Yes, but they would have spent it anyway. Has nothing to do with me.
That's like saying "Jack is gonna use Jill's Annual Pass, but it shouldn't matter to Disney, because Jill paid them $500 already."
-
Welcome to the WDWMAGIC.COM Forums!
Please take a look around, and feel free to sign up and join the community.
Do you think renting DVC points bothers Disney?
- Thread starter captainkidd
- Start date
Yes, but they would have spent it anyway. Has nothing to do with me.
That's like saying "Jack is gonna use Jill's Annual Pass, but it shouldn't matter to Disney, because Jill paid them $500 already."
It's simple math:
If Bob buys DVC for $25,000, then Disney has $25,000.
If Bill decides to stay at the Polynesian for $5,000, then Disney has $5,000 plus the $25,000 from Bob. So, Disney has $30,000.
If Bob rents his points out to Bill for $5,000, then Disney only has $25,000.
If Bob buys DVC for $25,000, then Disney has $25,000.
If Bill decides to stay at the Polynesian for $5,000, then Disney has $5,000 plus the $25,000 from Bob. So, Disney has $30,000.
If Bob rents his points out to Bill for $5,000, then Disney only has $25,000.
Very few resorts run at 100% occupancy simply because they can't. You need back up rooms for when rooms have to be taken out of service. When you go to book a room at the Poly and the reservation center tells you they are full they rarely have every single room booked. A certain percentage are kept out of inventory.
The only hotels that commonly run at 100% occupancy are, quite ironically, roadside motels like Motel 6. Due to guests stopping and sleeping for a few hours then leaving, it is not uncommon for them to rent the same room twice in the same day.
Trust me Disney is not loosing money renting points. Even if they are they are more than making up for it in increased DVC sales. Nearly everyone I know that has rented points has purchased DVC shortly there after.
That works great in a world with only Bob and Bill in it. There are more than 120 million other people that visit WDW every year. Sally is one of those 120 million and she books the room that Bill would have and now Disney is back to $30k.
dreamfinder
Well-Known Member
It can be though. The member essentially pay for the resort creation. With a healthy profit margin for WDW.
Any expenses for the upkeep of DVC property is split evenly among all the point owners. So that new roof? 99% paid for by owners dues, 1% (or whatever share WDW still owns) paid for by WDW.
The limited Mousekeeping, pretty much covered by the owners dues, and the inflated costs if anyone requests extra.
The prices that WDW get for their villas, mad money. A pretty big markup.
Locking DVC owners into long term vacations, pure profit. As I already pointed out, the owners pretty much pay for their services through their dues. Knowing that DVC either gets the dues and the owner doesn't use the property, or the owner comes down, buys tickets, food, souvenirs, etc. Disney is willing to make less on the owners rooms, by knowing that they get the guaranteed visits and associated spend. Knowing that someone will be paying for the points if they don't use them is a pretty big motivator to go to WDW and not say the Grand Canyon.
No it's not because Disney explicitly forbids people from "renting" their AP to others. With DVC it's built into the operating model.
What does Sally have to do with Bill? Would she not go if Bill did?
I get that, but it's essentially the same idea. You are using something that has already been paid for, and not giving Disney any extra money for the right to do so.
Maybe not. Maybe Sally had her heart set on the Poly and did not book a trip because it was full. When Bill canceled that freed up the Poly and now Sally is going to Disney World! That situation and any one of a thousand other scenarios happen all the time. In the end Disney gets all the money simply because the demand exceeds the supply.
The problem you are having is you are looking at from the perspective of a closed system. Bill either give his money to Disney or Bob. End of story. The reality however is very different. Bill might give his money to Bob but because he did so there is now room for Sally to give her money to Disney.
How much did you have to pay to rent the points? Right now the amount I pay for the same use with points is about the same. You are probably getting the points from someone who can't use them... and then the points are discounted. At one point, people paid good money for the use of those points. I know in the long run it works out to be a huge savings... but, it takes many years to break even. So, I'll bet it doesn't bother them at all
Lucky
Well-Known Member
I get that, but it's essentially the same idea. You are using something that has already been paid for, and not giving Disney any extra money for the right to do so. __________________
No, Disney gets the "extra" money in the DVC sales price and dues: it can charge more because people's willingness to pay is higher when you allow them to rent points.
If you were allowed to rent your AP to someone, you'd be willing to pay more for it too, so Disney could (and would) charge more for APs if that were part of the bargain.
No, Disney gets the "extra" money in the DVC sales price and dues: it can charge more because people's willingness to pay is higher when you allow them to rent points.
If you were allowed to rent your AP to someone, you'd be willing to pay more for it too, so Disney could (and would) charge more for APs if that were part of the bargain.
You've got more experience than I have since you're an agent, but I have never once not gotten the resort I wanted at Disney.
But they're getting that anyway. Whether I decided to rent points from an owner or not, they've already paid (and are continuing to pay) Disney. Me renting points doesn't give Disney extra money.
As long as you book far enough out you should not have a problem getting any resort at WDW. You might have trouble getting a very specific room type (eg turret room at YC), but unless you are booking only a couple months in advance or less or are booking for holiday season, getting a room at any WDW resort is not that hard.
You are probably right about a few things. By renting points, you are giving someone money they wouldn't have. That money goes to the DVC owner. You also are no longer purchasing a vacation package that would cost thousands of dollars. You saved money by doing this to boot which will proably encourage you to continue doing that. So, they do lose out. I personally think they allow this becasue the DVC properties are really overpriced and they offer this as a perk or incentive. BUT, I really wouldn't be suprised if they cut that perk. They have been cutting back recently on what they allow. They've made changes to what perks people get when they buy re-sale, and they are cutting back on what DVC members are actually getting. I wouldn't be suprised if they tried to stop this and only allowed people to "gift" a week to a relative. It's going to be difficult to control this though. The contracts do not say you can't give your points away. But, yes... mathematically, they lose the money you would spend. Most likely the park is not at full capacity and the room you would have booked will go empty.
Lucky
Well-Known Member
But the amount the purchaser agrees to pay in the first place depends on what he/she is getting in return for the money. If owners aren't restricted from renting out, ownership is worth more so Disney can charge more. So they are indirectly getting more money. This is just basic supply and demand.
Apparently not. Right now, for next week, I can get a room at the following:
Animal Kingdom Lodge, Polynesian, Saratoga Springs, Beach Club, Yacht Club, Grand Floridian, Boardwalk Inn, Boardwalk Villas, Contemporary, Bay Lake Towers, Wilderness Lodge, Fort Wilderness, Caribbean Beach Resort, Riverside, French Quarter, Coronado Springs, All Star Movies, Pop Century, All Star Music, All Star Sports, and Old Key West.
As a DVC member, I couldn't... those rooms are all used up. I couldn't even get a room at Kadani village... which has a ton of rooms.
Then how can you say demand is greater than supply?
That's actually my exact point.