Disneyland 3rd park Discussion

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PB Watermelon

Well-Known Member
Phrubruh said:
DNYA - Disney New York Adventure park
With five lands including
Manhattanland - with mini Hell's Kitchen land - meet Dare Devil, Jessica Jones and the Punisher.
Brooklynland - with the Spectacular Spiderman ride.
Queensland - with the Amazing Spiderman ride
Staten Island - help the Ghostbusters bust ghosts with the Statue of Liberty.
Bronxland - formally Disneyland's Tomorrowland
with a subway ride connecting all five lands.
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And a Charles Mintz ride where you find out all your animators have signed with Universal behind your back and you take a lonely train ride home and come up with a Mouse.
 
F

fctiger

Well-Known Member
Disneylover152 said:
I think we need to expect at least $4 billion to get something along those lines considering an Epcot overhaul is costing $2.2 billion.
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Jesus what the hell are they putting in Epcot lol. I know about the GOTG roller coaster and Ratatouille but I honestly know nothing beyond that. I thought it was DAK and DHS getting the billion dollar overhauls with Pandora, Star Wars, etc. So that's interesting.

But yes thats exactly the problem, they will have to make a huge splash from the outset and that's a lot of capital. I just don't expect them to want to drop so much considering how much they have done for both DL and DCA the last few years and still plenty of areas to improve on or build.
 
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DanielBB8

Well-Known Member
fctiger said:
Jesus what the hell are they putting in Epcot lol. I know about the GOTG roller coaster and Ratatouille but I honestly know nothing beyond that. I thought it was DAK and DHS getting the billion dollar overhauls with Pandora, Star Wars, etc. So that's interesting.

But yes thats exactly the problem, they will have to make a huge splash from the outset and that's a lot of capital. I just don't expect them to want to drop so much considering how much they have done for both DL and DCA the last few years and still plenty of areas to improve on or build.
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Other Epcot rumors is renovating the “spine” which means removing the Innoventions/Communicore buildings and planting lots of trees for the food festivals. Possible addition of Mary Poppins attraction in Britain Pavilion. Ongoing rumors of a final fix to Imagination and Wonders of Life building. Adding Marine Life Institute to Living Seas. Replacement of Living of the Land ride. Update to Mexico boat ride. Possible Japan attraction?
 
F

fctiger

Well-Known Member
Disneylover152 said:
That's all they've announced sofar. Plus a few updates to shows.
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DanielBB8 said:
Other Epcot rumors is renovating the “spine” which means removing the Innoventions/Communicore buildings and planting lots of trees for the food festivals. Possible addition of Mary Poppins attraction in Britain Pavilion. Ongoing rumors of a final fix to Imagination and Wonders of Life building. Adding Marine Life Institute to Living Seas. Replacement of Living of the Land ride. Update to Mexico boat ride. Possible Japan attraction?
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OK thank you both. So nothing yet official, just plans more will be added in the future and a few rumors. Epcot always seems to be going to the biggest changes out of all the parks.
 
Sharon&Susan

Sharon&Susan

Well-Known Member
I’ve heard SW:GE cost a billion to build at DL alone. It’d be very difficult for WDI with their lack of budgeting prowess could make a new park any less than 5 billion.
 
F

fctiger

Well-Known Member
mandstaft said:
In 2012/2013, I spent a full day at DCA. But the quality is going downhill, and the attractions are overall not as repeatable as those at Disneyland. If the suits want guests to stay in the park all day and not hop, they better come up with some new plans quickly. Pixar Pier was not the answer.
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I was just back at the resort yesterday and spent a lot of time in DCA with all the holiday stuff. I do think DCA is more of a full day park now but yes I agree with you they still don't have rides as repeatable as they do at DL. While they have more today I say they still need another 4-5 solid rides to keep people there all day. But one of the things I do like about DCA is that you can take your time and ride everything even on the busiest days where as DL you have to create a 5 point plan to see most of the park. But what works in DCA favor is all the most popular rides are on FP and if you get there early enough you can do everything. It's not like DCA 1.0 though where there was nothing to do after a few hours. DCA now builds things to do throughout the day and night (well whenever WOC gets going again) but yes its still not to the level of DL.

And the biggest issue with the Xmas season I really noticed is currently the entertainment factor. DL has three major things to do, F!, parade and the fireworks. DCA literally has one small show, the Navidad show which is a lot of fun but can't compete with the big guns and with no WOC Xmas show this season it's hard to keep people there past sun down for now.
 
Disneylover152

Disneylover152

Well-Known Member
I spent a full day at DCA but that was because the park was only open for 11 hours and I spent 75% of the day exploring Buena Vista Street and Cars Land.
 
F

fctiger

Well-Known Member
Disneylover152 said:
I spent a full day at DCA but that was because the park was only open for 11 hours and I spent 75% of the day exploring Buena Vista Street and Cars Land.
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Thats the other beauty of DCA today, is that I actually love to just sit and people watch. It's a lot of fun to sit outside at the Starbucks and watch people come and go with the Red Car Trolly running up and down the street. Or go to Flo's to the outdoor seating to watch the cars race each other with that majestic mountain backdrop while you're eating or having a quiet beer. They had none of these inviting environments when DCA 1.0 came around. Other than GRR the lands were frankly too bland and ugly. Now I can go and spend time in these places just like I can at NOS, MS or CC. You can keep busy or not at all and still feel like you are getting something out of your day.
 
T

Touchdown

Well-Known Member
DCA is as much a full day park as DL is, however with the right plan (and MaxPass) you can do both parks in one day, here is what I did yesterday:

-Peter Pan
-Toad
-Dumbo
-Pinocchio
-Snow White
-Alice
-iasw holiday
-Matterhorn (FP)
-Star Tours (FP)
-Buzz (FP)
-Indy (single rider)
-Pirates
-BTMRR (FP)
-HMH (FP)
-Splash
-Pooh
-Tiki Room
-Mermaid
-Viva Navidad
-Incridicoaster (Single)
-Toy Story (FP)
-Incridicoaster (FP)
-Soarin (FP)
-RSR x2 (Single)
-Luigi
-Mater
-Guardians (FP)
-Monsters Inc
-ACF Parade
-Star Tours (FP)
-Matterhorn (FP)
-iasw holiday (FP)
-Space (FP)
-Believe
-Indy (FP)
-Fantasmic!
-Pirates
-BTMRR (FP)
-HMH (FP)
-iasw holiday
-Sweeper Train back to Main Street

-16 hours, 40 attractions, 35 rides. Clearly there isn’t enough to in both parks to spend all day at either 🙄.

You Californians are spoiled, go to DHS or even AK and then come and tell me DCA is a half day park.
 
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EPCOTCenterLover

EPCOTCenterLover

Well-Known Member
Yes, I agree- in the Summer, I did 26 attractions between both parks, much the same waY you did. I just think DCA's attractions aren't as repeatable. Could I spend a full day at DCA? Yes. And I have a couple of times. Not saying its a half day park.
 
Disneylover152

Disneylover152

Well-Known Member
I think the people who say DCA is a half-day park are the AP holders who have never tried to just spend an entire day in DCA. It is easily possible. Theres a lot to do in that park if you count entertainment, character meet and greets, rides, shops, places to wander. Heck I even know a person who spent two hours on Redwood Creek Challenge because they were having such a great time.
 
Old Mouseketeer

Old Mouseketeer

Well-Known Member
UltimateRollercoaster said:
You can bow to Darkbeer all you want. And yes, he's generally well informed, but that doesn't make him right all the time.

However, I'll ask you this question. Why would Disney seek out this property and pay a premium price if the city of Anaheim's long term intent was to pave a road through the middle of the parcel dividing it? Such a plan would make the two parcels significantly less valuable.

Disney spent years trying to acquire the property from the Fujishige family. The family had refused repeated multi-million dollar offers to sell the 56-acre parcel. Disney stated at the time of purchase in 1998 their intent was to expand on the property. City leaders praised the news of the sale to Disney. A few years later Disney stated their long term plan was to eventually build a third theme park on the property.

I'm sorry, but Disney would've known the city's long term plan to extend the road at time they made this purchase. The bridge over Interstate 5 was put in to create another connection between the stadium and resort sides and it accomplished that goal, but there was NO INTENT to extend Gene Autry Way across the Disney property. There is no need for a direct road connection between the stadium and convention center. Beyond the Disney parcel there are two additional residential properties that stand in the way of paving a Gene Autry Way connection. Furthermore with the future of Anaheim Stadium unknown the need for a direct road between the two is even more questionable.

Disney's actions strongly suggest there was no intention by the city to extend the road any further.
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As Darkbeer pointed out elsewhere, the connection from Autry Way to Convention Way has been in the Anaheim Master Plan for a while. Remember, the extension from I-5 to Haster Street is fairly recent. I wondered for several years why it was such a wide street. What makes even more sense is an overpass over Haster (like Ball Rd.) going into a shared parking structure with Convention Center/Disney parking with a pedestrian overpass over Harbor.
 
Phroobar

Phroobar

Well-Known Member
When the kids where little I spent days at Redwood Creek Challenge. There is only so many times you can do the Spirit Cave.
 
Darkbeer1

Darkbeer1

Well-Known Member
UltimateRollercoaster said:
You can bow to Darkbeer all you want. And yes, he's generally well informed, but that doesn't make him right all the time.
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You are correct. Same with my former colleagues Al Lutz, Jim Hill, David Koenig and many others who have reported things behind the scenes. Projects are fluid, and while correct when reported, well, you know.

My sources are mainly on the city side now, though as my connections with Anaheim officials have grown, my Disney connections have also grown, and have re-connected with others due to the strengthening ties with major city officials.

So in the Gene Autry Way issue, I am talking from the city's point of view.

I mentioned Horse Trading, and let me add to the reasons why.

We just went through the November election, and found out a few things. The citizens didn't like the "Disney is Evil" campaign within City Hall, and how Mayor Tait and his group of 4 went out of its way to drive the message home. So much so, that early in 2018 they toned down the rhetoric to try and improve the chances of Mayor Tait's slate winning in November (He only won 1 out of 4 races).

On the other hand, we also saw the power of the Unions in the ALWI. Interesting to note, most voters who voted yes, did not understand what it actually did. Based on Polling after the election, they liked the concept of paying someone more, and that Disneyland would be one of the companies. So the Unions sold their message well, showing its power, along with all the money and volunteer hours it can use to do it.

Remember, anything that goes in front of the city council and the planning commission can be placed on the ballot with a petition signed by 10% of Anaheim voters, an easy bar that the Unions can gather internally with its partner groups like OCCORD. So ANYTHING related to Disney HAS to be a win-win for the city, and the current council clearly knows that. So does Disney.

So this has placed the city in a position of power. As others have mentioned, having Gene Autry go all the way through to the Convention Center is something high on its wish list.

The former Strawberry Farm is still zoned for Farming Use. Disney currently has a temporary permit for parking use, but that expires in a few years. We just seen the permit pulled for Guests restrooms to be built on the KCML lot property, though close to Toy Story specifically to service the ART Shuttle bus program.

So what does Disney want to do? Expand DCA and its Super Hero Land is a big one (How many Marvel Movies a year are being released?). To do that, they need to move the current Transportation Plaza. To do that, they need the Eastern Gateway project. That project is just in a delay mode until the Mayor and the council tell Disney they are ready. The council does want to make changes to the Planning Commission and settle in, but around mid-year Disney will be told to go ahead. Since the project does not require tax money, and delivers benefits to the city residents in traffic improvements, it is an easy sale, aka Win-Win.

But what is next? Disney really hasn't decided. But the Toy Story Zoning bothers them, as they want to do long term projects, and the land decision has to be made.

So time to Horse Trade. The city doesn't want to approve anything that prevents Gene Autry from not be completed. So what can Disney ask for in return for making Gene Autry go through, and how much will they spend? Will they pay for some of Gene Autry Way to be placed underground? Will Disney figure out a way to share some sort of Parking Structure, so part of it can be used for Convention Center parking? Disney hasn't decided on its course of action....

But the city has spoken very clearly to Disney. We want Gene Autry Way to connect to Convention Way at Harbor. You figure out how to make that work in your long range plans. So the ball is in Disney's court.

Now Disney is still waiting for the ALWI lawsuits to be heard. UNITE HERE will wait until January, and find one Disneyland CM or employee being paid less than $15 and file a claim with the city to get a ruling that the employee is not subject to the ALWI from the city. Once the official decision is made, then they will appeal through the court system. Until a final ruling, Disney will do nothing except go forward on the DL/DCA expansion plans already in the works (including Super Hero Land).

Once that decision is made, then Disney can make an informed choice as what they want to focus on the next 10-20 years. And getting Toy Story permanently zoned for use is a key element.
 

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