News Disney to reveal more about the future of Epcot at D23 Expo 2019

[BlakeW39]

But that’s not the THEME!!!

you honestly need “Microsoft logic checker” on your keypad....

Even dak...which gambled and won...stretched beyond cohesion for avatar. If you don’t have a high spending stickler like James Cameron involved...it’s just as likely you get cheap like “nfl” and toy story land slapped in Epcot.

I bet this guardians ride will be fun...but it doesn’t fit the theme.

T. H. E. M. E. Park

Lol you use a lot of "..."

But a couple of things:

First of all, I am going to pose a serious proposition.

Guardians MIGHT fit in Epcot. Hear me out. I don't really think it will. But that isn't because it can't, that's because I don't think they care enough about OG Epcot to make it. But Guardians doesn't have a strict theme. Therefore it is malleable. They're superheroes. A lot of cosmic Marvel depends on exploration and they could find a way to make it work. It might've done best replacing M:S since that ride is consistently derided by Disney fans and guests. Originally I was angry about GotG too but we don't actually know what it's about right now. That said, I'd guess that it will be inconsistent with the themes of Epcot.

And DAK didn't gamble on Pandora, neither did they stretch thematic cohesion. Avatar has the same themes as DAK. Pandora is a good land. Pandora fits DAK just as much as BK would have. The only reason people doubted it is because in general people are obsessed with what will never be in these parks... hence why instead of people suggesting new ideas, everyone always wants WDW to build BK, Fire Mountain, Rhine River, or something of the sorts.

The theme is disappearing, not changing. Actually to be more precise, it's shrinking. Let's call them micro themes. Over here you have comic book themes! Over here you have vaguely Nature based themes! Here in this direction you have car? themes! And so on. It's a very Universal approach to park design. And, hey, it works for Uni, why shouldn't Disney follow along?

Well put. I can't stand it when people whi don't care about theme say that it's changing... no, it's not. It's disappearing.

Individual themes for individual theme parks. That's what separates each one as unique lands. They all have different goals and approach those goals very differently. I coupd get into how but that isn't the point.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Lol you use a lot of "..."

But a couple of things:

First of all, I am going to pose a serious proposition.

Guardians MIGHT fit in Epcot. Hear me out. I don't really think it will. But that isn't because it can't, that's because I don't think they care enough about OG Epcot to make it. But Guardians doesn't have a strict theme. Therefore it is malleable. They're superheroes. A lot of cosmic Marvel depends on exploration and they could find a way to make it work. It might've done best replacing M:S since that ride is consistently derided by Disney fans and guests. Originally I was angry about GotG too but we don't actually know what it's about right now. That said, I'd guess that it will be inconsistent with the themes of Epcot.

And DAK didn't gamble on Pandora, neither did they stretch thematic cohesion. Avatar has the same themes as DAK. Pandora is a good land. Pandora fits DAK just as much as BK would have. The only reason people doubted it is because in general people are obsessed with what will never be in these parks... hence why instead of people suggesting new ideas, everyone always wants WDW to build BK, Fire Mountain, Rhine River, or something of the sorts.

Guardians is just gonna be a thrill ride for a park that seriously lags on draws. Soarin shouldn’t be a 75 minute wait...especially not after almost 15 years.

But...I differ with you on avatar. That movie had 6 or 7 higher theme priorities than animals. Ecology/conservation maybe...but “mythical animals” was just a side show in that movie. It worked out oK.

Well put. I can't stand it when people whi don't care about theme say that it's changing... no, it's not. It's disappearing.

Individual themes for individual theme parks. That's what separates each one as unique lands. They all have different goals and approach those goals very differently. I coupd get into how but that isn't the point.

The new low brow sycophant Disney defenders tout how “nobody can compare” to the parks...but advocate the abandonment of why nobody can compare to the parks: the consistency in planning, design and theming over the decades...now wanting “ball of string” (you like that one?) mental diversions like the frozen boats and slinky dog.

Abandoning theme will lead to a disjointed mess in the long haul. 4 mgms here...3 magic kingdoms there...redundant.

Epcot is the greatest park ever built (Disneyland second)...if you diss the theme, you just have no idea of historical context. It wasn’t “another Tomorrowland”...it was built for exposure to differences and ideas to stimulate the imagination first and foremost.

 

[BlakeW39]

Guardians is just gonna be a thrill ride for a park that seriously lags on draws. Soarin shouldn’t be a 75 minute wait...especially not after almost 15 years.

But...I differ with you on avatar. That movie had 6 or 7 higher theme priorities than animals. Ecology/conservation maybe...but “mythical animals” was just a side show in that movie. It worked out oK.




The new low brow sycophant Disney defenders tout how “nobody can compare” to the parks...but advocate the abandonment of why nobody can compare to the parks: the consistency in planning, design and theming over the decades...now wanting “ball of string” (you like that one?) mental diversions like the frozen boats and slinky dog.

Abandoning theme will lead to a disjointed mess in the long haul. 4 mgms here...3 magic kingdoms there...redundant.

Epcot is the greatest park ever built (Disneyland second)...if you diss the theme, you just have no idea of historical context. It wasn’t “another Tomorrowland”...it was built for exposure to differences and ideas to stimulate the imagination first and foremost.

You are correct. GotG will be merely a top tier E for a park that could use one. And thematically I imagine it not reeallly fitting, but to be honest I don't think it will be so bad that it ruins the park. Though as someone who deeply respects what Epcot could be... it is a bit of a let down.

Avatar is about ecology/conservation with a splash of zoology. But DAK's theme isn't merely animals.. it's more than that. It is to witness the majesty of nature, to transform through that adventure, and to then feel a need to conserve it. Avatar, while not a great film, hits all three and always has, and Pandora does so even better with more of a zoological focus - which is what DAK is centered around; animals are the characters in the story of the park.

Yeah I agree with your second bit for the most part. The parks will become disjointed if they do not stick to theme. They will be more a collection of lands, and WDW will have a part 1, 2, etc. rather than distinct kingdoms. All four should be separate in this respect which is why all four are a must, but now I am becoming very worried DHS will just be a themeless mess (IP is not a theme) and MK will be merely its superior. And Epcot isn't looking so good right now.

And no Epcot is nothing like Tomorrowland. Or at least it shouldn't be. They're structured fundamentally differently and that goes even beyond theme. They approach things differently, and even after the updates I don't know if they'll be similar.

 

[RSoxNo1]

But that’s not the THEME!!!

you honestly need “Microsoft logic checker” on your keypad....

Even dak...which gambled and won...stretched beyond cohesion for avatar. If you don’t have a high spending stickler like James Cameron involved...it’s just as likely you get cheap like “nfl” and toy story land slapped in Epcot.

I bet this guardians ride will be fun...but it doesn’t fit the theme.

T. H. E. M. E. Park

Lol you use a lot of "..."

But a couple of things:

First of all, I am going to pose a serious proposition.

Guardians MIGHT fit in Epcot. Hear me out. I don't really think it will. But that isn't because it can't, that's because I don't think they care enough about OG Epcot to make it. But Guardians doesn't have a strict theme. Therefore it is malleable. They're superheroes. A lot of cosmic Marvel depends on exploration and they could find a way to make it work. It might've done best replacing M:S since that ride is consistently derided by Disney fans and guests. Originally I was angry about GotG too but we don't actually know what it's about right now. That said, I'd guess that it will be inconsistent with the themes of Epcot.

And DAK didn't gamble on Pandora, neither did they stretch thematic cohesion. Avatar has the same themes as DAK. Pandora is a good land. Pandora fits DAK just as much as BK would have. The only reason people doubted it is because in general people are obsessed with what will never be in these parks... hence why instead of people suggesting new ideas, everyone always wants WDW to build BK, Fire Mountain, Rhine River, or something of the sorts.



Well put. I can't stand it when people whi don't care about theme say that it's changing... no, it's not. It's disappearing.

Individual themes for individual theme parks. That's what separates each one as unique lands. They all have different goals and approach those goals very differently. I coupd get into how but that isn't the point.

Guardians is just gonna be a thrill ride for a park that seriously lags on draws. Soarin shouldn’t be a 75 minute wait...especially not after almost 15 years.

But...I differ with you on avatar. That movie had 6 or 7 higher theme priorities than animals. Ecology/conservation maybe...but “mythical animals” was just a side show in that movie. It worked out oK.




The new low brow sycophant Disney defenders tout how “nobody can compare” to the parks...but advocate the abandonment of why nobody can compare to the parks: the consistency in planning, design and theming over the decades...now wanting “ball of string” (you like that one?) mental diversions like the frozen boats and slinky dog.

Abandoning theme will lead to a disjointed mess in the long haul. 4 mgms here...3 magic kingdoms there...redundant.

Epcot is the greatest park ever built (Disneyland second)...if you diss the theme, you just have no idea of historical context. It wasn’t “another Tomorrowland”...it was built for exposure to differences and ideas to stimulate the imagination first and foremost.

You are correct. GotG will be merely a top tier E for a park that could use one. And thematically I imagine it not reeallly fitting, but to be honest I don't think it will be so bad that it ruins the park. Though as someone who deeply respects what Epcot could be... it is a bit of a let down.

Avatar is about ecology/conservation with a splash of zoology. But DAK's theme isn't merely animals.. it's more than that. It is to witness the majesty of nature, to transform through that adventure, and to then feel a need to conserve it. Avatar, while not a great film, hits all three and always has, and Pandora does so even better with more of a zoological focus - which is what DAK is centered around; animals are the characters in the story of the park.

Yeah I agree with your second bit for the most part. The parks will become disjointed if they do not stick to theme. They will be more a collection of lands, and WDW will have a part 1, 2, etc. rather than distinct kingdoms. All four should be separate in this respect which is why all four are a must, but now I am becoming very worried DHS will just be a themeless mess (IP is not a theme) and MK will be merely its superior. And Epcot isn't looking so good right now.

And no Epcot is nothing like Tomorrowland. Or at least it shouldn't be. They're structured fundamentally differently and that goes even beyond theme. They approach things differently, and even after the updates I don't know if they'll be similar.

The story treatment for Pandora in DAK is perfect. It is a better fit than any single IP land in any other theme park in the world. You don't have to like it, but the story treatment is great. I understand the argument on the animals themselves, they're alien, they don't really have a history in ours or any culture, but the conservation message and appreciate of animals anywhere is the greater message here.

As for Guardians, there are absolutely story treatements that could put it in Epcot. They could make it a love letter to classic Epcot and have it be on brand with the Guardians. However, even that would be a bit awkward considering all the other damage they've done/are doing to that park's original identity.

Disney has shown beyond a shadow of a doubt that they are unwilling or unable to evolve Epcot. Instead they've opted to keep some of the aesthetics and change it into some disjointed version of the Magic Kingdom with better dining.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Well if combining IPs with theme parks gives us more immersive lands like SWGE and the Potter lands then that seems like a good way to go.

Just like DAK is a mixture of the real and the mythical of the animal world, I could see Epcot (including Future World) becoming a mixture of real and imagined mythical lands. But I'm a dreamer.

This IP push is 100% the fault of Harry Potter. Universal did an exceptional job with that land, but it resulted in theme park creativity taking a major hit. Disney learned the wrong lessons from that.

 

[lazyboy97o]

This IP push is 100% the fault of Harry Potter. Universal did an exceptional job with that land, but it resulted in theme park creativity taking a major hit. Disney learned the wrong lessons from that.

The franchise mandate predates the opening of the Wizarding World of Harry Potter.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The story treatment for Pandora in DAK is perfect. It is a better fit than any single IP land in any other theme park in the world. You don't have to like it, but the story treatment is great. I understand the argument on the animals themselves, they're alien, they don't really have a history in ours or any culture, but the conservation message and appreciate of animals anywhere is the greater message here.

As for Guardians, there are absolutely story treatements that could put it in Epcot. They could make it a love letter to classic Epcot and have it be on brand with the Guardians. However, even that would be a bit awkward considering all the other damage they've done/are doing to that park's original identity.

Disney has shown beyond a shadow of a doubt that they are unwilling or unable to evolve Epcot. Instead they've opted to keep some of the aesthetics and change it into some disjointed version of the Magic Kingdom with better dining.

Better dining??! You must not be eating at nine dragons

This IP push is 100% the fault of Harry Potter. Universal did an exceptional job with that land, but it resulted in theme park creativity taking a major hit. Disney learned the wrong lessons from that.

You’re gonna have to translate that into the “Clueless Dialect” to be able to communicate with them...as evidenced by the quote that is 110% wrong

How can a land be “immersive” before you ever set foot in the place? Or anyone else without an engineering degree?

“Drinking the sand”

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The IP mandate predates the opening of the Wizarding World of Harry Potter.

Around October 2005 when the tv clown “filled the void”

 

[bcoachable]

From our vantage point - it does seem theme is being thrown out the window with Future World for random IP placement...
Have we heard for sure that theme is not important for this park anymore? Or could this just be a thematic change in direction that we can’t recognize as of yet? Maybe d23 will explain the theme for Future World??
I’m trying hard to hold out hope up in here!

 

[MrMcDuck]

"while also evolving it to be more Disney, more family, more relevant and more timeless"

Oh, no. OH, NO.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

From our vantage point - it does seem theme is being thrown out the window with Future World for random IP placement...
Have we heard for sure that theme is not important for this park anymore? Or could this just be a thematic change in direction that we can’t recognize as of yet? Maybe d23 will explain the theme for Future World??
I’m trying hard to hold out hope up in here!

see below

"while also evolving it to be more Disney, more family, more relevant and more timeless"

Oh, no. OH, NO.

...what he said

 

[BlakeW39]

The story treatment for Pandora in DAK is perfect. It is a better fit than any single IP land in any other theme park in the world. You don't have to like it, but the story treatment is great. I understand the argument on the animals themselves, they're alien, they don't really have a history in ours or any culture, but the conservation message and appreciate of animals anywhere is the greater message here.

As for Guardians, there are absolutely story treatements that could put it in Epcot. They could make it a love letter to classic Epcot and have it be on brand with the Guardians. However, even that would be a bit awkward considering all the other damage they've done/are doing to that park's original identity.

Disney has shown beyond a shadow of a doubt that they are unwilling or unable to evolve Epcot. Instead they've opted to keep some of the aesthetics and change it into some disjointed version of the Magic Kingdom with better dining.

We agree that Pandora is remarkable and is perfect for DAK.

However Epcot I don't think is turning into MK... it certainly becoming dijointed, but the teo parks fundamentally approach bekng a theme park in different ways. Magic Kingdom follows the Disneyland model where as Epcot's Future World doesn't - it doesn't seek immersion in the same way a DL type park does.

Now of course they do refuse to treat Epcot properly. Which is sad. Because with DAK they have proven that they can do it. They can keep thematic cohesion even when a theme is rather specific. And they can do it very well. But with Epcot they choose not to; and that is unfortunate.

 

[Cmdr_Crimson]

It's like an oddball version of Project Gemini...I at least could go with Discoveryland motif if Future World gets renamed..

 

[jt04]

It's like an oddball version of Project Gemini...I at least could go with Discoveryland motif if Future World gets renamed..

The amount of land on the west side of Future World is truly massive. Bioreconstruct has some great recent views. Literally enough room for something on the scale of GE AND Pandora.

He also seems to be dropping a ton of hints about MK expansion.

I think we should hear about one of two of these parks soon. D23?

 

[jt04]

This IP push is 100% the fault of Harry Potter. Universal did an exceptional job with that land, but it resulted in theme park creativity taking a major hit. Disney learned the wrong lessons from that.

It certainly proved the viability of immersion. And the profitability. SWGE and Pandora have proven it wasn't a fluke. Guests are loving it.

 

[NoChesterHester]

Although this board wants to lament the loss of the non-IP attraction and believes that the average guest is a moron; it is undeniable that the IP based lands / attractions are a huge hit. Regardless on if executives have any vision, it is going to be really hard to turn away from what is working.

 

[NoChesterHester]

This IP push is 100% the fault of Harry Potter. Universal did an exceptional job with that land, but it resulted in theme park creativity taking a major hit. Disney learned the wrong lessons from that.

Did they though... is WWoHP in any realm of the same success if it isn’t based on the lore and fan base of that franchise? While the land is very well done it’s the IP that’s driving that success.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Did they though... is WWoHP in any realm of the same success if it isn’t based on the lore and fan base of that franchise? While the land is very well done it’s the IP that’s driving that success.

Then why did Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald under perform? Being part of a franchise doesn’t just drive success.

 

[NoChesterHester]

Then why did Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald under perform? Being part of a franchise doesn’t just drive success.

I never stated IP guarantees success. See: Solo.

 

[BlakeW39]

It's like an oddball version of Project Gemini...I at least could go with Discoveryland motif if Future World gets renamed..

I highly doubt that the updates to Epcot will resemble Gemini that much. But I could be very wrong.

And maybe for the best. I like some of what Gemini was trying to do... but not all of it.

However Future World NEEDS an aesthetic more than even new attractions. A Disney theme park should not resemble a mall and almost every pavillion needs a total makeover - and I mean total.

I have doubts they will do this.