February 2016 Disney World ticket price increases and new tiered 1 day tickets

[tissandtully]

I don't say this to make people on here mad, although I suspect it probably will.

But based on so many of the comments on this thread, it appears that people feel they are entitled to a Disney vacation at a price that they feel is reasonable and appropriate. But what Disney is doing is simply the basis of the free market economy that this country is based on - it's basic supply and demand. The price is only too high if it causes their attendance and business to suffer, not because a bunch of self-professed Disney fans feel the prices are "unreasonable" or are priced out of attending.

As a private business Disney doesn't "owe" anything to anyone. You don't like their new prices, then don't go. Only if enough people do that will prices stop going up or even possibly drop.

Wow, so brave.

 

[BrianV]

I don't say this to make people on here mad, although I suspect it probably will.

But based on so many of the comments on this thread, it appears that people feel they are entitled to a Disney vacation at a price that they feel is reasonable and appropriate. But what Disney is doing is simply the basis of the free market economy that this country is based on - it's basic supply and demand. The price is only too high if it causes their attendance and business to suffer, not because a bunch of self-professed Disney fans feel the prices are "unreasonable" or are priced out of attending.

As a private business Disney doesn't "owe" anything to anyone. You don't like their new prices, then don't go. Only if enough people do that will prices stop going up or even possibly drop.

Sure--not sure anyone here disagrees with you. But you can only raise prices and cut quality so long. And when you go too far you can't simply cut prices and get your customers back.

 

[matt9112]

I don't say this to make people on here mad, although I suspect it probably will.

But based on so many of the comments on this thread, it appears that people feel they are entitled to a Disney vacation at a price that they feel is reasonable and appropriate. But what Disney is doing is simply the basis of the free market economy that this country is based on - it's basic supply and demand. The price is only too high if it causes their attendance and business to suffer, not because a bunch of self-professed Disney fans feel the prices are "unreasonable" or are priced out of attending.

As a private business Disney doesn't "owe" anything to anyone. You don't like their new prices, then don't go. Only if enough people do that will prices stop going up or even possibly drop.

Don't worry I bought universal passes for a reason kid.

 

[ParentsOf4]

I don't say this to make people on here mad, although I suspect it probably will.

But based on so many of the comments on this thread, it appears that people feel they are entitled to a Disney vacation at a price that they feel is reasonable and appropriate. But what Disney is doing is simply the basis of the free market economy that this country is based on - it's basic supply and demand. The price is only too high if it causes their attendance and business to suffer, not because a bunch of self-professed Disney fans feel the prices are "unreasonable" or are priced out of attending.

As a private business Disney doesn't "owe" anything to anyone. You don't like their new prices, then don't go. Only if enough people do that will prices stop going up or even possibly drop.

Welcome to WDWMagic with your first post!

Your points have been raised numerous times before on numerous threads.

Please be aware that consumers also have a right to complain about the products that they buy, which is a lot of what you are reading. Those that post on forums such as WDWMagic are among Walt Disney World's most loyal customers. Many hold strong opinions.

Smart companies listen carefully to their current loyal customers before they reach they point where they become former customers.

If the complaining bothers you, then I suggest you avoid reading controversial threads with titles such as "February 2016 Disney World ticket price increases and new tiered 1 day tickets". After all, few consumers of any product are happy about any price increase.

Alternatively, as you spend more time on WDWMagic, you'll find that certain posters are more negative than others. As many have written before on these threads, "The 'Ignore' option is your friend."

 

[Po'Rich]

I don't say this to make people on here mad, although I suspect it probably will.

But based on so many of the comments on this thread, it appears that people feel they are entitled to a Disney vacation at a price that they feel is reasonable and appropriate. But what Disney is doing is simply the basis of the free market economy that this country is based on - it's basic supply and demand. The price is only too high if it causes their attendance and business to suffer, not because a bunch of self-professed Disney fans feel the prices are "unreasonable" or are priced out of attending.

As a private business Disney doesn't "owe" anything to anyone. You don't like their new prices, then don't go. Only if enough people do that will prices stop going up or even possibly drop.

You say that you don't want to make people mad, but terms such as "entitled" and "self-professed" are loaded and are intentionally polemic. The use of "entitled" is particularly loaded these days. It is used to describe people who believe that they, unrightfully, believe that they have something coming to them. For example, it is used to describe students who believe that they should earn an A, even if they haven't shown up and done the work. Yet, is this the correct image to project? Are these boards comprised of people who expect something from Disney without having given Disney anything?

Furthermore, your argument goes on to display a misconception that unfettered capitalism was what made this country great. A little reading into the Robber Baron era of America will show that this is not true. But I will also argue that many companies do not operate from the simplistic supply and demand argument that you present. If it did, why would companies invest in the Arts or charities? From a bottom-line standpoint, why does Disney spend so much money on conservation efforts? Companies also want to develop good will among people and develop brand loyalty. In addition, they create programs (such as DVC and Annual Passes) to promote brand loyalty. This is why Ford and Toyota both have commercials that feature people who have bought multiple cars from their brand. When consumers are loyal to a brand, they will frequently buy that brand even without going through a cost-benefit analysis. It's the reason why people continue to buy Coke when Pepsi is on sale. Disney relies on brand-loyalty and works hard to maintain it.

Rather than describe the people on the boards as "entitled...self-professed Disney fans," I would say that they represent an important segment of that group of Disney brand-loyalists. The people here may complain about changes from time to time (or complain about the lack of change), but they also are the group that celebrates trips to Walt Disney World, from pre-planning to pictures following those trips. People come here to stay connected to their Walt Disney World experiences even after they have returned to their lives back home. If this is not a group of brand loyalists, I don't know what is.

Some time ago (for some, it has been years...if not decades), individuals on this board weighed the options and decided that a Disney vacation was worth the money. Yet, for the past several years, Disney has been raising the prices faster than the price of inflation and faster than wages have increased. This means that a greater and greater percent of an individual's disposable income is going to pay for a Disney vacation. To return to my student analogy, rather than entitled students, this board represents students who have worked to get an A only to find that the standard keeps raising. Furthermore, some will also point out that it isn't just the case the prices have raised, but that parts of the experience have been removed or lessened.

When a company, such as Disney, has built up a large cadre of brand loyalists, they can get away with raising prices and lowering experiences for a while. Yet, brand loyalty is a relationship. Brand loyal consumers remain loyal to the brand but also trust that that loyalty won't be abused. What sometimes occurs on this board (and particularly in this thread) is a discussion about whether or not Disney has pushed that trust too far. Is this the straw that finally broke the camel's back? Companies that behave as you suggest will soon find themselves very susceptible to market competition. There are all sorts of companies that have gone under or lost market share because they were only concerned with what the market could bear. The reason why the Japanese automakers did so well in the '80s is partly because American automakers took brand loyalty for granted. The big three American automakers have never fully recovered.

However, I don't want to overstate my position. I don't think Disney is in any risk of going under. Magic Kingdom is still the most visited park in the world. All of the parks at WDW are in the top 10. Yet, I think that the experience at Walt Disney World could fundamentally change. Where once the focus of the park was middle class families, those families may decide not to go as often to WDW. It could become more of a one-and-done experience for many families. Those numbers could be replaced with more foreign touring groups or corporate retreats. As the income disparity continues to rise in America, WDW could also become a place mainly for privileged individuals and families to go. The bottom line is protected (at least for a generation), but the experience has fundamentally shifted, and I would argue, so has the brand loyalty.

So, rather than approaching this forum as a bunch of whiny consumers, consider it more like marriage counseling. Posters are here discussing if their significant other has pushed the limits too far this time. As such your response is similar to brushing off an emotionally abused spouse with "just leave"...and yes, such comments are going to make people mad.

 

[Mike S]

You say that you don't want to make people mad, but terms such as "entitled" and "self-professed" are loaded and are intentionally polemic. The use of "entitled" is particularly loaded these days. It is used to describe people who believe that they, unrightfully, believe that they have something coming to them. For example, it is used to describe students who believe that they should earn an A, even if they haven't shown up and done the work. Yet, is this the correct image to project? Are these boards comprised of people who expect something from Disney without having given Disney anything?

Furthermore, your argument goes on to display a misconception that unfettered capitalism was what made this country great. A little reading into the Robber Baron era of America will show that this is not true. But I will also argue that many companies do not operate from the simplistic supply and demand argument that you present. If it did, why would companies invest in the Arts or charities? From a bottom-line standpoint, why does Disney spend so much money on conservation efforts? Companies also want to develop good will among people and develop brand loyalty. In addition, they create programs (such as DVC and Annual Passes) to promote brand loyalty. This is why Ford and Toyota both have commercials that feature people who have bought multiple cars from their brand. When consumers are loyal to a brand, they will frequently buy that brand even without going through a cost-benefit analysis. It's the reason why people continue to buy Coke when Pepsi is on sale. Disney relies on brand-loyalty and works hard to maintain it.

Rather than describe the people on the boards as "entitled...self-professed Disney fans," I would say that they represent an important segment of that group of Disney brand-loyalists. The people here may complain about changes from time to time (or complain about the lack of change), but they also are the group that celebrates trips to Walt Disney World, from pre-planning to pictures following those trips. People come here to stay connected to their Walt Disney World experiences even after they have returned to their lives back home. If this is not a group of brand loyalists, I don't know what is.

Some time ago (for some, it has been years...if not decades), individuals on this board weighed the options and decided that a Disney vacation was worth the money. Yet, for the past several years, Disney has been raising the prices faster than the price of inflation and faster than wages have increased. This means that a greater and greater percent of an individual's disposable income is going to pay for a Disney vacation. To return to my student analogy, rather than entitled students, this board represents students who have worked to get an A only to find that the standard keeps raising. Furthermore, some will also point out that it isn't just the case the prices have raised, but that parts of the experience have been removed or lessened.

When a company, such as Disney, has built up a large cadre of brand loyalists, they can get away with raising prices and lowering experiences for a while. Yet, brand loyalty is a relationship. Brand loyal consumers remain loyal to the brand but also trust that that loyalty won't be abused. What sometimes occurs on this board (and particularly in this thread) is a discussion about whether or not Disney has pushed that trust too far. Is this the straw that finally broke the camel's back? Companies that behave as you suggest will soon find themselves very susceptible to market competition. There are all sorts of companies that have gone under or lost market share because they were only concerned with what the market could bear. The reason why the Japanese automakers did so well in the '80s is partly because American automakers took brand loyalty for granted. The big three American automakers have never fully recovered.

However, I don't want to overstate my position. I don't think Disney is in any risk of going under. Magic Kingdom is still the most visited park in the world. All of the parks at WDW are in the top 10. Yet, I think that the experience at Walt Disney World could fundamentally change. Where once the focus of the park was middle class families, those families may decide not to go as often to WDW. It could become more of a one-and-done experience for many families. Those numbers could be replaced with more foreign touring groups or corporate retreats. As the income disparity continues to rise in America, WDW could also become a place mainly for privileged individuals and families to go. The bottom line is protected (at least for a generation), but the experience has fundamentally shifted, and I would argue, so has the brand loyalty.

So, rather than approaching this forum as a bunch of whiny consumers, consider it more like marriage counseling. Posters are here discussing if their significant other has pushed the limits too far this time. As such your response is similar to brushing off an emotionally abused spouse with "just leave"...and yes, such comments are going to make people mad.

This post needs to be saved for posterity.

 

[Cesar R M]

You say that you don't want to make people mad, but terms such as "entitled" and "self-professed" are loaded and are intentionally polemic. The use of "entitled" is particularly loaded these days. It is used to describe people who believe that they, unrightfully, believe that they have something coming to them. For example, it is used to describe students who believe that they should earn an A, even if they haven't shown up and done the work. Yet, is this the correct image to project? Are these boards comprised of people who expect something from Disney without having given Disney anything?

Furthermore, your argument goes on to display a misconception that unfettered capitalism was what made this country great. A little reading into the Robber Baron era of America will show that this is not true. But I will also argue that many companies do not operate from the simplistic supply and demand argument that you present. If it did, why would companies invest in the Arts or charities? From a bottom-line standpoint, why does Disney spend so much money on conservation efforts? Companies also want to develop good will among people and develop brand loyalty. In addition, they create programs (such as DVC and Annual Passes) to promote brand loyalty. This is why Ford and Toyota both have commercials that feature people who have bought multiple cars from their brand. When consumers are loyal to a brand, they will frequently buy that brand even without going through a cost-benefit analysis. It's the reason why people continue to buy Coke when Pepsi is on sale. Disney relies on brand-loyalty and works hard to maintain it.

Rather than describe the people on the boards as "entitled...self-professed Disney fans," I would say that they represent an important segment of that group of Disney brand-loyalists. The people here may complain about changes from time to time (or complain about the lack of change), but they also are the group that celebrates trips to Walt Disney World, from pre-planning to pictures following those trips. People come here to stay connected to their Walt Disney World experiences even after they have returned to their lives back home. If this is not a group of brand loyalists, I don't know what is.

Some time ago (for some, it has been years...if not decades), individuals on this board weighed the options and decided that a Disney vacation was worth the money. Yet, for the past several years, Disney has been raising the prices faster than the price of inflation and faster than wages have increased. This means that a greater and greater percent of an individual's disposable income is going to pay for a Disney vacation. To return to my student analogy, rather than entitled students, this board represents students who have worked to get an A only to find that the standard keeps raising. Furthermore, some will also point out that it isn't just the case the prices have raised, but that parts of the experience have been removed or lessened.

When a company, such as Disney, has built up a large cadre of brand loyalists, they can get away with raising prices and lowering experiences for a while. Yet, brand loyalty is a relationship. Brand loyal consumers remain loyal to the brand but also trust that that loyalty won't be abused. What sometimes occurs on this board (and particularly in this thread) is a discussion about whether or not Disney has pushed that trust too far. Is this the straw that finally broke the camel's back? Companies that behave as you suggest will soon find themselves very susceptible to market competition. There are all sorts of companies that have gone under or lost market share because they were only concerned with what the market could bear. The reason why the Japanese automakers did so well in the '80s is partly because American automakers took brand loyalty for granted. The big three American automakers have never fully recovered.

However, I don't want to overstate my position. I don't think Disney is in any risk of going under. Magic Kingdom is still the most visited park in the world. All of the parks at WDW are in the top 10. Yet, I think that the experience at Walt Disney World could fundamentally change. Where once the focus of the park was middle class families, those families may decide not to go as often to WDW. It could become more of a one-and-done experience for many families. Those numbers could be replaced with more foreign touring groups or corporate retreats. As the income disparity continues to rise in America, WDW could also become a place mainly for privileged individuals and families to go. The bottom line is protected (at least for a generation), but the experience has fundamentally shifted, and I would argue, so has the brand loyalty.

So, rather than approaching this forum as a bunch of whiny consumers, consider it more like marriage counseling. Posters are here discussing if their significant other has pushed the limits too far this time. As such your response is similar to brushing off an emotionally abused spouse with "just leave"...and yes, such comments are going to make people mad.

Best post in a looong time. And pretty much says it all needs to be said.

 

[Lirael]

I don't say this to make people on here mad, although I suspect it probably will.

But based on so many of the comments on this thread, it appears that people feel they are entitled to a Disney vacation at a price that they feel is reasonable and appropriate. But what Disney is doing is simply the basis of the free market economy that this country is based on - it's basic supply and demand. The price is only too high if it causes their attendance and business to suffer, not because a bunch of self-professed Disney fans feel the prices are "unreasonable" or are priced out of attending.

As a private business Disney doesn't "owe" anything to anyone. You don't like their new prices, then don't go. Only if enough people do that will prices stop going up or even possibly drop.

A) if your intent wasnt to make people mad, then you seriously need to brush up on your writing skills and get down from the high horse you have no reason to be on.

B) You seriously joined the forum to whine about people being displeased? Seriously? That's really ridiculous, is this another troll??

C) Maybe we're not reading the same posts, but I have yet to see people (apart from two trolls that were duly replied to) feeling theyre entitled to anything. That is, noone is saying they deserve the price at a certain level. People are angry/displeased at price hikes and as this is a discussion forum, discussion and opinions over Disney stuff -be them positive or negative- are the whole point. We're not sitting outside the disney parks harassing any guests that seem happy as they buy tickets. We're not dissing disney unfairly on every corner of the internet, so why shouldnt we be allowed to share our displeasure in this tiny corner? Answer: there is no reason why we shouldnt.

D) In fact, it's the opposite of what you said: we do not owe Disney anything, so we don't have to accept anything they throw out without complaint. We dont have to bow our heads and keep our mouths shut. Disney isnt entitled to guests being quiet about changes that displease them. So why should we keep quiet if we don't like it?

 

[Beth826]

You say that you don't want to make people mad, but terms such as "entitled" and "self-professed" are loaded and are intentionally polemic. The use of "entitled" is particularly loaded these days. It is used to describe people who believe that they, unrightfully, believe that they have something coming to them. For example, it is used to describe students who believe that they should earn an A, even if they haven't shown up and done the work. Yet, is this the correct image to project? Are these boards comprised of people who expect something from Disney without having given Disney anything?

Furthermore, your argument goes on to display a misconception that unfettered capitalism was what made this country great. A little reading into the Robber Baron era of America will show that this is not true. But I will also argue that many companies do not operate from the simplistic supply and demand argument that you present. If it did, why would companies invest in the Arts or charities? From a bottom-line standpoint, why does Disney spend so much money on conservation efforts? Companies also want to develop good will among people and develop brand loyalty. In addition, they create programs (such as DVC and Annual Passes) to promote brand loyalty. This is why Ford and Toyota both have commercials that feature people who have bought multiple cars from their brand. When consumers are loyal to a brand, they will frequently buy that brand even without going through a cost-benefit analysis. It's the reason why people continue to buy Coke when Pepsi is on sale. Disney relies on brand-loyalty and works hard to maintain it.

Rather than describe the people on the boards as "entitled...self-professed Disney fans," I would say that they represent an important segment of that group of Disney brand-loyalists. The people here may complain about changes from time to time (or complain about the lack of change), but they also are the group that celebrates trips to Walt Disney World, from pre-planning to pictures following those trips. People come here to stay connected to their Walt Disney World experiences even after they have returned to their lives back home. If this is not a group of brand loyalists, I don't know what is.

Some time ago (for some, it has been years...if not decades), individuals on this board weighed the options and decided that a Disney vacation was worth the money. Yet, for the past several years, Disney has been raising the prices faster than the price of inflation and faster than wages have increased. This means that a greater and greater percent of an individual's disposable income is going to pay for a Disney vacation. To return to my student analogy, rather than entitled students, this board represents students who have worked to get an A only to find that the standard keeps raising. Furthermore, some will also point out that it isn't just the case the prices have raised, but that parts of the experience have been removed or lessened.

When a company, such as Disney, has built up a large cadre of brand loyalists, they can get away with raising prices and lowering experiences for a while. Yet, brand loyalty is a relationship. Brand loyal consumers remain loyal to the brand but also trust that that loyalty won't be abused. What sometimes occurs on this board (and particularly in this thread) is a discussion about whether or not Disney has pushed that trust too far. Is this the straw that finally broke the camel's back? Companies that behave as you suggest will soon find themselves very susceptible to market competition. There are all sorts of companies that have gone under or lost market share because they were only concerned with what the market could bear. The reason why the Japanese automakers did so well in the '80s is partly because American automakers took brand loyalty for granted. The big three American automakers have never fully recovered.

However, I don't want to overstate my position. I don't think Disney is in any risk of going under. Magic Kingdom is still the most visited park in the world. All of the parks at WDW are in the top 10. Yet, I think that the experience at Walt Disney World could fundamentally change. Where once the focus of the park was middle class families, those families may decide not to go as often to WDW. It could become more of a one-and-done experience for many families. Those numbers could be replaced with more foreign touring groups or corporate retreats. As the income disparity continues to rise in America, WDW could also become a place mainly for privileged individuals and families to go. The bottom line is protected (at least for a generation), but the experience has fundamentally shifted, and I would argue, so has the brand loyalty.

So, rather than approaching this forum as a bunch of whiny consumers, consider it more like marriage counseling. Posters are here discussing if their significant other has pushed the limits too far this time. As such your response is similar to brushing off an emotionally abused spouse with "just leave"...and yes, such comments are going to make people mad.

Po'Rich, I appreciate your well thought-out response and that you responded to my message instead of using my post to make assumptions about me as a person or my intentions. Reading over my earlier post again, you are correct in that I could have definitely worded it better. Even though it may not be clear, my post wasn't meant to be personal attack against any individual. But it appears that several people felt that it was, so I apologize for that. I tend to shoot off my mouth at times before thinking things through.

While your post, and the others in response to what I said, haven't totally changed my mind, they do add some perspective. I 100% agree that people are entitled to complain, and I do agree that Disney needs to be very careful about disillusioning their customer base and driving them away and that they may be headed towards doing that with their continued changes. But at the same time I definitely still believe it is every business' right to charge what they feel is appropriate for their product or service, and it is up to the market to correct it if they decide wrong. I think I just got annoyed (too quickly I now realize) by what I interpreted as an underlying belief by some that it's not "fair" for Disney to raise their prices, even if no one ever said it exactly that way. Was I reading too much into people's complaints? Probably so for many, if not most of them.

 

[Mike S]

Po'Rich, I appreciate your well-thought out response and that you responded to my message instead of using my post to make assumptions about me as a person or my intentions. Reading over my earlier post again, you are correct in that I could have definitely worded it better. Even though it may not be clear, my post wasn't meant to be personal attack against any individual. But it appears that several people felt that it was, so I apologize for that. I tend to shoot off my mouth at times before thinking things through.

While your post, and the others in response to what I said, haven't totally changed my mind, they do add some perspective. I 100% agree that people are entitled to complain, and I do agree that Disney needs to be very careful about disillusioning their customer base and driving them away and that they may be headed towards doing that with their continued changes. But at the same time I definitely still believe it is every business' right to charge what they feel is appropriate for their product or service, and it is up to the market to correct it if they decide wrong. I think I just got annoyed (too quickly I now realize) by what I interpreted as an underlying belief by some that it's not "fair" for Disney to raise their prices, even if no one ever said it exactly that way. Was I reading too much into people's complaints? Probably so for many, if not most of them.

I'll attempt to explain it batter by saying it's not just price increases alone but when they're combined with lowered quality that annoys us. Universal raises prices too but they're also increasing the quality of their resort while Disney continues to cut and slash and I'm not just talking about new attractions.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

I'll attempt to explain it batter by saying it's not just price increases alone but when they're combined with lowered quality that annoys us. Universal raises prices too but they're also increasing the quality of their resort while Disney continues to cut and slash and I'm not just talking about new attractions.

The only problem is that people are coming back from very recent trips, and saying that the quality hasn't changed. Of course I'm sure they are all pixie dust snorting idiots that always have Disney rose colored glasses on. They couldn't possibly be right since people that post here, and haven't even been to Disney recently, state that the quality sucks. So that has to be the reality.

 

[Mike S]

The only problem is that people are coming back from very recent trips, and saying that the quality hasn't changed. Of course I'm sure they are all pixie dust snorting idiots that always have Disney rose colored glasses on. They couldn't possibly be right since people that post here, and haven't even been to Disney recently, state that the quality sucks. So that has to be the reality.

I was there within the past two months and will be going again May 6th-8th for the last days of my AP but more importantly to hopefully catch a soft opening of King Kong. I've noticed a decline from even just a few years ago.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

I was there within the past two months. I've noticed a decline even from just a few years ago.

In what way?

 

[Mike S]

In what way?

Continued maintenance problems on rides like Space Mountain, Living with the Land, and Carousel of Progress just to name a few. Cuts to entertainment with no replacements (remember when DHS and DAK had parades?) and subpar replacements like those awful Lumberjacks.

 

[jensenrick]

You say that you don't want to make people mad, but terms such as "entitled" and "self-professed" are loaded and are intentionally polemic. The use of "entitled" is particularly loaded these days. It is used to describe people who believe that they, unrightfully, believe that they have something coming to them. For example, it is used to describe students who believe that they should earn an A, even if they haven't shown up and done the work. Yet, is this the correct image to project? Are these boards comprised of people who expect something from Disney without having given Disney anything?

Furthermore, your argument goes on to display a misconception that unfettered capitalism was what made this country great. A little reading into the Robber Baron era of America will show that this is not true. But I will also argue that many companies do not operate from the simplistic supply and demand argument that you present. If it did, why would companies invest in the Arts or charities? From a bottom-line standpoint, why does Disney spend so much money on conservation efforts? Companies also want to develop good will among people and develop brand loyalty. In addition, they create programs (such as DVC and Annual Passes) to promote brand loyalty. This is why Ford and Toyota both have commercials that feature people who have bought multiple cars from their brand. When consumers are loyal to a brand, they will frequently buy that brand even without going through a cost-benefit analysis. It's the reason why people continue to buy Coke when Pepsi is on sale. Disney relies on brand-loyalty and works hard to maintain it.

Rather than describe the people on the boards as "entitled...self-professed Disney fans," I would say that they represent an important segment of that group of Disney brand-loyalists. The people here may complain about changes from time to time (or complain about the lack of change), but they also are the group that celebrates trips to Walt Disney World, from pre-planning to pictures following those trips. People come here to stay connected to their Walt Disney World experiences even after they have returned to their lives back home. If this is not a group of brand loyalists, I don't know what is.

Some time ago (for some, it has been years...if not decades), individuals on this board weighed the options and decided that a Disney vacation was worth the money. Yet, for the past several years, Disney has been raising the prices faster than the price of inflation and faster than wages have increased. This means that a greater and greater percent of an individual's disposable income is going to pay for a Disney vacation. To return to my student analogy, rather than entitled students, this board represents students who have worked to get an A only to find that the standard keeps raising. Furthermore, some will also point out that it isn't just the case the prices have raised, but that parts of the experience have been removed or lessened.

When a company, such as Disney, has built up a large cadre of brand loyalists, they can get away with raising prices and lowering experiences for a while. Yet, brand loyalty is a relationship. Brand loyal consumers remain loyal to the brand but also trust that that loyalty won't be abused. What sometimes occurs on this board (and particularly in this thread) is a discussion about whether or not Disney has pushed that trust too far. Is this the straw that finally broke the camel's back? Companies that behave as you suggest will soon find themselves very susceptible to market competition. There are all sorts of companies that have gone under or lost market share because they were only concerned with what the market could bear. The reason why the Japanese automakers did so well in the '80s is partly because American automakers took brand loyalty for granted. The big three American automakers have never fully recovered.

However, I don't want to overstate my position. I don't think Disney is in any risk of going under. Magic Kingdom is still the most visited park in the world. All of the parks at WDW are in the top 10. Yet, I think that the experience at Walt Disney World could fundamentally change. Where once the focus of the park was middle class families, those families may decide not to go as often to WDW. It could become more of a one-and-done experience for many families. Those numbers could be replaced with more foreign touring groups or corporate retreats. As the income disparity continues to rise in America, WDW could also become a place mainly for privileged individuals and families to go. The bottom line is protected (at least for a generation), but the experience has fundamentally shifted, and I would argue, so has the brand loyalty.

So, rather than approaching this forum as a bunch of whiny consumers, consider it more like marriage counseling. Posters are here discussing if their significant other has pushed the limits too far this time. As such your response is similar to brushing off an emotionally abused spouse with "just leave"...and yes, such comments are going to make people mad.

Possibly my favorite post ever!

 

[ford91exploder]

You say that you don't want to make people mad, but terms such as "entitled" and "self-professed" are loaded and are intentionally polemic. The use of "entitled" is particularly loaded these days. It is used to describe people who believe that they, unrightfully, believe that they have something coming to them. For example, it is used to describe students who believe that they should earn an A, even if they haven't shown up and done the work. Yet, is this the correct image to project? Are these boards comprised of people who expect something from Disney without having given Disney anything?

Furthermore, your argument goes on to display a misconception that unfettered capitalism was what made this country great. A little reading into the Robber Baron era of America will show that this is not true. But I will also argue that many companies do not operate from the simplistic supply and demand argument that you present. If it did, why would companies invest in the Arts or charities? From a bottom-line standpoint, why does Disney spend so much money on conservation efforts? Companies also want to develop good will among people and develop brand loyalty. In addition, they create programs (such as DVC and Annual Passes) to promote brand loyalty. This is why Ford and Toyota both have commercials that feature people who have bought multiple cars from their brand. When consumers are loyal to a brand, they will frequently buy that brand even without going through a cost-benefit analysis. It's the reason why people continue to buy Coke when Pepsi is on sale. Disney relies on brand-loyalty and works hard to maintain it.

Rather than describe the people on the boards as "entitled...self-professed Disney fans," I would say that they represent an important segment of that group of Disney brand-loyalists. The people here may complain about changes from time to time (or complain about the lack of change), but they also are the group that celebrates trips to Walt Disney World, from pre-planning to pictures following those trips. People come here to stay connected to their Walt Disney World experiences even after they have returned to their lives back home. If this is not a group of brand loyalists, I don't know what is.

Some time ago (for some, it has been years...if not decades), individuals on this board weighed the options and decided that a Disney vacation was worth the money. Yet, for the past several years, Disney has been raising the prices faster than the price of inflation and faster than wages have increased. This means that a greater and greater percent of an individual's disposable income is going to pay for a Disney vacation. To return to my student analogy, rather than entitled students, this board represents students who have worked to get an A only to find that the standard keeps raising. Furthermore, some will also point out that it isn't just the case the prices have raised, but that parts of the experience have been removed or lessened.

When a company, such as Disney, has built up a large cadre of brand loyalists, they can get away with raising prices and lowering experiences for a while. Yet, brand loyalty is a relationship. Brand loyal consumers remain loyal to the brand but also trust that that loyalty won't be abused. What sometimes occurs on this board (and particularly in this thread) is a discussion about whether or not Disney has pushed that trust too far. Is this the straw that finally broke the camel's back? Companies that behave as you suggest will soon find themselves very susceptible to market competition. There are all sorts of companies that have gone under or lost market share because they were only concerned with what the market could bear. The reason why the Japanese automakers did so well in the '80s is partly because American automakers took brand loyalty for granted. The big three American automakers have never fully recovered.

However, I don't want to overstate my position. I don't think Disney is in any risk of going under. Magic Kingdom is still the most visited park in the world. All of the parks at WDW are in the top 10. Yet, I think that the experience at Walt Disney World could fundamentally change. Where once the focus of the park was middle class families, those families may decide not to go as often to WDW. It could become more of a one-and-done experience for many families. Those numbers could be replaced with more foreign touring groups or corporate retreats. As the income disparity continues to rise in America, WDW could also become a place mainly for privileged individuals and families to go. The bottom line is protected (at least for a generation), but the experience has fundamentally shifted, and I would argue, so has the brand loyalty.

So, rather than approaching this forum as a bunch of whiny consumers, consider it more like marriage counseling. Posters are here discussing if their significant other has pushed the limits too far this time. As such your response is similar to brushing off an emotionally abused spouse with "just leave"...and yes, such comments are going to make people mad.

Very well said FYI I'm one of the 'More Negative' posters that @ParentsOf4 mentioned but I've been visiting WDW for 30 years now since I was a young teen and that FIRST visit made me a fan for life, Disney gives the inner child in all of us a chance to express itself but what Disney is doing over the last 5 years or so is doing a lot of damage to that.

Yes planning for a WDW visit always even 30 years ago made for a better experience one could also choose to explore randomly and have a good time and eat at all the restaurants except for V&A yes you might have to wait but you would never be turned away at the podium as you are now if you attempt to walk up even if the restaurant is mostly empty.

Now a visit to WDW needs to be thought through as one was planning a military campaign and my family will be on Grid square MM71 at 1400H

I disargree with the notion that Disney has a generation to coast, I think they have under 10 years as recent changes and cuts have negatively influenced a lot of FIRST TIME visitors along with grumpy curmudgeons like me.

 

[BrianV]

Very well said FYI I'm one of the 'More Negative' posters that @ParentsOf4 mentioned but I've been visiting WDW for 30 years now since I was a young teen and that FIRST visit made me a fan for life, Disney gives the inner child in all of us a chance to express itself but what Disney is doing over the last 5 years or so is doing a lot of damage to that.

Yes planning for a WDW visit always even 30 years ago made for a better experience one could also choose to explore randomly and have a good time and eat at all the restaurants except for V&A yes you might have to wait but you would never be turned away at the podium as you are now if you attempt to walk up even if the restaurant is mostly empty.

Now a visit to WDW needs to be thought through as one was planning a military campaign and my family will be on Grid square MM71 at 1400H

I disargree with the notion that Disney has a generation to coast, I think they have under 10 years as recent changes and cuts have negatively influenced a lot of FIRST TIME visitors along with grumpy curmudgeons like me.

In 10 years there will be avatar land, star wars land, and toy story land.

Do you mean 10 years if they did nothing or 10 years even with the changes underway?

 

[ford91exploder]

In 10 years there will be avatar land, star wars land, and toy story land.

Do you mean 10 years if they did nothing or 10 years even with the changes underway?

10 years with the changes underway, less if they do nothing Disney needs to get these projects done and do them to AK standards then they have a chance but Uni is on track to overtake Disney as THE orlando destination. They need to have all the new stuff open no later than 2018,

My View is that WDW has been running on nostalgia but get enough 'Meh FIRST impressions well you have a damn high mountain climb to get the disney halo back.