HKDL gets new castle, frozen land and marvel land.

[Supersnow84]

Thus far they obviously don’t think a shopping district would offer a ROI.

Not even a cafe and Disney store on the esplanade.

I think they are stuck in a chicken and egg situation

People don’t see the single park as enough to justify spending extended periods of time there so Disney doesn’t see a shopping district as worth it but since there isn’t a shopping district it contributes to why people don’t spend enough time there to justify a shopping district

HKDL alone doesn’t have enough space to make the resort a multi day destination by itself even if they used every piece of space they had including the cast only areas. If they made every part of the current park land accessible it would be a strong 2 weak 3 day park for most guests. They simply need more in the wider resort to make it worth people to stay longer, Disneyland can’t do it alone

 

[marni1971]

I think they are stuck in a chicken and egg situation

People don’t see the single park as enough to justify spending extended periods of time there so Disney doesn’t see a shopping district as worth it but since there isn’t a shopping district it contributes to why people don’t spend enough time there to justify a shopping district

HKDL alone doesn’t have enough space to make the resort a multi day destination by itself even if they used every piece of space they had including the cast only areas. If they made every part of the current park land accessible it would be a strong 2 weak 3 day park for most guests. They simply need more in the wider resort to make it worth people to stay longer, Disneyland can’t do it alone

It’s a fantastic resort ( so much so we’re going again this year despite others being closer) but it seems to be wanting to be bigger and stumbling at the final hurdle time after time; be it a second park, forth hotel or shopping street. All the pieces are ready but they just can’t put them into place.

Hopefully the attendance increase continues and a decision is made. It has so much potential.

 

[Supersnow84]

It’s a fantastic resort ( so much so we’re going again this year despite others being closer) but it seems to be wanting to be bigger and stumbling at the final hurdle time after time; be it a second park, forth hotel or shopping street. All the pieces are ready but they just can’t put them into place.

Hopefully the attendance increase continues and a decision is made. It has so much potential.

That’s the feeling I get, it’s so close to greatness, the diehard community has already realised it. It’s just missing that last jump to put it on the map like Tokyo to your general park fans

It just needs something that’s not Disneyland, whatever that is they just need to go for it and do that thing

 

[Stevie Amsterdam]

HKDL seem to have snuck in a last minute refurbishment for Mystic Manor which is bang in the middle of my upcoming trip. I know it is what it is but having Mystic Manor closed is really annoying. I'm not sure when it was posted but it was not showing when they had other attractions posted as closed on their calendar.

Due to operational adjustments, Mystic Manor will be temporarily suspended from May 6 to May 19, 2025.

Bummer mate I totally understand the disappointment.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

It’s a fantastic resort ( so much so we’re going again this year despite others being closer) but it seems to be wanting to be bigger and stumbling at the final hurdle time after time; be it a second park, forth hotel or shopping street. All the pieces are ready but they just can’t put them into place.

Hopefully the attendance increase continues and a decision is made. It has so much potential.

That’s the feeling I get, it’s so close to greatness, the diehard community has already realised it. It’s just missing that last jump to put it on the map like Tokyo to your general park fans

It just needs something that’s not Disneyland, whatever that is they just need to go for it and do that thing

Yes, it seems so close to being a real destination resort including the fact it is so conveniently located near the airport for those flying in. As long as there is just one theme park and a few hotels, though, basing a holiday around HKDL Resort is going to be a hard sell for most people.

The problem seems to be whether the numbers really work for a second park and you really don't want a WDSP situation where a weak second park becomes a weight dragging down the entire resort just as it was becoming profitable. My impression is that, were they to open a second park, they would have to make sure it didn't face the criticisms of the original park for being too small/underbuilt and be prepared for at least a few years of losses as they worked to build the market for the resort beyond Hong Kong. Considering how much all this would cost and the uncertainty it would ever pay off, I unfortunately understand why they may not be keen to pull the trigger.

 

[marni1971]

Yes, it seems so close to being a real destination resort including the fact it is so conveniently located near the airport for those flying in. As long as there is just one theme park and a few hotels, though, basing a holiday around HKDL Resort is going to be a hard sell for most people.

The problem seems to be whether the numbers really work for a second park and you really don't want a WDSP situation where a weak second park becomes a weight dragging down the entire resort just as it was becoming profitable. My impression is that, were they to open a second park, they would have to make sure it didn't face the criticisms of the original park for being too small/underbuilt and be prepared for at least a few years of losses as they worked to build the market for the resort beyond Hong Kong. Considering how much all this would cost and the uncertainty it would ever pay off, I unfortunately understand why they may not be keen to pull the trigger.

Certainly for non-locals (like us) I don’t know why they don’t market it more as a destination that offers a world class park plus a convenient base to explore Hong Kong. Like you said airport access is so easy and anyone who’s done it knows how good access to the city is.

In Europe you see zero advertising for it.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

Certainly for non-locals (like us) I don’t know why they don’t market it more as a destination that offers a world class park plus a convenient base to explore Hong Kong. Like you said airport access is so easy and anyone who’s done it knows how good access to the city is.

In Europe you see zero advertising for it.

Yeah, you would think they would package it that way. I remember Disneyland brochures back in the day (I'm thinking early 1990s) with a page or two about the attractions of Southern California as a way of pitching it as a base for a longer vacation. You would think HKDL could pitch itself similarly as a good way to take a family vacation to Hong Kong.

I haven't lived in Australia for a while, but I do go back every year for about a month and my impression is that HKDL has largely dropped off the radar there, too. I remember it was advertised when the resort first opened, but now they seem to exclusively pitch Disneyland in Anaheim to Australians and a lot more aggressively than the used to. However, HKDL is closer and probably cheaper to get to. I believe Australian tourism to the US has dropped substantially in recent months as it is from everywhere else, so it could be an opportunity to take a fresh look at pitching HKDL as an alternative.

 

[DLR92]

It can’t remain a one park resort facility. Disney has to set the bar with its Hong Kong property. Otherwise what the point to have all this expansion land being not utilized? Disney should have learned their mistakes on the past from all regions; Hong Kong, Anaheim, Paris. You can’t under build and provide mediocre service and quality. It a big turn off from a consumer standpoint of view.

 

[Timothy_Q]

Rushing to build a second park before fleshing out more of the first one would be a huge financial gamble that I don't think would be smart for HKD right now.

Considering the park is still not pulling in the necessary crowds, It would likely put them in the red and make it very hard for them to get out of it, messing up future expansions for decades to come.

HKD still needs a couple more unique E+ tickets to draw people in before thinking of a second gate

 

[LameBoi]

Rushing to build a second park before fleshing out more of the first one would be a huge financial gamble that I don't think would be smart for HKD right now.

Considering the park is still not pulling in the necessary crowds, It would likely put them in the red and make it very hard for them to get out of it, messing up future expansions for decades to come.

HKD still needs a couple more unique E+ tickets to draw people in before thinking of a second gate

I would agree that HKDL needs more E/F-ticket attractions to fully flesh out the park, but the idea of a second gate has been in the works for quite a while now though. The first concept for a second gate appeared very early into HKDL’s life. Disney’s Enchanted Forest would have a treehouse style castle and an animatronic dragon on the bottom level similar to Paris. More recently in the late 2010s, new plans were being developed for a second gate by imagineer Joe Lanzisero before being derailed by the protests and then the pandemic. Joe Lanzisero is famous for developing ToonTown and the canceled Muppets Movie Ride before then being lead at to Tokyo, bringing many attractions to life like Tokyo’s Splash Mountain and Hightower ToT. He’s also famous for bringing Duffy to Tokyo and creating his backstory that led the Duffy and Friends being the phenomenon they are today. Joe was then drafted to HKDL where he developed the 3 mini-land expansion of Grizzly Gulch, Mystic Point, and Toy Story as well as the Explorer’s Lodge hotel. I’m sure whatever plans he created would’ve been amazing and highly detailed with such a high caliber imagineer behind them.

 

[Supersnow84]

The resort definitely cannot afford a second gate right now. As we have seen from parks that open after euro Disney the park would need to be launch day Shanghai calibre to be considered acceptable. That’s a massive undertaking for a park that can’t even pull Shanghai’s numbers itself

We have to consider the idea that HK simply just has a potential guest cap that is lower than the other parks. HK itself is much smaller than Shanghai and its a lot harder for the GBA to reach Hong Kong than it is for them to say go to chimelong ocean kingdom. It just might never be feasible for HK to pull numbers like Tokyo because of its position even if it offered equitable offerings

Because when you think about it I’m assuming based on total attractions people would probably put HK a little below the 4 old magic kingdoms but it pulls less than half of their attendance: there seems to be something holding HK back that isn’t quality of its offerings because if that was the only factor it would be pulling at least Shanghai’s numbers if not Paris

 

[marni1971]

I still think there’s a perception among general public park goers that it’s a small and cheap copy and paste park. And among even less savvy potential visitors many don’t even know it exists. The amount of colleagues I’ve talked to and didn’t know it even existed (“there’s one in Hong Kong as well??!!”)

 

[Sir_Cliff]

The resort definitely cannot afford a second gate right now. As we have seen from parks that open after euro Disney the park would need to be launch day Shanghai calibre to be considered acceptable. That’s a massive undertaking for a park that can’t even pull Shanghai’s numbers itself

We have to consider the idea that HK simply just has a potential guest cap that is lower than the other parks. HK itself is much smaller than Shanghai and its a lot harder for the GBA to reach Hong Kong than it is for them to say go to chimelong ocean kingdom. It just might never be feasible for HK to pull numbers like Tokyo because of its position even if it offered equitable offerings

Because when you think about it I’m assuming based on total attractions people would probably put HK a little below the 4 old magic kingdoms but it pulls less than half of their attendance: there seems to be something holding HK back that isn’t quality of its offerings because if that was the only factor it would be pulling at least Shanghai’s numbers if not Paris

I do also wonder whether the potential market is just smaller for HKDL. They seemed to build it with that idea that it would be a scaled-down Disneyland for smaller markets as almost a test case to see if that worked. And, of course, that didn't really fly! On the other hand, they always planned for a second park, hotels, etc., so on some level they must have assumed the potential at least existed for growth.

I would have thought it could be sold effectively as the Disneyland for South-East Asia. You have countries like the Philippines, Malaysia, Thailand, Indonesia, etc. not too far away, Hong Kong is well-connected by air to the region, and HKDL couldn't be more conveniently located for flying in and going directly between the airport and the resort with minimum hassle for short trips. I don't know how big that market is, but I would have thought if you could make it a fashionable holiday for upper middle class families in the region who stay at the hotels, eat at the restaurants, etc. it could be quite lucrative even if the raw numbers are not at, say, Disneyland Paris levels.

I still think there’s a perception among general public park goers that it’s a small and cheap copy and paste park. And among even less savvy potential visitors many don’t even know it exists. The amount of colleagues I’ve talked to and didn’t know it even existed (“there’s one in Hong Kong as well??!!”)

I got the exact same reaction when I mentioned to people back in Melbourne that I was stopping at Hong Kong Disneyland on the way back to Europe!

 

[no.swatz]

That's why the HK government + tourism board should really get back on board fully on plans for creating a 2nd gate for HKDL. But first, they have to clear the quarantine rooms on that plot of land... (I had friends who thought that entire land was a carpark )

 

[Supersnow84]

I think they could make an effort to “work on plans” publicly to show the resort has positive momentum but really the resort simply cannot afford it as of right now

Best case scenario they manage to sacrifice 20 years of expansion potential to dump out a WDS park and everyone hates it, worst case the attempted expansion bankrupts the resort entirely

Right now probably the best thing they could do is start on the esplanade and maybe try to integrate inspiration lake better, just give guests a reason to go that isn’t going into the park. But as marni points out they have probably ran the ROI on that and found it lacking

But it also seems like that simply pumping more into Disneyland alone isn’t enough because the park in its current iteration should draw more guests than it actually does relative to the other 5 magics

 

[Supersnow84]

If I were in charge, I would greenlight the construction of a Bon Voyage/World of Disney store along with a Starbucks on the esplanade — the ROI is a no-brainer. If successful enough, a second phase could bring a LEGO store, a QSR, and a TSR.

As for the Tarzan Treehouse, it could be rethemed into a Duffy and Friends walkthrough attraction (this one must be the "Reimagined attraction" mentioned during the announcement of the second expansion plan) , similar to the Adventureland Treehouse at Disneyland Resort, with each character having their own dedicated room filled with interactive elements.

An equivalent to Peter Pan’s Flight is sorely needed — perhaps themed to Aladdin? Soarin’, Toy Story Mania, and a large raft or E-ticket-scale flume ride should also be seriously considered.

That’s kinda the problem with the lower half of your comment, it just seems like adding to the current park’s offerings is simply not enough

FEA basically acts as a pseudo replacement for the third dark ride in fantasyland (not that it couldn’t have a fourth) and with arendelle as a wider land the park now has roughly the same number of attractions as Paris. Sure it could be argued Paris’s ride roster is more balanced and Paris as a “themed space” is leagues ahead of HK outside of arendelle but that still doesn’t seem to come close to explaining the guest discrepancy.

Let’s say we went blue sky on Disneyland, rethemed some space in fantasyland into a 4th dark ride, the TOT marvel opens with a courtyard and more themed space, we use the big pavilion plot to give one more E ticket flume ride and another d ticket plus a big expansion to space. With those changes the park would be rivalling Tokyo/magic for rides only really behind Disneyland Anaheim. However even with all those changes (which would be taking till like 2035 anyway) do people think that would give it Tokyo numbers (hell even Shanghai numbers)

I really don’t think it’s the quality of Disneylands offerings that are holding the wider resort back

 

[DLR92]

I really do think HK Resort needs a second park. Where exactly any expansion space left for HK Disneyland? Or they might as well remove Toy Story Land for something more quality.

 

[marni1971]

I really do think HK Resort needs a second park. Where exactly any expansion space left for HK Disneyland? Or they might as well remove Toy Story Land for something more quality.

East of Grizzly, north of Tomorrowland, north of TSL.

 

[Supersnow84]

East of Grizzly, north of Tomorrowland, north of TSL.

Do you mean west of Tomorrowland

North of Tomorrowland is the MTR

 

[LameBoi]

Working on plans for an expansion is a no brainer. They aren’t ready for a second gate yet, but planning for one doesn’t hurt. Like I’ve said, there are already multiple concepts for a second gate. If the funds and demand are there to support a second gate, they could immediately start construction with blueprints in hand. If there is something Hong Kong is famous for, it’s preplanning for the future. You could see it in the highway leading to HKDL, leaving a stub-end for a highway extension towards a future Phase 3 (further land reclamation from the Phase 2 land).

I’ve had a thought and maybe a hindrance for HKDL and the greater city of HK in this current economic climate is how expensive it is compared to the mainland and HK’s neighbors. The HK Dollar is directly tied to the USD. A strong dollar means less purchasing power for travelers from neighboring Asian countries and mainlanders.