threeyoda
Active Member
I think your dissecting this way too much. Its a kiddie dark ride in a theme park.
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Duplicate Animatronics/Figures in Little Mermaid
- Thread starter Pixiedustmaker
- Start date
I think your dissecting this way too much. Its a kiddie dark ride in a theme park.
unkadug
Follower of "Saget"The Cult
I agree...and I'm out of here...
EpcotForever82
New Member
Please know what you talk about before getting snarky about things like this. A point of a music director/conductor is help rehearse big groups, giving his interpretation of the music and directing the ensemble on playing that interpretation. Also, in performance, the conductor is a reference for tempos and is someone that persons in an ensemble can refer to if they need to be cued. "Playing in Tune", or Intonation, is something that is controlled by the ears of the performers, and the conductor can only do his best in rehearsals to point out the areas in the music that tend to be out of tune and tell the musicians to listen for that and adjust when they get to those areas. Jazz Band's usually have a director who does a lot less then a usual music director would for things such as an orchestral pit or symphony orchestra; however, Disneyland probably doesn't have one for the sake of $$.
Californian Elitist
Well-Known Member
Agreed, I'm surprised people are actually looking that close.
I wasn't looking for something out of whack with DCA's LM, but when I rode the ride shortly after it opened I felt that the finale scene looked off somehow, and the second time through I noticed the duplicate animatronics dancing to a different song . . . it kinda stands out.
I'm not exactly very good at noticing everything on a ride, I've ridden HM in DL hundreds of times but never noticed the "Skinny Puppy", and had to really look for it.
The duplicates in LM's finale really "pop" out as I immediately got the feeling like they we're doing a "review" of the big Under the Sea scene, when I saw that the whole thing was duplicated, I think this explains why Imagineers didn't release concept art for this scene, as folks would note the duplicates or they hadn't figured the scene out yet . . .
Fitting duplicates into a new scene is different from how WDI traditionally work as you conceptualize the scene and then build the animatronics custom for each scene. (Though some cool animatronics like the buffalo that would have gone into WRE were put in the land attraction).
They've re-used faces for animatronics in the park before, such as in DL the last guy on the totem pole in JC is the grave digger in the haunted mansion, and various other examples such as the dueling portraits which supposedly look like pirates. But we're talking about the same ride simply duplicating *exactly* a good portion of one scene by duplicating maybe eight different animatronics and passing it off a something new.
The scene kinda does't work in the sense that the fish look *way* too excited to see Ariel, and the dancing lobsters and turtle don't look good with the finale music, as obviously they weren't designed for it.
I'm sure I won't be the only one to notice this . . .
I'm not exactly very good at noticing everything on a ride, I've ridden HM in DL hundreds of times but never noticed the "Skinny Puppy", and had to really look for it.
The duplicates in LM's finale really "pop" out as I immediately got the feeling like they we're doing a "review" of the big Under the Sea scene, when I saw that the whole thing was duplicated, I think this explains why Imagineers didn't release concept art for this scene, as folks would note the duplicates or they hadn't figured the scene out yet . . .
Fitting duplicates into a new scene is different from how WDI traditionally work as you conceptualize the scene and then build the animatronics custom for each scene. (Though some cool animatronics like the buffalo that would have gone into WRE were put in the land attraction).
They've re-used faces for animatronics in the park before, such as in DL the last guy on the totem pole in JC is the grave digger in the haunted mansion, and various other examples such as the dueling portraits which supposedly look like pirates. But we're talking about the same ride simply duplicating *exactly* a good portion of one scene by duplicating maybe eight different animatronics and passing it off a something new.
The scene kinda does't work in the sense that the fish look *way* too excited to see Ariel, and the dancing lobsters and turtle don't look good with the finale music, as obviously they weren't designed for it.
I'm sure I won't be the only one to notice this . . .
Californian Elitist
Well-Known Member
If we're going to talk about everything that's appraently "wrong" in the Little Mermaid ride, let's talk about our other fellow Disneyland dark rides with problems.
When you first enter Pinocchio, he and the marionettes are dancing and singing. Pinocchio is singing "Hi-Diddle-Dee-Dee (an Actor's Life for Me)", when he really should be singing "Ive Got no Strings", since Honest John sings "An Actor's Life for Me" in the film.
Snow White is backwards, with us running through the forrest at the end of the ride, not in the beginning.
Peter Pan is fine for the most part, except the mermaids show up at the end of the ride.
Mr. Toad is just COMPLETELY DIFFERENT from the actual film. I don't think any of what happens in the ride happens in the movie, besides Toad stealing the motor car.
Alice is backwards as well, with the mad tea party being the last scene of the entire ride.
Pooh, Monster's, and Roger seem fine.
My point is, these are family rides, mainly designed and built the entertain the children. I don't think it matters if these so called mistakes are present because the kids sure don't care, and we all know as much as we (well, some of us) complain, we're still going to happily ride Pinocchio and sing "An Actor's Life for Me" with him. We're still going to enjoy the big happy birthday BOOM! at Alice's and we're still going to come out thinking, what in the world...? for Toad. I say we just enjoy the rides for what they are and stop thinking about the figurines apparently reappear.
When you first enter Pinocchio, he and the marionettes are dancing and singing. Pinocchio is singing "Hi-Diddle-Dee-Dee (an Actor's Life for Me)", when he really should be singing "Ive Got no Strings", since Honest John sings "An Actor's Life for Me" in the film.
Snow White is backwards, with us running through the forrest at the end of the ride, not in the beginning.
Peter Pan is fine for the most part, except the mermaids show up at the end of the ride.
Mr. Toad is just COMPLETELY DIFFERENT from the actual film. I don't think any of what happens in the ride happens in the movie, besides Toad stealing the motor car.
Alice is backwards as well, with the mad tea party being the last scene of the entire ride.
Pooh, Monster's, and Roger seem fine.
My point is, these are family rides, mainly designed and built the entertain the children. I don't think it matters if these so called mistakes are present because the kids sure don't care, and we all know as much as we (well, some of us) complain, we're still going to happily ride Pinocchio and sing "An Actor's Life for Me" with him. We're still going to enjoy the big happy birthday BOOM! at Alice's and we're still going to come out thinking, what in the world...? for Toad. I say we just enjoy the rides for what they are and stop thinking about the figurines apparently reappear.
I actually like the dark rides which are different from the films, this frees them up, Tony Baxter has talked a lot about Toad, and the Toad going to hell ending not in the film, and it works, 100%. A Mr. Toad's, Alice, Peter Pan and many others work as they allow you to enter the world of the characters, not relive the film.
I perhaps unfairly criticized for LM not sticking to the film, in fact, I like many others don't like LM for its "book report" approach and would have like a version closer to Tony Baxter's much more. Because LM is a book report ride, I criticized it on those terms.
BUT the finale scene that is presented is wrong not because it wasn't in the film, but because it was a cheap-o way to add a scene to the ride, just duplicate the characters. I guess you do this with any ride, duplicate the characters and add a couple of new ones waving at you at the end instead of designing and building a whole new scene. Toad goes to hell is pretty cool as it is something new and they had to build a lot of the stuff from scratch and availability of duplicates didn't drive this decision.
I have a bigger problem with the cut-out Ursula and the Ariel's shadow gets her voice scene that the finale.
I believe he is a Newt. Which would make that his flute.
bubbles1812
Well-Known Member
I don't think it's necessarily people looking "that close" rather than it's just simply noticeable. The first time I saw the ride, I wasn't looking for any of the things brought up in the thread. But I noticed the duplicates...it was definitely one of those "hey haven't I seen this before?" double takes when I watched the finale. It struck me as pretty lazy that they didn't bother to use different AAs in the finale. And again I wasn't looking for flaws in the ride...I actually really love The Little Mermaid. But seeing that took me completely out of the ride. Well, actually I could have dealt with that but for the cardboard cut out showing Ursula's "demise" That scene is one of the most memorable in the movie and you can't tell me they couldn't create one more actual show scene to show that in a cool way? The ride was great until those last scenes. You could tell a lot of love (and money) was put into the earlier show scenes and then those last scenes just made it look like funding was completely cut off or laziness just prevailed.
And it's not like I was the only one who noticed. I heard plenty of other guests say the same thing. And again, I wasn't trying to look for it. It was just that noticeable. I expected Disney to do better. Doesn't matter that it is "just a children's dark ride." And i really hope the problems are fixed in WDW's version though I'm not optimistic considering the WDW track is the exact same as DCA's when looking at the plans.
I had the same, "haven't I seen this before?" reaction, and like you I wasn't really looking for anything amiss, something just felt off and then I immediately "got" the connection to the Under the Sea scene. I kind of thought it was sort of a tribute within the ride to their big "Under the Sea" scene, but why do this? It makes more sense to have each scene make sense as a separate scene, and stand on its own, then I realized that the animals were exact duplicates . . .
I'm pretty sure a lot of guests get the obvious homage (reference?) to another scene in the finale, and some probably notice the same characters doing the same thing. Given how unfinished the rest of the ride looks (the beginning is the best part), I do feel that the influence of a budget cuts can be seen in the ride.
I don't normally notice the use of redundant props, sometimes in Small World the figures start to look the same, though I attribute it to Mary Blair's style. And despite a similar face, the figures in the scenes are dressed differently, and often move differently.
If the same partial scene duplication happened on another ride, it would be like taking out the hitch-hiking ghosts on haunted mansion and replacing them with another spooky corridor scene with the same pictures to save money, or like using the Johny Depp animatronic which pops out of the barrel on Pirates in all of the scenes, popping out of a cart, out of a treasure box and on and on . . .
Its either budget cuts or laziness . . .
Tim Lohr
Well-Known Member
Well the biggest scene in the ride, and the most memorable scene in the movie is the "Under the Sea" scene, so I can understand why them went all out on that, but I think the problem is that scene comes in the middle of the story/ride/movie.
Like the "Haunted Mansion" starts off simple, then each scene get progressively more elaborate until you reach the giant "Graveyard Finally", if they had put the graveyard in the middle everything that followed would probably seem less impressive.
I get your point though, it does seem like they low balled the ending a bit, but I don't know if seeing a giant Ursula die, and a huge room full of 100 mermaids waving good bye would've been a better way to end the show, seems like that'd be kind of a weird note to go out on.
Like the "Haunted Mansion" starts off simple, then each scene get progressively more elaborate until you reach the giant "Graveyard Finally", if they had put the graveyard in the middle everything that followed would probably seem less impressive.
I get your point though, it does seem like they low balled the ending a bit, but I don't know if seeing a giant Ursula die, and a huge room full of 100 mermaids waving good bye would've been a better way to end the show, seems like that'd be kind of a weird note to go out on.
Yeah, I agree with having an Ursula fight scene at all, there were rumors of a Prince Eric fights Ursula, but I don't think the scene is needed. I just criticize how it was done.
I think a better scene would have been one with comedy, like Sebastian escaping from the crazy chef, which happens at the end of the film.
I do think they should have added another Ursula scene, maybe the one with her scampering across the deck of Prince Eric's boat.
Haunted Mansion does have the graveyard scene, then sort of uses comedy to "unwind" from the drama, with the hitchiking ghosts, a certain comedic element would have worked here for me.
Tony Baxter's version of the ride focused on the love story, this version tries to cram in so many storylines it is confusing, using screens to show Ariel getting her legs, and getting her voice back, integral to the film, but they don't necessarily both need to be included, I would have ditched the part about her losing her voice and the Ursula exploding/screaming in the ocean.
A cheap scene is a cheap scene, and there are a couple at the end. Even the big Under the Sea scene has cheap effects in it.
Tim Lohr
Well-Known Member
Yeah it's kind of a "no win" situation, if you don't stick completely to story of the movie people will be confused, but you'll never be able to fit 80 minute movie into a 5 min ride
That being said though, if they're going to sculpt an entire mountain out of concrete for the building, they could at least sculpt some new figures for the last few scenes of the ride
Exactly, why be so constrained with the design of a final scene that you have to make previously used characters fit? They are spending so much money to make the outside of the building, and the queue, look good that I can't see anybody simply ordering duplicates for the inside because they are cheaper. It would be like a home builder building a mansion, and then putting a folding table with a microwave and simple sink for the kitchen, hoping that the outside is good enough to sell the home.
I know that the rides are supposedly identical, but TDO must have some leeway with the budget to get their version right, be it by a couple thousand, a couple hundred thousand, or a couple million. If you're going to spend something like $150 million on the ride, what is a couple million to replace the temporary scenes and remove the duplicates from the finale?
danlb_2000
Premium Member
This assumes that they feel there is something wrong with the ride as it is.
Tim Lohr
Well-Known Member
There was a rumor or a thread on here a while back that the WDW version would have a more elaborate ending than DCA, but I don't remember what was said though.
I know they changed some parts of the DCA because peoples reaction like her "soft serve" hair and the effect of the fish spitting water in the "Kiss the Girl" scene. I hope if there is a new ending they unveil it in WDW so I can see it in person, I feel like I've seen too much already
Disneyboy17
Active Member
I've done numerous walk throughs over at the new mermaid here in Orlando an it woulnt diss appoint! Expect some surprises an yes imagineers an people who work hand in hand with them everyday read these blogs or forums everyday. TDO gives us budgets we must follow it's not up to us to make duplicates or such. Chris knows what he's doing with this project for Fantasyland he woulnt disappoint, they're could also quite be a living character for Ursula but who knows where that'll go an would be placed in after a couple of months of the attractions opening.
FigmentJedi
Well-Known Member
Would be nice to see Ariel's sisters make it into the Fantasyland version.
RSoxNo1
Well-Known Member
What bothers me is that people don't criticize attractions that rightly deserve this level of criticism, mainly Peter Pan's Flight. Under the Sea: Journey of the Little Mermaid is 3x the ride that Peter Pan's Flight is, yet no one dares to criticize Peter Pan's Flight because it's a classic.