FP+ meltdown part x

[BigTxEars]

When you say “I don’t want to go to Disneyland” you ARE saying you are not interested in Disneyland. That is EXACTLY what you are saying. There is no other way to interpret it. Some people will also infer you have never been from that statement.



Differing opinions are encouraged. It invalidates your argument however when you are using words incorrectly. In your examples you do just that. I can’t say anything more to the point without it reported as attacking your intelligence.

If your best argument is my kid thinks it’s cool than you’re in trouble. I imagine they are not allowed to make a lot of decisions yet and that’s because they lack critical thought and understanding.

As an fyi… Disney is not the first company to use RFID to “magically” open hotel rooms or gain entry into a park/event. Personally I didn't it to be anything special. Then again I’m not a kid.

Oh good Lord stop it already. I spent my honeymoon at DL in 1992, been there before that and since that. Saying you don't want to go somewhere (especially when you say you would rather go somewhere else instead) does not mean you are not interested in it or that you have not been there. For the record I don't want to go to the bathroom right now I rather go to the kitchen and eat, but maybe latter I will prefer the bathroom.....and I have been there once or twice as well.....

Where else can I go and use a MB like device to do what I can at WDW? I'll wait for your answer.....

I gave my reasons ( I am not arguing about what I prefer, I know what I prefer and it's not something that I feel the need to argue about) why I like the MBs. I gave the example of the kids as yet one more reason why I think MBs are immersive. I gave a number of reason that had nothing to do with kids as well.

Glad you not a kid, enjoy your trips to the magic kingdom ruled by the talking mouse as a adult.

 

[doctornick]

No, that's not my "main complaint". My "main complaint" is that planning what attraction you are going to be around in a theme park up to 3 months in advance is simply insanity.

The post of yours I replied to said nothing about booking far in advance. The "main complaint" in that post was about how FP+ was apparently inflexible, which it may arguably be in some way -- but is no worse than paper FP in that regard (and I would argue that flexibility is a strength of FP+ compared to paper FP, not a detriment).

Furthermore, even ignoring that FP+ cannot be reserved 3 months in advance (nothing like tossing some hyperbole in just for effect), but nothing compels someone to reserve rides at the 30 or 60 day windows. If you find it absurd to reserve rides that far in advance, there's a simple solution: don't do it. I mean if the idea bothers you that much, why would you do it? Wait til a week before you are there to select FP+. Or do it in the morning before going to the park. Whatever works for you.

It's hard to have this discussion when different folks are on way different levels of understanding of just how the concept itself of doing so is utterly baffling and hilarious to those outside of the Disney fandom bubble (and many of us inside, as well).

I think if someone presents the concept to someone in a hyperbolic way -- as you are apt to describe it -- than, yes, it will be thought of as bizzare to the uninitiated. If you present it in a more levelheaded way, then I think most people don't think it's that odd. Different than what they might be used to, but not crazy. There's nothing really that weird about a plan resulting in having an hour window to be able to quickly get on a ride for 3 rides a day. That's far from the whole day being planned out. And I'll emphasize again the hour window -- it's not like it's a specific time (ride at 3:43pm or somesuch), but a general time of day to be in a particular area of the park.

I'm helping two novice families right now with trip plans for Jan/Feb timeframe (i.e. they haven't booked FP+ yet). The one family has a wife who is doing the planning and thinks it's awesome that she can get ride reservations and keeps asking me the specifics of what to book and when in the day and everything. The other family, I explained FP+ to them and they thought it was different but since they expected to plan a lot for Disney, weren't that phased by it.

How do you know what the weather will be like that day? How do you know your kid won't have a stomach ache and not be able to ride the rides you chose three months ago?

For the latter, so? If your kid has a stomach ache, it's going to wreck havoc on your day regardless of having FP+ reserved. If you were getting paper FP in the morning and that happened, would you somehow be in better shape? How? Obviously, you are going to have to modify plans on the fly when needed. The upside of FP+ is that at least the reservations can be changed -- to a different time or different attraction -- unlike paper FP.

There's always going to be things that happen. FP+ provides a framework for a daily plan, but it's not cast in stone. If it doesn't work, then you don't use that FP+ or the party changes it. The vacation will go on, much like it did if you grabbed a paper FP and didn't use it.

Oh, you can just leap on your smartphone, if you have one, and reschedule - if there are any available FP+ left, and then you have to mess around and go through this whole process which is beyond words more complex than just "go as you go along", grabbing a FP here or there when it helps.

Again, hyperbole. Sure you might not be able to change a FP+ to something you want. And if you have a paper FP you grabbed that didn't work for you, you weren't able to get a brand new FP for something you did want at the time you wanted either. In either system, you can just forgo Fastpass and get in the standby line. If things change in your plans, they change; FP+ doesn't prevent you from rolling with the punches.

You schedule a five minute meeting with a President three months in advance, not a five minute theme park ride.

Again, no one is holding a gun to your head to schedule FP+ -- in any specific timeframe or at all in advance. And many people like people to reserve rides and make plans from the comfort of their home before the stress and anxiety of being in the midst of the vacation. In my experience, a bigger cause of guest dissatisfaction with WDW is poor planning resulting in wasting time as a group can't figure out what to do and walks around aimlessly and feels they didn't get their money's worth. YMMV, but from the people I have helped planned trips are generally happier and more satisfied the more they planned and prepared for WDW. FP+ helps with that by giving some modicum of structure to the day.

No, that's not a clear positive. The regular FP system was the same.

No, it wasn't. First of all, FP+ replacements for a broken down ride can be used on any ride, not just the one that broke down. That's a big benefit for flexibility. Second of all, though less significant, for those with a smartphone, you get an e-mail notice about the ride being down and being able to use the FP+ elsewhere -- this helps save time from walking over to the ride to seeing that it has broken down, so it potentially helps your day run smoother.

However, because you've booked that day three months in advance, you are at that park, you've scheduled your whole day around those FP, is far different than getting a FP a few hours before, somewhere you happen to be and that you plan on being for the next few hours.

People didn't plan on being in a particular park on a particular day before FP+? Even ignoring dining reservations, a lot of people tend to have some outlines of plans (at least a sense of "we're doing 2 days at MK, 1 day at DAK, etc." even if specific days aren't assigned). The number of guests who are like "it is raining today, let's not go to a park" are very few and far between as most people are going to the parks come hell or high water since they paid for that vacation.

And if you are the type who picks a park on a whim, well great for you. Book your FP+ when you get there (or are on the way). All the reports I've seen is that except for very few attractions (namely Elsa&Anna and the 7DMT), you can easily get last minute FP+ the night before or morning of. Maybe not as many times being available, but I think we all realize that pre-planning has advantages. You won't get the ressie at Cindy's castle either.

I get it - some folks are eating this up and loving it. At a different time, perhaps I would have as well - but never for one minute would I think this was typical whatsoever of what the average WDW guest would want, because all I have ever heard from most folks when it comes to planning a WDW vacation is that it ALREADY was too much planning and scheduling to begin with - those folks who like to go on vacation like this - folks that would come to a Disney board to begin with - are by nature not typical.

Depends on the person, but I suspect the "typical" WDW guests who doesn't know much would probably benefit from FP+ more because it actually encourages some planning and structure compared to "winging it" and standing around in Adventureland with everyone arguing about where to go next.

 

[AEfx]

Furthermore, even ignoring that FP+ cannot be reserved 3 months in advance (nothing like tossing some hyperbole in just for effect), but nothing compels someone to reserve rides at the 30 or 60 day windows. If you find it absurd to reserve rides that far in advance, there's a simple solution: don't do it. I mean if the idea bothers you that much, why would you do it? Wait til a week before you are there to select FP+. Or do it in the morning before going to the park. Whatever works for you.

I love how you make it sound so easy and carefree, ROFL.

But you miss all the effects that this has on everyone who does not use it. It is completely changing everything about how the parks are run. You already see folks having to stalk the website for some magic unknown time where a ride "opens up" for their dates. When you look at the list functionally, there really are only 3 or maybe 4 rides in the park that actually need a FP, and those are the ones everyone goes for. It's turned it into this Internet clicky game - and some folks just like it because they like being obsessive planners and this is yet another excuse to spend hours living in your head in commando-nirvana.

Look what happened with the Toy Story "FP+ only" test - anyone that thinks that isn't something we are going to see more of, is fooling themselves. Absolutely. Disney doesn't shut down a standby line for a week as a "test" and not mean serious business. The fact that you have to pick electronically a ride and a time even a day in advance is pushing it for sheer craziness - particularly when you then can't ride at all. That just happened, folks are pooh-poohing it as it was a "test" - but how many business do multi-day tests in a live guest environment that aren't pretty serious about doing what it is they are testing?

You know what that "test" was, really? To test how many people they'd PO and get complaints from if they did it.

I think if someone presents the concept to someone in a hyperbolic way -- as you are apt to describe it -- than, yes, it will be thought of as bizzare to the uninitiated. If you present it in a more levelheaded way, then I think most people don't think it's that odd. Different than what they might be used to, but not crazy. There's nothing really that weird about a plan resulting in having an hour window to be able to quickly get on a ride for 3 rides a day. That's far from the whole day being planned out. And I'll emphasize again the hour window -- it's not like it's a specific time (ride at 3:43pm or somesuch), but a general time of day to be in a particular area of the park.

If you find me hyperbolic, it's a response to this Disney commercial some folks are putting forth where they are forgetting to put that little disclaimer at the bottom that says, "*sequences shortened and experience may not be typical". Some of you guys make this sound so breezy and easy and convenient, but the truth is, there are a lot of "if's" in there - and assumes everything works perfectly.

And I'm sorry, I just disagree - it's just not reasonable to normal people who aren't in the "planner" bubble. Three rides, in parks that's open like 9 hours on average a lot of the year? Even presuming that you were there the entire time (most aren't), and you figure at least a dining reservation a day - that's four points in a day, somewhere you have to be every two hours on average. Given how long it takes just to walk around the parks - yes, that's a significant part of the day you have to decide ahead of time.

For the latter, so? If your kid has a stomach ache, it's going to wreck havoc on your day regardless of having FP+ reserved. If you were getting paper FP in the morning and that happened, would you somehow be in better shape? How? Obviously, you are going to have to modify plans on the fly when needed. The upside of FP+ is that at least the reservations can be changed -- to a different time or different attraction -- unlike paper FP.

But you didn't secure that paper FP, and choose that day to be in that place, days or weeks or months in advance.

We are going around the same thing over and over here, you and I simply have a completely fundamental different idea of what most folks look for in a vacation to WDW. I constantly hear folks overwhelmed by how much planning was already involved, and this entire system just is so ridiculously specific and caters to the very folks who already didn't wait much for rides - and is really messing over the average folks who just want to get in line and do a ride.

I love technology. I have gadgets and associated toys galore. I was the first person I know to adopt just about every new major technology before everyone else does. But it has to have a reason, a purpose, be better than what I had before - I'm not fooled by pretty shiny or appeals to internal issues like the excessive planning gene.

And when I look at this, how much it cost, and what it's reducing the already reduced park experiences to - I simply think it's a bad idea. You disagree. I'm glad you think it's a zip-a-dee-doo-da time, I just don't think it's really going to give the best experience for guests, and I don't think it's going to measurably make any extra money for WDW (at least not significant enough to justify it's cost - I have a feeling those numbers will make it look like it would take 100 years to amortize).

In any case, I look forward to the inevitable leaks of guest satisfaction surveys, particularly about the TSMM test - to see just how folks who aren't Disney-planning-addicts respond to this.

Depends on the person, but I suspect the "typical" WDW guests who doesn't know much would probably benefit from FP+ more because it actually encourages some planning and structure compared to "winging it" and standing around in Adventureland with everyone arguing about where to go next.

That's just it - there is a middle ground between "standing around Adventureland arguing..." and this type of militaristic planning.

In any case, I would disagree with the above statement - the list of attractions is so padded, that it would be very difficult for those who aren't experts. Disney's attraction pages aren't really known for their accuracy in depictions of attractions, either. Before, you knew if you needed one or not for an attraction because you could choose to ride or wait in line. Now, it's just a guessing game.

That's why, although some folks are simply enamored with this, I wonder what they will say in a few more trips when they have seen all the variables play out and how much planning down to that level is really limiting more than it's liberating. I can already hear kids/spouses saying, "Can we just go to Disney regular again?"

Most folks spend a good portion of their lives on schedules, time crunches, planning their days in advance - I bet if you did a study, you'd find the most common thing said about Disney vacations over the years was "you need a vacation from the vacation" and lament how much pre-planning needs to be done and how folks would rather "relax and enjoy" not stick to a time table.

As I said before, this was designed for the Disney Moms crowd, before they started to get shuffled off the stage, and appeals to those who wish to make a hobby out of WDW vacation planning. I just don't think that the general public is going to see any of this the same way as they start to experience it.

 

[BigTxEars]

I love how you make it sound so easy and carefree, ROFL.

But you miss all the effects that this has on everyone who does not use it. It is completely changing everything about how the parks are run. You already see folks having to stalk the website for some magic unknown time where a ride "opens up" for their dates. When you look at the list functionally, there really are only 3 or maybe 4 rides in the park that actually need a FP, and those are the ones everyone goes for. It's turned it into this Internet clicky game - and some folks just like it because they like being obsessive planners and this is yet another excuse to spend hours living in your head in commando-nirvana.

Look what happened with the Toy Story "FP+ only" test - anyone that thinks that isn't something we are going to see more of, is fooling themselves. Absolutely. Disney doesn't shut down a standby line for a week as a "test" and not mean serious business. The fact that you have to pick electronically a ride and a time even a day in advance is pushing it for sheer craziness - particularly when you then can't ride at all. That just happened, folks are pooh-poohing it as it was a "test" - but how many business do multi-day tests in a live guest environment that aren't pretty serious about doing what it is they are testing?

You know what that "test" was, really? To test how many people they'd PO and get complaints from if they did it.



If you find me hyperbolic, it's a response to this Disney commercial some folks are putting forth where they are forgetting to put that little disclaimer at the bottom that says, "*sequences shortened and experience may not be typical". Some of you guys make this sound so breezy and easy and convenient, but the truth is, there are a lot of "if's" in there - and assumes everything works perfectly.

And I'm sorry, I just disagree - it's just not reasonable to normal people who aren't in the "planner" bubble. Three rides, in parks that's open like 9 hours on average a lot of the year? Even presuming that you were there the entire time (most aren't), and you figure at least a dining reservation a day - that's four points in a day, somewhere you have to be every two hours on average. Given how long it takes just to walk around the parks - yes, that's a significant part of the day you have to decide ahead of time.




But you didn't secure that paper FP, and choose that day to be in that place, days or weeks or months in advance.

We are going around the same thing over and over here, you and I simply have a completely fundamental different idea of what most folks look for in a vacation to WDW. I constantly hear folks overwhelmed by how much planning was already involved, and this entire system just is so ridiculously specific and caters to the very folks who already didn't wait much for rides - and is really messing over the average folks who just want to get in line and do a ride.

I love technology. I have gadgets and associated toys galore. I was the first person I know to adopt just about every new major technology before everyone else does. But it has to have a reason, a purpose, be better than what I had before - I'm not fooled by pretty shiny or appeals to internal issues like the excessive planning gene.

And when I look at this, how much it cost, and what it's reducing the already reduced park experiences to - I simply think it's a bad idea. You disagree. I'm glad you think it's a zip-a-dee-doo-da time, I just don't think it's really going to give the best experience for guests, and I don't think it's going to measurably make any extra money for WDW (at least not significant enough to justify it's cost - I have a feeling those numbers will make it look like it would take 100 years to amortize).

In any case, I look forward to the inevitable leaks of guest satisfaction surveys, particularly about the TSMM test - to see just how folks who aren't Disney-planning-addicts respond to this.




That's just it - there is a middle ground between "standing around Adventureland arguing..." and this type of militaristic planning.

In any case, I would disagree with the above statement - the list of attractions is so padded, that it would be very difficult for those who aren't experts. Disney's attraction pages aren't really known for their accuracy in depictions of attractions, either. Before, you knew if you needed one or not for an attraction because you could choose to ride or wait in line. Now, it's just a guessing game.

That's why, although some folks are simply enamored with this, I wonder what they will say in a few more trips when they have seen all the variables play out and how much planning down to that level is really limiting more than it's liberating. I can already hear kids/spouses saying, "Can we just go to Disney regular again?"

Most folks spend a good portion of their lives on schedules, time crunches, planning their days in advance - I bet if you did a study, you'd find the most common thing said about Disney vacations over the years was "you need a vacation from the vacation" and lament how much pre-planning needs to be done and how folks would rather "relax and enjoy" not stick to a time table.

As I said before, this was designed for the Disney Moms crowd, before they started to get shuffled off the stage, and appeals to those who wish to make a hobby out of WDW vacation planning. I just don't think that the general public is going to see any of this the same way as they start to experience it.

I would be fine if they removed all types of FP, just all stand by lines. But barring that this is a better system than the previous one IMO. At least I have a chance to work around the limits that any type of reservation system has before I set foot in the park instead of reacting to them as they occur. I much rather know my "ride time" for Splash Mountain is at 4:30pm and my ADRs are at 5:30pm 3 weeks before I leave Texas than find out on the Tuesday I am at MK that my paper FP is for 5:00p to 6:00p and my ADRs I made 3 months ago is at 5:30pm. Thats one reason we like the new system better.

Also with something like the Frozen M&G we were able to get FP+ and look forward to that for weeks and weeks ahead of time, that was fun for us to talk about. That would not have occurred with the previous system, that conversation would have been "I hope we can get FPs"......not as much fun weeks ahead of time

Now if you can get all of the reservations system pulled then we have a deal!

 

[MMDVC]

I guess it must be working for future generations. My young grandchildren (5 and 7) were helping me unpack(big move from Ks to TX) and came across my MB box and wanted to wear those MBs in their fave color and they haven't even been to the parks yet, so don't even know what they are but yet they knew! I showed them how to unlock the garage door with the Band.. not really, but good idea!

 

[1023]

I think I may be able to simplify most of the issues with FastPassMinus. Disney has created a way to limit (or mandate) the amount of time you spend in line and the number of attractions you can experience in a day. Additionally, many of their under-informed customers and folks under the effects of "pixie dust" think this is a good thing. They have said, "Hey, we can get you onto your 3 favorite attractions in one park per day." They fail to mention that this is only if you select your attractions exactly 60 days out, because if you are even one day late, the 7DMT is not going to be available. Woe be to those in the future, selecting any Avatar themed screen ride that becomes popular in the distant future. (Provided it actually gets built as planned.)

Sure, most visitors to WDW were not power users of the "legacy" FastPass system. However, there can be no argument that educated use of the "legacy" system was far superior. You could acquire "legacy" FastPasses in multiple parks. This also made the ability to "park hop" more worthwhile. It can not be argued that going to DHS for the morning and hitting FP queue for TSMM, standby line at RnR, standby at ToT, hitting your TSMM time, walking into Star Tours, visiting Kermit and friends, and catching the GMR before 11:00am was a very effective use of your time. From there, you could go to any other park and benefit from any other "legacy" FastPass at another attraction that had them available.

With proper planning, "You" could hit every attraction at Magic Kingdom in one day. You may even be able to hit your favorite attraction more than once. If you argue that you shouldn't have to be a "guerrilla" planner to hit your favorite attractions at a given theme park, I laugh at those lauding the FastPassMinus system which makes it nearly impossible to hit 3 popular attractions now. Imagine if the only way to visit a particular attraction is by having a FastPassMinus reservation for that ride during your visit. (Recent guests at DHS don't have to imagine.)

Please be intellectually honest and admit that you have substantially less value in your WDW vacation because of the new MyMagicMinus implementation regardless of your desire to take advantage of the previous "legacy" system. Recognize that the "Park Hopper" option was gutted by removing your ability to use FastPasses in multiple parks. Acknowledge that the limitations of the "new" system makes it harder to realize the benefits of "Park Hopping" at all. Take notice, this system was designed to make your trip more structured to benefit Disney and less about "your" needs or for "your" convenience. Be informed that "NGE" was designed solely to "get more money from your wallet".

These are the facts, and they cannot be disputed.

*1023*

 

[BigTxEars]

I guess it must be working for future generations. My young grandchildren (5 and 7) were helping me unpack(big move from Ks to TX) and came across my MB box and wanted to wear those MBs in their fave color and they haven't even been to the parks yet, so don't even know what they are but yet they knew! I showed them how to unlock the garage door with the Band.. not really, but good idea!

Welcome to Texas

 

[BigTxEars]

I think I may be able to simplify most of the issues with FastPassMinus. Disney has created a way to limit (or mandate) the amount of time you spend in line and the number of attractions you can experience in a day. Additionally, many of their under-informed customers and folks under the effects of "pixie dust" think this is a good thing. They have said, "Hey, we can get you onto your 3 favorite attractions in one park per day." They fail to mention that this is only if you select your attractions exactly 60 days out, because if you are even one day late, the 7DMT is not going to be available. Woe be to those in the future, selecting any Avatar themed screen ride that becomes popular in the distant future. (Provided it actually gets built as planned.)

Sure, most visitors to WDW were not power users of the "legacy" FastPass system. However, there can be no argument that educated use of the "legacy" system was far superior. You could acquire "legacy" FastPasses in multiple parks. This also made the ability to "park hop" more worthwhile. It can not be argued that going to DHS for the morning and hitting FP queue for TSMM, standby line at RnR, standby at ToT, hitting your TSMM time, walking into Star Tours, visiting Kermit and friends, and catching the GMR before 11:00am was a very effective use of your time. From there, you could go to any other park and benefit from any other "legacy" FastPass at another attraction that had them available.

With proper planning, "You" could hit every attraction at Magic Kingdom in one day. You may even be able to hit your favorite attraction more than once. If you argue that you shouldn't have to be a "guerrilla" planner to hit your favorite attractions at a given theme park, I laugh at those lauding the FastPassMinus system which makes it nearly impossible to hit 3 popular attractions now. Imagine if the only way to visit a particular attraction is by having a FastPassMinus reservation for that ride during your visit. (Recent guests at DHS don't have to imagine.)

Please be intellectually honest and admit that you have substantially less value in your WDW vacation because of the new MyMagicMinus implementation regardless of your desire to take advantage of the previous "legacy" system. Recognize that the "Park Hopper" option was gutted by removing your ability to use FastPasses in multiple parks. Acknowledge that the limitations of the "new" system makes it harder to realize the benefits of "Park Hopping" at all. Take notice, this system was designed to make your trip more structured to benefit Disney and less about "your" needs or for "your" convenience. Be informed that "NGE" was designed solely to "get more money from your wallet".

These are the facts, and they cannot be disputed.

*1023*

Oh how I love when someone gives their opinions on the internet and says they are facts that can not be disputed......

How about you you let me decide if my WDW vacation has more or less value with My Magic or not. Unless your paying it's not up to you to decide the value of what I get for my dollar.

 

[1023]

I showed them how to unlock the garage door with the Band.. not really, but good idea!

As an aside, it would be very easy to use any type of "near field communication" device to open you garage door, after all, they are used everyday for that type of thing. Not a "super" secure use of the tech, but easily used for your garage door conundrum.

*1023*

 

[1023]

Oh how I love when someone gives their opinions on the internet and says they are facts that can not be disputed......

How about you you let me decide if my WDW vacation has more or less value with My Magic or not. Unless your paying it's not up to you to decide the value of what I get for my dollar.

Not one thing stated is not a fact. If you find value in less, I cannot help you.The current system places more limitations on your vacation. That is not debatable. A limitation is a restriction. The new restriction is more confiscatory than it's predecessor. Again, that is not debatable.

I am "paying" for my vacation and I am getting less. That is not debatable. Regardless of who it is "up to", you are getting less. Six FastPasses in magic Kingdom is more that three. Six is more than three (or 6>3). That is not debatable. I cannot get a 7DMT FP- reservation for my upcoming trip. If this new attraction had legacy "FastPass" machines, I could pick one up the morning I visited the Magic Kingdom. "Value" of my admission entry has been removed.

An "opinion" is: I don't like strawberry ice cream.
A Fact is: I have an allergic reaction to strawberries.

A Fact is also: 2+2=4
An opinion is: I like 2 better than 4.

You are "okay" with "less" is an opinion that someone can draw from your posts in various threads on these forums.
It is a "fact" that I am frustrated with the "lesser" value of admission at the offerings at WDW.

Anecdotes may contain "facts" but anecdotes may not be factual. If you re-read my post, the only things that could be considered "opinion" is my mis-statement of the trademark names of FastPass+ as FastPassMinus and my identification of those content with the new system as "under the influence of pixie dust".

Your response does not address the factual information contained within my post. Do you like less or more? That is an opinion. You are getting less, that is a fact.

*1023*

 

[BigTxEars]

Not one thing stated is not a fact. If you find value in less, I cannot help you.The current system places more limitations on your vacation. That is not debatable. A limitation is a restriction. The new restriction is more confiscatory than it's predecessor. Again, that is not debatable.

I am "paying" for my vacation and I am getting less. That is not debatable. Regardless of who it is "up to", you are getting less. Six FastPasses in magic Kingdom is more that three. Six is more than three (or 6>3). That is not debatable. I cannot get a 7DMT FP- reservation for my upcoming trip. If this new attraction had legacy "FastPass" machines, I could pick one up the morning I visited the Magic Kingdom. "Value" of my admission entry has been removed.

An "opinion" is: I don't like strawberry ice cream.
A Fact is: I have an allergic reaction to strawberries.

A Fact is also: 2+2=4
An opinion is: I like 2 better than 4.

You are "okay" with "less" is an opinion that someone can draw from your posts in various threads on these forums.
It is a "fact" that I am frustrated with the "lesser" value of admission at the offerings at WDW.

Anecdotes may contain "facts" but anecdotes may not be factual. If you re-read my post, the only things that could be considered "opinion" is my mis-statement of the trademark names of FastPass+ as FastPassMinus and my identification of those content with the new system as "under the influence of pixie dust".

Your response does not address the factual information contained within my post. Do you like less or more? That is an opinion. You are getting less, that is a fact.

*1023*

"Please be intellectually honest and admit that you have substantially less value in your WDW vacation because of the new MyMagicMinus implementation regardless of your desire to take advantage of the previous "legacy" system."

That is 100% opinion and nothing more....you may have less value but as I have explained in previous post we find more value. ....Not everyone use the number of rides that can squeeze into a day at the parks as a benchmark for the value of that day...some of us find the flow of the day much more important to how we enjoy it than the content. I don't have a ride checklist where more "checks" equal more value...if you do that is fine but at least try and understand not everyone tours WDW like you do. There is no right or wrong way to "do Disney"....

 

[Ariel1986]

I am "paying" for my vacation and I am getting less. That is not debatable. Regardless of who it is "up to", you are getting less. Six FastPasses in magic Kingdom is more that three. Six is more than three (or 6>3). That is not debatable. I cannot get a 7DMT FP- reservation for my upcoming trip. If this new attraction had legacy "FastPass" machines, I could pick one up the morning I visited the Magic Kingdom. "Value" of my admission entry has been removed.

You can use rolling FP+ after your initial 3 at MK. That means you could have 6, or more. So your "fact" is not "fact". Sure they may not be for the big attractions at the middle to the end of the day, but it was the same with Legacy, when the fast passes would run out for the popular attractions.

You CAN also ride Seven Dwarfs- you can ride standby! And if you got there first thing in the morning you could get into a shorter standby. So saying you can't is what you THINK is going to happen and is your opinion, not fact!

 

[BrerJon]

Look what happened with the Toy Story "FP+ only" test - anyone that thinks that isn't something we are going to see more of, is fooling themselves. Absolutely.

I'd love to see a historic list of things Disney has run tests of, and then seen which have or haven't eventually become permanent.

 

[BrerJon]

If you find me hyperbolic, it's a response to this Disney commercial some folks are putting forth where they are forgetting to put that little disclaimer at the bottom that says, "*sequences shortened and experience may not be typical". Some of you guys make this sound so breezy and easy and convenient, but the truth is, there are a lot of "if's" in there - and assumes everything works perfectly.

That's exactly it. From the descriptions I assumed the kiosk process was scan card, touch the name of the ride you want, get given next available time. Total time, 15-20 seconds maybe, about as long as the old system.

The reality was using the kiosk required almost every guest in line to get assistance from a Cast Member, slowing things down, and the software itself had extra hoops to jump through that add time to the process.

 

[BrerJon]

I much rather know my "ride time" for Splash Mountain is at 4:30pm and my ADRs are at 5:30pm 3 weeks before I leave Texas than find out on the Tuesday I am at MK that my paper FP is for 5:00p to 6:00p and my ADRs I made 3 months ago is at 5:30pm. Thats one reason we like the new system better.

I have an idea for that point... make it so that Fastpasses don't have an enforced expiry time., so diners never have to rush.

There Disney, saved ya a couple of billion.

 

[BrerJon]

Recognize that the "Park Hopper" option was gutted by removing your ability to use FastPasses in multiple parks. Acknowledge that the limitations of the "new" system makes it harder to realize the benefits of "Park Hopping" at all.

One of the underlying tenets of the NextGen program was how to get guests to spend longer on property, and spend more money, without having to build anything new.

Universal was opening two Harry Potter lands and goodness knows what else, and guests were starting to drift off... were they vacationing longer? No, they were doing a half day at DHS and DAK, to make space for a couple of days at Universal. MyMagic fixes that.

By essentially killing off park hopping, and making it tough to do all the headliners in the morning, they've now engineered a system where the only way to really get the best out of the trip is to spend the full day at a single park. When you have to do that, there's no longer room for detours up I-4, at least that was the theory.

 

[ford91exploder]

I'd love to see a historic list of things Disney has run tests of, and then seen which have or haven't eventually become permanent.

Create a thread

 

[ford91exploder]

One of the underlying tenets of the NextGen program was how to get guests to spend longer on property, and spend more money, without having to build anything new.

Universal was opening two Harry Potter lands and goodness knows what else, and guests were starting to drift off... were they vacationing longer? No, they were doing a half day at DHS and DAK, to make space for a couple of days at Universal. MyMagic fixes that.

By essentially killing off park hopping, and making it tough to do all the headliners in the morning, they've now engineered a system where the only way to really get the best out of the trip is to spend the full day at a single park. When you have to do that, there's no longer room for detours up I-4, at least that was the theory.

But by diminishing value and increasing hassle they may insure that no days are spent at Disney by some families especially ones with kids older than 8 or so...

 

[BrerJon]

But by diminishing value and increasing hassle they may insure that no days are spent at Disney by some families especially ones with kids older than 8 or so...

They usually trot out the 'most visitors are first timers who don't know any better, so we don't care' whenever anyone suggests they might suffer by guests going elsewhere instead for their vacations.

 

[ford91exploder]

I have an idea for that point... make it so that Fastpasses don't have an enforced expiry time., so diners never have to rush.

There Disney, saved ya a couple of billion.

You mean like the old days when the return time was a you cannot ride before this time but any time after was OK. I really don't understand why some people hated the fast pass runner as I was usually the runner in my family it gave me a chance to check out what was going on in the park and find interesting things to do.

FP- reminds me of a family I saw a couple years ago who we're staying at the same resort they had color coded laminated cards with their daily schedules on them. Each day they looked more tired and miserable. It was like their day was at Camp Lejune and their DI was R. Lee Ermey And the only easy day was yesterday.

What's fun about a regimented experience like this??? DFIL is a Marine and he doesn't understand that kind of mentality for a vacation.