For a land most originally said they weren't interested in ................

L.C. Clench

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure how you can say that no one cares to see these movies when the only one yet released was one of the top grossing films, it's like you're ignoring the facts and using 'guesses' to try to make a point?

I agree that Disney could have created a land based on an original theme if they'd wanted to, but again box office takings would suggest that some do care about the film. Any land done well would probably have worked, I wouldn't ague with that and it's not the connection with Avatar that excites me but rather the execution of the land itself. However I don't think that the connection with Avatar will harm it's appeal either, it is what it is.
Adjusted for inflation it drops down the list pretty quickly since Avatar made its money based on the 3D and IMAX costs. If box office was the big indicator a Dr. Zhivago or Sound of Music land would be the better choice. Universal has some of the other big ones already locked down.
 

mergatroid

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Adjusted for inflation it drops down the list pretty quickly since Avatar made its money based on the 3D and IMAX costs. If box office was the big indicator a Dr. Zhivago or Sound of Music land would be the better choice. Universal has some of the other big ones already locked down.

If the point is that 'nobody cares about it' as you originally said, it would be way down the list of top grossing movies. So now 'nobody cares about it' has changed to it not being as good as Dr. Zhivago or The Sound of Music if I understand your post? Let's be honest, if nobody cared about it and the takings were only because of IMAX etc, it wouldn't have made the huge amount of money it did. There's thousands of films that 'nobody cares about', lumping Avatar in there because you don't to appear to have enjoyed it seems a big stretch?

Anyhow an interesting debate and everyone's opinion counts.
 

twebber55

Well-Known Member
Adjusted for inflation it drops down the list pretty quickly since Avatar made its money based on the 3D and IMAX costs. If box office was the big indicator a Dr. Zhivago or Sound of Music land would be the better choice. Universal has some of the other big ones already locked down.
Thats not entirely accurate
 

L.C. Clench

Well-Known Member
If the point is that 'nobody cares about it' as you originally said, it would be way down the list of top grossing movies. So now 'nobody cares about it' has changed to it not being as good as Dr. Zhivago or The Sound of Music if I understand your post? Let's be honest, if nobody cared about it and the takings were only because of IMAX etc, it wouldn't have made the huge amount of money it did. There's thousands of films that 'nobody cares about', lumping Avatar in there because you don't to appear to have enjoyed it seems a big stretch?

Anyhow an interesting debate and everyone's opinion counts.
I don't believe I said "nobody cares". I said that the draw is more with something new than Avatar itself. I do think some people liked the movie for the story but I think more liked it for the effects than anything else. I'm sure the area will look fantastic but I don't think the name is going to be what draws in massive amounts of people.
 

Incomudro

Well-Known Member
Why do some people insist on pushing the narrative that Avatar isn't a well-liked movie? A movie simply does not become the highest grossing film of all time if people didn't enjoy it.

Any time something is super popular, certain people feel the need to put it down or emphasize that they did not in fact see this super popular movie that everyone else did (see also: Frozen). Yeah, we get it, you're not some sheep who sees and likes the same things everyone else does, you're so much cooler than everyone else /s.

Reminds me of music acts that sell in the millions, but no one claims to like.
 

G00fyDad

Well-Known Member
It certainly seems to have gained a lot of attention.

"I'm not interested in the movie so it shouldn't get a land"
"The film was rubbish, who'll want to see this"
"Nobody I know liked the film, crazy idea"
"Disney will mess it up, they always do"
"Yawn"
"Desperate to fight Universal and Potter, no chance of competing"

Were the type of things said by many when this land was announced on here (fair enough, it's all about opinions). Now there appears to be so much hope and anticipation for it which is strange after the initial claim the film wasn't good enough to interest people to visit a theme park.

So has anyone changed their mind since it was announced, or have the naysayers just stopped posting and the 'pixie dusters' taken over the sub forum. Go on, be honest?

A starving person will eat a saltine like a Ritz.
 

LuvtheGoof

Grill Master
Premium Member
Do we have to go over this crap again???? The new area has NOTHING to do with the PLOT of the movie. ONLY THE PLANET. Can people just get it through their heads that the MOVIE DOESN'T MATTER. It doesn't matter if you saw the movie, didn't see the movie, like the movie, or didn't like the movie. NONE OF THAT MATTERS to the new area. Get over it already.
 

PorterRedkey

Well-Known Member
When people asked me if I thought Avatar was good, I would always tell them... it is pretty. The story is standard, however, the extended cut is better from the story standpoint. The long cut gives more story about the previous interactions with the Na'vi, but it is the visuals (and 3D) that made this movie so popular - not the story.

Disney has taken the best of the movie and disregarded the rest to make their 1 billion-dollar themed land. I for one, cannot wait to be there in person!
 

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
No no. You're fine.

Disney's Animal Kingdom is an in depth study of the human experience's facination with nature.

Dinosaurs are a reflection of our fascination with the untamed and wild. They were here and now are gone. The only thing keeping them alive is our curiosity.

Africa and Asia are the real and physical animals of today running up against society and humanity. Those areas tend to focus coexistence and learning to appreciate nature.

BK was representative of how man used to look at nature and make sense of a frightening world. Dragons, Unicorns, and Magic were all humanity's way of rationalizing a world that didn't make sense. Where stepping out in the woods could mean your doom. The weather could make or break you subsistence. Unexplained illness could ravage society.

That's how humanity viewed a more frightening and unexplainable world.

Avatar is an interesting case. In a way it's reflective of a fear that has consumed the public. A scenario of what if we wreck everything? What happens then? Resisting power in potentially violent ways is the solution the movie comes to.

This film isn't set on Earth, nor is it a celebration of mankind's cultural and physical run ins with nature. It's set as a distant far off place where lessons can be learned.

To the team's credit, they've been working overtime to make Avatar as Earthlike as possible. They brought a new level of depth and coherence to the franchise. I personally think one of the biggest winners of this land will be Cameron, who has had to sit down and hash out in depth how his world works. It's one thing to animate a fantasy rainforest, it's another to get down and ask how does it work?

Like I said, I still don't like it at Disney's Animal Kingdom nor do I think it fits. I do on the other hand obviously realize this will be one of the landmark lands in the world.

There's enough room for a middle ground, and that's where I stand. ;)
As we watch Pandora come out of the ground I feel that of the existing four WDW parks, Animal Kingdom is the most appropriate home for this land. The focus on this land is natural structures, they just happen to be of a different world. When the land was announced, my self sales pitch was: "If we were told that James Cameron was teaming up with Imagineers to create a land of mythical animals and plants for the Animal Kingdom, we'd all be on board." That's how and why I'm buying it. At the end of the day, there is a connection there and if the rides are any good it will be a solid and well placed addition to my favorite park.
 

L.C. Clench

Well-Known Member
Do we have to go over this crap again???? The new area has NOTHING to do with the PLOT of the movie. ONLY THE PLANET. Can people just get it through their heads that the MOVIE DOESN'T MATTER. It doesn't matter if you saw the movie, didn't see the movie, like the movie, or didn't like the movie. NONE OF THAT MATTERS to the new area. Get over it already.
Have you talked to the design team about that? They just released a video trying to explain how the land fits in AK and one of the pitches was the plot of the movie.
 

mergatroid

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
I don't believe I said "nobody cares". I said that the draw is more with something new than Avatar itself. I do think some people liked the movie for the story but I think more liked it for the effects than anything else. I'm sure the area will look fantastic but I don't think the name is going to be what draws in massive amounts of people.

Apologies, indeed you are right. You quoted me replying to somebody who had said 'nobody cares' so I mistakenly thought it was that person I was chatting to.

I do agree with you that the name may not draw masses amounts of people, but I believe the quality and where it's situated (in Disney) will. I also don't think it will harm attendances either though.
 

LuvtheGoof

Grill Master
Premium Member
Have you talked to the design team about that? They just released a video trying to explain how the land fits in AK and one of the pitches was the plot of the movie.
Umm, maybe you need to listen again, but he talked nothing about the PLOT of the movie - which was earth idiots treating locals like crap for unobtanium, and then getting their butts kicked off the planet. Please point out where he touched upon that at all.
 

DDLand

Well-Known Member
Do we have to go over this crap again???? The new area has NOTHING to do with the PLOT of the movie. ONLY THE PLANET. Can people just get it through their heads that the MOVIE DOESN'T MATTER. It doesn't matter if you saw the movie, didn't see the movie, like the movie, or didn't like the movie. NONE OF THAT MATTERS to the new area. Get over it already.

I tend to agree with your sentiment. It's hard to pin down its longterm impact without surveys or future box office data. I will say it doesn't feel like it had a profound impact culturally outside of its immediate release, but that's obviously anecdotal and not really admissible.

One more substantive indicator was from a rerelease done a couple years later, and didn't perform extremely well. Of course that was during a time when a whole bunch of releases were bombing, so once again we're left in the dark.

It is somewhat relevant from a business standpoint though. The idea behind these IP lands is partially to drive interest because of the IP. There should be people going to Disney theme parks that never would have, or wouldn't have for a greater amount of time, because of Star Wars Land. Disney expects the same to hold true for Avatar. If it doesn't, that would be problematic.

Disney didn't build this land to get billion dollar addition level of crowds. Disney built this to get Billion dollar addition level crowds and people who love Avatar.

I'm not dumb enough to bet against Cameron. Every time he makes a film it takes forever, goes over budget, and has internal problems. Every time he makes a film people call for it to flop critically and financially.

Every time he ends up making everyone look stupid.

Could the Avatar sequels be the ones to bomb? Possibly. I just wouldn't bet on it. I'm guessing these films will be the Empire and Jedi to A New Hope. Big Billion+ grosses, but not quite as big as the original. We only get films like that every so often.

The clock is ticking, filming shoud start pretty soon.
 
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L.C. Clench

Well-Known Member
Umm, maybe you need to listen again, but he talked nothing about the PLOT of the movie - which was earth idiots treating locals like crap for unobtanium, and then getting their butts kicked off the planet. Please point out where he touched upon that at all.
I'm not going to try a direct quote but when someone says the "theme of the movie" that certainly implies that the movie is connected.
 

LuvtheGoof

Grill Master
Premium Member
I tend to agree with your sentiment. It's hard to pin down its longterm impact without surveys or future box office data. I will say it doesn't feel like it had a profound impact culturally outside of its immediate release, but that's obviously anecdotal and not really admissible.

One more substantive indicator was from a rerelease done a couple years later, and didn't perform extremely well. Of course that was during a time when a whole bunch of releases were bombing, so once again we're left in the dark.

It is somewhat relevant from a business standpoint though. The idea behind these IP lands is partially to drive interest because of the IP. There should be people going to Disney theme parks that never would have, or wouldn't have for a greater amount of time, because of Star Wars Land. Disney expects the same to hold true for Avatar. If it doesn't, that would be problematic.

Disney didn't build this land to get billion dollar addition level of crowds. Disney built this to get Billion dollar addition level crowds and people who love Avatar.

I'm not dumb enough to bet against Cameron. Every time he makes a film it takes forever, goes over budget, and has internal problems. Every time he makes a film people call for it to flop critically and financially.

Every time he ends making everyone look stupid.

Could the Avatar sequels be the ones to bomb? Possibly. I just wouldn't bet on it. I'm guessing these films will be the Empire and Jedi to A New Hope. Big Billion+ grosses, but not quite as big as the original. We only get films like that every so often.

The clock is ticking, filming shoud start pretty soon.
There are literally millions and millions of people that have never even heard of Avatar the movie that will love the new area. Comparing it to Star Wars, which is a franchise that has been around for 40 years with 7 major films, different series, and a whole host of other things is not the same at all. Even if there is never another Avatar movie, the LAND stands on it's own, and if the movie never existed, we would consider this an amazing land that has no IP attached. No, I do not think Disney cares one whit whether a new movie does well, as it could be several years before there even is a new movie.
 

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