WDWFigment
Well-Known Member
When I went to watch it last night and it had already been removed from YouTube, I was a bit surprised to see that it had actually been out elsewhere since December.
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Glen Keane Resigns from Disney Animation
- Thread starter FigmentJedi
- Start date
When I went to watch it last night and it had already been removed from YouTube, I was a bit surprised to see that it had actually been out elsewhere since December.
COProgressFan
Well-Known Member
Without institutional history, the company keeps making the same mistakes again and again, and the people who learned from them the first time are long gone (or in another area of the company).
So much of that history and experience was lost in the layoffs of 2009, and b y folks kindly shown the door to retirement when their pay got too high....its a shame.
zooey
Well-Known Member
The WDC culture has so changed that it doesn't even resemble what it once was, due to the old timers being ousted and not respected to carry on their traditions. The people in charge seem to have less and less respect for creative, which is odd for a company that sells creative material, and relies more and more on MBA kids who want nothing more than to sell sell sell. I work with people like this, too. They want everything to be new, different, and viral, which puts less emphasis and respect on old proven ways. There is a balance for sure, but you see that ignorant mentality at Disney where everyone wants to prove themselves by trying to transform the brand. In other words, they serve themselves and not the brand. Losing Glen is a massive blow.
Magic Man 85
New Member
Haha sorry about that. I do work with him and trust me, he's under bone crippling stress right now trying to get a ride ready for the upcoming season. It's a very tense situation for all of us. We are both nice guys in the end though. I'll watch the language and I'm sure he will too.
As for all this Glen talk, I think it's really sad to lose him. He did a lot of good for the studio.
WDW1974
Well-Known Member
I got nothing against old Stitch ... and sorry you guys had a bad week at the office. I've had a stressful week myself, so I ran off to the beach.
But there's no good spin to be placed when you lose a talent like Glen.
WDW1974
Well-Known Member
Exactly.
They are letting talent walk out the door (often ushering it out) and turning into a giant distribution company ... ESPN, Pixar, Marvel, Dreamworks, Muppets ... what exactly do they create anymore? They have barely any films coming out under the Disney banner (what happened to Walt?) and they all are franchises for the most part (or intended to be).
You just can't run a successful dream factory this way ... this is how you run a brokerage house or an electronics corp or a land holdings company, what is the future going to look like? Scary.
wolf359
Well-Known Member
I don't disagree with what you're saying, but how would Glen Keane staying change that? I think 37 years with a company is a good run in any profession but no matter how much you love what you do everyone reaches the point when it is time to let go.
zooey
Well-Known Member
I want to believe that TWDC is over the arc on their downward trajectory and will soon hit some kind of "rock bottom." If they do, perhaps they will bounce back like they did in the 80s with a major overhaul, back to basics business model.
TWDC has marketed, and continues to market this idea of WALT. Walt, the man, is all over the parks. They use it to justify decisions in the public's eye over and over again, i.e. "Walt always wanted so-and-so and now this project fulfills Walt's original intention," which we all know is either false or dubious. Then, behind the scenes where the facade ends and the business begins WALT is nothing but passe; a ghost that nobody understands nor wants to emulate (except in name recognition). I don't think the company ever understood what this dichotomy would actually do to their fans: it confused the eff out of them. They remove WALT from everything, they take the possessive S off the brand lead in, and they consolidate everything to further confuse the meaning of the brand. When they began making Walt so visible as a mascot, I doubt they realized that they were actually creating a cult of sorts. What they didn't realize that fans would actually buy into Walt's vision for his company and for his parks, and hopefully those same fans then go outside of the company bubble to understand more about the man, his ways, and his era so that those fans can then turn around and demand more from the company that is failing to meet the standards they themselves told their fans to have. THAT demand from the consumer has to be the origin of the "bounce back" after this steep decline in quality and philosophy.
zooey
Well-Known Member
Because Disney had a hit with Tangled, and is/was doing Frozen (formerly Ice Queen, I think) and such could be a third Renaissance for animation (albeit 3d and not 2D), but not without someone to helm the ship. Glen Keane is the reason Tangled looked like a Disney movie. He successfully transferred the Disney style to 3D animation, thus any ongoing success in Disney animation is because of Glen's talent. He likely was an integral part to animation moving forward at Disney, and it doesn't bode well that he would rather leave than work with them, because that most likely means Disney has no intention of moving forward and doing new and interesting things within the field they defined. They are not respecting their artists, nor are they valuing them enough.
Also, 37 years is a long time, but he's not retiring. He's moving on, which means any of your competitor's have the chance to grab him. Which means their competition gets yet another leg up.
You just don't let those kinds of people leave you for someone else. He earned whatever wage he was earning and also earned the right to push forward whatever projects he wanted.
COProgressFan
Well-Known Member
Interesting dichotomy indeed. I think it's because they are such a large conglomerate, with such poor leadership, that one hand doesn't know what the other is doing. As you mentioned, while on one hand everything is made more generic Disney (no Walt, no possessive apostrophe), the other constantly tries to play the "Walt" card (often pathetically) on everything from park commercials, merchandise, all the way to construction walls of all places!
As a consumer, it's very confusing, and in many ways the company doesn't seem to really know what it wants to be exactly. I think this has tremendous impact in people's connection to the company and its products (or the brand) and what it means to buy a "Disney" product. If you are trying to sell a product, whether it be a physical good, a movie, or a theme park, you certainly want to avoid that buyer confusion.
Any legit market research could tell them this.
MarkTwain
Well-Known Member
One thing I'd heard before about Glen Keane, and I'm now hearing a lot again online from those that know him, is that he is a very "high art" kinda guy. So much so that he prefers to be referred to as an artist, as opposed to being called an animator. My understanding of Keane, and of people that see themselves as artists in general, is that they generally don't like to do much of one thing for too long... much less for 37 years. They like to explore their medium, push their abilities, trying changing their style up every now and then. And let's face it, drawing Long John Silver from Treasure Planet or Disney Princess #537 isn't conducive to that.
It doesn't have to do so much with corporate culture or executive meddling, so much as the fact that Disney has had a certain style since it was founded, and Keane can probably expect it won't be changing enough to meet his desires. His letter plainly stated that he's "convinced that animation really is the ultimate art form of our time with endless new territories to explore" and that he "can’t resist it’s siren call to step out and discover them". I don't think that's a dig at Disney, as much as it is an implication he wants more freedom to pursue more personal for these last few years before his retirement. As heartbroken as I am to hear this news, I think he's deserved that.
It doesn't have to do so much with corporate culture or executive meddling, so much as the fact that Disney has had a certain style since it was founded, and Keane can probably expect it won't be changing enough to meet his desires. His letter plainly stated that he's "convinced that animation really is the ultimate art form of our time with endless new territories to explore" and that he "can’t resist it’s siren call to step out and discover them". I don't think that's a dig at Disney, as much as it is an implication he wants more freedom to pursue more personal for these last few years before his retirement. As heartbroken as I am to hear this news, I think he's deserved that.
WED Purist
Well-Known Member
Ollie Johnston used to talk about Freddie Moore going over a line, over and over, trying to find what he wanted to express. Guys used to bring their drawings to Milt Kahl for critique, knowing it was going to hurt, but make them better. Herbie Ryman could make you feel a painting, and want to go there. Glen is one of those people, who yearns to act through a pencil. Disney doesn't court that anymore, and it's really sad. But I hear things might be changing.
MarkTwain
Well-Known Member
Yeah, I was astounded to hear that the other day. Considering Freddie Moore was the man that created the modern Mickey Mouse, and in general Disney's master of character proportions, I'm really curious to know what Walt's reasoning was.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
If I recall correctly, Moore eventually descended into some bad habits, including excessive drinking. He did return briefly and was working at the studio when he was killed by injuries from a car wreck (he was not driving).
bgraham34
Well-Known Member
Its really not worth going out of your way to watch. I did not think that it was that great. I was more fascinated with the Sting aspects than anything else.
HMF
Well-Known Member
Probably was a Communist.:animwink: Kidding.:lookaroun
radiohost
Well-Known Member
Correct. He did become an alcoholic after WWII and his work (his animation) reflected it. He became, as Walt put it bluntly, deadwood; and was terminated.
Another person Walt fired???? Ward Kimball!!! Now, this occured because Walt had asked Ward to direct the movie "Babes in Toyland". When Kimball refused, Walt took offense (you didnt tell the boss no in that studio) and fired him. As Ward Kimball later told it, he literally got on his knees and begged for his job back inside of Walt office. This was in the early 60's. Kimball had traveled the country with Walt and had been at the studio since Snow White, and here he was getting fired.
Walt relented and hired him back, but at a price. Kimball was demoted to the animation drawing board to animate Ludwig Von Drake. It was, as Kimball described, humiliating at this point in his career.