Downtown Disney update

[jt04]

Or, build a resort that caters to that life style. A little less kid friendly, with dance clubs etc. open later in the evening/night, eliminates any driving issues or public displays of drunkeness, but at the same time, maintain Disney's standard for behavior. I'm not suggesting club Sodom, but something tasteful and adult. Maybe 3-4 clubs, each with a different theme. The Adventurers Resort...?

Yep. Such a concept would be welcome. Either convert an existing resort or build a new resort. Personally I think Flamingo Crossing would be perfect. And an agreement between DCL and WDW could make for some great Land/Sea package deals where such a resort could be a great asset.

My concept for a "PI" at CS is interesting. I'd have a heavily themed area that existed during prohibition. Basically a set of ramshackled buildings in a 'remote' woods or swamp where there could be several eateries, clubs and entertainment options to please most tastes. I think it works because it transports guests to a different place and time and plays off of the PI controversy.

 

[J03Y]

Ok, PI closed for whatever reason, and nothings replaced the empty buildings. Does anyone think it would be feasible to open another "adult" area somewhere within the confines of WDW property, somewhere with more control? A place or location that affords more oversight and is perhaps more selective of who gets in? As I stated earlier, I'm not familiar with PI and it's problems (both real and urban myth), but it does seem like that adult entertainment is something that people want. I understand that DTD is/was a logical place for this, but if Disney is having a hard time reconciling the two "atmospheres", then create a different place. Like I said, don't know a lot about this, just throwing out ideas.

i've been imagining a place like this too, maybe not so remote, but still a place similar to Pleasure Island that you must pay some money to even have access to it.

my parents said the main problem with Pleasure Island wasn't just because the drunk dudes were ruining the atmosphere of Downtown Disney, but because gangs would come to the clubs and ruin the area and start fights. Disney had to close it down in order to get rid of the gangs.

but with a more VIP access-ish thing/mini park, i think they can have a successful and thriving adult thing. and in a remote location would be a bonus i guess, but why not just make a... not a theme park but literally a small theme park-ish place that's adults only, with clubs and bars of the sort.

 

[J03Y]

The idea of gangs going to Disney World seems pretty bizarre. Did they have special red or blue Mickey ears made up? Going to Disney does not seem like a very gang-like thing to do.

no, but the clubs were. at the time i never paid attention to what was going on with Pleasure Island, but from what my parents have told me, it sounds like the gangs just wanted a place to do business, and Disney's clubs were available.

 

[menamechris]

no, but the clubs were. at the time i never paid attention to what was going on with Pleasure Island, but from what my parents have told me, it sounds like the gangs just wanted a place to do business, and Disney's clubs were available.

......after the gates were taken down. Everyone seems to forget that part. This was strategic by Disney. By taking the gates down and not charging admission, it created a problem and thus, they were able to close down PI in hopes of filling the area with 3rd party vendors.

 

[Mouse Detective]

my parents said the main problem with Pleasure Island wasn't just because the drunk dudes were ruining the atmosphere of Downtown Disney, but because gangs would come to the clubs and ruin the area and start fights. Disney had to close it down in order to get rid of the gangs.

Your parents must have been getting their information from Jt's Blog. Before the gates came down, after the gates came down, doesn't matter. There were no gangs hanging out in or out of the clubs! There were no more teens hanging out in DTD Disney when PI was open as there are now with PI closed. Jt keeps repeating it over and over and people are believing it!

You can deflect all you want but nobody is going to buy that there were not serious issues surrounding the clubs of PI. PI closed partly because of the mix of underage teens being too close in proximity to seedy elements around the clubs including illegal drug use. That is the truth of the matter.

OMG, where do you get this BS except to make it up yourself? There were "seedy elements" hanging around the clubs: What were they, gangsters, longshoremen, drug cartel members, what?
There was illegal drug use? On what authority are you saying such things? There was no drug problem at PI anymore than at your local high school or shopping mall.

The only truth in your statement is that underage teens did find PI and DTD an attractive hangout. They still do today.

For someone who had never been there you sure seem to think you know a lot about Pleasure Island.

 

[J03Y]

Your parents must have been getting their information from Jt's Blog. Before the gates came down, after the gates came down, doesn't matter. There were no gangs hanging out in or out of the clubs! There were no more teens hanging out in DTD Disney when PI was open as there are now with PI closed. Jt keeps repeating it over and over and people are believing it!

um... my parents... are 40. they lived PI. and they don't even know this Jt person you speak of. and i trust my parents' judgement more, so...

 

[Mouse Detective]

um... my parents... are 40. they lived PI. and they don't even know this Jt person you speak of. and i trust my parents' judgement more, so...

I think what they have told you is incorrect but if that was their perception, fine. They're entitled to that and at least you're getting your information from someone that was there. Unlike someone else.

 

[jt04]

Your parents must have been getting their information from Jt's Blog. Before the gates came down, after the gates came down, doesn't matter. There were no gangs hanging out in or out of the clubs! There were no more teens hanging out in DTD Disney when PI was open as there are now with PI closed. Jt keeps repeating it over and over and people are believing it!



OMG, where do you get this BS except to make it up yourself? There were "seedy elements" hanging around the clubs: What were they, gangsters, longshoremen, drug cartel members, what?
There was illegal drug use? On what authority are you saying such things? There was no drug problem at PI anymore than at your local high school or shopping mall.

The only truth in your statement is that underage teens did find PI and DTD an attractive hangout. They still do today.

For someone who had never been there you sure seem to think you know a lot about Pleasure Island.

I have NEVER claimed there were "gangs" at PI. Unless I meant it sarcastically. What I have said is there was increasing crime, drugs, underage drinking and security issues. You would have a lot more credibility if you actually had your facts straight. You are the one with a narrow view of events and only see people in two categories. Your view of events and a sterotype of how you view anyone who disagrees with what you believe at all.

Of course I have been there. Through every phase. But once again you fall back on your false pre-conceived sterotypes. Pathetic.

 

[jt04]

um... my parents... are 40. they lived PI. and they don't even know this Jt person you speak of. and i trust my parents' judgement more, so...

I think I may know them. The stories I could tell.

 

[GoofGoof]

um... my parents... are 40. they lived PI. and they don't even know this Jt person you speak of. and i trust my parents' judgement more, so...

Maybe there was a big change after the gates came down, but I lived PI too in the late 90s and early 2000s and there were no gangs. Even though their were clubs it was still so totally Disney. I personally felt very Safe and comfortable and never witnessed the major problems others are describing. Maybe after the gates came down teens started to loiter and there were fights or other issues, but that is a far stretch from gangs.

 

[GoofGoof]

As someone with more than a passing knowledge of branding, I'll simply say you are equating two things that are not the same: theme park attendance and BRAND value and perception.

Two very different things.

I would tend to agree with you, but I was responding to the other poster who was equating the loss of Orlando market share to a tainting of the Disney brand. In my opinion the Disney brand has not taken a major hit anywhere except on this board.

 

[Jim Handy]

It was certainly headed in that direction. And the issues are still being dealt with today. Quick fix would be parking garages with connecting walkways that do not allow for easy access and departures. This is why CityWalk is relatively secure compared with the way PI operated especially after the gates came down.

A system that doesn't allow easy access? That's great for customers.

 

[flynnibus]

Pi got bad press and little things started to become a lightning rod for scrutiny. Nothing sells like shocking news happening at the infallible happiest place on earth.

It became a bit of a thorn to Disney. That is where all the violence stories come from. Isolated issues that get wound up into some greater 'issue' which leads to greater scrutiny over everything.

 

[flynnibus]

but with a more VIP access-ish thing/mini park, i think they can have a successful and thriving adult thing. and in a remote location would be a bonus i guess, but why not just make a... not a theme park but literally a small theme park-ish place that's adults only, with clubs and bars of the sort.

You basically described what pleasure island started as

 

[J03Y]

You basically described what pleasure island started as

that sounds like a good idea, why didn't they just keep that?

 

[Mouse Detective]

that sounds like a good idea, why didn't they just keep that?

Answering that would just bring us full circle. Bottom line though is that they thought they could make more money leasing out the club spaces to 3rd parties who would run shops and restaurants in them versus what they were making running the PI clubs.

Rock'n'Roll Beach Club was the first to close and the lease on it was snapped up immediately. So they thought this was going to be so easy to pull off and they closed everything else with 3 months notice. The decision-makers were a little blind to the rapidly declining economy and by the time everything did get closed, there were no longer any takers. And here we are 4 years later and still no takers.

 

[GoofGoof]

Assuming that the clubs at PI are gone for good it would be nice to see them add some kind of attraction to draw people in and get them to stay. PI had the new years eve every night concept and I think that worked. Maybe they can add some kind of light show similar to World of Color at DCA (if you don't know what I am talking about search for world of Color on YouTube - it looks insane). I know that show cost something like $75M and took 5 years to design and build so I would not expect that level of commitment unless you could charge for admission. Maybe a simpler fountain show in the lake similar to the one at the Bellagio rather than all the lights and special effects or something in between the 2. If you build a few waterfront bars/restaurants in addition to the ones you already have you could draw people in with front view seats. If they want to utilize the lake they could also build something g like this:
http://seacrets.com/ocean-city-md-homepage

 

[John]

ahhhhhh Secrets.....many of memories there.....and some I dont remember. But thats another story.

I actually like the idea of an adult themed resort. Seems to me it is a untapped market for Disney. Serveing a different clientel. Also, DIsney loves loves DVC.....chaaaa chinggggg. Something like this would outsell everyother property...IMO. People like tropical surroundings, make it tropical. Two or three clubs....something along the lines of Margarittaville...absolutely Adv. club. Dance club with 70's-80's music. Seems this would be a cant miss.

I get so tired of hearing the same argument as to why PI closed, it wears me out. Gangs? stop already... I guess if there are more then two people you could call it a gang but there were NEVER any "gangs" at PI. In all my visits I never witnessed any fight...none. Not even between two drunk guys trying to prove thier masculinity. As much as somepeople talk there wasnt any security there...which is just not the case. There were numerous security officers....sheriffs and Disney security. As one put it, we felt VERY safe on property. Drug use? really? I never seen it. I am sure it was there but never out in the open. I promise you there is drug use at any nightclub....anywhere. To say there was drug use is probably a truthful statement. But to think it was somekind of open air drug market or people smoking weed in the common areas is rediculus. Where there is money there are drugs......cold truth.
I promise you there is drug use in the parks.....yes even MK. Do I use drugs....Absolutely not, but I am a child of the 70's and am what you call streetwise.

PI was as safe as any of the parks. Some keep repeating untrue facts over and over again . No matter what issues PI had there is ONE common denominator that goes hand and hand with its closeing.....When the gates were removed was the end of PI.......period

 

[flynnibus]

People smoke weed commonly at Disneyland...

It's funny how everyone is talking about some night adult park. To those suggesting that, do you remember the rumored nightly kingdom boutique park that was supposed under serious consideration not just a year or two ago?

Pi had issues, but none that would not be unexpected for a adult district open to the public. It just started drawing a lot of negative press. Just like transportation did after the kid on the bike incident and monorail accident.

Outsourcing pi fell right into the business thinking prevalent in Orlando which is... Why run expensive things when you can let someone else do it and just collect great fees or royalties. You see it in the recent land deals.. Entertainment... Sell the parks ideas...etc

 

[GoofGoof]

People smoke weed commonly at Disneyland...

It's funny how everyone is talking about some night adult park. To those suggesting that, do you remember the rumored nightly kingdom boutique park that was supposed under serious consideration not just a year or two ago?

Pi had issues, but none that would not be unexpected for a adult district open to the public. It just started drawing a lot of negative press. Just like transportation did after the kid on the bike incident and monorail accident.

Outsourcing pi fell right into the business thinking prevalent in Orlando which is... Why run expensive things when you can let someone else do it and just collect great fees or royalties. You see it in the recent land deals.. Entertainment... Sell the parks ideas...etc

I am pretty new here so I missed that rumor. I googled it and found this:

http://jimhillmedia.com/editor_in_c...theme-park-going-experience.aspx#.T_jdehB5mSM

I assume that is what you are talking about. Looks like a cool concept. Too bad the economy tanked later that year.