News Guest dies, found unresponsive after riding Stardust Racers

[lazyboy97o]

The reason Big Thunder was closed for 2 months was because the death there was due to blunt force trauma also.

Stardust Racers didn’t have a car derail and crush a rider. Not really an “also” type situation.

 

[lewisc]

O

Two folks died on Mission Space and it was closed for a very short time and re opened quickly if I remember correctly.

Mission Space deaths were a result of natural causes, preexisting conditions. It re opened quickly.

Thunder Mt death was due to maintenance. The ride was closed for months.

Stardust has been closed for weeks. I doubt it will reopen without some modifications

 

[Jrb1979]

You're right it did. It also had nothing to do with blunt force trauma which makes it different to this accident. The reason Big Thunder was closed for 2 months was because the death there was due to blunt force trauma also. Different incidents with different outcomes are treated differently and as this proves Universal and Disney appear to have been treated very similarly with the incidents where deaths sadly resulted from blunt force trauma as opposed to the deaths that weren't.

It's equally sad whenever a person dies at an amusement park be it from an actual impact injury or be it a medical problem the person didn't know they had. Nobody wants anyone they love or care for dying at an amusement park (or anywhere really) under any circumstances. However trying to imply that two things are the same when they're clearly not as though the whole thing is a Universal are Treated worse than Disney is quite simply belittling the death of a person and making it a one side against the other type of thing which seems so beneath a forum of adults.

It's about opinions and everyone's entitled to them but let's not try to constantly make it about one side versus the other or trying to make out things that are different are the same when a few seconds research on google can show that they're not. This is a thread about a man's death and not a thread where we're arguing which park is better.

I agree. I will say though that as a Coaster enthusiast, it bothers me that the media and general public are so quick to push the narrative that coasters aren't safe, there isn't enough state inspections, they have become too intense, and all coasters with inversions need either vests or over the shoulder restraints.

 

[mergatroid]

I agree. I will say though that as a Coaster enthusiast, it bothers me that the media and general public are so quick to push the narrative that coasters aren't safe, there isn't enough state inspections, they have become too intense, and all coasters with inversions need either vests or over the shoulder restraints.

Completely agree. I suppose as they're not park enthusiasts like ourselves they kind of don't have anything invested in the outcome and see a death and that it resulted from some type of impact and so ultimately decide it must equate to a dangerous attraction. It's fairly lazy journalism which they're probably guilty of across the board unless it's a subject matter that they're more familiar with.

 

[mergatroid]

Stardust Racers didn’t have a car derail and crush a rider. Not really an “also” type situation.

Yes you are correct however the cause of death was from a trauma similar to SR as opposed to the MS deaths which clearly weren't after a quick bit of research. Both deaths from SR and BTM were both from trauma but I'm happy (not literally) to concede that BTM came off the tracks whereas SR remained on the tracks. I'm also conceding that Disney were responsible due to lack of maintenance and as of yet Universal haven't been found guilty of doing anything wrong and may very well not be. I'll concede that the two attractions have different tracks, different lengths, different vehicles and pretty much anything else that is different.

The point of the post was that MS and SR and the incidents involving them were completely different causes of deaths which the person I was responding to seemed to be unaware of otherwise they surely wouldn't have made the comparison in the first place?

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

O

Mission Space deaths were a result of natural causes, preexisting conditions. It re opened quickly.

Thunder Mt death was due to maintenance. The ride was closed for months.

Stardust has been closed for weeks. I doubt it will reopen without some modifications

The fact it’s still closed makes me think there’s still some uncertainty about what actually happened, why it happened, and how to resolve it.

As you said the other incidents were pretty clear cut, they knew exactly what happened and how to fix it… this incident seems more complex.

 

[flynnibus]

Good lord this BTMRR comparison needs to stop. The kid died in California because the ride vehicle was literally CRUSHED due to the derailment and the train crashing into itself. An accident that was caused by the staff not following maintenance procedures and processes.

There is nothing drawing lines between these situations except it involving a roller coaster and a person being killed.

 

[Disstevefan1]

That is because the ride was intense and without a doubt due to health conditions vs g forces sustained. It was clear cut and eventually easy to reprogram and give choices with less intense option.

This is People presuming a man's previous conditions could be a contributing factor of multiple blunt force impacts but none seem to know for sure why so it could have little to do, or nothing to do with the man's condition and ride has to be investigated and or changed either way.

I am not a Dr or a Coaster engineer, but I do think based on how many folks rode Stardust just fine that Kevin's preexisting condition did contribute, apparently he needed to be strapped into his wheelchair under normal conditions for example.

He passed out on the ride, possibly from his preexisting condition and/or medication he was taking. Its possible he did not have core strength and without seeing any video, I am suspecting most of his body weight was above the lap bar, perhaps he had much less body weight below the waist than a person that have use of their legs?

Without seeing anything, I think he was coming out of his seat and getting thrashed to death.

Where is the mistake here?
Should Kevin should have been NOT allowed to ride?
Should the coaster be slowed down?
Should there be over the shoulder restraints be added to some or all of the cars?

EDIT: All this said, I also think had Kevin NOT passed out, I think he would have had the upper body strength to keep himself in his seat.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

You know exactly what i meant, but let me rephrase.

I think they, like many folks, did make complaints before this about a rough ride or not feeling good after riding. That is a standard thing that happens in theme parks every single day. These clearly did not result in any actual injuries, and especially nothing severe.

That is an incorrect assumption. Some people choose to file a lawsuit after an injury; others avoid filing a case. There are many reasons why people opt to avoid filing lawsuits.

 

[lewisc]

am not a Dr or a Coaster engineer....

Universal hasn't released a report.

Your posts are speculation.

The coaster remains closed. That suggests that Kevin's medical condition isn't the sole cause of death.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I was Googling some G-Forces -
EPIC - Stardust - 4.6
DHS Rock n Rollercoaster - 5 - I always thought this one was on the mild side
Universal - Rip Ride Rocket - 4.1
Universal - Hulk - 4
EPCOT - Mission Space - 2.5 - Childs play

 

[ToTBellHop]

Good lord this BTMRR comparison needs to stop. The kid died in California because the ride vehicle was literally CRUSHED due to the derailment and the train crashing into itself. An accident that was caused by the staff not following maintenance procedures and processes.

There is nothing drawing lines between these situations except it involving a roller coaster and a person being killed.

I think the point is Disney was likely more negligent there and they are viewed under a more intense microscope than Universal. Yet the ride reopened. So talk of SR being demolished feels a bit extreme.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Universal hasn't released a report.

Your posts are speculation.

The coaster remains closed. That suggests that Kevin's medical condition isn't the sole cause of death.

Yup, pure speculation and I never said Kevin’s preexisting condition was the sole cause of death, nobody said that, it’s said Kevin died of blunt force impact. I only speculated his preexisting condition could have contributed, as it’s fact that thousands and thousands of folks rode Stardust without issue.

EDIT: The more I speculate about this, could Kevin's body's weight distribution contribute? Probably most of his body mass was his upper body; chest and arms as he must use his upper body in day to day life. Below the waist, his legs might have been the lightest part of his body.

Did Kevin get shot out of his seat on the first hill and could not get back in his seat and get thrashed to death? What a terrible awful death if it happened that way!

Just my opinion, Stardust should have some or all cars changed to have shoulder restraints.
If not all, maybe some with shoulder restraints to accommodate those with special needs.

 

[lewisc]

I was Googling some G-Forces -
EPIC - Stardust - 4.6
DHS Rock n Rollercoaster - 5 - I always thought this one was on the mild side
Universal - Rip Ride Rocket - 4.1
Universal - Hulk - 4
EPCOT - Mission Space - 2.5 - Childs play

I agree with your observation regarding RnR.

I conclude max G force isn't a valid way to judge the overall intensity of a coaster.

 

[flynnibus]

I think the point is Disney was likely more negligent there and they are viewed under a more intense microscope than Universal. Yet the ride reopened. So talk of SR being demolished feels a bit extreme.

Yeah but to that same point - the "ride" or anything intrinsic about it behind the why the accident happened at BTMRR. It was purely an operations/maint series of fault that lead to the accident. That's not the concern to date around SDR.

These events are universes apart...

 

[Disstevefan1]

I agree with your observation regarding RnR.

I conclude max G force isn't a valid way to judge the overall intensity of a coaster.

Yea RnR is really just a take off into the loop I think? I cant remember the exact ride path but its fun that I ride it as much as I can,

Gs PLUS all the twists and turns on other coasters makes a ride less tolerable?

 

[hopemax]

I still want to understand how someone is thrown forward anyway besides in a braking zone. The entire ride experience is about acceleration which should push you back, down, and up. So besides collapsing under the positive G force, the being 'thrown forward' is the part I struggle with to grasp how was part of the ride experience. Maybe on a downhill or drop before the ride starts to accelerate? But again, with enough force to cause harm?

This part I still struggle with to separate the victim's circumstances from the general riders...

Catching up on the thread... I rode Stardust Racers 4 times, and the reason it was only 4 and not double or triple that number (I've been in Epic on 4 days) is because of the feeling that the lap bar was being jammed into my stomach, on each of the hills and, like taking a gut punch, the body's reaction is to double over. I did feel like I was flopping forward a lot more than on other rides. I was actually disappointed in the coaster because people were rating it close to Velocicoaster (which is my favorite, and I can ride it with my arms up the whole ride, so I'm not a coaster wuss) and for me it wasn't. I even commented on the feeling in my post-1st visit report from April in the other thread, and on the DIS. This is also why I speculated about the metal handhold on the lap restraint vs the ride vehicle. Neither make a lot of sense, but based on my rides I can see how a person could hit their head on the lap restraint. Even repetitive hits on the padded portion seem like they could be problematic.

If I had a different personality, I could be one of those people claiming injury because it really did hurt my stomach area when I got off. I couldn't ride them back to back. The two days we rode, we did one side, took a several hour break and did the other side later. The final ride was the best, because I was finally learning how to brace myself to take pressure off my abdomen at certain points. I stopped riding Space Mountain and headbangers when they got to painful, so unfortunately, I felt like Stardust Racers was going to a coaster I didn't ride very much. I felt like the acceleration / deceleration was too much in places, so reports of breaking zones as a solution, is actually a positive. Assuming the ride is cleared to reopen, eventually.

 

[celluloid]

Catching up on the thread... I rode Stardust Racers 4 times, and the reason it was only 4 and not double or triple that number (I've been in Epic on 4 days) is because of the feeling that the lap bar was being jammed into my stomach, on each of the hills and, like taking a gut punch, the body's reaction is to double over. I did feel like I was flopping forward a lot more than on other rides. I was actually disappointed in the coaster because people were rating it close to Velocicoaster (which is my favorite, and I can ride it with my arms up the whole ride, so I'm not a coaster wuss) and for me it wasn't. I even commented on the feeling in my post-1st visit report from April in the other thread, and on the DIS. This is also why I speculated about the metal handhold on the lap restraint vs the ride vehicle. Neither make a lot of sense, but based on my rides I can see how a person could hit their head on the lap restraint. Even repetitive hits on the padded portion seem like they could be problematic.

If I had a different personality, I could be one of those people claiming injury because it really did hurt my stomach area when I got off. I couldn't ride them back to back. The two days we rode, we did one side, took a several hour break and did the other side later. The final ride was the best, because I was finally learning how to brace myself to take pressure off my abdomen at certain points. I stopped riding Space Mountain and headbangers when they got to painful, so unfortunately, I felt like Stardust Racers was going to a coaster I didn't ride very much. I felt like the acceleration / deceleration was too much in places, so reports of breaking zones as a solution, is actually a positive. Assuming the ride is cleared to reopen, eventually.

This is very true and part of the reason the ride is still closed. It is a body type variable far more than it is Kevin's prexisting condition. Which people have zero idea his official diagnosis other than he was in a wheelchair due to born with Spinal Cord condition. They act like he was completely atrophied. The dude clearly even had a manual upper body to use his wheelchair manually. The ride was already ready to have some alterations, now every seat likely will for the safety benefit.

People claiming only 4 gs and not the most intense is irrelevant. The man did not habe a heart attack or stroke due to intensity of coaster. It does not take many Gs to lurch forward or downward when lap is restrained. Anyone who has had someone pump brakes fast or too hard in even a slow moving car knows this.

The Disneyland thunder Mt and Stardust are not a 1:1.

One was a maintenence negligence situation and the other was a deaign oversight culpability situation.

 

[AidenRodriguez731]

EDIT: The more I speculate about this, could Kevin's body's weight distribution contribute? Probably most of his body mass was his upper body; chest and arms as he must use his upper body in day to day life. Below the waist, his legs might have been the lightest part of his body.

Did Kevin get shot out of his seat on the first hill and could not get back in his seat and get thrashed to death? What a terrible awful death if it happened that way!

Just my opinion, Stardust should have some or all cars changed to have shoulder restraints.
If not all, maybe some with shoulder restraints to accommodate those with special needs.

To be fully fair, this accident happened pretty early into the coasters run so while its not a definite thing that WILL happen to you if you get on this coaster, I do think the risk is definitely enough to be investigated considering this has happened way before it has gotten the ridership of most of the other competing coasters in the US.

Now, I will say that although you and anyone else on this site has not stooped this low... there is a sizable portion of people that blame this man 100% for what happened including some comments I've seen that say that the FAMILY of this poor guy should have to pay Universal or other vacationing families for "the inconvience of not being able to ride this coaster" And this comment has gotten enough likes for me to think this is not a sole persons opinion.

How people have acted about a man dying is quite literally disgusting unfortunately and I'm glad that people here are not nearly so cruel.

 

[AidenRodriguez731]

This is very true and part of the reason the ride is still closed. It is a body type variable far more than it is Kevin's prexisting condition. Which people have zero idea his official diagnosis other than he was in a wheelchair due to born with Spinal Cord condition. They act like he was completely atrophied. The dude clearly even had a manual upper body to use his wheelchair manually.

The Disneyland thunder Mt and Stardust are not a 1:1.

One was a maintenence negligence situation and the other was a deaign oversight culpability situation.

I think people are so woefully unaware of how people with disabilities actually are, they are just making up stuff to explain things that don't make sense to them.

One of the major things that I feel is absolutely crazy is the people blaming his family and saying they should not have LET him ride???

He's a grown man? In his 30s? Afaik he is not a severely mentally disabled man and can make his own choices??