Goofnut1980
Well-Known Member
I know it will never come back, but Spectro was a better show. The music was WAY more tollerable over this MSEP. lol
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Electrical Light Parade Replacement?
- Thread starter NoChesterHester
- Start date
CaptainAmerica
Premium Member
I love these conspiracy theories. Can someone explain to me why any company out to make money from its guests would falsify guest surveys in order to deliberately give guests something those guests don't want? I'm guessing if the surveys say "guests love MSEP," then maybe, I don't know, guests actually DO love MSEP.
Example: F&B surveys indicated there was a lack of QS dining variety and also that most guests don't care about eating healthy at WDW. Introducing the macaroni and cheese hot dog!
Another Example: Lodging surveys indicated a lack of affordable options for parties larger than four or five. Introducing the Art of Animation family suites!
Biggest Example: Guests indicated that there were "friction points" in the planning process of a WDW vacation. Introducing the Next Generation Experience!*
*This is not an argument about the execution of the NGE concept. It's merely proof that Disney WILL spend significantly in response to guest feedback.
ToInfinityAndBeyond
Well-Known Member
On this ma-gic niiii~gght,
A mil-lion stars will play be-side us!
Cast a spell of lii~ight!
Glimmering! Shimmering! Caaa-rousell-ing!
ToTBellHop
Well-Known Member
Only here can an adult type those words with a straight face (and the appropriate melody goes through my head).
CDavid
Well-Known Member
Source please.
Perhaps because the decisions are being made by a management team which fundamentally doesn't understand the very theme park business they are tasked with managing and are hopelessly out of touch with the needs, preferences, and tastes of the majority of their guests.
There is also too frequently a problem with the survey instrument itself (a common problem with surveys, hardly unique to Disney). Among many issues, you have to be very careful to avoid both 'leading' questions (which tend to produce the answer you were looking for rather than an honest, forthcoming response) and surveys which emphasize only areas of strength and customer satisfaction while failing to uncover problems or legitimate concerns. Nor can you make sweeping generalizations from very specific survey items.
RadiatorSpringsRacer
Well-Known Member
I don't hate the MSEP, but I would also really love to see a brand-new night parade
Zippitybop! Zippitydoo! Bippitybop! Bobbidiboo! ZAP!
Zippitybop! Zippitydoo! Bippitybop! Bobbidiboo! ZAP!
CaptainAmerica
Premium Member
Not having a source that I can link to doesn't make the information incorrect. Disney views guests in three categories (my terminology is off, but the framework is legit).
1. Disneyphiles - Guests who come all the time, frequent message boards, love all things Disney. Management doesn't focus on this group because they already "have them." Marketing dollars are wasted because these people are coming either way. Brand affinity drives repeat visitation.
2. Occasional visitors - Guests who come every few years. Marketing focuses on closing the gaps between trips (say shortening from every five years to every three years) and ultimately converting into "Disneyphiles," at which point marketing stops becoming important as brand affinity serves as an "autopilot" marketing device.
3. Once-in-a-lifetime - Self explanatory. Marketing to this group is aimed at convincing them to make that one and only trip in the first place. Less profitable than #2 because they're one-and-done revenue.
You don't falsify surveys due to incompetence. Something like that needs to be done on purpose.
JediMasterMatt
Well-Known Member
MSEP parade's celebration of America's Bicentennial is very appropriate for a park and resort that clearly has its head stuck in the sand and not looking towards the future.
TDO - keep rocking it like it's 1776 or 1976 4 eva
They let Spectro rot to pick the MESP back up for a summer special promotion... they deserve to stay together forever. Each time I see a MSEP parade unit miss a roll-out due to mechanical failure or see a unit break down mid show, a little tear forms in my eye and I think to myself, "only WDW's management can be so short sighted that they let a parade with less wear and tear rot to keep showing this." Makes me smile.
TDO - keep rocking it like it's 1776 or 1976 4 eva
They let Spectro rot to pick the MESP back up for a summer special promotion... they deserve to stay together forever. Each time I see a MSEP parade unit miss a roll-out due to mechanical failure or see a unit break down mid show, a little tear forms in my eye and I think to myself, "only WDW's management can be so short sighted that they let a parade with less wear and tear rot to keep showing this." Makes me smile.
CaptainAmerica
Premium Member
The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands by it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price upon its goods; and it would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as FREEDOM should not be highly rated.
You know, upon reading that... it sounds like the way some of the people on here talk about WDW.
ToInfinityAndBeyond
Well-Known Member
I-I just wanted to talk about their funny dance.
(But I think you're on to something there...)
GiveMeTheMusic
Well-Known Member
To be sure there are countless guests who love MSEP. Those same guests would love a dazzling, incredible and technologically relevant parade even more. There is NO excuse for showing a 40+ year old parade. None. It doesn't matter if people love it, parades don't get to last that long and for good reason. They become outdated (like MSEP!) and they break down a lot (like MSEP!). Plus, replacing them is a relatively small expense compared to an attraction. They are meant to be replaced and refreshed often.
For what is supposedly the most attended theme park in the world at inane ticket prices, guests should be treated to a parade worthy of 2015. MSEP is not that parade.
Surveys aren't required to figure out that WDW guests would gladly buy mac-n-cheese hot dogs. Spend 10 minutes looking around and you'll see the market is there. As for AOA, "family suites" pushing $300/night is not affordable. That's how much a five star hotel costs in a real city.
There is no conspiracy theory. I've been in meetings and seen it first hand. Disney uses surveys to justify whatever they want to do. If they don't want to spend money on a new light parade, then they just have to produce a survey showing how much guests love MSEP. This isn't hard to do - their surveys are very particularly worded to engender specific responses. Conversely if they want to get rid of something, they'll come up with the same surveys. Luigi's Flying Tires didn't become the lowest rated attraction at DLR because managers liked it so much. They wanted it gone and guest surveying played a part in its demise (there were several other factors).
You have to understand that corporate Disney is a toxic environment where people hold onto jobs like liferafts and will shove the next head underwater to stay afloat. Not to mention getting bonuses for cutting spending. There are very few who have any real understanding of how theme parks operate, let alone a passion for them, and those people are usually not in positions of authority.
Nothing demonstrates that better than NGE. Guests hate waiting in lines, so Disney creates a multi-billion dollar system so complicated none of them can figure it out. But hey, they get FastPasses to Captain EO and the Jungle Cruise and high capacity attractions that used to have fast moving queues...don't.
Anyone with more than three brain cells can figure out that adding capacity reduces lines by soaking up crowds. And yet, they came up with the most roundabout way to "solve the problem" and avoid adding new capacity. Cutting the Country Bear Jamboree down by seconds to get in more cycles per day? The mind truly reels.
MSEP is a symptom of the culture. No one wants to pony up the dough for as much as a Paint the Night clone, so MSEP is "beloved by our guests" and "extended indefinitely due to popular demand" because it's cheap and easy. That is not the Disney way (or at least it didn't used to be). The Disney way used to be overdelivering. Wowing people where they didn't expect it so that they'd become fans for life and return again and again.
CaptainAmerica
Premium Member
This is the lynch pin of your argument and it doesn't make ANY sense. Disney doesn't need to "justify" anything that DISNEY does. If Disney doesn't want to do XYZ, they just won't do XYZ. They don't need a survey to justify it because they're one ones making the decision. Who are they "justifying" it to? Themselves?
You're talking out of both sides of your month. They won't replace a parade because they're "cheap" but like it or not, they spent the money on NextGen. I get that it's not how YOU would spend the money but that's irrelevant. They spent it. $1B and beyond. Cruise ships. $1B each. DCA refurb and on and on. They ARE spending, just not on what you want them to.
GiveMeTheMusic
Well-Known Member
Do you think Disney is just a group of four or five people who make all the decisions? There are thousands of employees, and hundreds of managers and executives. Everything that gets done has to be approved on multiple levels. How do you get your proposal approved? One of the tools in your arsenal should be guest surveys that go along with what you're wanting to do. How do you get those surveys? You have them conducted. Then you can show the data to the next exec up the chain and say, "SEE?!?! THIS IS WHY WE SHOULD DO XYZ! IT'S WHAT OUR GUESTS WANT!!!"
ToInfinityAndBeyond
Well-Known Member
It sounds like that is what he is inferring: i.e. in order to justify a change to the bean counters, someone presents a report that "helps" their argument. It may not be far from the truth, but it is a foil hat shy of a conspiracy theory.
CaptainAmerica
Premium Member
You're still not explaining the genesis of the idea. Why would Director of Magic Kingdom Entertainment Steve put forth a proposal NOT to replace the electrical parade out of nowhere such that he'd go out and fudge surveys to make it look like guests love it when they really don't? You don't see how tinfoil this is?
CaptainAmerica
Premium Member
This only works if the bean counters are absolute idiots. If it's so painfully obvious to anyone with "three brain cells" as @GiveMeTheMusic seems to think, I have to believe that someone in the Parks and Resorts hierarchy would be able to sniff those things out. They're not all morons, believe it or not. There are probably some talented folks in there. I understand organizational inertia and all that but this would have to be deliberate and systematic.
cheezbat
Well-Known Member
Having just visited the Magic Kingdom and saw this parade again, I seriously see why so many people want it gone.
My gosh is the soundtrack annoying and dated! 70's style synth sounds! I forgot how bad it was.
And the floats...my gosh are they so old! Whoever thought keeping this was a good idea should be fired. Spectro was better for sure, but in my opinion both were dated.
WDW should be doing a new night parade every ten years. Is that so much to ask?
My gosh is the soundtrack annoying and dated! 70's style synth sounds! I forgot how bad it was.
And the floats...my gosh are they so old! Whoever thought keeping this was a good idea should be fired. Spectro was better for sure, but in my opinion both were dated.
WDW should be doing a new night parade every ten years. Is that so much to ask?
Blairnicol
Well-Known Member
I'm thinking they are working on the new parade for DL not WDW
lobelia
Well-Known Member
It would be very interesting to be a fly on the wall in the departmental meetings that create these surveys. I have seen extremely well educated individuals still put out a biased survey question(s). Those truly acquainted with research methods and creating surveys (and care about research integrity) must be pulling out their hair. Is it deliberate? Possibly all statistics can be made to give you the response you want. However, I think sometimes we can become tunnel visioned.
Communicore
Well-Known Member
What I don't like is that it is a remixed version, I don't mind the original sound, but the remix is terrible. And the logo that says Disney's Electrical Parade, the Tinkerbell, those annoy me too.