GAC to Become DAS

[BroganMc]

Honestly, I'm not entirely sure that was the originial intention of the GAC system. Now, the start of the GAC program was before my time, so I don't have first-hand knowledge of its origins, but this is how it has been explained to me by a handful of seasoned cast and leaders:

I'm sure GAC was not intended to help non-transfer wheelie folks like me. That's why I never thought to ask for a card the first couple years it existed. It was supposed to be for guests with invisible disabilities. Not something a CM could detect at the gate.

Back then guests needing that special wheelchair accommodation were directed to special wheelchair queues. IASW had you report to a CM and then go to the Exit and proceed down the ramp to wait for service. ECVs were not even allowed inside. Sometimes you'd get wheelies transferring but usually we all just waited for the wheelchair boat to cycle through the ride. Then they went to FPs and mainstream access for the ECVs. Now you could take an ECV into a queue, but those who needed the special cars lost direct access to that queue.

So CMs started recommending those guests get the GAC allowing them to bypass one queue to get to theirs. But it got confusing, because some GS CMs gave you a GAC with a wheelchair stamp. That was redundant because it was meant for guests who used strollers as wheelchairs or ECVs as wheelchairs. If you were in an actual wheelchair that was pretty obvious.

It doesn't surprise me EPCOT was not in the habit of giving out the "Alternate Entrances" stamp. Most of the attractions there are either movie seating with wheelchair access in the back rows or involve very inaccessible vehicles that require a hard transfer (e.g. Test Track where you do a difficult lift and slide transfer down into the vehicle). The two that have wheelchair cars tend not to be busy or have separate lanes for wheelies inside.

Spaceship: Earth is a unique exception. It operates the same way it has since 1998 for wheelies. You go inside the exit, report to a CM and wait for boarding. CM takes your name, number of your party and gives you an estimate for a wait time. They try to factor in Standby times outside to be fair. I always go when the crowd has moved on to the Countries for the day so I'm just waiting for that new slide-transfer vehicle to cycle through the ride. (I wasn't able to ride this attraction before they had that. It was like Haunted Mansion and Snow White for me. One I could only do if I had helpers to lift me. Now I can do HM mostly on my own. Snow White never got accommodation before it was taken down.)

Ideally I'd like to see more attractions do that or what they do at Star Tours. There you are sent up a separate wheelchair ramp to wait for boarding. Gets you away from the pedestrian throng and let's them process wheelie guests much more efficiently. Used to be you boarded from the front. Now you are escorted down a hallway to the exit and are assigned a vehicle to wait for. When that unloads, you can drive your chair down the ramp to the vehicle, do a slide transfer and then ride. You exit the same, except someone brings you back your wheelchair. CMs just have to remember to save some seats for your party because while you are loading via the exit, the Standby folks are loading from the entrance.

I plan to have talks with GS next week and explain my situation. I'll also try those rides I now do with the GAC and see if they have some different instructions for guests such as me. I can see the abuse if they just willy nilly hand out return tickets for everyone with a wheelchair. It shouldn't be for guests in ECVs, or those with little to no transfer issues. I'd be happy if I had a stamp, card or even a wristband that says I can only use DAS if I ride in my wheelchair. Most abusers will not want to do that.

FWIW, CMs have always tried to be very helpful to me when they can with just a few exceptions. CMs directed me to get the GAC so they could help me and still follow their rules.

 

[Mr Bill]

Right, because Disney is too conceited to think that Universal has a far more reasonable system. They wouldn't dare come up with a similar rule because they always have to be "smarter" than the competition.

Giving disabled guests return times that are 5 minutes out (which it sounds like they will do when the wait time is 15 minutes) is an exercise in stupidity. There's a difference between having a program that is "fair to all" and a program that is "fair to all, but also creates unnecessarily stupid waits."

That is indeed the procedure they want CMs to go through for 15 minute waits. Whether or not the CMs will actually do that remains to be seen. The best part is that the times are to be treated like FastPasses are, letting people in up to 5 minutes early so that "come back in 5 minutes" return time turns into "Just head right over to the Fastpass return and go on in." but with two or three extra steps thrown in for fun.

 

[startraveler]

Out of curiosity, when do you visit WDW? I thought I'd seen it all at TSM during my visits (Feb, March, April, May, Sep, Oct, December) I've been here during the lull times of Sep and May, the busy times of Spring Break and Columbus Weekend. I even come at the mega busy time of NYE. In all those trips I have never seen a family of non-wheelie guests board at the regular exit at TSM. We all just wait together for those two 6-seater cars.

I did encounter a first last Sunday when a 7-8 person non-wheelie family (I cannot remember exactly how many were in the group) boarded a regular 8-seater vehicle. But that vehicle was brought into the 6-seater loading bay. CMs told me they had the ability to pull up those 8 seaters when the transfers got backed up. Great I thought. I've been asking them to do this since the ride opened.

Every other time in the past that wheelie line gets jammed because they insist on using the same 6-seater for all guests. They just pull out the seat and ready it for a wheelchair or put it back together depending on if they have a transfer or non-transfer guest. I'm often asked to make room for a transfer guest who arrived behind me because there were seats available in the 6 seater for them. Irritates me when that vehicle was loaded with all transfer guests. To be fair to all, CMs make the decision whether it is a transfer or non-transfer vehicle based on the first guest in line.

So if Guest 1 is a transfer, but Guest 2 & 3 are non-transfers while Guest 4 & 5 are transfers, the next vehicle up takes Guests 1, 4 & 5 leaving Guests 2 & 3 waiting for the next vehicle to cycle thru the ride. Guest 3 has to wait for Guest 1, 4 & 5 to return to board.

I had been suggesting forever that they alternate the two wheelchair vehicles with a transfer one, then keep one of the vehicles broken down and ready for a wheelchair. They have the ability to know what sort of demand they have. As soon as you get up the ramp a CM polls the line to find out if you are transfer or non-transfer. It just seemed like this attraction could be handled a lot more efficiently.

Perhaps they made changes since I was last here?

We go during the same times. I've only seen them take people who can transfer to the exit when the line is really backed up with a lot of non-transfer people. I do try to ride that ride a lot though since it is one of the few I can ride. You're right, It would seem more efficient in busy times to keep one vehicle able to receive a wheelchair at all times.

 

[BroganMc]

Of course, anyone except for psychopaths would do the same.

But you'll have to pardon the rest of the public who gives the stinkeye if a child with a "severe disability" looks and acts like every other child waiting in the 90 minute Standby line, but the invisibly severely disabled child and their siblings and parents all go to the head of the line with a GAC or DAS. If the severe disability manifests itself in a wheelchair bound child or some other visual cue that the child is severely disabled, I don't think I've ever met anyone who wouldn't gladly allow that child to head up the exit or via FP and gain access to the ride that way.

The good news here is that the DAS program still allows those severely disabled children, whether their disability is visible or invisible, to head in via FP or the exit to access the ride without waiting in Standby. It will act just like GAC in that regard. So I'm not sure where the anger from the disabled folks come from.

This is an old post I dug up in the thread because I want to demonstrate something to the folks like this who may still not understand where the anxiety in the disabled community comes from.

All the literature I'm reading about DAS says that those kinds of kids and adults with very visible physical disabilities that would require their family to lift them into ride vehicles or confine them only to use the designated special wheelchair cars won't be allowed to get a DAS card or the subsequent return time ticket.

That means those families will have to go by Standby or FP like ablebodied guests.

Now many times the very medical condition that has put that kid in a wheelchair also affects their stamina and ability to get to a park early enough to get a FP or wait for the night time FP time. (By the time I was able to get to EPCOt all the FPs for Test Track were gone and Soarin was for 7:30. I left the park by then because my back pain was acting up badly. )

Now you might think "so they can just join the standby line like the rest of us". Sure in many cases they already do when there is no other option for the attraction. But have you ever tried to manage a wheelchair in a crowd? It is common for pedestrians to back into you, bang your feet, whack you in the head with a backpack, and sometimes just lean against your handlebars. Not to mention they always squeeze in front of you if the line condenses from something large like the Soarin interactive game section to the narrow boarding area. Because of these things most wheelchair bound folks avoid crowds. It's not technically a medical disorder but rather a smarter way to go about in the world and avoid problems.

I'm hoping GS CMs are getting training on these sorts of people so they understand the request for help. My fear is that in order to curb the cheaters who equate a twisted ankle with a severe mobility disorder they are being trained to just blanket reject anyone with a wheelchair and without an anxiety disorder.

It would bug the crap out of me to know I had to cope with my physical issues and not have the ability to ask for the assistance an autistic person could get. (Not that I don't know there are things I can do that an autistic person can't or begrudge them the necessary help.)

 

[Lord_Vader]

Out of curiosity, when do you visit WDW? I thought I'd seen it all at TSM during my visits (Feb, March, April, May, Sep, Oct, December) I've been here during the lull times of Sep and May, the busy times of Spring Break and Columbus Weekend. I even come at the mega busy time of NYE. In all those trips I have never seen a family of non-wheelie guests board at the regular exit at TSM. We all just wait together for those two 6-seater cars.

Last Christmas/NY we were loaded several times at the exit queue (over two weeks) as a result of the wheelchair ramp/entrance line extending to and past the merge point which was causing a bottleneck for the FP and SB lines. The CM at the merge point told us the first time that the wait would be about an hour and a half to two hours based on their experience but as more wheelchairs pulled up from the SB line (they had already waited at least 60 minutes) the line suddenly started moving FAST, very fast to be honest. When we got up the ramp and moved into the loading area a CM was escorting any/all guests that could transfer to the exit side to reduce the backup.

It ended up taking about 30 minutes that day, when we were expecting a much longer delay.

BTW, having never been able to move through the line from the merge point up the stairs, how long does it normally take as we have been wondering for years now?

 

[flynnibus]

BTW, having never been able to move through the line from the merge point up the stairs, how long does it normally take as we have been wondering for years now?

It's still a decent wait from that point. You go up the stairs down and back a hallway, and then down the stairs on the other side. It's rather confining up there and not too pleasant. Maybe another 120-150? feet of queue?

 

[jrlbc06]

Last Christmas/NY we were loaded several times at the exit queue (over two weeks) as a result of the wheelchair ramp/entrance line extending to and past the merge point which was causing a bottleneck for the FP and SB lines. The CM at the merge point told us the first time that the wait would be about an hour and a half to two hours based on their experience but as more wheelchairs pulled up from the SB line (they had already waited at least 60 minutes) the line suddenly started moving FAST, very fast to be honest. When we got up the ramp and moved into the loading area a CM was escorting any/all guests that could transfer to the exit side to reduce the backup.

It ended up taking about 30 minutes that day, when we were expecting a much longer delay.

BTW, having never been able to move through the line from the merge point up the stairs, how long does it normally take as we have been wondering for years now?

Once you go up the stairs it is a matter of probably 5-7 minutes. It is quick from there. Just one switchback and down the other set of stairs to the load area.

 

[fosse76]

All the literature I'm reading about DAS says that those kinds of kids and adults with very visible physical disabilities that would require their family to lift them into ride vehicles or confine them only to use the designated special wheelchair cars won't be allowed to get a DAS card or the subsequent return time ticket.

That means those families will have to go by Standby or FP like ablebodied guests.

Yes. Equal treatment/access.

Now many times the very medical condition that has put that kid in a wheelchair also affects their stamina and ability to get to a park early enough to get a FP or wait for the night time FP time. (By the time I was able to get to EPCOt all the FPs for Test Track were gone and Soarin was for 7:30. I left the park by then because my back pain was acting up badly. )

Unfortunately, that's life. Disney is only required to reasonably accomodate access to its attractions. Even the non-disabled have different levels of stamina. If I get tired after three hours in the park, should I qualify for GAC or the new DAS, despite not having any disability? No one is really on equal footing, as everyone has differing levels of stamina and abilities. And if you have back problems, there are quite a few attractions you shouldn't be experiencing in the first place.

Now you might think "so they can just join the standby line like the rest of us". Sure in many cases they already do when there is no other option for the attraction. But have you ever tried to manage a wheelchair in a crowd? It is common for pedestrians to back into you, bang your feet, whack you in the head with a backpack, and sometimes just lean against your handlebars. Not to mention they always squeeze in front of you if the line condenses from something large like the Soarin interactive game section to the narrow boarding area. Because of these things most wheelchair bound folks avoid crowds. It's not technically a medical disorder but rather a smarter way to go about in the world and avoid problems.

That's the nature of crowds! When you are in a queue, it doesn't matter if you are in a wheelchair or non-disabled, people will bump into you or otherwise invade your personal space at some point. That's just the way it is.

I'm hoping GS CMs are getting training on these sorts of people so they understand the request for help. My fear is that in order to curb the cheaters who equate a twisted ankle with a severe mobility disorder they are being trained to just blanket reject anyone with a wheelchair and without an anxiety disorder.

It's been mentioned in this thread before by other posters, but I also don't understand why people put themselves in situations that will make them uncomfortable for significant periods at a time. Unable to tolerate heat? Why go to Florida to theme parks that are outdoors in the heat? Unable to tolerate crowds? Why go to a crowded theme park? If personal conditions make these unbearable, it makes no sense to endure it. Disney is making what are reasonable accomodations. You, no matter what you may think, are NOT entitled to immediate access to any attraction, no matter your disability. After reading your posts, you don't seem to want Disney to accomodate you; rather, you want Disney to cater to your every want/need, and at the expense of delaying or inconveniencing other guests in the park (and you aren't the only one, many other GAC users who are upset with these changes also want to be catered to and not merely accomodated). Disney is legally obligated to provide a reasonable accomodation that grants you physical access to the ride. Nothing more. The DAS system does just that.

Yes, it is unfortunate that you and others in this thread have conditions that prevent you from experiencing the parks in the same manner as an able-bodied guest. Yes, it's unfortunate to have a child with autism, who will breakdown at any second and be difficult to manage. That doesn't entitle you to enjoy MORE attractions than the average guest. I'm sorry that some people have low stamina as a result of a disability, but if that alone were reason to grant front-of-line access, then everyone who enetered the parks would qualify for DAS, since no one has the same stamina levels.

It would bug the crap out of me to know I had to cope with my physical issues and not have the ability to ask for the assistance an autistic person could get. (Not that I don't know there are things I can do that an autistic person can't or begrudge them the necessary help.)

If the attractions are wheelchair accessible, you don't need the accomodation that an autistic person does. And while anxiety CAN be protected under ADA (depending on severity), the ADA was not designed to eliminate anxiety-causing conditions.

 

[Dasnowz]

A Little more info ...


• How long is a DAS Card valid?
A DAS card is valid for up to 14 days depending on a guest’s ticket entitlement.


This is official from Disney. don't ask for more as I cannot say more yet.

 

[Lord_Vader]

That's the nature of crowds! When you are in a queue, it doesn't matter if you are in a wheelchair or non-disabled, people will bump into you or otherwise invade your personal space at some point. That's just the way it is.

A simple bump is one thing, I have seen guests jump (JUMP) over my wifes legs to get across where we were walking, had guests push her out of their way while in line for photos, walked up and stand in front of her for parades, etc.

Normal crowd and congestion is one thing, completely rude and disrespectful is another.

Most people that walk generally consider a wheelchair much ase they do a stroller except they fail to understand that an adult in a chair is infinately more difficult to stop when going downhill or requires a great deal of effort to restart moving uphill when they just stop in front requiring us to maintain a larger space in front of us at all times resulting in those guests jumping across or even worse dragging their children in a chain of people.

 

[IWantMyMagicBand]

A simple bump is one thing, I have seen guests jump (JUMP) over my wifes legs to get across where we were walking, had guests push her out of their way while in line for photos, walked up and stand in front of her for parades, etc.

Normal crowd and congestion is one thing, completely rude and disrespectful is another.

Don't ever take her to Disneyland Paris. This is normal behaviour over there for everyone

 

[George]

I, for one, feel that the biggest change is the G becoming a D. I know that the C also changes into an S, but I feel like the beginning of the acronym is the most important bit. Plus, the A remaining an A isn't really a change at all, is it? Further, from a phonetic perspective, DAS has a nice sound whereas GAC is reminiscent of vomiting.

 

[luv]

Disney has made it harder for those with real problems. No doubt about it.

We have those who didn't have real problems, but used the GACs anyway, to blame.

It's done now, though.

 

[IWantMyMagicBand]

I, for one, feel that the biggest change is the G becoming a D. I know that the C also changes into an S, but I feel like the beginning of the acronym is the most important bit. Plus, the A remaining an A isn't really a change at all, is it? Further, from a phonetic perspective, DAS has a nice sound whereas GAC is reminiscent of vomiting.

I still prefer the pre-DAS acronym. ARS. Now that IS phonetically pleasing

 

[crispy]

I still prefer the pre-DAS acronym. ARS. Now that IS phonetically pleasing

It sounds pirate-y. AARRRSSS.

(I obviously have nothing meaningful to add to this thread, but I enjoy reading everyone's perspectives.)

 

[startraveler]

A simple bump is one thing, I have seen guests jump (JUMP) over my wifes legs to get across where we were walking, had guests push her out of their way while in line for photos, walked up and stand in front of her for parades, etc.

Normal crowd and congestion is one thing, completely rude and disrespectful is another.

Most people that walk generally consider a wheelchair much ase they do a stroller except they fail to understand that an adult in a chair is infinately more difficult to stop when going downhill or requires a great deal of effort to restart moving uphill when they just stop in front requiring us to maintain a larger space in front of us at all times resulting in those guests jumping across or even worse dragging their children in a chain of people.

You are right. People bumping into you and invading your space is different than what regularly happens to wheelchair users. I have had kids sit on my feet and not move off when asked, people always trip over my footrests when I am stopped because they don't look where they are going (probably trying to see a wait time on their phone ); I have people literally crawl overtop my lap to get to people ahead of me in line; people are always hitting me in the head with their bags, cameras, etc.; most of the time they don't even realize or understand what they are doing. What makes me feel really bad is that is that I try to leave space in front of me when I am navigating the park. People just like bad drivers jump into that space all the time. They get hurt when they don't realize my feet stick out further than the chair or I run into their ankles. Many times they fall right on the concrete and I'm not even moving. So yeah, they invade the space you are in, not the space around you. It is really difficult for others to understand. I've even had people put their children in front of me when I am waiting for a parade and say well, he can't really enjoy it. Or people stand in front of me at parades so they can get good pictures. Then act all mean when I ask them to move - they don't by the way. I have also had a multitude of wonderful experiences from other guests who were friendly, engaged in wonderful conversation and helpful when I needed it. But each day of a visit has the "climbing" and "hitting" etc. You just learn to live with it. But it is different than normal bumping and space invading.

 

[JerseyDad]

I, for one, feel that the biggest change is the G becoming a D. I know that the C also changes into an S, but I feel like the beginning of the acronym is the most important bit. Plus, the A remaining an A isn't really a change at all, is it? Further, from a phonetic perspective, DAS has a nice sound whereas GAC is reminiscent of vomiting.

And speaking of the acronym ...now I'm seeing posts (elsewhere) that people are whining that the "D" stands for 'disabled' ....and want it to stand for "Disney"?

Any more catering to or accommodations? ...please ...speak up. Perhaps the color of the card offends you too.?

 

[TP2000]

It would bug the crap out of me to know I had to cope with my physical issues and not have the ability to ask for the assistance an autistic person could get. (Not that I don't know there are things I can do that an autistic person can't or begrudge them the necessary help.)

Yes, waiting in Standby for 90 minutes next to obnoxious people completely sucks. Waiting next to obnoxious people in long lines at Disney World in the heat has sucked since the 1970's, before they called that particular level of hell "Standby". You have to time potty breaks and snacks and hope to God the people you are wedged in next to are halfway-tolerable. But that's how a very busy Disney theme park works. For everyone.

Brave disabled advocates fought long and hard to get the ADA finally passed in 1990 so they could have equal access, not better access. Equal treatment, not special treatment. An equal Disney theme park visit requires juggling Fastpass times, planning out logistics in advance, fighting crowds at every turn, and waiting in long Standby lines.

 

[cmellito]

Info on new Disabled Assistance System:
http://micechat.com/42628-miceage-disneyland-update/

To summarize:

October 9, 2013 is the start of the new guest assistance program, which will replace GAC

Guests will go to Guest Services to get a card (with photo ID) and then go to kiosks elsewhere in the park to make ride reservations

Like a Fastpass return time, less 10 or 15 min, the reservations allow you to not wait in line, but you will not be able to get more than one at once. You can get other types of Fastpasses during this time though.

People may not qualify for the program if they are in wheelchairs at DCA (and maybe AK and DHS, since all have accessible queues?)

 

[cmellito]

Info on new Disabled Assistance System:
http://micechat.com/42628-miceage-disneyland-update/

To summarize:

October 9, 2013 is the start of the new guest assistance program, which will replace GAC

Guests will go to Guest Services to get a card (with photo ID) and then go to kiosks elsewhere in the park to make ride reservations

Like a Fastpass return time, less 10 or 15 min, the reservations allow you to not wait in line, but you will not be able to get more than one at once. You can get other types of Fastpasses during this time though.

People may not qualify for the program if they are in wheelchairs at DCA (and maybe AK and DHS, since all have accessible queues?)

This new program will not work..Hershey Park has this also. So after I get a return time what am I supposed to do with my autistic child who can't wait in lines? Are we supposed to walk around and to do nothing and then come back for our for return time? All the rides will have waits, so we can't go to another ride.