Do you think renting DVC points bothers Disney?

[captainkidd]

Obviously, from a single family's standpoint, it means nothing to them. But as an example, we go to Disney twice a year. 1 week in January and 2 weeks in July. We have stayed Deluxe the past 5 years. However, since discovering the option of renting DVC points, I've gone with that option for both our trips this year, and will more than likely continue to do so. I wonder how Disney looks at this. They've scored about $5,000 to $6,000 a year off of us in resort stays the last 5 years. Now, we're not giving them anything. Of course, we're still spending money at the parks, but that only accounts for half of what we were spending with them a year.

Do you think they care? Do you suppose they will at some point start targeting families like us with better incentives to book through Disney, and do you think they will (or even can) initiate a policy in which renting points is no longer allowed?

 

[Hakunamatata]

My guess is that if it were a problem for Disney they would put a stop to it.

 

[Pioneer Hall]

Like Hakuna said, Disney isn't at the point of being annoyed enough where they obviously feel compelled to do something about it. However, if I was to take thousands of dollars out of your pocket then you probably wouldn't be too thrilled either. This is why Disney has no compassion when it comes to botched rental reservations. If you happen to be one of those few people who walks up to the desk and got burned by the person renting to you, they won't really care. They will check what is available at the resort, but you can be sure you will be paying the full rack rate should you want the room.

 

[dreamfinder]

They only care about serial renters. There is a limit on the number of people you can have make reservations for under the account in a given year. So they do have a policy in place to keep someone from buying massive numbers of points, and then never actually using them, instead just renting them out.
I imagine they look at the one in a while renters three ways. First, it helps to get people to stay in the DVC units that now may end up buying points. I know that until we stayed, it wasn't something that ever crossed my mind. Second, it helps to keep the units full. Disney already made their money off of the points, and they make the same amount whether the owner or a guest uses them. And they then make the cash for food and tickets and such. Third, it helps to keep the owners happy. Giving them a way to recoup the costs of the points for a given year when otherwise unable to go is a small thing that the owners appreciate.

 

[captainkidd]

They only care about serial renters. There is a limit on the number of people you can have make reservations for under the account in a given year. So they do have a policy in place to keep someone from buying massive numbers of points, and then never actually using them, instead just renting them out.

There are a couple of people (or businesses) out there that have thousands of points that they rent out. Not sure if they ever use them themselves, but they most certainly rent out thousands every year.

 

[Pioneer Hall]

There are a couple of people (or businesses) out there that have thousands of points that they rent out. Not sure if they ever use them themselves, but they most certainly rent out thousands every year.

If you mean businesses like David's DVC rental, then they don't actually own the points. They act as an intermediary between renter and owner and just help to complete safer transactions. There are a few people with thousands of points who do a lot of renting, but there is a clause in the contract saying how many reservations can be made in other names.

 

[nolatron]

There are a couple of people (or businesses) out there that have thousands of points that they rent out. Not sure if they ever use them themselves, but they most certainly rent out thousands every year.

I think that generally these services are a pool of points from members and not a single individual.

Take http://www.dvcrequest.com/ for example. It's "David's" DVC rental, but the points he's using is from a pool of members who register and offer their points to him to rent out. That's why the price is jacked up to $13/point. Members get $10/point and he pockets the other $3/point.

Course, not all these sites may operate like this but this how they probably get around that "single member renting points" issue.

 

[Master Yoda]

My guess is that if it were a problem for Disney they would put a stop to it.

You hit the nail on the head. I do not know of any law requiring Disney to let its members rent points. At most it would seem like it is a perk. If Disney was in anyway loosing money in the deal I think they would either stop it or make is so difficult to do that few would do it.

 

[captainkidd]

You hit the nail on the head. I do not know of any law requiring Disney to let its members rent points. At most it would seem like it is a perk. If Disney was in anyway loosing money in the deal I think they would either stop it or make is so difficult to do that few would do it.

Of course they're "losing money". I cancelled my reservation at the Polynesian this summer. That was $5,000. Instead, I gave my money to a DVC owner to rent points.

 

[Master Yoda]

Of course they're "losing money". I cancelled my reservation at the Polynesian this summer. That was $5,000. Instead, I gave my money to a DVC owner to rent points.

Did your room stay empty or did someone else rent it? Odds are there was a family in that room and Disney lost nothing.

 

[captainkidd]

Did your room stay empty or did someone else rent it? Odds are there was a family in that room and Disney lost nothing.

No matter how you look at, they still lost money. Unless every resort on property is running at 100% capacity, which we know they're not, they're losing out. And as of right now, for our dates in July, there are open rooms at every resort on property. Granted, many of those will be booked by July, but clearly, not all of them will be.

 

[Lucky]

I think you have to look at the bigger picture. The more restrictions Disney puts on DVC owners, the lower the value of ownership, and the less it can charge owners in purchase price and annual dues.

 

[Hakunamatata]

No matter how you look at, they still lost money. Unless every resort on property is running at 100% capacity, which we know they're not, they're losing out.

The profit margin is obviously higher with DVC or they would be building more Deluxe resorts. I think Disney could actually care less if you moved from a Deluxe to a DVC. Just think how many people have likely done exactly what you did and then decided to buy into DVC because they liked it so much.

 

[captainkidd]

The profit margin is obviously higher with DVC or they would be building more Deluxe resorts. I think Disney could actually care less if you moved from a Deluxe to a DVC. Just think how many people have likely done exactly what you did and then decided to buy into DVC because they liked it so much.

I definitely see your point, but with us, I don't see the benefit for Disney. :shrug:

And if it's less expensive, as DVC owners point out, to be a member than to stay Deluxe, how can Disney's profit margin be higher with DVC? Can't possibly be both ways.

 

[Master Yoda]

No matter how you look at, they still lost money. Unless every resort on property is running at 100% capacity, which we know they're not, they're losing out.

I will look at it from the math angle.

$5000-$5000+$5000=$5000

Looks like profit to me.

For your assumption to be correct every person that rented points would have had to stay at another Disney resort if renting points had not been an option. The simple fact is that many people who rent points would simply travel elsewhere, stay off property or not travel at all if that option was not available. Just like many people who book using promotions would go elsewhere, stay off property or not travel at all if the promotions were not there.

In the past several years we have seen Disney shutter things not because they were loosing money but not as profitable as they wanted them to be. Do you honestly think that Disney would continue to do something like this if they were loosing money in the process?

 

[captainkidd]

I will look at it from the math angle.

$5000-$5000+$5000=$5000

Looks like profit to me.

I don't get how you figure this. I'm not spending $5,000 with Disney. I'm spending $5,000 with a DVC owner.

 

[Master Yoda]

I don't get how you figure this. I'm not spending $5,000 with Disney. I'm spending $5,000 with a DVC owner.

The person who more than likely took your room at the Poly did.

 

[Hakunamatata]

I definitely see your point, but with us, I don't see the benefit for Disney. :shrug:

And if it's less expensive, as DVC owners point out, to be a member than to stay Deluxe, how can Disney's profit margin be higher with DVC? Can't possibly be both ways.

Cash up front invested in properties that get them more cash up front. Plus that room at the deluxe is only booked out, what a year in advance? With DVC that room is booked out 50 years. It takes less marketing to book that DVC room and you dont have to offer those people anything more than what was in the contract. Genius to me.

 

[Hakunamatata]

I don't get how you figure this. I'm not spending $5,000 with Disney. I'm spending $5,000 with a DVC owner.

And that DVC owner likely spent $25k or $30k with Disney......

 

[captainkidd]

The person who more than likely took your room at the Poly did.

You're glossing over the obvious - Unless Disney is running at 100% capacity, there is an open room(s) that I could be spending my money on, but am not.