From the OS: Gator drags child into Seven Seas Lagoon

[GoofGoof]

This is all true.

Let's put it in perspective-

20 Million People Live in Florida.

Over 90 Million People Visit Florida Per Year.

So out of Over 110 Million People in 2015-
9 were attacked by an alligator.

Be aware, but it isn't cause for alarm.

It's a pretty big cause for alarm for those 9 people.

Is it your opinion that Disney should do nothing after this? It's not a cause for alarm, just keep everything as is and hope it's another 30 years before it happens again?

 

[GoofGoof]

I think the biggest issue is that the habitat has changed.

I'm not totally familiar with the various land sales that have occurred, but hasn't Disney sold off some of their previously unused land that is being developed for homes, hotels and/or shopping. If the habitat is shrinking and there is an uptick in people feeding the gators that's a bad combination.

 

[kelknight84]

10 Million will never repay for someone's life that was my point, but it is the best Disney can physically do. Seven Seas Lagoon does not look like a swamp it has a beach. I have known for years that gators were in Seven Seas Lagoon, but it is unacceptable that Disney not have any warning until something bad happened. Disney probably just thought the odds are too slim. This is the second attack so far. Sorry about that though.

I don't know where you are from but most parks in FL have lakes and most of those lakes have sandy shores that look like the beach. Disney's beach on a lake is not unique. Yes it is man-made but mainly so it would be shaped the way they wanted. It is still a lake and it's a lake in FL, which means FL wildlife comes with it. Take a tour on google maps and tons of other resorts nearby also have sandy beaches with lounge chairs on them on ponds and lakes, and I bet many still allow swimming. I've swam in many of FL lakes and rivers and will continue. You be aware of your surroundings no matter if you are at a resort or in the wilderness. I stayed at a hotel in Cleveland a few years ago at age 28 and it was the first time I saw, walked, and drove in snow. The hotel didn't give me any warnings or instructions on how to navigate their property, and just like this it was an act of nature and I didn't expect them to. I could have fallen or driven into black ice on their man made property. It's life, it's nature

It sucks a kid died, and it's a terrible tragedy but the family isn't at fault and I don't think Disney is negligent for the wild animal either. If people fed the gator then hold them accountable. It's against the law, so if CM's wanted to report something they should call the police. I also doubt that many reported it anyways since gators are such a part of FL life and very common. Most gator accidents happen because the gator is provoked.

And to one of your other posts about sharks in ankle water, please do some research because people do get bit in ankle deep water pretty often in FL.

 

[ParentsOf4]

Sharks are in oceans, bears and bobcats are in the wilderness, killer bees can fly anywhere, gators are naturally in bodies of water in Florida.

Are signs posted on every beach in the world warning of sharks? Are signs posted in forests warning of bears?

Interestingly enough, decades ago when I was a lifeguard, the beaches would be closed when sharks or jellyfish were spotted nearby, and "Beach Closed" signs would be posted.

About a decade ago while I was on business in Tucson, Saguaro National Park was closed because a large cat (cougar?) was spotted. And I recall seeing a "Park Closed" sign.

I've seen more than a few bear warning signs in my day. In one case, even though the park was open, there was an aggressive bear they were attempting to locate and park rangers were discussing it with every car entering the park. More than a few cars (including us) turned around.

The point is, Disney needs to warn its Guests.

 

[natatomic]

Not really. A life is irreplaceable. But what I said, and you would know this if you heart hadn't bled all over your screen therefore imparing your vision, is that 10 million is going to take good care of them for the rest of their lives. Perhaps I have to spell that out for you just like how we now have to spell out gators and snakes live in a swamp so stay out of the water.

That's not at all what you said, and you know it.
10 million dollars might "take care of them for the rest of their lives" financially, but they will hate every single penny that they spend and every single thing they will buy with that money for the rest of their lives too. That money will be a constant reminder of the tragedy that led them to obtaining the money in the first place. If they sue and get money, at least.

 

[EngineJoe]

Honestly if I were in the situation these parents are in I would never find closure. It's a horrible thing I would think about every day for the remainder of my life.

Yes but you can think about it in your palace. Most people

My odds would probably be less given the shocking reactions after situations the past few months.

I didn't come to that conclusion because of this thread, or any news outlet. I came to that conclusion because I love Florida, lived there for most of my life, and this isn't the first attack of nature that I've heard of. I also understand that life has risks, very small ones, but risks nonetheless. There are gators and crocs and sharks and snakes and tons of other things that can kill us, regardless of where we are.

Like I said, you're probably right on odds are higher that a lot of people would sue. I just don't think this family will. And I could be completely wrong.

I don't think they will sue and Disney will make sure they are not even in a position to sue by just giving them something like 10 million dollar undisclosed, lifetime passes to Disney and lifetime vip treatment for them and their remaining daughter in exchange for not suing.

If these parents are reasonable at all and I think they are they will take what Disney is offer img because they probably feel guilty for not being right with the child (everyone blames themselves when something like this happens even if it's not their fault because you can play the what if game) and they realize this was a freak accident that Disney really had little control over.

 

[Daveeeeed]

This is honestly my final post about this as I am tired of people not understanding why Disney is the most to blame and is legally responsible. A baby lost its life, and it seriously could have been avoided, but Disney thought it would never happen even though a nonfatal attack happened in 1986. Odds are Disney didn't want to scare people away from the beach, which in turn got someone killed.
here's a brief list of why Disney is the most to blame, and I am not saying this to point fingers, but because people seriously need to understand why.

- Disney knew there were gators in and around Seven Seas Lagoon.
- Disney had no warnings. Most people don't expect gators to be in a manmade lagoon on vacation at a Disney resort if they don't know about alligators literally being in every body of water in Florida. Not to mention it was at night.
- Disney had an inviting beach where they played a movie on.
- Disney was warned by multiple Cast Members that there were gators appearing more frequently (possibly due to more people feeding gators, maybe because of the Polynesian Bungalows).
- Just a swimming sign doesn't have anything to do with with standing along or barely in the water which an alligator can attack both those places. There needed to be warnings of alligators, snakes, and to not go in the water at all.
- Many more reasons, but that covers the bulk of it.

Odds are it won't happen again, but someone shouldn't of had to die for them to make change. As I've said, someone was attacked in '86.
If you know that there are alligators there you're lucky, not everyone does though, especially foreigners as there aren't warnings.
Just please pray for the family, the baby that lost its life and hope for the best. And really to Disney too, I love Disney, but I cannot deny that Disney is the only one with fault here. Yes the family shouldn't have let him play at night, but realistically I don't think they expected a gator to be in there at all much less attack their child in inches deep water.

 

[EngineJoe]

It is not about the location seriously how do you not get this, it is about the fact how Disney KNEW there were gators, HAD A MOVIE on the stupid beach where gators were present & didn't have a sign warning of gators. If you come from China would you call a person stupid for not knowing about gators in a man made lagoon on an inviting family-friendly beach?

You need to stop Disney shaming and blaming. This isn't the time for that. Think about the children.

 

[kelknight84]

Interesting enough, decades ago when I was a lifeguard, the beaches were closed when sharks or jellyfish were spotted nearby, and "Beach Closed" signs were posted.

About a decade ago while I was on business in Tuscan, Saguaro National Park was closed because a large cat (cougar?) was spotted. And I recall seeing a "Park Closed" sign.

I've seen more than a few bear warning signs in my day. In one case, even though the park was open, there was an aggressive bear they were attempting to locate and park rangers were discussing it with every car entering the park. More than a few cars (including us) turned around.

The point is, Disney needs to warn its Guests.

If they closed the beaches here for every shark, jellyfish and stingray then they would be closed everyday year round.

At the Fort we've multiple times been given flyers about a bear and to keep food inside and call immediately if we see it.

Gators usually lay around unless provoked or fed. It's rare for them to approach humans and go near populated zones. I've heard many stories of bears around the country and even FL seeking out food so they often get close to humans.

Gators not so much, so until now it really wasn't a concern or on the radar.

 

[EngineJoe]

I'm a life long Disney fan. It it were me, and through negligence they caused me to lose a child, I would sue. I would be extremely angry and want to create change. Companies only change their ways due to pain. A long public lawsuit would be part of how I would deal. I'm not saying it's healthy to want to strike back. Only that it's human. I'm not a fan of lawsuits. But here it's appropriate IMHO.

Well the you can show solidarity and boycott Disney. Put your money where your mouth is. But I bet you won't in the end.

 

[jackson2005]

I googled " why no swimming at Disney world" before we went a few years ago. It came up with the info about the bacteria that is in the water and is stirred up walking in the shoreline. If it enters the blood stream can kill you.

 

[EngineJoe]

I didn't want to say this, but honestly this just shows how stupid you are being right now. Please just stop. An inviting beach should remain, but an inviting beach should have warnings up of freakin' alligators when they knew they were there.

You shouldn't call 21stamps stupid. It weakens your arguement when you resort to such name calling.

 

[kelknight84]

This is honestly my final post about this as I am tired of people not understanding why Disney is the most to blame and is legally responsible. A baby lost its life, and it seriously could have been avoided, but Disney thought it would never happen even though a nonfatal attack happened in 1986. Odds are Disney didn't want to scare people away from the beach, which in turn got someone killed.
here's a brief list of why Disney is the most to blame, and I am not saying this to point fingers, but because people seriously need to understand why.

- Disney knew there were gators in and around Seven Seas Lagoon.
- Disney had no warnings. Most people don't expect gators to be in a manmade lagoon on vacation at a Disney resort if they don't know about alligators literally being in every body of water in Florida. Not to mention it was at night.
- Disney had an inviting beach where they played a movie on.
- Disney was warned by multiple Cast Members that there were gators appearing more frequently (possibly due to more people feeding gators, maybe because of the Polynesian Bungalows).
- Just a swimming sign doesn't have anything to do with with standing along or barely in the water which an alligator can attack both those places. There needed to be warnings of alligators, snakes, and to not go in the water at all.
- Many more reasons, but that covers the bulk of it.

Odds are it won't happen again, but someone shouldn't of had to die for them to make change. As I've said, someone was attacked in '86.
If you know that there are alligators there you're lucky, not everyone does though, especially foreigners as there aren't warnings.
Just please pray for the family, the baby that lost its life and hope for the best. And really to Disney too, I love Disney, but I cannot deny that Disney is the only one with fault here. Yes the family shouldn't have let him play at night, but realistically I don't think they expected a gator to be in there at all much less attack their child in inches deep water.

The 1986 attack was prompted because the kid was feeding wildlife and the gator probably wanted to get in on it.

It is called SS lagoon, but it is a lake with a fancy name.

I highly doubt Disney was warned by several CM's because 1 they probably didn't see anything and 2 most want to stay off their bosses radar, and 3 if there were issues the news would have gotten wind, they eat that kind of stuff up.

 

[s8film40]

Yes but you can think about it in your palace. Most people

Let's put it this way. I have a 2 year old right now. There is no amount of money that would make me want to trade places with these parents.

 

[flynnibus]

But if there had been past instances where previous visitors were threatened to the point of reporting the issue to you and you chose to ignore those warnings

The problem with everyone starting with this 'fact' is it assumes all gator sightings and reports are equal. How do we know how many of these reports were 'ignored' because they were in fact insignificant? Is every guest and CM now an expert on what gators are worthy of intervention? Prior to this week, how many even know Disney or FWC's standards for intervention? So why do we take these reports as de facto evidence of Disney's failure to act?

The feeding issue is separate... but I find it depressing that everyone is so up in arms over Disney's lack of response to the actions of these people... rather than the actions of these people! Least we forget... it's not Disney's responsibility to police and enforce these feeding laws.

These people have endangered OTHERS and what are the consequences for them? Nothing... because we have these insane principles in our society that somehow the host should be responsible for everything.

I totally get that Disney is responsible for acting if things get out of balance with reasonable norms.. but when are we going to actually look at people's responsibilities instead of always looking for someone to cover for someone else..

 

[EngineJoe]

I think (and this is just my opinion) that the reason Disney did not give guests a paper warning of alligators up till now is simply because they didn't want to frighten people. They're a business that deals in family getaways. The last thing you want to do is have people coming to your business and then being told they might possibly encounter a dangerous creature. I understand that it sounds stupid but if you think about it Disney doesn't want to put people on edge about something that probably is not going to be a big deal. Yes, recent events might make that comment sound incredibly silly. But if you think about it most people who get a piece of paper from Disney warning them of alligators would take that to an extreme and assume that alligators are around every corner and outside every hotel room. People panic over small things. Again, that's just my opinion.

Yup if you have to warn about aligators in slash Mountain, alligators in the bathroom stalls in the magic kingdom, armadillos that carry leporosy and can transmit it if a small child pets them or the armadillo sneezes on you, poisonous snakes and anacondas, poisonous Bufo frogs and terrorist/crazy killers then people get scared, especially kids. So I kind of Agee with you.

But now they are gonna warn about ever single danger I think. He current sign says beware aligators and snakes.

 

[flynnibus]

The fact that IT WAS AN INVITING BEACH at Grand Floridian where most people would never even consider gators being there

Should Disney be obligated to warn guests that the Sun is more intense in Florida vs other northern places? And if you don't take appropriate action you will end up with severe sunburn? After all.. most people probably don't realize the latitude makes a big difference... and Disney puts out these inviting chairs without umbrellas... etc

I mean.. it's an artificial environment, made inviting...

 

[s8film40]

I highly doubt Disney was warned by several CM's because 1 they probably didn't see anything and 2 most want to stay off their bosses radar, and 3 if there were issues the news would have gotten wind, they eat that kind of stuff up

I've seen an extremely large number of instances where CM's have passed on concerns to their managers. It happens every day at WDW and its not uncommon for them to be ignored. I've done it myself personally when I worked there. There are videos on YouTube of guests feeding gators, I don't think it's unlikely this was witnessed by CM's This is not far fetched at all. This would not have been anything the news would have been interested in, in fact I'm pretty sure those YouTube videos were posted before this event. If the news were interested it was sitting there waiting.

 

[flynnibus]

Alligators tend to stay away from humans, but when you feed them they start coming back

And alligators still attack small mammals regardless of humans feeding them or not. Which is why they kill animals and pets frequently. We keep forgetting those important factors about the attack.

This isn't an alligator attacking a grown man in the middle of a parking lot during lunchtime.

 

[JohnD]

I'm usually no fan of Slate but here's a good article about the repercussions of feeding and interacting with wildlife: http://www.slate.com/articles/healt...lligators_lead_to_the_2_year_old_s_death.html