Elemental (Pixar - June 2023)

[Tha Realest]

Transformers is dropping almost 70% on weekend two.

The Flash is keeping people away from theaters.

This is really convoluted and a creative way to cast blame somewhere else. Nice try though!

 

[MrPromey]

It still opened at like $170 million worldwide.

That it's dropping so hard so fast really tells you how much this month is gonna suck.

Yeah, everyone who was excited to see it ran out opening weekend.

Huge drops like this are pretty common with movies that suck.

I'm sure it'll make plenty of money in China where they've largely given up on trying to understand western-based movie plots and just go for the effects with movies like this, anyway.

 

[Ghost93]

Huge drops like this are pretty common with movies that suck.

Rise of the Beasts wasn't awful. The problem is that so many of the past Transformers movies were abysmal (Revenge of the Fallen, Age of Extinction and The Last Knight) that the brand has been severely damaged. I don't think Transformers could ever regain the popularity it once had.

 

[erasure fan1]

I saw it six times in the theater and twice on streaming. I think a lot of the stuff about the movies that Avatar fans like (scenes of the Na'vi just chilling by the ocean) are the same scenes that non-fans find to be "boring filler."

Oh I'm sure I will like it. I don't even think it will be boring. But the way things go, I usually can't start a movie until 10:30p or so. And with Avatar being as long as it is, I just keep putting it off.

Rise of the Beasts wasn't awful. The problem is that so many of the past Transformers movies were abysmal (Revenge of the Fallen, Age of Extinction and The Last Knight) that the brand has been severely damaged. I don't think Transformers could ever regain the popularity it once had.

That is a very good possibility. You've had 2 solid transformers movies, the first and bumblebee. The other 3 were less than stellar from a audience reception standpoint. I believe Disney is suffering from a similar thing. decent movies can get looked over if what came before is less than great.

 

[Jedijax719]

Yeah, once people see that a movie flops opening weekend, it negatively taints their view of the movie even if it has decent reviews. I think there is often a "fear of missing out" element with movies. If a film is making a lot of money people may check a movie out just to be part of the conversation. But if they see that a movie isn't doing well, there is no "fear of missing out" element to drive them to the cinemas, as they don't think any of their friends/family/coworkers will be talking about the film.

That's exactly what happens with movies. And it is especially true now.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I'm going out on a limb to say that positive word-of-mouth means nothing if the main headliner of the weekend is such a pile of dog crap that it drags the whole slate down with it.

Which seems to be what happened here.

Especially when people know it won't be that long before it is on D+

"Oh, the movies good? Cool, will definitely watch in like a month when I'm D+ then"

 

[Ghost93]

Especially when people know it won't be that long before it is on D+

"Oh, the movies good? Cool, will definitely watch in like a month when I'm D+ then"

I remember seeing a lot of LGBT people on Twitter, when they saw Strange World flop opening weekend, complain that they didn't see the movie because Disney hadn't marketed enough. But once they became aware of the movie after it flopped opening weekend they didn't say "oh, I better support it in theaters!" Instead most said "this is great representation! I can't wait to check it out on Disney Plus!"

I don't know what it would take for the "wait for Disney Plus" mindset to go away for a non-franchise movie. All of the Disney movies that have been profitable the past year have had pre-existing fanbases, like Avatar and Marvel.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I remember seeing a lot of LGBT people on Twitter, when they saw Strange World flop opening weekend, complain that they didn't see the movie because Disney hadn't marketed enough. But once they became aware of the movie after it flopped opening weekend they didn't say "oh, I better support it in theaters!" Instead most said "this is great representation! I can't wait to check it out on Disney Plus!"

I don't know what it would take for the "wait for Disney Plus" mindset to go away for a non-franchise movie. All of the Disney movies that have been profitable the past year have had pre-existing fanbases, like Avatar and Marvel.

Yeah, not sure how exactly to really push "you need to see this in the theater!"?

Maybe special merch only in the theater (popcorn buckets etc)? Maybe offer a discount on tickets for D+ subscribers if you go see it in theaters?

 

[Ghost93]

Yeah, not sure how exactly to really push "you need to see this in the theater!"?

Maybe special merch only in the theater (popcorn buckets etc)? Maybe offer a discount on tickets for D+ subscribers if you go see it in theaters?

I think one of the reasons Avatar: The Way of Water and Top Gun: Maverick did so well last year is that they emphasized the need to see it on a gigantic Imax/Dolby screen to get the full experience. Both of those movies had a "you need to see it on the big screen" quality that many movies today don't have.

 

[MrPromey]

Yeah, not sure how exactly to really push "you need to see this in the theater!"?

Maybe special merch only in the theater (popcorn buckets etc)? Maybe offer a discount on tickets for D+ subscribers if you go see it in theaters?

They already do the special popcorn bucket and drink topper things.

Problem is, these are real popcorn buckets for actually functionally holding popcorn to consumed at a movie. You only need so many of those in your life and the things Disney sells in the parks as popcorn buckets these days which people collect are pretty obvious failures at being practical functional items so it's hard to imagine people wasting money on them in the theaters.

We ended up getting a Black Widow bucket on one trip a few months after it was gone from the theater because they were just using them as large popcorn buckets at that point to get rid of them without even being asked.

 

[Ghost93]

I blame Bob Chapek for making Elemental flop at the box office. I hope he gets punished! No good deed goes unpunished!

I'd say being fired is punishment. Unfortunately, so much damage was done to the Disney brand during his tenure that I don't see it going away anytime soon.

 

[MrPromey]

I'd say being fired is punishment. Unfortunately, so much damage was done to the Disney brand during his tenure that I don't see it going away anytime soon.

He got a check for $20 million with that pink slip.

I'd like to know what I could do to get fired like that!

A lot of companies these days don't even give severance for layoffs much less bonuses for being terminated due to job performance.

Then again, maybe part of that check was Iger's apology for promoting him into a position he was clearly not qualified for - something Bob the 1st, should have already known after working with him for all those years.

Of course, he's all that was around when Iger hopped in the escape pod so what's $20 million between Fortune 100 execs?

 

[TsWade2]

He got a check for $20 million with that pink slip.

I'd like to know what I could do to get fired like that!

A lot of companies these days don't even give severance for layoffs much less bonuses for being terminated due to job performance.

Then again, maybe part of that check was Iger's apology for promoting him into a position he was clearly not qualified for - something Bob the 1st, should have already known after working with him for all those years.

Of course, he's all that was around when Iger hopped in the escape pod so what's $20 million between Fortune 100 execs?

Unhappy!

Note: I’m not saying it’s the end of Disney.

 

[TP2000]

My comment from a few days ago is handy here now that the box office numbers for the weekend are in...

Lightyear flopped, Strange World was a historic mega bomb, and now Elemental looks like it's going to slot somewhere between those two options. At best, a Lightyear style average flop.

And yet both of those animation studios spend $150 to $200 Million on each film to get there? Not sustainable.

It looks like Elemental is going to slot in right under Lightyear. But Elemental had the same $200 Million production budget as Lightyear, so that's not good at all. Tragic, really. Especially for the Sharp Pencil Boys and the women who love them.

 

[TP2000]

The national and industry media is now weighing in late this afternoon on Elemental's financial status.

‘Elemental’ Posts Pixar’s Worst Box Office Premiere In Decades As ‘The Flash’ Underperforms

Pixar’s ‘Elemental’ earned just $29.5 million this weekend, and DC’s ‘The Flash’ brought in $55.1 million, though it fell short of expectations.

www.forbes.com

Pixar film 'Elemental' opens as studio's second-lowest box office debut

Pixar's animated movie "Elemental" took in roughly $30 million at U.S. and Canadian box offices over the weekend, the second-lowest debut in the history of the acclaimed studio behind the "Toy Story" franchise, "Finding Nemo" and other classics.

www.reuters.com

This headline from the New York Times, "Pixar's Elemental Falls Flat, Adding to Worries About the Brand" mirrors my overall concern about the Pixar brand/studio and its future.

Pixar’s ‘Elemental’ Falls Flat, Adding to Worries About the Brand

The original animated film took in $29.5 million at the box office, by far the worst opening in Pixar’s three-decade history. “The Flash,” from Warner Bros., also struggled.

www.nytimes.com

 

[TalkingHead]

Variety: ‘The Flash’ Disappoints With $55 Million Debut, Pixar’s ‘Elemental’ Flops With $29.5 Million in Battle of Box Office Lightweights

Hollywood Reporter: Box Office: Ezra Miller’s ‘The Flash,’ Pixar’s ‘Elemental’ Get Iced in Openings

Lotta misery drinks being poured in Burbank this weekend.

 

[TP2000]

Variety: ‘The Flash’ Disappoints With $55 Million Debut, Pixar’s ‘Elemental’ Flops With $29.5 Million in Battle of Box Office Lightweights

Hollywood Reporter: Box Office: Ezra Miller’s ‘The Flash,’ Pixar’s ‘Elemental’ Get Iced in Openings

Lotta misery drinks being poured in Burbank this weekend.

Elemental opened with only 60% of the domestic box office that Lightyear debut-flopped with exactly one year ago.

I doubt the Burbank execs even went out to Mimosa brunch in Silver Lake today to show their faces in public. Probably just stayed home and poured some bourbon in their oatmeal, and are still wearing their pajamas this afternoon.

I have no idea where they go to brunch up in the Bay Area around Emeryville. That town is overrun by homeless folks now, and adjacent Oakland is much worse, apocalyptically so, so the Pixar set must have a brunch place up in the hills now instead. But likely no Mimosas were poured there this morning either.

 

[MisterPenguin]

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/18/...3GBFA-kEKSiFR7jfInNghSnx-nMJDw&smid=url-share

Pixar’s ‘Elemental’ Falls Flat, Adding to Worries About the Brand​

The original animated film took in $29.5 million at the box office, by far the worst opening in Pixar’s three-decade history. “The Flash,” from Warner Bros., also struggled.​

​

By Brooks Barnes​

June 18, 2023Updated 3:23 p.m. ET​

​

Pixar is damaged as a big-screen brand.​

​

That was one of the rather glum takeaways from the weekend box office, which found “Elemental,” a $200 million-plus Pixar original, arriving to a disastrous $29.5 million in domestic ticket sales. “The Flash,” a Warner Bros. superhero spectacle that cost about $200 million, also struggled, taking in a lethargic $55.1 million, according to Comscore, which compiles ticketing data.​

​

“Hard to sugarcoat this,” said David A. Gross, a film consultant who publishes a newsletter on box office numbers.​

​

Questions about Pixar’s health have swirled in Hollywood and among investors since last June, when the Disney-owned studio released “Lightyear” to disastrous results. How could Pixar, the gold standard of animation studios for nearly three decades, have gotten a movie so wrong — especially one about Buzz Lightyear, a bedrock “Toy Story” character?​

​

Maybe pandemic-worried families were not quite ready to return to theaters. Or maybe, as some box office analysts speculated, Disney had weakened the Pixar brand by using its films to build the Disney+ streaming service. Starting in late 2020, Disney debuted three Pixar films in a row (“Soul,” “Turning Red” and “Luca”) online, bypassing theaters altogether.​

​

By streaming standards, those three movies were runaway hits. But Pixar’s most recent box office success was in 2019, when “Toy Story 4” took in $1.1 billion worldwide.​

​

Attendance for “Elemental” over the weekend reinforced the brand problem hypothesis: It was Pixar’s worst opening-weekend result ever in the United States and Canada. The previous bottom was “Onward,” which arrived to $39 million ($46 million after adjusting for inflation) in domestic ticket sales in March 2020, just as the coronavirus pandemic started to sweep the globe.​

“Elemental,” a cross-cultural girl-meets-boy romantic comedy, took in an additional $15 million in limited release overseas, Disney said.​

​

To re-establish Pixar movies as more than just Disney+ food, the company held a premiere for “Elemental” at the Cannes Film Festival as well as in Los Angeles at the Academy Museum of Motion Pictures. “We’ve trained audiences that these films will be available for you on Disney+,” Pete Docter, Pixar’s chief creative officer, said on Friday in an interview with Variety, a trade news outlet. “We’re trying to make sure people realize there’s a great deal you’re missing by not seeing it on the big screen.”​

​

Films based on original stories are becoming harder sells, especially at a time when going to the movies has become more expensive and the broader economy is unsettled. People want to know that spending the money will be worth it. The animated movies that have been succeeding have been based on established characters and franchises.​

​

“If you don’t swing for original stories you can’t make new franchises, and we swung really hard,” said Tony Chambers, Disney’s executive vice president of theatrical distribution. Referring to intellectual property, he added, “Original I.P. needs to work a lot harder to break through nowadays.”​

​

Families turned out in colossal numbers for “The Super Mario Bros. Movie” (Universal) in April and “Spider-Man: Across the Spider-Verse” (Sony) early this month. Family moviegoing budgets may be used up at this point, and movie watchers know they will be able to catch “Elemental” before long at home.​

​

Some people in Hollywood and on Wall Street also worry that Pixar’s once-dazzling creative spark has started to flicker. The studio has suffered brain drain; it eliminated 75 jobs last month as part of Disney-wide layoffs and cost cuts. (The “Lightyear” director Angus MacLane, a 26-year Pixar veteran, was among those who received a pink slip.) Pixar has also been pushed to expand into television production to keep the Disney+ shelves stocked. “The higher the volume, the lower the quality,” said Terry Press, a former Disney, DreamWorks and CBS Films executive.​

​

Reviews for “Elemental” were mostly positive, although to a lesser degree than normal for a Pixar release. Ticket buyers gave it an A grade in CinemaScore exit polls. The “audience score” on Rotten Tomatoes stood at a sky-high 91 percent on Sunday morning.​

​

In a statement, Disney said that the positive reviews “set us up for a strong theatrical run through the school holiday period.” The next major animated film for families is “Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles: Mutant Mayhem” (Paramount), which does not arrive in theaters until Aug. 2.​

​

“The Flash” (Warner Bros.) received weaker reviews and a chillier audience response — ticket buyers gave it a B in CinemaScore exit polls — but filled enough seats to rank as the No. 1 movie in the United States and Canada. The movie finds the titular superhero using his powers to travel back in time, accidentally causing mayhem. Batman and Supergirl also figure prominently.​

​

In part, “The Flash” suffered from timing: It was delayed by the pandemic, finally arriving at a moment when late night shows — crucial movie marketing platforms — are shut down because of a strike by show writers. Warner Bros. and its DC Studios division have also cited superhero fatigue as an explanation for the recent underperformance of a string of their comics-based movies, including “Shazam! Fury of the Gods” and “Black Adam.”​

​

Ezra Miller, who played the Flash, became a divisive figure after a spate of offscreen legal troubles and erratic behavior in 2021 and 2022. (The actor, who is nonbinary, issued an apology last year and said they were seeking mental health treatment. They largely did not do publicity for “The Flash.”)​

​

“The superhero world is fantasy, escapist fun,” Mr. Gross said. “Everybody has to play along. This didn’t help.”​

 

[BlakeW39]

Unfortunately, so much damage was done to the Disney brand during his tenure that I don't see it going away anytime soon.

not Chapek. Iger. Don't believe the hype. Chapek was bad yes no doubt but most of the current problems in Disney right now were IPger, not $lappie

 

[Disstevefan1]

Like the first one, that was a movie made to be watched in 3D in a theater.

It's never going to be that great without the experiential elements.

You can call it a failure of story if you want but it was just made to be an experience, kind of like how nobody would really want to sit around and watch a flight of passage ride-through on a TV in their living room but crowds continue to love it in the park.

I'd just bow out of the whole franchise if you aren't interested in trying to see it in a theater because it's going to disappoint on story, alone.

The first one all but disappeared after it's initial theatrical run for this very reason only to come back and do great on re-release in the lead-up to the new one.

Not trying to portray it as a failure, I watched the first one at home way back in 2009, watching ironically, a bootleg DVD it was fine.

I will agree, it is totally different at home VS. in the theater, in the theater you have committed your self having traveled there and paid for the seat and there is no pause, stop or rewind. I think that’s the difference for me.

On the other hand,there are series on series on streaming I will binge watch for hours, so if the content grabs me, I will sit there for hours an watch too.