Disneyland passholder lawsuit alleges Magic Key deceptively advertises no blockout dates - OCR

[shambolicdefending]

Because of reservations? No. That’s just how they are spinning it to justify the decision.

It's almost definitely being boosted by the reservation system. It's increasing the price-per-visit for pass holders and has almost definitely pushed more of them towards day ticket use where the PPV is even higher.

What appears to be happening, based on the analysis we have available, is that the money coming from the old AP segment is at or near what it was before, but they're visiting less which is decreasing costs. The suits are also likely banking on that giving a long-term boost to tourism, if they can downplay the "too crowded" brand over time.

In short, the numbers are appearing to come in exactly how they implied they wanted them to come in. Which means their plans are working and they aren't going back to the old way.

 

[mickEblu]

I’m spending way more money per visit now than I used to in the past as an AP. Maybe triple. I don’t attribute that to the reservation system though. I attribute it to the pandemic and just how happy we are to get out again and enjoy the parks. We’re even getting a hotel room for about 50% of our trips these days. In the past this was something that was very rare for us as we only live an hour away from the park. How does Disney account for this in their data that says the reservation system has guests spending more money per visit when we’ve been in post pandemic mode for the entirety of the reservation systems existence?

I also attribute some of my extra spending on the better quality/ more variety of food being offered in the parks now. They have a seasonal approach to food now throughout the year that’s keeping demand high on popular items.

So personally I’d say I’m spending more due to being in the happy post pandemic/ restrictions phase, the food and maybe mobile ordering too. They ve lost some money from me in merch sales though. They haven’t really been selling my kind of merch since the reopening.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

I’m spending way more money per visit now than I used to in the past as an AP. Maybe triple. I don’t attribute that to the reservation system though. I attribute it to the pandemic and just how happy we are to get out again and enjoy the parks. We’re even getting a hotel room for about 50% of our trips these days. In the past this was something that was very rare for us as we only hour away from the park. How does Disney account for this in their data that says the reservation system has guests spending more money per visit when we’ve been in post pandemic for the entirety of the reservation systems existence?

Exactly. Per guest spending is up because people were cooped up for 2 years! The exec.’s are claiming it’s because of the brilliant reservation system. In reality, I believe the reservation system is hurting the bottom line from where it would be if parks were running “as normal”

 

[mickEblu]

Exactly. Per guest spending is up because people were cooped up for 2 years! The exec.’s are claiming it’s because of the brilliant reservation system. In reality, I believe the reservation system is hurting the bottom line from where it would be if parks were running “as normal”

I think it’s too soon to tell anything in regards to the reservation system. I guess what remains to be seen is if this level of spending will be sustainable by guests? Will it just become the new normal to fork over 3x the amount of money (way more in my case if we’re counting hotels and gas) for entertainment that one did in the past? Or will we say “ok that was fun but let’s reel it back in a bit.” A lot of things we complain about become the new normal at the parks. For myself personally the hotel thing is definitely not sustainable. I imagine I will be spending a lot more money on food at the parks than I did in the past. But again, that has nothing to do with reservation system.

EDIT: how could I forget Genie +/ individual Lightning lanes. I’ve been spending a decent amount on these too but again that goes back to spending going up due to being cooped up during the pandemic . We ve been going to the parks with a lot of non AP fam and friends who were also tried of being home. I’m more inclined to purchase these for myself and others when visiting with infrequent visitors to show them a good time.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

Exactly. Per guest spending is up because people were cooped up for 2 years! The exec.’s are claiming it’s because of the brilliant reservation system. In reality, I believe the reservation system is hurting the bottom line from where it would be if parks were running “as normal”

This is my theory also, our travel budget is $1500 a month and we usually use every penny of that, in 2020 and 2021 we barely traveled so we only spent about $5,000 for the whole year, that left an extra $25,000 burning a hole in our pockets.

Disney is getting about 1/3 of that next year via a couple Disney cruises but the bulk of it is likely going towards a Rheine River cruise in Europe in 2024, a dream vacation that is largely possible because we sat at home for most of two years, and also because we won’t be spending several hundred dollars a month at DL since we’re letting our keys go.

A lot of middle class people are sitting on more cash than normal right now, for some like us that means a dream voyage across Europe, for others that means a dream vacation in WDW, that money will dry up in a couple years though, then reality sets back in.

 

[chadwpalm]

I believe the reservation system is hurting the bottom line from where it would be if parks were running “as normal”

Is it though? From what I'm hearing the parks have been pretty crowded lately, and with the way the reservation bucket system is set up to allow more single and multi-day tickets to be available I would think they'd be making more money on those than they did pre-pandemic when most vacationers were squeezed out of the parks by overcrowding of locals with APs. They seems to want to keep the reservation system in place for the foreseeable future, so if it was hurting their bottom line I doubt they'd want to continue doing it.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

pre-pandemic when most vacationers were squeezed out of the parks by overcrowding of locals with APs.

When did this happen?

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

When did this happen?

I was going to say the same, the parks only reached capacity a handful of days a year, and those days already blocked out 90% of the APs.

Prior to the reservation system you rarely ever heard of guests being turned away at the ticket counters, now you hear it regularly. It’s not just APs being turned away, it’s people walking up to the ticket counter with $150 in their hand also.

I know people say they’re doing reservations to save money on staffing but I don’t think the financials show that, unless every ticket sold requires an additional employee ($120 ticket covers a $15 employee for 8 hours) there’s no way they’re saving more in labor costs than they’re losing in lost revenue. It’s basically a 1-1 ratio, reducing admission by 10,000 people is not allowing them to reduce staffing by 10,000 CMs.

Even factoring in benefits, unemployment taxes, etc a 2 guest lost to save 1 employee ratio is nowhere near enough savings to justify the lost revenue.

 

[TsWade2]

Yep, this fantasy that somehow this lawsuit is going to make Disney drop the reservation system is just that a fantasy. Disney was already testing the reservation system before the pandemic with the Flex Pass, so this wasn't even a pandemic requirement. Disney wants the reservation system and so its here to stay whether there is an AP type system or not.

I'm not saying they should get rid of the reservation system, even though that would be nice. But, I'm saying maybe they should work on the reservation system a little more to make it more fair to the guests. I don't know what is I want for Disneyland, but I want Disneyland to do better with their reservation system even though it's not going anywhere anytime soon. And to be honest, in my opinion, I blame the pandemic.

 

[Disney Irish]

I'm not saying they should get rid of the reservation system, even though that would be nice. But, I'm saying maybe they should work on the reservation system a little more to make it more fair to the guests. I don't know what is I want for Disneyland, but I want Disneyland to do better with their reservation system even though it's not going anywhere anytime soon. And to be honest, in my opinion, I blame the pandemic.

As stated previously the reservation system was already being tested before the pandemic, so its not something you can really blame on the pandemic other than accelerating its use.

Also you state you want them to work on the reservations system to be more "fair" to the guests. What does that mean?

 

[CaptinEO]

I'm not saying they should get rid of the reservation system, even though that would be nice. But, I'm saying maybe they should work on the reservation system a little more to make it more fair to the guests. I don't know what is I want for Disneyland, but I want Disneyland to do better with their reservation system even though it's not going anywhere anytime soon. And to be honest, in my opinion, I blame the pandemic.

It has nothing to do with the pandemic. Capacity restrictions were dropped for all parks in summer 2021. Disney is just providing bad customer service.

 

[TsWade2]

As stated previously the reservation system was already being tested before the pandemic, so its not something you can really blame on the pandemic other than accelerating its use.

Also you state you want them to work on the reservations system to be more "fair" to the guests. What does that mean?

It has nothing to do with the pandemic. Capacity restrictions were dropped for all parks in summer 2021. Disney is just providing bad customer service.

Well, it's my opinion and I'm sticking to it.

 

[Disney Irish]

Well, it's my opinion and I'm sticking to it.

Ok, and not saying you can't have that opinion.

But I still would like to know what you mean when you state that you want them to work on the reservations system to be more "fair" to the guests. What does a reservation system that is more "fair" to guests look like to you?

 

[TsWade2]

Ok, and not saying you can't have that opinion.

But I still would like to know what you mean when you state that you want them to work on the reservations system to be more "fair" to the guests. What does a reservation system that is more "fair" to guests look like to you?

Well, they screwed up my brother's reservation or he might of screwed up and it's also very hard to find a reservation I've heard even when you use the Dream Key pass. I think it's unfair they change it. I know they're trying to control crowds, I don't know. I just want them to make their reservation system more easy. I don't know, maybe I'm just complaining.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Well, they screwed up my brother's reservation or he might of screwed up and it's also very hard to find a reservation I've heard even when you use the Dream Key pass. I think it's unfair they change it. I know they're trying to control crowds, I don't know. I just want them to make their reservation system more easy. I don't know, maybe I'm just complaining.

Many of us agree with you. When every other theme park makes it easy and Disney makes you jump through extra Mickey ear shaped hoops it gets very old.

 

[TsWade2]

Many of us agree with you. When every other theme park makes it easy and Disney makes you jump through extra Mickey ear shaped hoops it gets very old.

Tell me about it.

 

[flynnibus]

They should replace aps with an actual loyalty program. Spend more, get more.

 

[Disney Irish]

Well, they screwed up my brother's reservation or he might of screwed up and it's also very hard to find a reservation I've heard even when you use the Dream Key pass. I think it's unfair they change it. I know they're trying to control crowds, I don't know. I just want them to make their reservation system more easy. I don't know, maybe I'm just complaining.

Ok, so you don't have an idea on how you would make it more "fair", you just want it "easy".

Got it.

Ya it sounds like you're just complaining, no problem with that.

 

[Disney Irish]

Many of us agree with you. When every other theme park makes it easy and Disney makes you jump through extra Mickey ear shaped hoops it gets very old.

Recent surveys from Uni indicates they maybe looking at adding a reservation system too. So yeah, don't think that just because other parks don't have them today doesn't mean they won't in the future.

 

[Disney Irish]

They should replace aps with an actual loyalty program. Spend more, get more.

I have no issue with that, I kind of thought prior to the Keys being introduced they might go that route. But that still doesn't mean they won't have a reservation system.