Eddie Sotto's take on the current state of the parks (Part II)

[WDWTank]

Also, if the movie studio division is not micromanaged creatively, then why in the world is the theme park division micromanaged to oblivion?
The films make billions of dollars because their not creatively micromanaged.
Meanwhile, at TDO, the parks could have a higher potential income but only if they built a more variety of attractions vs. princesses, Star Wars, etc. Why is Toy Story Land not a Pixar land?
The best theme parks are the most well-balanced. Diversification is the key to successful investment in stocks. Why won't Disney do the same with their parks?

 

[HMF]

Is Marty Sklar still alive? Either him or Baxter should attempt to resurrect the company on more creative heels

Both Marty and Tony sold their souls to stay with the company long ago and both had their role significantly reduced over time and "retired". I can only assume Joe Rohde is on the same path. I belive the threads namesake @Eddie Sotto left because of dissatisfaction with the Company's direction and he now has his own design studio where he is the boss. I would say and I am sure he would agree that it was probably a wise decision.

 

[rushtest4echo]

Both Marty and Tony sold their souls to stay with the company long ago and both had their role significantly reduced over time and "retired". I can only assume Joe Rohde is on the same path. I belive the threads namesake @Eddie Sotto left because of dissatisfaction with the Company's direction and he now has his own design studio where he is the boss. I would say and I am sure he would agree that it was probably a wise decision.

As it would be with all multinational conglomerates.Then again, people have been leaving Disney to start their own firms across theme parks, animation, and all of Disney's other offerings since the company started so I guess you could apply that line of reasoning to almost anything that's happened in management and creative within Disney for the last 80 years. You're not going to be your own boss there, even Walt knew that which is why MAPO, WDI and Retlaw came to be (though one could argue that those were fronts for Walt to play with his toys and funnel more cash into irresponsible business decisions that Roy repeatedly had to solve).

 

[Figments Friend]

Both Marty and Tony sold their souls to stay with the company long ago and both had their role significantly reduced over time and "retired". I can only assume Joe Rohde is on the same path. I belive the threads namesake @Eddie Sotto left because of dissatisfaction with the Company's direction and he now has his own design studio where he is the boss. I would say and I am sure he would agree that it was probably a wise decision.

Eddie's dissatisfaction was not nessesarily because of the direction the Company was going in at the time.
If i am recalling his own self-told tale here correctly, it had more to do with his desire to grow and develop his own designing skill set in another direction outside of Disney.

He felt at the time Imagineering was not providing enough opportunity for his own personal creative development, so he chose to leave on his own and seek it elsewhere.
Eddie tells his own story in one of these large threads...basically, he had a interest in learning to work with new digital design tools to expand his development further and those needs he felt were not being met at WDI at that time.




I also have to say I disagree with your assessment of Tony 'selling his soul'.
From my perspective, it was his determination to not sell out and become a 'yes man' to the New Order that caused his full time role to be purposely diminished over the years.
Tony stuck to his morals, and it cost him project opportunities and eventually his full time position in the end.
An outrage, in my own personal opinion, considering the truly monumental creations he managed to accomplish over the years.




Marty on the other hand.....
Well, we can agree on that in some respects.


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[HMF]

I also have to say I disagree with your assessment of Tony 'selling his soul'.
From my perspective, it was his determination to not become a 'yes man' to the New Order that caused his full time role to be purposely diminished.

The 98 Tomorrowland and the characters and America Scene in Small World would refute that. Don't get me wrong I love Tony too, but he did have a few at best questionable ideas on occasion.

 

[Sam Magic]

Marty in the other hand.....
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Marty sold his sole when Roy Disney said, "Walt's dead. We're not doing EPCOT."

 

[HMF]

Also, if the movie studio division is not micromanaged creatively, then why in the world is the theme park division micromanaged to oblivion?

Because Iger sees the Theme Parks as nothing more than a marketing platform for the Studio.

 

[EPCOTCenterLover]

The 98 Tomorrowland and the characters and America Scene in Small World would refute that.

I'm not sure Tony had any say so on IASW- but regarding Tomorrowland '98, if you're in charge of a project and the budget is cut, you're still in charge of the project. No soul selling in that.

 

[HMF]

I'm not sure Tony had any say so on IASW- but regarding Tomorrowland '98, if you're in charge of a project and the budget is cut, you're still in charge of the project. No soul selling in that.

I would argue that the concept of TL98 was flawed to begin with also Marty credits Tony with the idea of characters in Small World, Yet, he also insisted the America Scene wasn't happening and Lawrence Dobkin was the original narrator of Spaceship Earth, so you have to do some reading between the lines there.

 

[articos]

Is Marty Sklar still alive? Either him or Baxter should attempt to resurrect the company on more creative heels

Marty is very much alive. He was just around WDW a month ago.

 

[bcoachable]

I wonder if either of those two ever have time to read these boards
or maybe even have a hidden screen name in order to post their thoughts...

 

[HMF]

I wonder if either of those two ever have time to read these boards
or maybe even have a hidden screen name in order to post their thoughts...

I would love Tony to post here like Eddie used to but seeing as how he is still technically a "Consultant" I don't see that happening.

 

[Figments Friend]

The 98 Tomorrowland and the characters and America Scene in Small World would refute that. Don't get me wrong I love Tony too, but he did have a few at best questionable ideas on occasion.

The final result of the TL 98' project at Disneyland was not Tony's vision.
Tony and his team had a far grander plan that includes a lot more enhancements that were nixed for further development due to horrendous budget cuts that were made far above him and out of his control.

It is my understanding that the Tommorowland redo had begun development and then a major sponsor bowed out suddenly, leaving them short handed in the funds department.
Add into this additional aggressive cuts made by DLR Management at the time to purposely downscale what was once a massive overhaul and how could it have not ended up as it did..?
Tony and his team did what they could picking up the few peices that were left after the piggy bank was smashed, but the cuts hurt the project tremendously.

It was unfortunate, but he is not the one who should take the fall for other people's shortsightedness.
Blame DLR's very heavy handed budget restraints happening at the time...not Tony and his team.


Regarding the 'Small World' charactrization at Disneyland, that was a project that was led by Kim Irvine i believe, with some involvement by Tony.
The character overlay was mandated by others above them, namely upper Management at the time I believe, but I could be wrong of course.
I would direct my 'blame' for the characterization of 'Small World' towards the decision of those uppers....but your mileage may vary.
The team involved in doing the overlay was just following orders....with one arm tightly held behind their back, i'm sure.

I have always gotten the impression Tony's involvement was more to keep him occupied as he had sadly been shelved by WDI even by that point.
So instead of just sitting idle in his office, he helped a friend and colleague with a current project.
If i had been in his position at the time, knowing what he was going through, i would have done the same thing.


Having said all that, we can agree that some of the design choices made for those two projects may have ended up less then satisfactory from certain points of view.
But for people to constantly blame the man for the end results as a whole is a little unfair, in my opinion.
There were so many other factors exerting influence that directly effected the end result.


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[Figments Friend]

I wonder if either of those two ever have time to read these boards
or maybe even have a hidden screen name in order to post their thoughts...

Eddie had noted back in 2013 that Tony had visited this Forum to read the 'Eddie Threads'.



Tony has no presence online at all, and I think he wants to keep it that way for the time being.
He does not post anywhere 'incognito' or under alias names.
Since he still has active ties to WDI, and is still working there on a part time basis, it means online posting is a big no-no for him.
He takes that rather seriously.



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[EPCOTCenterLover]

The final result of the TL 98' project at Disneyland was not Tony's vision.
Tony and his team had a far grander plan that includes a lot more enhancements that were nixed for further development due to horrendous budget cuts that were made far above him and out of his control.

It is my understanding that the Tommorowland redo had begun development and then a major sponsor bowed out suddenly, leaving them short handed in the funds department.
Add into this additional aggressive cuts made by DLR Management at the time to purposely downscale what was once a massive overhaul and how could it have not ended up as it did..?
Tony and his team did what they could picking up the few peices that were left after the piggy bank was smashed, but the cuts hurt the project tremendously.

It was unfortunate, but he is not the one who should take the fall for other people's shortsightedness.
Blame DLR's very heavy handed budget restraints happening at the time...not Tony and his team.


Regarding the 'Small World' charactrization at Disneyland, that was a project that was led by Kim Irvine i believe, with some involvement by Tony.
The character overlay was mandated by others above them, namely upper Management at the time I believe, but I could be wrong of course.
I would direct my 'blame' for the characterization of 'Small World' towards the decision of those uppers....but your mileage may vary.
The team involved in doing the overlay was just following orders....with one arm tightly held behind their back, i'm sure.

I have always gotten the impression Tony's involvement was more to keep him occupied as he had sadly been shelved by WDI even by that point.
So instead of just sitting idle in his office, he helped a friend and colleague with a current project.
If i had been in his position at the time, knowing what he was going through, i would have done the same thing.


Having said all that, we can agree that some of the design choices made for those two projects may have ended up less then satisfactory from certain points of view.
But for people to constantly blame the man for the end results as a whole is a little unfair, in my opinion.
There were so many other factors exerting influence that directly effected the end result.


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If you know more about what was proposed by Tony for Tomorrowland, please do share!

 

[Figments Friend]

A project known as 'Tomorrowland 2055'.
Look it up sometime.

It originally entailed complete facade and building redesigns for all the present show buildings in Disneyland's TL excluding 'Space Mountain' , The AstroJets, and the PeopleMover.
It was meant to look very alien and futuristic in some respects, as well as have multiple levels to explore accessed by upper level walkways.
Think of John Hench's early 'Space Mountain' concept art that showed multiple upper level walkways and features all above the ground level of Tomorrowland.
Along those lines.

It was also supposed to include the original 'Alien Encounter' Attraction, which was sent to Walt Disney World instead after the TL 2055 project concept was passed over for development at Disneyland.
A elaborate AA staged Show was also planned for the old Carousel of Progress theater.
This part of the concept went through many design variations...from a mechanical musical revue of 'futuristic robots' , to a unique cast of performing alien creatures.
Eddie worked on the development of this...I recall him talking about it quite a bit in one of these large threads some years ago.

The general feel was for Tomorrowland to take on a very extra terrestrial environment and vibe set several years into the 'future'.


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[HMF]

A project known as 'Tomorrowland 2055'.
Look it up sometime.

It originally entailed complete facade and building redesigns for all the present show buildings in Disneyland's TL excluding 'Space Mountain' , The AstroJets, and the PeopleMover.
It was meant to look very alien and futuristic in some respects, as well as have multiple levels to explore accessed by upper level walkways.
Think of John Hench's early 'Space Mountain' concept art that showed multiple upper level walkways and features all over Tomorrowland
Along those lines.

It was also supposed to include the original 'Alien Encounter' which was sent to WDW after the TL 2055 project concept was passed over.
A elaborate AA staged Show was also planned for the old Carousel of Progress theater.
This part of the concept went through many design variations...from a mechanical musical revue of 'futuristic robots' , to a unique cast of performing alien creatures.

The general feel was for Tomorrowland to take on a very extra terrestrial environment and vibe.


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Tomorrowland 2055 would have been magnificent and as long as Tony did not come up with the idea for Rocket Rods is mostly blameless regarding TL98

 

[the.dreamfinder]

Tomorrowland 2055 would have been magnificent.

Yes indeed.

 

[Figments Friend]

Here is a look at the project logo from a neat jacket that was specifically made for the team working on the project -

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[lazyboy97o]

The 98 Tomorrowland and the characters and America Scene in Small World would refute that. Don't get me wrong I love Tony too, but he did have a few at best questionable ideas on occasion.

Tony does not shirk his responsibility for Tomorrowland 98. He is under no delusions regarding how it turned out and his role in letting it happen.