Fight in the briefing room on Test Track

[enoe01]

Thanks everyone for the positive comments. There is no doubt in my mind that I would do the same thing all over again, although I hope I never have to again while in WDW. I hope more people will step forward and do the right thing when they see an injustice.

Thanks again

Erik

 

[flavious27]

I swear some people should not be let out into the public.

 

[enoe01]

I agree some people just shouldnt be let out into the public, although i guess i wouldnt have a job if they werent. I just wish people would relax and enjoy the magic of Disney!

 

[flavious27]

I agree some people just shouldnt be let out into the public, although i guess i wouldnt have a job if they werent. I just wish people would relax and enjoy the magic of Disney!

people will not leave their attitudes at the door.

 

[Fievel]

From one officer to another, thanks for stepping in.

I don't think people realize that we are never really *not* on duty in some capacity. The minute we take our oath, and are handed our badge, our job becomes one with our life.

Thumbs up!

 

[loveofamouse]

Im going to play devil's advocate here but I see this story in a different light


First off, while it may not have been gpa's fault that the little boy was yanking on him, did he do anything to stop it? Second, when he realized he was repeatedly being pulled into another adult, did he ever apologize? Third, when the younger guy finally lost his cool about it and shoved him, he didn't have to shove the guy back.

The way I see it, there were TWO adults here that were not taking the right steps to defuse a situation. Yes, people should be able to handle crowds. But, also, others should know how to act and be curteous of those around them.

I, for one, would have said something to my son if he was doing that. I would have told him to stop and pointed out to him that he was hurting someone. Second, the first time i was pulled into someone, I would have quickly apologized to the person. And I definitely would not have shoved back, esp with someone who could easily whoop my butt lol


Often times, people are very understanding of kids' behaviors, to a degree. What people are not understanding with is with parents or caregivers who aren't taking control of a situation. When a child is screaming in a restaurant, people are frustrated with the child. They get frustrated with the parents for not DOING ANYTHING. In this situation, that's what I see.

I see a man who was trying to enjoy a ride with his family but was being constantly shoved into from behind by a complete stranger. He prolly rolled his eyes and tried to be patient. The last shove, though, may have been stronger. He loses it and turns and shoves the guy, maybe not realizing it was an old man. This wasn't the correct action but whatever. Well, the old man shoves back, obviously indicating that he didn't care about the other man's repeated discomfort and got defensive. He punched. Not ok but I don't see this guy being a complete d****e either.

 

[rsoxguy]

Im going to play devil's advocate here but I see this story in a different light

We are collectively losing our soul as a society. You are correct in your belief that the child's grandfather should have controlled him, regardless of the child's enthusiasm. From that point, however, I must respectfully disagree with portions of your assessment. The person being shoved should have simply turned to the adult and strongly requested that the child's inappropriate behavior be stopped (Sir, you may not realize this, but your grandson is shoving me repeatedly, and it's very uncomfortable. Would you please tell him to wait as the line moves forward?). The bully in this story had no business resorting to violence against the older man. He should have instead intervened verbally (Hey, let's break this up and remember that we're at Disney World, or I'm going to call for security against you and your grandson).
Violence seems to be the only solution to which we turn when facing conflict, and it is destroying the very fiber of our society.

 

[hdme]

I see a man who was trying to enjoy a ride with his family but was being constantly shoved into from behind by a complete stranger. He prolly rolled his eyes and tried to be patient. The last shove, though, may have been stronger. He loses it and turns and shoves the guy, maybe not realizing it was an old man. This wasn't the correct action but whatever. Well, the old man shoves back, obviously indicating that he didn't care about the other man's repeated discomfort and got defensive. He punched. Not ok but I don't see this guy being a complete d****e either.

The older man who got punched was bumping into another older man. The 40-something yr old who did the punching seems to be the son of the man who was being bumped into. The man who was being bumped into should have been adult enough to turn around and say something to the man who got punched rather than escalating the situation by shoving him. Saying a few simple words such as "Could you please back up a bit?" would have probably solved the problem and if it didn't, he could have moved away from the man & his grandson.


OP - thanks for stepping in and caring about the safety of people around you. I know that you feel that you were just doing your job, but it takes a certain type of person to put other people's safety in front of their own. :sohappy:

 

[sweetpee_1993]

Wdwfqntflyer, I may have misread the OP's story but it was my understanding that the person who shoved first was also an older man. Yeah, the grandfather should've had better control of his grandson & corrected his misbehavior but turning around and shoving someone is inappropriate as well. Once a person puts their hands on another person they give that person the right to defend themselves. If someone shoved me in close proximity to one of my kids I would likely shove that person back not in retaliation but more to get the person away from my kid & me. If I'm not mistaken, that's what the OP said the grandfather did when he shoved back. Then for a younger man (the initial shover's son) to haul off and deck an elderly fellow, well that's totally unacceptable. Straight up. To me that's the equivalent to if the guy had popped a woman. It's just wrong.

Bottom line is there's a thousand what-ifs and alternate ways of handling the situation. I'm glad the OP was there and took the time to do the right thing. He could've just as easily turned his shoulder. Nobody there knew he was law enforcement. Here's a person who took action because it was the right thing to do even if it inconvenienced him & his family. The parks were a little safer that day when a potentially volatile person was removed because one person cared and did the right thing. We need more people like this in the world. Unfortunately, a lot of people today would rather whip out a cell phone to capture video, tweet about a scuffle, or just not get involved out of fear or avoiding inconvenience. It's so sad.

 

[joel_maxwell]

What disturbs me about the situation is that the CM didn't seem to have any intention of doing anything until the OP identified himself as apolice officer and demanded to see the supervisor. It doesn't matter that the CM didn't witness the incident...calling a supervisor or security should be an immediate response. If it had actually been serious (and an assault isn't necessarily a felony) where the victim had been injured, Disney could also be found liable for failure to act. It seems to me Disney's procedures are "turn a blind eye." And people wonder why Disney is always a target!

You cant hold Disney's position on the situation by the reaction, or a lack there of, of one CM. That is looking at the glass half empty. Looking at it half full is seeing how Disney treated the OP for getting involved on his vacation and trying to right the situation. What is the ratio to Disney CM to Disney Guest? We are all responsible to help, first starting with our own kids, then to others. We cant expect CM's to see everything nor expect a potential young CM to take every report like it is a terrorist attack. With all the talk and expectations of efficiency and the number of guest to load in an hour, stopping to get involved might not have been his first reaction. The positive is, once he was aware the OP was serious, he got the proper authorities.

I see a man who was trying to enjoy a ride with his family but was being constantly shoved into from behind by a complete stranger. He prolly rolled his eyes and tried to be patient. The last shove, though, may have been stronger. He loses it and turns and shoves the guy, maybe not realizing it was an old man. This wasn't the correct action but whatever. Well, the old man shoves back, obviously indicating that he didn't care about the other man's repeated discomfort and got defensive. He punched. Not ok but I don't see this guy being a complete d****e either.

Playing devils advocate part 2, it is hard to read and take your point seriously. Sorry.

 

[loveofamouse]

You cant hold Disney's position on the situation by the reaction, or a lack there of, of one CM. That is looking at the glass half empty. Looking at it half full is seeing how Disney treated the OP for getting involved on his vacation and trying to right the situation. What is the ratio to Disney CM to Disney Guest? We are all responsible to help, first starting with our own kids, then to others. We cant expect CM's to see everything nor expect a potential young CM to take every report like it is a terrorist attack. With all the talk and expectations of efficiency and the number of guest to load in an hour, stopping to get involved might not have been his first reaction. The positive is, once he was aware the OP was serious, he got the proper authorities.

Playing devils advocate part 2, it is hard to read and take your point seriously. Sorry.

Because I said "prolly" and not "probably" that makes my entire post not worth reading? Yeah, okay. Whatever


To further clarify my point, I didn't say ANYONE was RIGHT. I said ALL parties were wrong. It was a situation that ANYONE could have done 1 thing differently and changed the whole outcome. NO ONE should have pushed ANYONE. An adult should have calmed the child. So, as I said, ALL adults were victims AND wrong.

 

[joel_maxwell]

Because I said "prolly" and not "probably" that makes my entire post not worth reading? Yeah, okay. Whatever


To further clarify my point, I didn't say ANYONE was RIGHT. I said ALL parties were wrong. It was a situation that ANYONE could have done 1 thing differently and changed the whole outcome. NO ONE should have pushed ANYONE. An adult should have calmed the child. So, as I said, ALL adults were victims AND wrong.

No, it makes your post sound like a immature 13 year old typed it. Just telling you how it comes across and you might want to change it. It is the same thing if I type, "I luv disney cuz it is kewl." Looks ridiculous.

Well, you and I weren't there so we don't know who or what started it. We both can agreed that the OP did the right thing and hats off to him. Well done. :wave:

 

[si23]

yeah it shouldn't have happen both are at fault the grandad for not stoping his grandchild i nearly lost my temper when some kid was running into me and smacking my back with their bag in the line for spaceship earth.The grandad should have not pushed the guy back

 

[minniemickeyfan]

Okay....no one should shove or hit anyone and we should all be adults at Disney as well as on these boards. That also means we don't have to pick out a word that someone spells differently when we know what it means...especially when the person that points it out isn't perfect with their words as well.

Can't everyone just be nice?
Have a Magical Day Everyone!:xmas:

 

[flavious27]

calmer heads should have prevailed, yet they did not. the op was correct to alert disney personnel so that nothing even more serious would have happened.

 

[kucarachi]

They should have took out the test dummies and put the puncher in its place for the crash scene. I mean who isnt for punching old people who arent really expecting it..but not in disney world in front of other guest, save it for bingo night.
In all seriousness though, i think the stress of how much it cost and spending that much time with some peoples families really brings out the worst in some people. I have seen some serious yelling in the parks and most of the time its things that are so little you ask yourself why even get on the airplane if you hate your spouse that much.

I hope the old guy had a good lawyer cause it sounds like disney wanted nothing to do with this...and really its not there fault..but if you cant put up with kids then i think las vegas is the place you should be on vacation at.

 

[wishesjake]

We are collectively losing our soul as a society. You are correct in your belief that the child's grandfather should have controlled him, regardless of the child's enthusiasm. From that point, however, I must respectfully disagree with portions of your assessment. The person being shoved should have simply turned to the adult and strongly requested that the child's inappropriate behavior be stopped (Sir, you may not realize this, but your grandson is shoving me repeatedly, and it's very uncomfortable. Would you please tell him to wait as the line moves forward?). The bully in this story had no business resorting to violence against the older man. He should have instead intervened verbally (Hey, let's break this up and remember that we're at Disney World, or I'm going to call for security against you and your grandson).
Violence seems to be the only solution to which we turn when facing conflict, and it is destroying the very fiber of our society.

Losing our soul as a society? Because of a fight at Disney World. Not trying to pick a fight, but that seems a bit ridiculous.

 

[rsoxguy]

Losing our soul as a society? Because of a fight at Disney World. Not trying to pick a fight, but that seems a bit ridiculous.

Not trying to return a fight, but crime statistics continue to show that things are not getting better, but worse. Videos of people being carelessly trampled at the opening of stores, simply because everyone wants to save a few dollars on a new TV, don't help against my point. Common civility is losing ground to rudeness and anger, whether it be in an office or a grocery store. Please do not think that I believe that the sky is falling, because I do see much good within this world. My statement simply refers to a general down slide in civility within our present society, and I didn't mean to ruffle your feathers or offend you in any way.

 

[joel_maxwell]

Not trying to return a fight, but crime statistics continue to show that things are not getting better, but worse. Videos of people being carelessly trampled at the opening of stores, simply because everyone wants to save a few dollars on a new TV, don't help against my point. Common civility is losing ground to rudeness and anger, whether it be in an office or a grocery store. Please do not think that I believe that the sky is falling, because I do see much good within this world. My statement simply refers to a general down slide in civility within our present society, and I didn't mean to ruffle your feathers or offend you in any way.

That was crazy! Complete idiots too.

I will say that I agree to a certain point. There was a time in our society that you just didnt or wouldnt have ever considered physically attacking a senior citizen. I cant imagine ever hitting or attacking an old man no matter what he said to me. I will say that our society is more prone to acting out like that these days. We are a little different culture than years ago.

 

[rsoxguy]

That was crazy! Complete idiots too.

I will say that I agree to a certain point. There was a time in our society that you just didnt or wouldnt have ever considered physically attacking a senior citizen. I cant imagine ever hitting or attacking an old man no matter what he said to me. I will say that our society is more prone to acting out like that these days. We are a little different culture than years ago.

This is all I'm saying. I didn't mean to seem "ridiculous", but the terminologies that I use at times get me into trouble.