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Flamingo Crossing Hotels

MrPromey

Well-Known Member
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This run of the mill strip mall with motel/hotels is on par with the mundane mix of crap Disney has added to to the mix: Riviera, Dolphin Addtion, Destino tower. Sad, ordinary, pedestrian and urban blight on day one.
Except this isn't really meant to be part of the resort, proper - more like developed property adjacent to it. I doubt that most guests who end up in this area will even realize they are on Disney property to begin with which I thought, to some degree, was kind of the goal of this area from the start.

I mean, we all pay heated attention to stuff like this because we're hyper-focused on the Florida land in general but I'm pretty sure the Disney connection will be rather subtle, like non-pro sports and cheer groups doing stuff at WWOS being guided to these locations rather than other off-site properties in the future.

They don't want this area to look too much better than the other areas around it because they don't want to cannibalize business within the resort itself. They're just looking for a piece of the pie (and maybe a little control) when it comes some of their "off-site" guests.

I'd be surprised if you saw any mention of this area when booking a stay with Disney online, for instance.
 
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peter11435

Well-Known Member
This run of the mill strip mall with motel/hotels is on par with the mundane mix of crap Disney has added to to the mix: Riviera, Dolphin Addtion, Destino tower. Sad, ordinary, pedestrian and urban blight on day one.
This is no different than the little lake Bryan/crossroads development nearly 4 decades ago. This is not intended to be part of WDW or thought of as part of WDW.
 

MrPromey

Well-Known Member
That’s right, but Disney has the power to push and demand for something better.

But why would they? They don't want this to compete with their "on-property" resorts.

I don't disagree that Disney in general has taken a slide when it comes to quality and theme in their newer offerings but I feel like you don't understand what the point of the Flamingo Crossing project is.

It's supposed to be newer and a little nicer than some of the other nearby budget areas outside of WDW but well below what you expect once you pass those entrance gates. That's intentional.

They don't want this to be a place people aspire to stay. They want it to be where you end up when you can't afford a Disney resort instead of on land they aren't making rent on.

Everyone wants to be in first class. Nobody wants to be crammed into economy but way more people fly economy. Disney wants their resorts to be seen as first class. They don't want their name attached to economy but they recognize they're losing money by not offering something for that market. This is an attempt to rectify that.

Their goal is to keep this economy and that means not adding touches that would make it "better".
 

seascape

Well-Known Member
But why would they? They don't want this to compete with their "on-property" resorts.

I don't disagree that Disney in general has taken a slide when it comes to quality and theme in their newer offerings but I feel like you don't understand what the point of the Flamingo Crossing project is.

It's supposed to be newer and a little nicer than some of the other nearby budget areas outside of WDW but well below what you expect once you pass those entrance gates. That's intentional.

They don't want this to be a place people aspire to stay. They want it to be where you end up when you can't afford a Disney resort instead of on land they aren't making rent on.

Everyone wants to be in first class. Nobody wants to be crammed into economy but way more people fly economy. Disney wants their resorts to be seen as first class. They don't want their name attached to economy but they recognize they're losing money by not offering something for that market. This is an attempt to rectify that.

Their goal is to keep this economy and that means not adding touches that would make it "better".
Disney wanted these low budget hotels build right next to WDW and right next to the western entrance. That was people who want to stay in a very low cost room stay in a location that encourages their guests to go to WDW and not other parks.
 

MrPromey

Well-Known Member
Disney wanted these low budget hotels build right next to WDW and right next to the western entrance. That was people who want to stay in a very low cost room stay in a location that encourages their guests to go to WDW and not other parks.
Great point.
 

peter11435

Well-Known Member
That’s right, but Disney has the power to push and demand for something better.
And they do… When it is warranted. This development is not intended to be associated with Disney after the initial construction and it’s certainly not intended to compete with Disney branded offerings. They have very specific goals with this and are executing them according to plan.
 

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
Disney wanted these low budget hotels build right next to WDW and right next to the western entrance. That was people who want to stay in a very low cost room stay in a location that encourages their guests to go to WDW and not other parks.
WDW may have had a say in how large they built as well, these are huge compared to the offramp models they build in other places.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
But why would they? They don't want this to compete with their "on-property" resorts.

I don't disagree that Disney in general has taken a slide when it comes to quality and theme in their newer offerings but I feel like you don't understand what the point of the Flamingo Crossing project is.

It's supposed to be newer and a little nicer than some of the other nearby budget areas outside of WDW but well below what you expect once you pass those entrance gates. That's intentional.

They don't want this to be a place people aspire to stay. They want it to be where you end up when you can't afford a Disney resort instead of on land they aren't making rent on.

Everyone wants to be in first class. Nobody wants to be crammed into economy but way more people fly economy. Disney wants their resorts to be seen as first class. They don't want their name attached to economy but they recognize they're losing money by not offering something for that market. This is an attempt to rectify that.

Their goal is to keep this economy and that means not adding touches that would make it "better".
Being more budget conscious does not require it be the same sort of sprawl that Walt Disney World was reacting against and goes against the supposed values of being more sustainable espoused by the present day The Walt Disney Company. There’s a lot between seas of asphalt with cheap, poorly designed CMU boxes and themed experiences that directly compete with Disney.
 

the.dreamfinder

Well-Known Member
A recurring theme I’ve seen more and more often on this forum is the difference between folks who think because Disney does something it is always right or great and those who believe that Disney happened/happens to make great things.

That might be too nuanced of an opinion in the year of our lord twenty twenty, but it’s true and certainly applies to this discussion of Disney wringing every last penny out of their tens of thousands of acres, regardless of consequence.
 

the.dreamfinder

Well-Known Member
I don't disagree that Disney in general has taken a slide when it comes to quality and theme in their newer offerings but I feel like you don't understand what the point of the Flamingo Crossing project is.
They don't want this to be a place people aspire to stay. They want it to be where you end up when you can't afford a Disney resort instead of on land they aren't making rent on.

Everyone wants to be in first class. Nobody wants to be crammed into economy but way more people fly economy. Disney wants their resorts to be seen as first class. They don't want their name attached to economy but they recognize they're losing money by not offering something for that market. This is an attempt to rectify that.
It bears repeating that the OG Flamingo Crossings was developed alongside Golden Oak as part of an effort to maximize the short term revenue coming out of the Florida property.

Same purpose, very different price points.

As an addendum, a friend toured a Golden Oak home and complained of the quality of construction. They particularly noted how thin the walls were and how the home was a gussied up version of what you could pay much less for in nice parts of central FL.
 

jaklgreen

Well-Known Member
It bears repeating that the OG Flamingo Crossings was developed alongside Golden Oak as part of an effort to maximize the short term revenue coming out of the Florida property.

Same purpose, very different price points.

As an addendum, a friend toured a Golden Oak home and complained of the quality of construction. They particularly noted how thin the walls were and how the home was a gussied up version of what you could pay much less for in nice parts of central FL.

How could your friend tell the thickness of the walls of a house? I can't imagine that they are not built to code. Of course you can buy a house cheaper somewhere else. Did anyone think otherwise?
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
How could your friend tell the thickness of the walls of a house? I can't imagine that they are not built to code. Of course you can buy a house cheaper somewhere else. Did anyone think otherwise?
Aside from how much you can hear, you can see the thickness of walls at openings. The building code is a minimum requirement focused on safety, not a standard of quality.
 

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
They could very clearly hear a conversation happening a couple rooms away.

Aside from how much you can hear, you can see the thickness of walls at openings. The building code is a minimum requirement focused on safety, not a standard of quality.

Residential construction in Florida is something that I can speak to great lengths on.

Your standard interior wall thickness for residential construction will be a 2x4 (3.5") This is true for a $120k tract home as well as a multimillion-dollar mansion. Sure, there are exceptions, but they are rare.

"I can hear sound through the wall because they are so thin" is one of those statements that makes my brain itch.

Wall thickness has little to do with the sound transfer. What makes the difference is insulation and assembly. The STC rating of an uninsulated (nearly all interior walls have no insulation) 2x4 and 2x6 wood-framed wall are nearly identical. To lessen sound transfer through walls, insulation, or sound deadening material needs to be added. A 2x8 wall of course has more room for insulation than a 2x4, but remove that key component for either, and sound will easily travel through that wall.

This however is only one of a myriad of factors when it comes to how sound travels through a house. For instance, the sound will travel a whole lot more in a house when it hits $30 a square foot natural stone floors vs $1 per square for carpet.

That being said, the quality construction for the houses in Golden Oak is going to vary wildly from house to house. While all must meet Florida building code as @lazyboy97o pointed out, this has more to do with safety vs quality. I have seen numerous "luxury" builders that don't give any more thought to the quality of construction than a builder that puts up 2000 3/2 tract style houses a year. The term "McMansion" that is used to describe the construction in many of these luxury communities is often well deserved.
 

MrPromey

Well-Known Member
Being more budget conscious does not require it be the same sort of sprawl that Walt Disney World was reacting against and goes against the supposed values of being more sustainable espoused by the present day The Walt Disney Company. There’s a lot between seas of asphalt with cheap, poorly designed CMU boxes and themed experiences that directly compete with Disney.
While I often agree with many of your points as they pertain to the parks and resorts, this is nether a Disney park or Disney resort we're talking about. In fact, it's something that doesn't even have Disney's name associated with it in a way that the vast majority of the public will ever be aware of.

That said, clearly, you and I are never going to see eye-to-eye on this.

I can distinguish Disney the brand from Disney the publicly traded company. It appears that either you cannot or chose not to.

Disney the company is a business and needs to get business done. To me, that is not an excuse to tarnish the Disney brand in the name of making a quick buck the way they do with increasing resort prices and cutbacks in quality across "property" but in terms of "outside" development, you do realize that Disney originally built and owned that shopping center (Crossroads) directly across the street from the Hotel Blvd entrance to WDW over thirty years ago, right?

What Disney's doing here isn't exactly new for the company and in comparison to that project, this seems both nicer and far less attached to Disney than that ever was.

There is a lot to be said about the slide in management focus and how it pertains to certain aspects of the company*. This, I do not believe, is one of them.



*particularly, the resorts the own or have a majority ownership stake in, particularly in the US, particularly east of the Mississippi
 

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