FastPass+ Most Certainly Not Coming Back As It Was

[CastAStone]

Really? Where did you get such low numbers?

I know for a fact that my Contemporary reservation for September 2021 went up by exactly $550.62 over September 2020 (which was cancelled due to COVID). That is an 8.1% price increase from 2020 to 2021 and the numbers cannot not lie. This is also lower than normal as Disney prices normally increase by 10% every year.

I would be very surprised if any Disney resort has under 5% yearly inflation.

Mousesavers and TouringPlans both keep a compendium of prices. I compared a bunch of resorts before and after.

Its certainly possible if you're going in the latter half of September, those prices increased at an outsized rate at CR compared to the rest of the year. CR was above average overall.

 

[G00fyDad]

 

[Lil Copter Cap]

I'm speaking out of my left ear, but isn't some concept of business to create a really great quality product and slightly chip away at its quality (therefore less cost to the business to make/provide) until majority of consumers recognize a difference (i.e. "The tipping point")?

This has been happening more often with various brands that I enjoy and I'm trying to not live into the mentality of "things used to be so much better" –but woof is it getting harder as the years go by.

 

[CastAStone]

I'm speaking out of my left ear, but isn't some concept of business to create a really great quality product and slightly chip away at its quality (therefore less cost to the business to make/provide) until majority of consumers recognize a difference (i.e. "The tipping point")?

This has been happening more often with various brands that I enjoy and I'm trying to not live into the mentality of "things used to be so much better" –but woof is it getting harder as the years go by.

I worked in packaged food for years and all of our competitors were constantly slightly worsening their products, and because no individual change was “statistically significantly worse” than the previous version in testing, they just kept doing it. Then they were flabbergasted when their sales continuously fell.

A 2% decrease in preference is almost certainly not statistically significant with the sample sizes these companies use, so they tel their bosses “there’s no difference”, but a non-significant 2% decrease still means a 2% decrease in sales is the most likely outcome. People who make decisions at big companies have been taught the same very dumb ideas at the same very dumb corporate training classes (no business school teaches “make your products worse” because it runs counter to all available evidence). And they lead to the same very dumb outcomes.

Bob Chapek, it can’t be said enough, started his career and was trained on business at a packaged food company (Heinz).

 

[disneyfreak0710]

I'm speaking out of my left ear, but isn't some concept of business to create a really great quality product and slightly chip away at its quality (therefore less cost to the business to make/provide) until majority of consumers recognize a difference (i.e. "The tipping point")?

This has been happening more often with various brands that I enjoy and I'm trying to not live into the mentality of "things used to be so much better" –but woof is it getting harder as the years go by.

I would agree with this. Very different example, but any parent of older children should be able to attest to this with the quality of children's clothing. Gymboree did this - and ran themselves straight into bankruptcy. Children's Place 15 years ago, was a great place to buy clothes. Today the girls t-shirt material is often so thin it's see-through. I have literally bought better quality shirts at Walmart and paid 50-75% less.

 

[Disney Glimpses]

EMH only came about after 9/11 though remember.

I'm talking about the 90s EMH. But yeah, it's always relative to what they need help selling.

 

[dovetail65]

I can't see us ever staying on site again, especially if they monetize FP+. Granted, we're one of those middle-classers they're trying to price out, y'know, the All Star budget folk

However, in pricing our trip for 2022, compared to our 2019 trip, the same hotel room at All Star Movies for same time has increased $50 per night. That's a huge jump.

Magical Express is gone, so we'll have to add on roughly $150-200 for airport transportation.

The price of food has increased - having looked at menus it looks like it would be an increase of about $200+ for our family of four for a week (based on two meals a day plus snacks and one character meal breakfast).

So....already we're at an increase of $700-750 for the EXACT same trip we took 3 years ago, and that doesn't even include the increase in ticket prices!!! Those are just direct resort-related costs.

Now add in the fact that EMH will have gone from 1-2 hours morning or evening (and we LOVED the evening hours) to 30 minutes AND potentially the loss of free FP+??? It's asinine.

I wrote a long post then deleted it, WHY? Because all my stats and numbers could be up summed up in a sentence or two.

Disney appears to be after the one and done people, last time I checked 17 million people of the 20 to 21 million that visit are one time visitors. These visitors don't know what Disney gave last year and for the most part don't care what they offer next year.

It has worked for Disney and historically though there have been peaks and valleys it's like stocks, over the long term the attendance and profits for the WDW resort is on a long term upward trend doing what they are doing.

Time will tell if they value the repeat customers and in short order. Once they open to 100% capacity we will see what they come up with.

 

[PirateFrank]

Then again the shortened Halloween party for $160, which I thought was a complete rip-off, brought down the Disney phone lines for 3 days, so what do I know. I guess there is an inexhaustible supply of people who would pay anything.

Yes, But dont discount pent-up demand. Large portions of the country are starting to declare some sort of official end to the pandemic - especially in some of the more locked down states.

People who haven't vacationed in a year or more - who may have had 1-3 vacations canceled on them, are ready to go - they have a surplus of vacation dollars and vacation days, and they're willing to use both.

 

[disneyfreak0710]

Yes, But dont discount pent-up demand. Large portions of the country are starting to declare some sort of official end to the pandemic - especially in some of the more locked down states.

People who haven't vacationed in a year or more - who may have had 1-3 vacations canceled on them, are ready to go - they have a surplus of vacation dollars and vacation days, and they're willing to use both.

This. I think we're a couple years away from seeing the REAL effect all these cutbacks and increases have had. This year and next year will be full of pent-up travel, people who are making far more emotional decisions than they normally would with how they spend their money. Give it a couple years, let the pandemic fade into memory a bit, things return to normal, and then we'll see how Disney is faring.

 

[spaldingclan]

Yes, But dont discount pent-up demand. Large portions of the country are starting to declare some sort of official end to the pandemic - especially in some of the more locked down states.

People who haven't vacationed in a year or more - who may have had 1-3 vacations canceled on them, are ready to go - they have a surplus of vacation dollars and vacation days, and they're willing to use both.

you just perfectly summed up our family...this may be the only time we go to WDW (we're in Oregon and go to DL every three to four years) and I'm willing to splurge because my family needs to be spoiled because of the last 16 months

 

[WDWTrojan]

Another benefit to staying on site is the ability to book a dining package, especially free dining. The possibility of free dining and fast passes returning is why we are currently booked at Pop Century for our August 2022 trip.

But "free" dining was also a ruse. You forwent any kind of promotion on the room, which could be substantial, and paid top dollar rack rate for the ability to promise Disney you'd eat a ton.

 

[seascape]

I nwver cease to be amazed at those families that make 3 times the median income and still claim to be middle class. The lack of knowledge of how the real middle class Americans live is shocking. Middleclass Americans have never been able to afford an onsite WDW vacation. Some did manage to visit if they stayed with relatives or stayed offsite and only visited once, but too many here claim WDW or DL used to be affordable for the middleclass to visit yearly. THAT IS PURE BS. Walt always charged prices that allowed his to live a rich lifestyle.

 

[Willmark]

Getting back to on topic.

Perhaps I missed it but this is a result of not building enough rides as the population of the US and those from other countries could afford it started going.

Ride rationing is just rearranging deck chairs on the titanic IMO.

 

[disneyfreak0710]

I nwver cease to be amazed at those families that make 3 times the median income and still claim to be middle class. The lack of knowledge of how the real middle class Americans live is shocking. Middleclass Americans have never been able to afford an onsite WDW vacation. Some did manage to visit if they stayed with relatives or stayed offsite and only visited once, but too many here claim WDW or DL used to be affordable for the middleclass to visit yearly. THAT IS PURE BS. Walt always charged prices that allowed his to live a rich lifestyle.

So many flaws in this, where to start though I guess we could start with the fact that many are unaware that middle class is roughly $40,000 - $120,000, with the median middle class income being around $65,000. Median national income is roughly $34,000. So yes, if you make 3x that, you're still middle class. And regardless of that, within the scale of middle class, an on-site Disney vacation is doable. Even yearly, if you're on the upper end of the scale.

 

[Dreaming of Disney World]

But "free" dining was also a ruse. You forwent any kind of promotion on the room, which could be substantial, and paid top dollar rack rate for the ability to promise Disney you'd eat a ton.

No, it was a great discount for groups of 3-4 people staying in a value room. We saved $1000 when we added free dining to our reservation (we had booked the dining plan that includes 1 table service meal, 1 quick service meal, and 2 snacks pp/per day). So as soon as that promotion was added to our booking our total was instantly reduced by $1000. If we had chosen the room discount promotion (staying at pop century) we would have saved a few hundred dollars. The dining plan allowed us to do character meals every day, which we all loved and wouldn't have been able to afford otherwise.

 

[RSoxNo1]

EMH only came about after 9/11 though remember. The problem (like free FP and dining) is guests have been conditioned to expect something. Take it away and the complaints naturally start.

Wasn't this all part of the mindset of trapping people on property:

• Magical Express
• Extra Magic Hours
• Magic Your Way Tickets where each additional day was only a few dollars

More and more, the current leadership has stripped away this approach.

 

[Lilofan]

EMH only came about after 9/11 though remember. The problem (like free FP and dining) is guests have been conditioned to expect something. Take it away and the complaints naturally start.

EMH was something else and a great perk for resort guests. In its heyday, during 12/25-12/31 on select nights , MK EMH was 1am-4am, followed by MK opening up at 7am.

 

[Bullseye1967]

EMH was something else and a great perk for resort guests. In its heyday, during 12/25-12/31 on select nights , MK EMH was 1am-4am, followed by MK opening up at 7am.

I did one of those nights and had a blast but slept 16 hours when we finally left the parks.

 

[Lilofan]

I did one of those nights and had a blast but slept 16 hours when we finally left the parks.

That's amazing. I once met someone at DHS when I was in the park at opening at 9am on NYE. He said he will stay until the end. DHS on NYE was closing at 3am that night and that was 20 years ago.

 

[GhostHost1000]

So about these fastpasses…

(trying to reset the discussion)