Eddie Sotto's take on the current state of the parks

[Eddie Sotto]

Eddie, can you comment at all on Gary Sinise? He was the perfect choice for that role and now whenever I hear or see him I think M:S. It's obvious that he's reading cue cards, so I always wonder if he came in for half a day and cranked out a few shots, did the voices and left.

Were there other actors considered?

I quit the company in late 1999. So the project was still in development and those elements had not gone into production. Alot changed after I left. Usually, due to the cost of talent they come in and out pretty quickly. Tom Fitzgerald approves all story and produced/directed all media for all the attractions, so his division was called "Theme Park Productions" (no longer exists) did that type of thing for each project. Tom edited the storys and scripts personally at that time. Every script! He was always swamped. I liked working with him as he was very nice and always wanted to push things to make them better. You pretty much just design it at that point in collaboration with them.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

I didn't even notice this was the case until you said something. Nice touch! :wave:

It's true, an early idea. When I used to pitch the ride in a cardboard mockup (with the rented control panels from Apollo 13 movie), it was fun pretending to "fight the forces" to reach up and barely touch the buttons, so yes you want to do that when you feel the effects.

 

[wedenterprises]

I quit the company in late 1999. So the project was still in development and those elements had not gone into production. Alot changed after I left. Usually, due to the cost of talent they come in and out pretty quickly. Tom Fitzgerald approves all story and produced/directed all media for all the attractions, so his division was called "Theme Park Productions" (no longer exists) did that type of thing for each project. Tom edited the storys and scripts personally at that time. Every script! He was always swamped. I liked working with him as he was very nice and always wanted to push things to make them better. You pretty much just design it at that point in collaboration with them.

Interesting, I've always wanted to meet Tom. M:S is one of my favorite experiences at WDW, I'll never forget the first time I took the trip into space. Unreal. So, thank you!

I heard that M:S had to be "toned down" before opening day, is this true? Something about the G-force being too intense?

 

[wdwmagic]

Interesting, I've always wanted to meet Tom. M:S is one of my favorite experiences at WDW, I'll never forget the first time I took the trip into space. Unreal. So, thank you!

I heard that M:S had to be "toned down" before opening day, is this true? Something about the G-force being too intense?

I don't know how close Eddie got to testing before he left, but I did have the chance to talk with some Imagineers who worked on it and they tell me that once the actual parameters were developed during the prototype stage it was set in stone and they opened with that. Marginal changes in the G Force did not affect the likelihood of people suffering motion sickness. Contrary to internet myth, the G's were not changed since opening either, just the addition of the non-spinning version.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Eddie,

My future step father in law insists that the ride was longer early on (perhaps during previews). Was there a longer version of the attraction that you worked on? Perhaps where your shuttle didn't stop at the barriers?

 

[wdwmagic]

My future step father in law insists that the ride was longer early on (perhaps during previews). Was there a longer version of the attraction that you worked on? Perhaps where your shuttle didn't stop at the barriers?

I was lucky enough to be on the first groups of the guest previews, and it is the same ride today as it was then.

 

[KevinYee]

I've received emails from ride engineers who say the ride hasn't changed. I also got email from NASA personnel who say that it is a well-known phenomenon that your body gets used to the G-forces, so the nausea disappears and only euphoria (for some) is left. That is, indeed, my experience with the ride as well.

 

[HMF]

Look at Mickey...Upper management took away his wand and left him empty handed!

Some may think that is a good thing:lookaroun
http://idiozeitgeist.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2007/07/undermonorail.jpg

 

[HMF]

I quit the company in late 1999. So the project was still in development and those elements had not gone into production. Alot changed after I left. Usually, due to the cost of talent they come in and out pretty quickly. Tom Fitzgerald approves all story and produced/directed all media for all the attractions, so his division was called "Theme Park Productions" (no longer exists) did that type of thing for each project. Tom edited the storys and scripts personally at that time. Every script! He was always swamped. I liked working with him as he was very nice and always wanted to push things to make them better. You pretty much just design it at that point in collaboration with them.

"Theme Park Productions" no longer exists? That is news to me. BTW' Eddie when the Bob Zalk/Sue Bryan team took over did they make any changes to the version that would have been had you stayed?

 

[Slowjack]

Look at Mickey...Upper management took away his wand and left him empty handed! No new magic without corporate approval.

You know, because of that [insert word inappropriate for WDWMAgic here] wand on Spaceship Earth, I think many people have forgotten that Mickey didn't have a wand as the Sorcerer's Apprentice. It's the hat that's magic, for Pete's sake. I therefore applaud the new logo...someone was paying attention!

 

[Slowjack]

I think one of the reason Horizons is beloved is because it was the only attraction that addressed futurism, the thing you expect the most from EPCOT. the other pavilions dodged the future by retelling lots of history and only hinted in the post show. The history of the future is an optimistic one and Horizons did a good job of portraying it. I give it a D plus. I don't fault Space or any other attraction for replacing it, it's just that not having the "story of the future" told in... dare I say Future World, leaves a gaping hole in the park.

I think you hit the nail on the head there. I think the implicit message of the original EPCOT as a whole was that the future was going to be a great place to live--great technology, countries living side-by-side in harmony, etc. Horizons was the most explicit expression of that message.

The problem with M:S is that it replaces an optimistic look to the future with a realistic look that's almost to the past, in that it recreates a training run like would have been done back during the original Space Race. And it's explicitly a simulation--we're not told that we are going to Mars, but that we're going to experience the kind of training an astronaut who might go to Mars would receive.

I don't fault the replacement, mind you. Horizons was a ghost town the last time I rode it, and that's when Test Track was behind schedule so there was nothing else to ride, even, and M:S draws good crowds, so it was the right call. I just wish the thrill ride could have included the original EPCOT sense of awe and wonder.

Same issue with Test Track--it's a great ride, but it's reproducing the rather pedestrian world of automobile testing, whereas the World of Motion took you on an adventure, culminating with a vision of a future utopian city.

 

[ChrisFL]

You know, because of that [insert word inappropriate for WDWMAgic here] wand on Spaceship Earth, I think many people have forgotten that Mickey didn't have a wand as the Sorcerer's Apprentice. It's the hat that's magic, for Pete's sake. I therefore applaud the new logo...someone was paying attention!

That is true

 

[HMF]

You know, because of that [insert word inappropriate for WDWMAgic here] wand on Spaceship Earth, I think many people have forgotten that Mickey didn't have a wand as the Sorcerer's Apprentice. It's the hat that's magic, for Pete's sake. I therefore applaud the new logo...someone was paying attention!

So let me get this straight: You hate the Wand but love the Sorcerers Hat? Well one is already gone and the other does not have much of a future.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

I think you hit the nail on the head there. I think the implicit message of the original EPCOT as a whole was that the future was going to be a great place to live--great technology, countries living side-by-side in harmony, etc. Horizons was the most explicit expression of that message.

The problem with M:S is that it replaces an optimistic look to the future with a realistic look that's almost to the past, in that it recreates a training run like would have been done back during the original Space Race. And it's explicitly a simulation--we're not told that we are going to Mars, but that we're going to experience the kind of training an astronaut who might go to Mars would receive.

Perhaps it was not very clear in the show, but the idea behind MS was that someday all of us would train to go to space, not just a few. The early versions of the show had you going into orbit, repairing the ISS, instead being struck by debris and marooned, then an emergency return, but that did not use the spinning enough, so Mars became the new direction.

The problem with going to Mars or anywhere is that you have to deliver on it. Where is the Space Suit? What do you do there that does not have Exit Signs and Handrails? "Space stations" filled with screaming kids and guests end up being too much of the real world for me. "Weightlessness" is the big "wow" on other worlds and how do you deliver on that in a believable and mass capacity way? It was this issue of not going down a road you can't deliver on. Especially when the budget is that tight. My belief, right or wrong was that Space is essentially boring and there is no "there" there, that's why they call it space. Gas and rocks. The thing that most people wanted to experience was blasting off and weightlessness. Simulating it in training made it ok for things to "go wrong" and create drama while avoiding the touchy territory of real space disasters that we could not get away with doing. Excuses Excuses!

 

[Mansion Butler]

I've actually come to be just fine with Mission: Space as a simulator and a setting that's about space travel potentially being a part of your future.

 

[WDWGoof07]

Perhaps it was not very clear in the show, but the idea behind MS was that someday all of us would train to go to space, not just a few. The early versions of the show had you going into orbit, repairing the ISS, instead being struck by debris and marooned, then an emergency return, but that did not use the spinning enough, so Mars became the new direction.

I think that message is clear. Mission: Space is just as futuristic as the ride it replaced.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

"Theme Park Productions" no longer exists? That is news to me. BTW' Eddie when the Bob Zalk/Sue Bryan team took over did they make any changes to the version that would have been had you stayed?

I don't think so, at least not in it's present form. I could be wrong.

Yes, many changes were made. It's hard to say exactly what the final version would have been had I stayed, As I had a voice in the process, but Tom had control over the final story. It's collaborative. We were heading toward doing Mars while I was there, so I'm sure we would have ended up with that direction, maybe a bit different tone.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

You know, because of that [insert word inappropriate for WDWMAgic here] wand on Spaceship Earth, I think many people have forgotten that Mickey didn't have a wand as the Sorcerer's Apprentice. It's the hat that's magic, for Pete's sake. I therefore applaud the new logo...someone was paying attention!

We used to joke about the whole "Sorcerer's Apprentice" being the mantra/mascot for WDI. He steals the "magic" and abuses it, loses control, (but produces a pretty cool water show) then gets punished by corporate and begs for forgiveness. Pretty accurate?

 

[redshoesrock]

Perhaps it was not very clear in the show, but the idea behind MS was that someday all of us would train to go to space, not just a few. The early versions of the show had you going into orbit, repairing the ISS, instead being struck by debris and marooned, then an emergency return, but that did not use the spinning enough, so Mars became the new direction.

The problem with going to Mars or anywhere is that you have to deliver on it. Where is the Space Suit? What do you do there that does not have Exit Signs and Handrails? "Space stations" filled with screaming kids and guests end up being too much of the real world for me. "Weightlessness" is the big "wow" on other worlds and how do you deliver on that in a believable and mass capacity way? It was this issue of not going down a road you can't deliver on. Especially when the budget is that tight. My belief, right or wrong was that Space is essentially boring and there is no "there" there, that's why they call it space. Gas and rocks. The thing that most people wanted to experience was blasting off and weightlessness. Simulating it in training made it ok for things to "go wrong" and create drama while avoiding the touchy territory of real space disasters that we could not get away with doing. Excuses Excuses!

Well, you did say that M:S is a "love it or hate it" ride and sadly enough, I am in the latter category. I can just never get over the fact M:S is a simulation of a simulation; it just has the feel of a cop-out. I mean, we "flew to the moon" from 1955-1975, and then "flew to Mars" until '92/'93 complete with screaming kids, exit signs, and no space suits. Why would you wear a space suit in the cabin anyway; I would think you'd wear it if you were going outside in space for a space-walk or walking on the Moon. But that's just me.

I feel the opposite about space; I think there's so many amazing things in space that I would have a hard time deciding just what to do for a ride. I suppose if I were in the room, since we already "went" to the Moon and "went" to Mars, the natural progression would be to do a grand-tour of the solar system. The wonders of the solar system would be the "wow", and even combine excitement with education (if that's not what Epcot is or wants to be I don't know it). You'd still be able to have the take-off from Earth, you could link-up with a larger craft, and then visit interesting places in the Solar System (off the top of my head: the Sun (cabin gets hot), asteroid field (drama flying through asteroids ala Empire Strikes Back), Jupiter's moon Io (drama flying past volcanoes spewing magma into space), flying through Saturn's rings (cool "ooooh" moment), some other things I can't think of because it's 1am where I am, then swing back around to Earth and land just like at the end of M:S.

Don't mean to rag on anyone; if you like M:S it's cool with me. But it doesn't do anything for me.

 

[Eddie Sotto]

Well, you did say that M:S is a "love it or hate it" ride and sadly enough, I am in the latter category. I can just never get over the fact M:S is a simulation of a simulation; it just has the feel of a cop-out. I mean, we "flew to the moon" from 1955-1975, and then "flew to Mars" until '92/'93 complete with screaming kids, exit signs, and no space suits. Why would you wear a space suit in the cabin anyway; I would think you'd wear it if you were going outside in space for a space-walk or walking on the Moon. But that's just me.

I feel the opposite about space; I think there's so many amazing things in space that I would have a hard time deciding just what to do for a ride. I suppose if I were in the room, since we already "went" to the Moon and "went" to Mars, the natural progression would be to do a grand-tour of the solar system. The wonders of the solar system would be the "wow", and even combine excitement with education (if that's not what Epcot is or wants to be I don't know it). You'd still be able to have the take-off from Earth, you could link-up with a larger craft, and then visit interesting places in the Solar System (off the top of my head: the Sun (cabin gets hot), asteroid field (drama flying through asteroids ala Empire Strikes Back), Jupiter's moon Io (drama flying past volcanoes spewing magma into space), flying through Saturn's rings (cool "ooooh" moment), some other things I can't think of because it's 1am where I am, then swing back around to Earth and land just like at the end of M:S.

Don't mean to rag on anyone; if you like M:S it's cool with me. But it doesn't do anything for me.

I get that. I like your celestial tour idea too. What you describe is a bit romantic take on it all. We did some of that in the early version where you look back at the Earth and have that 2001 spiritual "moment". The cabin changes temperature, in fact you lose power and almost freeze. Space walkers repair our ship from the outside. So there was less of a chase scene aspect to early versions, but in the end we got the job because we had to add thrill to EPCOT, so there you are. I like your version too, although I don't see MS as a cop out, as even in simulation we used and studied the methods actually used by aerospace to test and train. It is true to it's roots in that sense and a unique sensation. Could it have been more? Sure. Much more. But I think they did a good job with a science fact ride.