seems largely geared towards something to market in an effort to justify their increasing prices and to push back that psychological barrier (pack even more people!) rather than as something to actually relieve capacity concerns and provide real long-term growth for the resort.

After all, once people get there and realize that they're locked out of doing that great "new thing" that was marketed unless they pay extra, assuming they even get the chance before that capacity is taken, this erodes the value of the place in people's minds. If the one-and-done group remain unlimited and word doesn't get out how much of a bait-and-switch it is, I suppose that could be sustainable but it seems like that little bubble started bursting the moment they tried to create it.

It's one thing to have to be rich to do something but it's a whole other thing to have to be both rich and lucky. Black Friday camp-outs and strategizing doesn't in my mind, seem to be the kind of thing the wealthy audience they're after are fond of doing and nothing screams opulence like eating a $20 fast service meal while sitting on an inverted curb or using a trash can as a table because you have nowhere else available to do it.

Time will tell, I guess. :/

 

[el_super]

After all, once people get there and realize that they're locked out of doing that great "new thing" that was marketed unless they pay extra, assuming they even get the chance before that capacity is taken, this erodes the value of the place in people's minds.

Except it doesn't erode. It never ever ever does.

We talk here of how the parks are failing and declining, but they keep raking in money, year after year.

Even now that serious concern has come up on Chapek's future, the concern is being driven by PR fiascos, not because of the way the parks are managed.

 

[TikibirdLand]

Except it doesn't erode. It never ever ever does.

We talk here of how the parks are failing and declining, but they keep raking in money, year after year.

Even now that serious concern has come up on Chapek's future, the concern is being driven by PR fiascos, not because of the way the parks are managed.

I agree, buddy. I keep hearing about that "breaking point" that's coming. I think I've been hearing about it for five years now (may be longer; that's as far back as I remember -- 2017). But, the parks are packed. People are p*ssed off about the reservations system. They can't stand the Genie experience. And yet, they still come. I don't get it. Seems to escape the bounds of reality.

 

[Lilofan]

I agree, buddy. I keep hearing about that "breaking point" that's coming. I think I've been hearing about it for five years now (may be longer; that's as far back as I remember -- 2017). But, the parks are packed. People are p*ssed off about the reservations system. They can't stand the Genie experience. And yet, they still come. I don't get it. Seems to escape the bounds of reality.

Complaints are rightly so but the average human attention span averages 8 seconds. Goldfish fare better in this category.

 

[MrPromey]

Except it doesn't erode. It never ever ever does.

We talk here of how the parks are failing and declining, but they keep raking in money, year after year.

Even now that serious concern has come up on Chapek's future, the concern is being driven by PR fiascos, not because of the way the parks are managed.

Except in the last 12 months, I've read more bad press about the situation in the parks than I have in the rest of my lifetime combined.

It's no-longer just people on forums like these who go more than normal people think is healthy griping about it.

The question regarding the value and what isn't quite right are now starting to slip over into mainstream media that more causal audiences follow. This is media where Disney previously excelled at controlling the narrative.

Maybe it won't make a difference and Disney can do no wrong and at this point, not even an economic downturn will dent them but it feels like this (among other things both as negatives to the company brand as well as increased competition) are creating a unique situation that combined puts them in a position they've yet to find themselves in, prior.

Again, maybe it'll amount to nothing. Maybe Chapeke will be uncovered to be a secret Nazi and guests will protest by wearing their Etsy bought novelty shirts coyly making reference to that while standing in line for overpriced samples at Food-and-Wine.

I used to be one of the people that complained and still went.

I've since put my money where my mouth is and stopped going.

It's possible.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Except in the last 12 months, I've read more bad press about the situation in the parks than I have in the rest of my lifetime combined.

It's no longer just people on forums like these who go more than normal people think is healthy griping about it.

The question regarding the value and what isn't quite right are now starting to slip over into mainstream media that more causal audiences follow.

Maybe it won't make a difference and Disney can do no wrong and at this point, not even an economic downturn will dent them but it feels like this (among other things both as negatives to the company brand as well as increased compeition) are creating a unique situation that combined puts them in a situation they've yet to find themselves in, prior.

Again, maybe it'll amount to nothing. Maybe Chapeke will be uncovered to be a secret Nazi and guests will protest by wearing their Etsy bought novelty shirts coyly making reference to that while standing in line for overpriced samples at Food-and-Wine.

I used to be one of the people that complained and still went.

I've since put my money where my mouth is and stopped going.

It's possible.

I would agree with this…they’ve never had this much bad park press in such a short time.

And it’s not “people always want to take shots at Disney”

This is being being thrown out by the financial outlets…the travel press…the Hollywood press…and even some main news editorial stuff.

It’s also…from the looks of it…behind fanned by at least one ex CEO…

More to follow