Elemental (Pixar - June 2023)

[Ghost93]

You got farther than me. I can't seem to even start it. Every time I think, I'm going to try and watch it, I then say, maybe another time as it won't be over until 1:30am. I know if I start it, it will take 3 attempts at least because I'll keep falling asleep. Lol

I saw it six times in the theater and twice on streaming. I think a lot of the stuff about the movies that Avatar fans like (scenes of the Na'vi just chilling by the ocean) are the same scenes that non-fans find to be "boring filler."

 

[MrPromey]

Transformers is dropping almost 70% on weekend two.

The Flash is keeping people away from theaters.

Does that Transformers drop really surprise you?

It had a 53% on Rotten Tomatoes.

That series, for anyone looking for more than special effects, has been pretty much crap starting with the first one.

It doesn't seem shocking to me at all that it didn't have legs.

 

[MrPromey]

Side note - I am on my third try to watch Avatar 2 on streaming, I just keep Turing it off, but I am trying.

Like the first one, that was a movie made to be watched in 3D in a theater.

It's never going to be that great without the experiential elements.

You can call it a failure of story if you want but it was just made to be an experience, kind of like how nobody would really want to sit around and watch a flight of passage ride-through on a TV in their living room but crowds continue to love it in the park.

I'd just bow out of the whole franchise if you aren't interested in trying to see it in a theater because it's going to disappoint on story, alone.

The first one all but disappeared after it's initial theatrical run for this very reason only to come back and do great on re-release in the lead-up to the new one.

 

[Slpy3270]

Does that Transformers drop really surprise you?

It had a 53% on Rotten Tomatoes.

That series, for anyone looking for more than special effects, has been pretty much crap since the first one.

It doesn't seem shocking to me at all that it didn't have legs.

It still opened at like $170 million worldwide.

That it's dropping so hard so fast really tells you how much this month is gonna suck.

 

[Ghost93]

I'd just bow out of the whole franchise if you aren't interested in trying to see it in a theater because it's going to disappoint on story, alone.

The first one all but disappeared after it's initial theatrical run for this very reason only to come back and do great on re-release in the lead-up to the new one.

I genuinely thought Avatar: The Way of Water had a good story. Sure it was simple and relied on archetypes, but I still think it was executed well.

But I agree the main draw of the Avatar franchise is the feeling of being immersed in another world, and that immersive element isn't nearly as present at home compared to the cinema.

 

[Ghost93]

It still opened at like $170 million worldwide.

That it's dropping so hard so fast really tells you how much this month is gonna suck.

Transformers should have moved to August or April. It's not the billion dollar franchise it once was.

 

[Tha Realest]

Transformers is dropping almost 70% on weekend two.

The Flash is keeping people away from theaters.

This is really convoluted and a creative way to cast blame somewhere else. Nice try though!

 

[MrPromey]

It still opened at like $170 million worldwide.

That it's dropping so hard so fast really tells you how much this month is gonna suck.

Yeah, everyone who was excited to see it ran out opening weekend.

Huge drops like this are pretty common with movies that suck.

I'm sure it'll make plenty of money in China where they've largely given up on trying to understand western-based movie plots and just go for the effects with movies like this, anyway.

 

[Ghost93]

Huge drops like this are pretty common with movies that suck.

Rise of the Beasts wasn't awful. The problem is that so many of the past Transformers movies were abysmal (Revenge of the Fallen, Age of Extinction and The Last Knight) that the brand has been severely damaged. I don't think Transformers could ever regain the popularity it once had.

 

[erasure fan1]

I saw it six times in the theater and twice on streaming. I think a lot of the stuff about the movies that Avatar fans like (scenes of the Na'vi just chilling by the ocean) are the same scenes that non-fans find to be "boring filler."

Oh I'm sure I will like it. I don't even think it will be boring. But the way things go, I usually can't start a movie until 10:30p or so. And with Avatar being as long as it is, I just keep putting it off.

Rise of the Beasts wasn't awful. The problem is that so many of the past Transformers movies were abysmal (Revenge of the Fallen, Age of Extinction and The Last Knight) that the brand has been severely damaged. I don't think Transformers could ever regain the popularity it once had.

That is a very good possibility. You've had 2 solid transformers movies, the first and bumblebee. The other 3 were less than stellar from a audience reception standpoint. I believe Disney is suffering from a similar thing. decent movies can get looked over if what came before is less than great.

 

[Jedijax719]

Yeah, once people see that a movie flops opening weekend, it negatively taints their view of the movie even if it has decent reviews. I think there is often a "fear of missing out" element with movies. If a film is making a lot of money people may check a movie out just to be part of the conversation. But if they see that a movie isn't doing well, there is no "fear of missing out" element to drive them to the cinemas, as they don't think any of their friends/family/coworkers will be talking about the film.

That's exactly what happens with movies. And it is especially true now.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I'm going out on a limb to say that positive word-of-mouth means nothing if the main headliner of the weekend is such a pile of dog crap that it drags the whole slate down with it.

Which seems to be what happened here.

Especially when people know it won't be that long before it is on D+

"Oh, the movies good? Cool, will definitely watch in like a month when I'm D+ then"

 

[Ghost93]

Especially when people know it won't be that long before it is on D+

"Oh, the movies good? Cool, will definitely watch in like a month when I'm D+ then"

I remember seeing a lot of LGBT people on Twitter, when they saw Strange World flop opening weekend, complain that they didn't see the movie because Disney hadn't marketed enough. But once they became aware of the movie after it flopped opening weekend they didn't say "oh, I better support it in theaters!" Instead most said "this is great representation! I can't wait to check it out on Disney Plus!"

I don't know what it would take for the "wait for Disney Plus" mindset to go away for a non-franchise movie. All of the Disney movies that have been profitable the past year have had pre-existing fanbases, like Avatar and Marvel.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I remember seeing a lot of LGBT people on Twitter, when they saw Strange World flop opening weekend, complain that they didn't see the movie because Disney hadn't marketed enough. But once they became aware of the movie after it flopped opening weekend they didn't say "oh, I better support it in theaters!" Instead most said "this is great representation! I can't wait to check it out on Disney Plus!"

I don't know what it would take for the "wait for Disney Plus" mindset to go away for a non-franchise movie. All of the Disney movies that have been profitable the past year have had pre-existing fanbases, like Avatar and Marvel.

Yeah, not sure how exactly to really push "you need to see this in the theater!"?

Maybe special merch only in the theater (popcorn buckets etc)? Maybe offer a discount on tickets for D+ subscribers if you go see it in theaters?

 

[Ghost93]

Yeah, not sure how exactly to really push "you need to see this in the theater!"?

Maybe special merch only in the theater (popcorn buckets etc)? Maybe offer a discount on tickets for D+ subscribers if you go see it in theaters?

I think one of the reasons Avatar: The Way of Water and Top Gun: Maverick did so well last year is that they emphasized the need to see it on a gigantic Imax/Dolby screen to get the full experience. Both of those movies had a "you need to see it on the big screen" quality that many movies today don't have.

 

[MrPromey]

Yeah, not sure how exactly to really push "you need to see this in the theater!"?

Maybe special merch only in the theater (popcorn buckets etc)? Maybe offer a discount on tickets for D+ subscribers if you go see it in theaters?

They already do the special popcorn bucket and drink topper things.

Problem is, these are real popcorn buckets for actually functionally holding popcorn to consumed at a movie. You only need so many of those in your life and the things Disney sells in the parks as popcorn buckets these days which people collect are pretty obvious failures at being practical functional items so it's hard to imagine people wasting money on them in the theaters.

We ended up getting a Black Widow bucket on one trip a few months after it was gone from the theater because they were just using them as large popcorn buckets at that point to get rid of them without even being asked.

 

[Ghost93]

I blame Bob Chapek for making Elemental flop at the box office. I hope he gets punished! No good deed goes unpunished!

I'd say being fired is punishment. Unfortunately, so much damage was done to the Disney brand during his tenure that I don't see it going away anytime soon.

 

[MrPromey]

I'd say being fired is punishment. Unfortunately, so much damage was done to the Disney brand during his tenure that I don't see it going away anytime soon.

He got a check for $20 million with that pink slip.

I'd like to know what I could do to get fired like that!

A lot of companies these days don't even give severance for layoffs much less bonuses for being terminated due to job performance.

Then again, maybe part of that check was Iger's apology for promoting him into a position he was clearly not qualified for - something Bob the 1st, should have already known after working with him for all those years.

Of course, he's all that was around when Iger hopped in the escape pod so what's $20 million between Fortune 100 execs?

 

[TsWade2]

He got a check for $20 million with that pink slip.

I'd like to know what I could do to get fired like that!

A lot of companies these days don't even give severance for layoffs much less bonuses for being terminated due to job performance.

Then again, maybe part of that check was Iger's apology for promoting him into a position he was clearly not qualified for - something Bob the 1st, should have already known after working with him for all those years.

Of course, he's all that was around when Iger hopped in the escape pod so what's $20 million between Fortune 100 execs?

Unhappy!

Note: I’m not saying it’s the end of Disney.

 

[TP2000]

My comment from a few days ago is handy here now that the box office numbers for the weekend are in...

Lightyear flopped, Strange World was a historic mega bomb, and now Elemental looks like it's going to slot somewhere between those two options. At best, a Lightyear style average flop.

And yet both of those animation studios spend $150 to $200 Million on each film to get there? Not sustainable.

It looks like Elemental is going to slot in right under Lightyear. But Elemental had the same $200 Million production budget as Lightyear, so that's not good at all. Tragic, really. Especially for the Sharp Pencil Boys and the women who love them.