danlb_2000
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Florida commission: Disney discriminated against autistic visitors
- Thread starter PhotoDave219
- Start date
No. You're rude and clearly do not understand the law.
That's how it was meant.... Sorry yo.
BuzzKillington
Active Member
You are referring to children with mild autism and I agree that they should not be treated as disabled since it is a proven fact that they will grow up to be independent and productive citizens. However, children with severe autism cannot be taught and are in a world of their own. You put a kid with severe autism on a ride and then try and get him off when it is over and you will have a fight on your hands if he doesn't want to. There is a big difference when it comes to children who have severe autism and those who have mild autism.
Tom Morrow
Well-Known Member
*Disney implements the same procedure that every other theme park in the world does.*
*Disney gets sued because Disneyhas the deepest pockets is a RIGHT and not a privilege!
There would NOT have been backlash if they hadn't for years offered an extremely lenient "covers everything" pass that also granted the holder considerable benefits, legitimate card usage or otherwise.
*Disney gets sued because Disney
There would NOT have been backlash if they hadn't for years offered an extremely lenient "covers everything" pass that also granted the holder considerable benefits, legitimate card usage or otherwise.
polynesiangirl
Well-Known Member
I'm glad I'm not in charge of developing a program for disabled WDW guests because it doesn't seem like there is any option that won't be abused and/or considered to be not good enough.
StarWarsGirl
Well-Known Member
#1 Mmmhmm. Would you like to tell my brother that his anxiety, which causes severe meltdowns, is normal and that he should just deal with it? Or would you say that his limited comprehension of the English language and ability to communicate should be considered "normal"? Believe me, it is not that simple. These accommodations are there specifically because these kids are not like their non-autistic counterparts. And yes, it is quite insulting to parents who have worked for years with their children to be told that they are still not doing their job right, especially when you yourself do not have a child with autism and ergo have no idea what it is like to raise a child with autism.
#2 You've literally met once person with autism. Every kid is different. And having a friend who has a child and observing said friend with autism is much different than living with a child with autism or working and caring for children with autism on a daily basis. You may be understanding, but until you actually live with a child with autism or work with them, you have no idea what it's like on a daily basis and should not make such sweeping judgments about how parents who have children with autism choose to raise their children.
Matt_Black
Well-Known Member
Well, when compared to the average youtube comments section.... (Just trying to break tension here).
RSoxNo1
Well-Known Member
Time for name calling: You're an idiot.
Its not a one size fits all type of disorder, with a child that is verbal what your talking about is usually much easier and usually just takes some time. The DAS gives you no real advantage other than they can wait somewhere else, and for many of us its enough, especially in combination with FP+, which has actually been the best solution for us because we can plan 3 rides in quick succession and maybe one DAS and we are out of the park. But you get someone who is non verbal and your tilting at windmills, because you have no idea if anything you are saying is even registering, some of these kids are far from normal. The kids on the upper end of the spectrum know they are different not because we as parents tell them , because they look at other kids and just know they are not the same. The societal norms like waiting in line have to be taught and almost programmed like a computer.
I have described the difference like this to a fellow IT person. Imagine most people are born as beta level software, after about 3 to 4 years the majority of crashes (melt downs, behavior etc) are done with and they been bug fixed to a point where they are a stable release ready for yearly updates(birthdays). Well an autistic child comes out a lot closer to alpha state socially, they don't catch on to cues and visual stimuli like other kids so the road to stable is a lot longer and you take much smaller steps. These parents are teaching their kids to be as normal as they can, its just that these kids don't always understand whats normal. So if learning how to deal with crowds and lines takes them starting in a shorter line and waiting the majority of the time elsewhere, that's a good step, because most of those parents would gladly wait hours in line if they didn't have to go through this. And would happily trade places with that guy in standby giving them the dirty look.
Simply shoving them in a standby line and telling them this is what normal people do simply isn't going to cut it in most cases.
Oh God this I am somewhat hard to say I am agreeing with BUzzKillngton. But its a little more complicated with those cases of what you refer to as mild autism. because in many cases those mild cases are not really mild they are middle of the road cases who have had a lot of therapy and they simply have more tools and they are verbal, which is a big milestone, because therapy and a lot of other things are 10X harder when you don't know if they are getting you, and in many cases they are but just can't respond. In the mildest of cases like which used to be categorized as Aspergers they can function normally for the most part in society. My son intellectually should do very well in university, but statistics show especially among the milder cases job retention and simply getting a good job well the numbers are not good.
A good summary of the job prospects for those on the spectrum can be read here in a very well written Drexel University article
http://drexel.edu/now/archive/2013/September/Autism-Spectrum-Young-Adult-Transition-Studies/
StarWarsGirl
Well-Known Member
This. Times 1000.
I feel so bad for my younger brother and other kids on the spectrum sometimes because I know they can tell he's different. I have to think that it's very frustrating, and possibly very lonely at times.
yensid67
Well-Known Member
I am not saying this at all despite what others are reading into it! I was just #1 stating my personal feelings regard the abuse of the DAS card, #2 Having been a Cast member, I have seen those abusing the system and therefore I have seen and heard parents tell their children something so they DO have a meltdown and what they tell them is not that they have to wait! #3 I was just saying some parents do feel they are owed the world on a silver platter because the son/daughter has special needs. I know not all are like that, it usually the ones that are abusing the system and that's where my comments were directed, not at any other parent that is raising the special needs child as best they can and I apologize with a heavy heart if my comments came across as anything but my opinion! I just get so tired of those who take advantage of the DAS system that they ruin it for the rest of those that do need it. I am not a bad or rude person, I am just stating my personal opinion
With that being said, I still feel there are those PARENTS that feel they are entitled for whatever reason and will abuse the DAS program until it hurts those that need it! That is my final thought I will no longer comment on this thread.
Again, with a heavy heart I apologize if I offended anyone by not explaining my thoughts.
Yeah those parents don't have kids with autism they have kids and want to game the system.
There will be people who abuse every system, from both disabled and non disabled communities, so you are not wrong in saying the abuse came from everywhere and from all sides. Also remember its hard to tell sometimes the nature of someones disability just by looking at them so they may look and act normal in a brief conversation but its not the whole story.
The simple fact is Disney is in a no win situation because of the way the ADA is structured and the fact that for years the GAC was more than what they have now. Now legally they are in a winnable position, but with some parents that doesn't matter.
angiebelle
New Member
The basis of the argument is that some people either do not or refuse to admit that some with autism cannot be taught certain behaviors. If it was that easy, there would not be an argument. My friend has an autistic son. She has worked with him since his diagnosis 9 years ago. This woman taught honors classes but went back to school to qualify as a Special Education teacher so she could learn even more about how best to work with her son.
People are so mean spirited about this topic. I always think about our daughter who is a Type 1 diabetic. Would some here expect me to teach her, "Tell your pancreas to catch a grip". Some of these kids with autism have no more control over their thought processes than our daughter does over her faulty pancreas. The attitudes are like those not too many years ago that mental illness was something people just needed to get over.
Compassion is not a bad thing.
People are so mean spirited about this topic. I always think about our daughter who is a Type 1 diabetic. Would some here expect me to teach her, "Tell your pancreas to catch a grip". Some of these kids with autism have no more control over their thought processes than our daughter does over her faulty pancreas. The attitudes are like those not too many years ago that mental illness was something people just needed to get over.
Compassion is not a bad thing.
ParentsOf4
Well-Known Member
This is a discussion forum. Everyone has the opportunity to express their opinion, as long as they adhere to the rules of the forum. However, disagreements will happen. Some might disagree so much that they respond.
When I post, I brace myself for the reaction it could generate, knowing that I might have to defend what I write. We all might be questioned, even attacked when we express our views. I respectfully suggest you keep this is mind when you post. Sometimes, "no post" is the best post of all.
You are a former CM who has "seen those abusing the system".
This lawsuit is not about those who abuse the system. It's about what those with ADA protected disabilities are entitled to receive under the law.
Those in the lawsuit have children with Autism. If I correctly understand the law, they had a right to GAC when Disney offered GAC. They have a right to DAS now that Disney offers that. Legally, they might be entitled to something more than DAS. They are not the ones abusing the system.
Please don't lump together those who scam the system with those who legally are entitled to modifications according to the ADA, and I won't lump you with what some consider to be a decline in the quality of Cast Members over the decades.
In revising ADA in 2008, Congress found that "discrimination against individuals with disabilities persists in such critical areas as employment, housing, public accommodations, education, transportation, communication, recreation, institutionalization, health services, voting, and access to public services".
Discrimination due to disability is not a practice relegated to the history books. It happens today.
I understand that you believe "some parents do feel they are owed the world on a silver platter because the son/daughter has special needs". However, maybe the issue is that Disney and its Cast Members have treated some individuals with disabilities in a discriminatory manner.
Please recall the Florida Commission on Human Relations finding: "reasonable cause exists to believe that an unlawful public accommodation practice occurred."
Maybe, just maybe, Disney and its Cast Members are at fault. Maybe it's the attitudes you express, which appear to be jaded by despicable people abusing the system, that is at the heart of this lawsuit.
I have no doubt that there are many who abuse the system. I don't like the way the laws are written. I believe the laws make it too easy for unscrupulous people to abuse the system. However, I also recognize that ADA requires Disney to make reasonable modifications to accommodate those with legitimate needs. As a spectrum disorder, it's very possible that there could be individuals who need something more than DAS.
The lawsuit will tell us.
Matt_Black
Well-Known Member
Hey, now, let's leave that kind of talk at the docks where it belongs!
jlthomas81
Well-Known Member
Thank you for your post. So many feel that because ASD is an "invisible" disability that can be cured. You are right to remind us that there are MANY "invisible" disabilities and Disney does a wonderful job at trying to accommodate all (i.e; offering alternative menu items at its restaurants). Compassion is definitely the answer here, but something that is greatly lacking in our society today. People are tooting entitlement all over this thread, however all I am hearing in those comments is "well since I am not effected by such a disability I don't see why its fair for you to have special treatment". That sounds more like entitlement to me then a person with a disability just getting the help which the law says they are allowed to have.
GrammieBee
Well-Known Member
This entire issue is a "on the one hand" and "on the other hand" arguement. It is a sad situation because no matter what the courts eventually decide, some will be unhappy or angry with the decision.
Most people have compassion for those with special needs and want them to be able to enjoy the parks. Unfortunately, or perhaps realistically, they also feel that maybe the special need person or parent may have to realize that there are things they simply cannot do depending on the disability.
It is also unfortunate that there will also always be those who will take advantage of any policy, situation, rule or law and try to use it for their own advantage. For them, those who play by the rules are just poor dumb schmucks who don't know any better.
Most people have compassion for those with special needs and want them to be able to enjoy the parks. Unfortunately, or perhaps realistically, they also feel that maybe the special need person or parent may have to realize that there are things they simply cannot do depending on the disability.
It is also unfortunate that there will also always be those who will take advantage of any policy, situation, rule or law and try to use it for their own advantage. For them, those who play by the rules are just poor dumb schmucks who don't know any better.