FastPass+ Most Certainly Not Coming Back As It Was

[themarchhare]

I’m actually going to Universal for the first time in my next trip and planning to stay in a premier hotel because of the Express Pass. Feels like an insane value compared to Disney, especially for ~$300/nightC though their hotels are a lot more appropriately priced than Disney.

Universal on-property is awesome! Highly suggest staying on property there, honestly. Staying at Dockside for ~$100/night.

 

[LittleBuford]

The rest is getting in line, or buying line-skips adhoc.

With designated return times.

Again, not what I would call spontaneous.

 

[ctrlaltdel]

Universal on-property is awesome! Highly suggest staying on property there, honestly. Staying at Dockside for ~$100/night.

Gonna try to stay at Royal Pacific since it will be our first trip and we are only doing 3 days. Going at an off-peak time and it will only be about $300/night for a Water View King Room. Feel like we will not get to anywhere close to that value at a Disney moderate but still want to go there as my wife is begging me and it’s been a long time since I’ve done WDW.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

??? If 50% of the guests were there every year, that would translate to almost 10% of Americans.

I have dozens of co-workers. None have been to WDW more than a couple of times. I have hundreds of friends and family — none go every year.

If 1/10 Americans went to WDW every year.. I would think that I would have met some of these people, at some point in my life.
And I do go with other people— 10 years ago, went with my brother and his family — that was their only trip.
7 years ago, went with 2 groups of friends. For 1 family, it was their only trip. The other family has done 2 trips. 4 years ago, went with 3 families, it was the only trip for all 3.

Now this is anecdotal of course. But the reality is that a high proportion of Americans visit WDW 1 or more times in their lives… it’s not the same 25 million people going every single year. (I recall Iger saying a few years ago, that about 10% of guests repeat within 5 years).

It sorta depends where here is, no?

Alaska/Hawaii or GA/SC/NC/VA? How often Americans visit WDW probably varies by where they live.

I'm sure it also matters how strictly we mean 'once a year.' Literally once a year? Roughly every 12-15 months? (each of you might be seeing this a little differently.)

 

[ppete1975]

And to think Disney is working hard to promote their “inclusiveness.”
My axx

It used to be working class could work a second job or really tighten the belt for a year or two and take the family to the magic kingdom (you know.. the people in the commercials). If you’re barely affording to get in, one souvenir each, but doing your best to give your kids that once in their childhood vacation in fantasy. Its a kick in the teeth and honestly insulting to say that multi thousand dollar trip is going to upcharge you 40 dollars per ride. And forget relaxation and enjoying it. You have to plan every thing out 3 months in advance, be on your phone the entire time to be able to eat or ride anything. If im a blue collar family that might not even have internet, disney world is becoming for the rich.

this is coming from a disney apologist. Im kind of sick at this point

 

[MrPromey]

Thank you getting my point.

I’ve been told that WDW represents some sort of step up from a traditional park (I don’t see it). WDW is just another amusement park with a lot of IP, overzealous IP lawyers, and a lot of people who go who have memories as a kid (not to those who want to pounce, I didn’t say all).

I should think that if Disney is such a cut above everyone else (very debatable) that part of it would be getting lost in the immersion of “the world”.

Disney used to be a major step up.

Two things have happened though:

Over the years, many others have stepped up to compete, both in central Florida as well as regionally, following Disney's original lead.

Disney has allowed others to catch up without reacting - somehow believing they were insulated from that and while pushing more and more business into their parks, did not bother to update or add capacity to handle it all over the years and the guest experience has suffered.

We still get flashes of brilliance like FOP but we've gotten nothing, way more often over the last decade while everyone else moved forward.

As a result, people are finding more and more that they can have a more enjoyable time other places. Some of it's that those places have gotten better and some if is the feeling that the they haven't oversold themselves and are a more relaxing experience at a better value.

That said, this hasn't seemed to have had a significant impact on Disney's finances so it's unclear if they see a problem with any of this or not.

 

[AEfx]

..and in some cases too complex for the guest.

Oh, I think we jumped that shark some time ago. I know it is so normalized around here that some folks have rationalized just how insane planning a WDW trip has become, but when you try explaining it to a "normie", their eyes start to glaze over and they can't believe that people go through all that to just get a meal or a ride in a theme park.

 

[CuteAsMinnie]

No..... the restaurant previously charged $110 for all you can eat salad and pasta..
Now, they want to add steak, lobster and caviar to the menu.
Now they charge $110 for the table -- They took away the all-you-can-eat pasta... but you can still get the salad included, and you now also have the option of adding on steak, lobster, pasta, etc...

DPA does give you something you didn't get before: Ability to get easily get same-day Front-of-line... no 60 days in advance at 6am, no constant refreshing with fingers crossed. It also now lets you get more than 1 Tier-1 "front of line" experience. Likely more than 3. And it lets you pick and choose which ones among those that you really want. You don't have to add BATB just because you need to have a 3rd FP before you can get a 4th. You're also getting, for the "included rate," the ability to spend part of your standby time without actually being in the line.

So, a little is getting taken a way but tons of stuff is being added. With some ala carte pricing as part of what's being added.

Although I appreciate your perspective, if you think a Little is being taken away and a ton of stuff is added you may want to reevaluate as Disney history is looked at.

 

[aladdin2007]

It used to be working class could work a second job or really tighten the belt for a year or two and take the family to the magic kingdom (you know.. the people in the commercials). If you’re barely affording to get in, one souvenir each, but doing your best to give your kids that once in their childhood vacation in fantasy. Its a kick in the teeth and honestly insulting to say that multi thousand dollar trip is going to upcharge you 40 dollars per ride. And forget relaxation and enjoying it. You have to plan every thing out 3 months in advance, be on your phone the entire time to be able to eat or ride anything. If im a blue collar family that might not even have internet, disney world is becoming for the rich "geeks".

this is coming from a disney apologist. Im kind of sick at this point

I completely agree and added to the last bolded line. And sounds like they are pushing the guests right out of the door, you either succumb and pay up to their big brother rules and requirements "almost like a tax" or your not welcome. Not allowed to enjoy a day in the park anymore. So when do the restroom fees and reservations start Disney?? Chapek can't wait, I know this is martins line and forgive me for using it but, idiots!

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

I'm seeing some people make the argument that it will be a good thing if this is expensive, because less people will be using it, thus less interference with the standby lines.

Well, no. At Universal, the Express pass costs more than a one day ticket, yet Universal's Express lines are often jammed which, like Fastpass, often grinds the standby lines to a halt.

Only if you buy it as a standalone. A significant chunk of folks using Express Pass get it as part of staying at Portofino (750 rooms) , RP (1,000rooms) , and HRH (650 rooms). If we guesstimate 3 people per room, and near full capacity, that would be roughly 7,200 Express Passes/day going to hotel guests. (if the rate is more like 4 people per room, that would be 9,600 Express passes per day, but some rooms sleep 5, some are king rooms, many don't have 4 people/room, and they don't get to 100% occupancy.

(Digging further, Universal's 3 top tier hotels allow rollways, so king rooms actually sleep up to 3 people, and 2-queen rooms sleep up to 5 people. )

 

[MrPromey]

Although I appreciate your perspective, if you think a Little is being taken away and a ton of stuff is added you may want to reevaluate as Disney history is looked at.

Your response is what I wanted to say but much nicer than how I started to say it so I'm glad I saw your reply.

 

[CuteAsMinnie]

Your response is what I wanted to say but much nicer than how I started to say it so I'm glad I saw your reply.

I rewrote that more times than I care to admit

 

[MrPromey]

Only if you buy it as a standalone. A significant chunk of folks using Express Pass get it as part of staying at Portofino (750 rooms) , RP (1,000rooms) , and HRH (650 rooms). If we guesstimate 3 people per room, and near full capacity, that would be roughly 7,200 Express Passes/day going to hotel guests. (if the rate is more like 4 people per room, that would be 9,600 Express passes per day, but some rooms sleep 5, some are king rooms, many don't have 4 people/room, and they don't get to 100% occupancy.

(Digging further, Universal's 3 top tier hotels allow rollways, so king rooms actually sleep up to 3 people, and 2-queen rooms sleep up to 5 people. )

... and while some people may go alone or as a couple, others make make full use of that room capacity specifically to take advanget of the Express Pass perk... which just makes it hard to figure out, I guess.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I thought so myself we stayed at Hard Rock, for a week. Nice Hotel not to a GF or Poly theming level, First 2 days at UO/IA were fun Volcano Bay we did an all day. Kids were bored, we were there for the 2nd week of Hagrids and yes I waited in line for 8 hours with wife and kids spelling me to hold our line placement. We kept being told like many others in line that you cant do that (leave line and have someone else stand in your place) and we just ignored the cast members like the rest of the people in line. Ride was good but not that good. Kids admitted afterward that we should have done Disney and come to UO/IA for a single day, as we had done several years ago. Food so-so at Hard Rock and in the park, best place we found was Three Broomsticks or Mythos. Went to eat the rest of the trip at nite to Disney Springs LOL.

…it’s not a weeklong place

Are the other parks you go to as expensive as WDW?

Few are…just universal. But you can “get around that” pretty easily

No..... the restaurant previously charged $110 for all you can eat salad and pasta..
Now, they want to add steak, lobster and caviar to the menu.
Now they charge $110 for the table -- They took away the all-you-can-eat pasta... but you can still get the salad included, and you now also have the option of adding on steak, lobster, pasta, etc...

DPA does give you something you didn't get before: Ability to get easily get same-day Front-of-line... no 60 days in advance at 6am, no constant refreshing with fingers crossed. It also now lets you get more than 1 Tier-1 "front of line" experience. Likely more than 3. And it lets you pick and choose which ones among those that you really want. You don't have to add BATB just because you need to have a 3rd FP before you can get a 4th. You're also getting, for the "included rate," the ability to spend part of your standby time without actually being in the line.

So, a little is getting taken a way but tons of stuff is being added. With some ala carte pricing as part of what's being added.

You have officially lost it. You’re the Disneycane or inconmundro of a non-covid thread.

Just keep paying, dude.

 

[themarchhare]

Once again begging people who think that this is just paid fastpass to read further on standby lines.

The heavy reactions are based off of the latter; not paid fastpass. Frankly, if they just brought MaxPass here and limited the amount sold per day, I don't think anyone would be mad at all. Hell, I'd be happy.

Because apparently this needs to be re-stated for some folks.

 

[GoofGoof]

I am on the "Too many Fastpasses cause longer waits for everyone" team, so I think if there are less Fastpasses, there would be lower standby wait times overall.

Whatever we end up with will provide maximum shareholder value, not an improved guest experience.

Just my opinion, I am not a Fastpass scientist.

Perhaps we need to gather all the FastPass scientific experts of the world so we can get the scientific consensus so the science can be settled on the FastPass VS Overall Wait time issue.

I’m no FP scientist but in general this system sounds like maxpass at DLR but with no paper fast pass option and an added paid front of the line feature that works per ride vs for all rides. The unique feature for WDW will be the standby pass which when crowded or on a popular ride eliminates the regular standby option. So here’s how I see it working

1. Premium access guests go through the FP line and it is offered to anyone willing to pay for it and gets you an assigned time right away vs waiting. As slots are sold the price goes up until nobody is willing to pay for it
2. If you don’t buy premium access you then have the option of getting into the standby line for the same attraction. This will work the same as today using the standby entrance and queue with a posted wait time.
3. Once the standby wait hits a targeted wait time they close the standby line and activate standby pass. Standby pass works like max pass at DLR giving you the option to reserve a return time which will be a window when you can return and ride the ride. Guests would return to the standby entrance and show their reservation before entering the queue. Your wait would be longer than traditional fast pass on return but capped by Disney by the number of standby passes available each time slot.

So steps 2 and 3 are free to all guests. Step 1 is a pay as you go offering. So assuming you chose not to pay your wait times per ride are still capped by Disney. This likely means people get shut out of popular attractions when standby pass is”sold out”. If a lot of people agree to pay for premium access that could mean less availability for standby. It shouldn’t change wait time for anyone not paying for premium access.

All of this my amateur opinion.

 

[Trauma]

No..... the restaurant previously charged $110 for all you can eat salad and pasta..
Now, they want to add steak, lobster and caviar to the menu.
Now they charge $110 for the table -- They took away the all-you-can-eat pasta... but you can still get the salad included, and you now also have the option of adding on steak, lobster, pasta, etc...

DPA does give you something you didn't get before: Ability to get easily get same-day Front-of-line... no 60 days in advance at 6am, no constant refreshing with fingers crossed. It also now lets you get more than 1 Tier-1 "front of line" experience. Likely more than 3. And it lets you pick and choose which ones among those that you really want. You don't have to add BATB just because you need to have a 3rd FP before you can get a 4th. You're also getting, for the "included rate," the ability to spend part of your standby time without actually being in the line.

So, a little is getting taken a way but tons of stuff is being added. With some ala carte pricing as part of what's being added.

Hey everyone we found Bob.

 

[themarchhare]

I’m no FP scientist but in general this system sounds like maxpass at DLR

The standby line doesn't get closed with maxpass.

 

[flynnibus]

With designated return times.

Again, not what I would call spontaneous.

By your logic - nothing without a wait is 'spontaneous'. Remember.. we're talking about planning your day out months in advance vs being told 'come back in 30mins' kind of scale. I think you need to step back and consider the scale of what you are trying to split hairs over.

 

[GhostHost1000]

So if you pay for a premier pass to the #1 attraction in the park and it goes down for the day then what? Are they going to replace all the dvc kiosks with guest relations?