Disney to charge for Fastpass

kcw

Member
^^^^ I agree 100% with Brian, and I get a laugh everytime I hear people complain about how FP makes stand-by longer for everyone else. When I go to the parks, I rarely wait in stand-by, and I definitely never wait if it's longer than about 25 mins. I don't feel bad that people have to wait for 2 hours for a ride, because they could have done what I did and gotten a FP too :shrug: Yes, I realize that if everyone got FP and nobody stood in Stand-by that we'd have an entirely different situation on our hands, but that's not the case, and judging by the number of people who seem to always go stand-by (for whatever reason), I don't see that happening in the near future.
 

jakeman

Well-Known Member
True. But, it makes them shorter for me. So, I'm cool with that.
That is so awesomely true. I know how to use Fastpass, so my wait times are almost always shorter. I don't really feel bad for the folks in the stand-by line. No one forced them there.

I think it would be very delicate to introduce Fastpass for money this late in game. It was such a revolutionary item when it was introduced that anyone who used it more than likely remembers that something that awesome was free, regardless if they get the name right. This is a perk that I think that anyone at all who has been in the past 9 years would noticed had gone from free to requiring money and Disney is usually more subtle in s__________g money away.

I don't know how this can't be implementing without the general population saying "Hey...that was free last time I was here....that sucks."

So...suck-ing is blocked but sucks isn't...wierd...lol
 

Brian Noble

Well-Known Member
Disney would love it if we all shopped or visited restaurants while we waited for our FP window. If we all did this, the system would work as intended and lines would not be lengthed. But realistically, who does that?
Exactly.

To amplify on some of my prior comments, Fastpass appears to be a really interesting case study in how The Mouse House works. The initial rationale was that virtual queuing would allow guests to spend more money---that we were time-limited, not money-limited in our in-park spending. Disney rolled out FP on that assumption, and a few other park operators did the same thing. All of them expected higher guest spending to follow.

And, as near as I can tell, none of them actually saw it. It turned out guests were already spending as much as they comfortably could---they were money-limited in their spending, not time-limited. Instead, they used the extra time to hop in some other line, and so were enqueued twice.

In reaction to this, every other operator that had free virtual queuing (and there weren't that many) dropped it---it costs money to run (you need an extra staff member to manage the merge point, plus infrastructure) but didn't return on that investment. Cedar Fair never replaced it with anything at Cedar Point (the only park they tried it at). Universal just kept their pay-for-play versions. At the same time, Six Flags, Herschend, and Busch added or expanded their use of pay-for-play virtual queues.

Disney, however, has been the lone exception. Why? I think it's because the guests who use it and use it well, like it a lot. Because, for them, wait time in lines goes down. The guests who don't use it (or use it poorly) don't realize that their average waits have gone up, and have complained surprisingly little about all these people "cutting in line."

Disney, more than any park operator, considers guest satisfaction a marketable asset. Most operators care only if depolying a new feature returns more in revenue than it costs to deploy. Disney actively supports spending money to make its guests happy---because happy guests are return guests, and often guests who come back and "step it up a notch" on their next trip. You know, go from Value to Moderate, or Moderate to Deluxe, etc.

So, with very strong guest satisfaction numbers, Fastpass continues despite the fact that, from a strictly financial standpoint, it's nothing but a money hole. But, as more and more operators demonstrate that guests are willing to live with paid virtual queueing without backlash, I suspect that (eventually) the financial side will win out over the guest satisfaction side in the Mouse House.

So, my guess it that Fastpass will never go away completely, but Disney will eventually find a way to directly monetize it. As far as I can tell, it's only a matter of time.
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
Here's a link to an old Jim Hill article that discusses some of the technology Disney has been exploring for Fast Pass:

http://jimhillmedia.com/blogs/jim_h...ls-that-fastpass-for-pay-is-not-far-away.aspx

I know Jim Hill gets a lot of things wrong and has a bad reputation around here. But this is a publicly filed patent. So, Disney has the ability to do these things.

Whether or not they will implement them is another matter. But since they have invested money in developing the technology, I'd be very surprised if they don't eventually use it in some form or another.
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
Exactly.

To amplify on some of my prior comments, Fastpass appears to be a really interesting case study in how The Mouse House works. The initial rationale was that virtual queuing would allow guests to spend more money---that we were time-limited, not money-limited in our in-park spending. Disney rolled out FP on that assumption, and a few other park operators did the same thing. All of them expected higher guest spending to follow.

And, as near as I can tell, none of them actually saw it. It turned out guests were already spending as much as they comfortably could---they were money-limited in their spending, not time-limited. Instead, they used the extra time to hop in some other line, and so were enqueued twice.

In reaction to this, every other operator that had free virtual queuing (and there weren't that many) dropped it---it costs money to run (you need an extra staff member to manage the merge point, plus infrastructure) but didn't return on that investment. Cedar Fair never replaced it with anything at Cedar Point (the only park they tried it at). Universal just kept their pay-for-play versions. At the same time, Six Flags, Herschend, and Busch added or expanded their use of pay-for-play virtual queues.

Disney, however, has been the lone exception. Why? I think it's because the guests who use it and use it well, like it a lot. Because, for them, wait time in lines goes down. The guests who don't use it (or use it poorly) don't realize that their average waits have gone up, and have complained surprisingly little about all these people "cutting in line."

Disney, more than any park operator, considers guest satisfaction a marketable asset. Most operators care only if depolying a new feature returns more in revenue than it costs to deploy. Disney actively supports spending money to make its guests happy---because happy guests are return guests, and often guests who come back and "step it up a notch" on their next trip. You know, go from Value to Moderate, or Moderate to Deluxe, etc.

So, with very strong guest satisfaction numbers, Fastpass continues despite the fact that, from a strictly financial standpoint, it's nothing but a money hole. But, as more and more operators demonstrate that guests are willing to live with paid virtual queueing without backlash, I suspect that (eventually) the financial side will win out over the guest satisfaction side in the Mouse House.

So, my guess it that Fastpass will never go away completely, but Disney will eventually find a way to directly monetize it. As far as I can tell, it's only a matter of time.

This is probably the best post I have ever seen on the subject of Fast Pass. Well done! :sohappy:
 

pauluk

Member
Special Fastpass already exists in DLRP

Taken from the disneyland paris website:

"VIP FASTPASS®: as a Suites Guests, you get immediate access to the attractions equipped with "FASTPASS® Service".

Disney Hotel FASTPASS®: faster entry at your choice of time on some of your favourite "FASTPASS®" attractions. Available to Guests staying at the Disneyland Hotel.

http://www.disneylandparis.com/uk/good_to_know/park_information/fast_pass.htm

This looks to me like two forms of special Fastpass "Given" to guests staying at the resort.
 

EmOhYouEssE

New Member
Here's a link to an old Jim Hill article that discusses some of the technology Disney has been exploring for Fast Pass:

http://jimhillmedia.com/blogs/jim_h...ls-that-fastpass-for-pay-is-not-far-away.aspx

I know Jim Hill gets a lot of things wrong and has a bad reputation around here. But this is a publicly filed patent. So, Disney has the ability to do these things.

Whether or not they will implement them is another matter. But since they have invested money in developing the technology, I'd be very surprised if they don't eventually use it in some form or another.

Interesting article. I don't think that's the one where I read the patent originally, but it was similar. I am curious about one thing though:

I noticed the FP's they illustrated were not for WDW in Florida. The 1st one was for Soarin in DCA (I could tell by the mention of the Redwood Creek Challenge Trail on the FP, and that's in DCA) and the other two were in different languages. Do you think this is something they will try at other parks as a "test run" to see how well it works if they do try to implement it?

Em
 

EmOhYouEssE

New Member
Taken from the disneyland paris website:

"VIP FASTPASS®: as a Suites Guests, you get immediate access to the attractions equipped with "FASTPASS® Service".

Disney Hotel FASTPASS®: faster entry at your choice of time on some of your favourite "FASTPASS®" attractions. Available to Guests staying at the Disneyland Hotel.

http://www.disneylandparis.com/uk/good_to_know/park_information/fast_pass.htm

This looks to me like two forms of special Fastpass "Given" to guests staying at the resort.

That would make sense as to why the FP's illustrated in that article lebeau posted were in another language.

Thanks for the link and heads up!

Em
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
Interesting article. I don't think that's the one where I read the patent originally, but it was similar. I am curious about one thing though:

I noticed the FP's they illustrated were not for WDW in Florida. The 1st one was for Soarin in DCA (I could tell by the mention of the Redwood Creek Challenge Trail on the FP, and that's in DCA) and the other two were in different languages. Do you think this is something they will try at other parks as a "test run" to see how well it works if they do try to implement it?

Em

Kevin Yee had a similar article about the same time as this one. I tried to find a link, but apparently MiceAge is archiving the old articles. Maybe that's the one you read.

From what I understand, Disney has already done some testing of this system in Orlando. I think the FastPasses they illustrated for the article may have been mock-ups, but I don't know that for a fact.
 

MMFanCipher

Well-Known Member
It is amazing to me what a good job Disney marketing has done with FP.

FP is not a perk. It doesn't make lines any shorter. It just redistributes the wait times. People who use FP effectively have shorter waits because other people are waiting in longer stand-by lines.

If you did away with FP entirely, everyone would wait in equal lines that would move much faster than stand-by lines currently do.

Disney marketing has sold people on the idea that FP makes lines shorter. But that simply isn't true.


So be it. I like FP and will use it. Hand me another glass of kool-aid!! :p
 

jt04

Well-Known Member
Taken from the disneyland paris website:

"VIP FASTPASS®: as a Suites Guests, you get immediate access to the attractions equipped with "FASTPASS® Service".

Disney Hotel FASTPASS®: faster entry at your choice of time on some of your favourite "FASTPASS®" attractions. Available to Guests staying at the Disneyland Hotel.

http://www.disneylandparis.com/uk/good_to_know/park_information/fast_pass.htm

This looks to me like two forms of special Fastpass "Given" to guests staying at the resort.

Seems to me this would pretty much guarantee the hotels stay full. I really don't think Disney will roll this out at WDW until Flamingo Crossings, all the new DVC rooms and 4 Seasons are operating. Then the change will happen. Your room key will be your fastpass access. I also think that there will be a Premium Annual Pass available that also has the VIP fastpass included. I would love this to happen at WDW. :sohappy:
 

WhatJaneSays

Well-Known Member
As long as it's included with the APs or SPs or an "on property stay" perk I don't really care; which it most likely would be.

Like other's have said before: Disney is a company, they are in the money making business. So if this makes them additional money or saves them money they will do it. They may test this out in phases at some point to see if it is cost effective. They could even end up running a dual system (I doubt they would but you never know).
 

Susan Savia

Well-Known Member
Yep, if its gonna make them more money, then they might try it. The idea of linking it to an annual pass or room key sounds good.

____________________

Next Trip - January 2009
 

Maerj

Well-Known Member
I really hope this isnt true. This will really dent me wanting to go back to WDW, theres alot of things they're doing that Im not really pleased with, and this one will probably take the cake. Why charge after its been free for so long? Yea, other parks may do it and may have abandoned the free thing, but this is disney world, it isnt cheap to go there as is, so yea it would benefit them but it wouldnt really benefit us.

I totally agree with this. Its like you know its all about the money but they could try to be a little less obvious about it.
 

deWild

Well-Known Member
As much as many people love the FastPass idea, over the last year or so the Fastpass lines have been out the door, and the people in the regular standby have to wait almost twice as long as it would normally. I can see why Disney would consider this, but I just can't see it happening.
 

mrerk

Premium Member
I can see paying for the Ultimate Fasspass where you could walk onto any ride at anytime had a while back. I dont' know if they still do it but just for the regular run of the mill fastpass I think it is ludicrous.

Disney has never in any way, shape, or form charged for Fastpass. Perhaps you are thinking of the old E-Ticket nights where you paid extra to stay in the MK after normal closing? Kind of like the present EMH, only you had to pay for it.
 

fosse76

Well-Known Member
Illegal? Surely you are kidding. Why would the government get involved? There are plenty of place where you pay to get in and then have the option to pay for additional options.

And that's exactly why it should be regulated. What if movie theaters started charging $10.00 to get in to the movie, and then added a $2.00 seating fee? There is absolutely nothing to stop them (other than the ridicule they'd get in the press). Charging for a FP is essentially a surcharge, since many parks with the pay system have shown to have longer standby waits than before the FP system was implemented. It's called price gauging. They force the waits to be longer so that you will buy their FP system...increasing their bottom line. Call it what you want, but it's shady. And too many people think its worth the money. If you go to the Animal Kingdom for a day, it's over $70.00. What is that, 6 rides? And then force an additional $30 to cut in the lines. Just go back to the pay-per ride system. They'd probably make more money.
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member
And that's exactly why it should be regulated. What if movie theaters started charging $10.00 to get in to the movie, and then added a $2.00 seating fee? There is absolutely nothing to stop them (other than the ridicule they'd get in the press). Charging for a FP is essentially a surcharge, since many parks with the pay system have shown to have longer standby waits than before the FP system was implemented. It's called price gauging. They force the waits to be longer so that you will buy their FP system...increasing their bottom line. Call it what you want, but it's shady. And too many people think its worth the money. If you go to the Animal Kingdom for a day, it's over $70.00. What is that, 6 rides? And then force an additional $30 to cut in the lines. Just go back to the pay-per ride system. They'd probably make more money.

Actually, there are movie theaters that charge extra to sit in VIP areas. It's really no different. You have to spend more to get the perks. There's nothing shady about it.

And it's not price gauging. Disney can charge whatever the market will bear. If they raise the price too high, they will lose business to their competitors.
 

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