Fast no, but the ones who live and work in the high stress rat race Northeast don't live and work in the slower paced laid back South.
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News Disney plans to accelerate Parks investment to $60 billion over 10 years
- Thread starter CaptainAmerica
- Start date
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
I don’t disagree. That is the wrong thing in the wrong spot…but the parks DO need a lot of that type.
What the issue is they are embarsssing themselves a bit. You build it and open it. Period
Years…WDI web featurettes, dvc mag writeups, build up and announcements.
It’s not laughable…until you do that.
A pitcher has to vary his pitches or he’ll get knocked around and booed off the mound.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Reality sucks.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Silly generalities do too…especially ones not that clever
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
What a bunch of $&@!
I’ve yet to fully dissect numb’s comments today
Need an Arby’s run first
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Well the good news is Bob spoke so the markets were all up today…everyone had a good day…
…wait a minute…this just in…
…wait a minute…this just in…
Gringrinngghost
Well-Known Member
I’m back with today’s installment of why Disney is not concerned about Epic Universe and why I agree with them.
First and foremost, Disney, such as NBC Universal did with Epic Universe, would not haphazardly announce any significant projects, such as a new park, in an investor call. They would want to make a spectacle out of it, and in this game, spectacle wins. That is why it’s unlikely to see any proper response to the new park until after it opens to take the oxygen out of the room., especially a fifth gate.
Now, with the pleasantries aside, let me explain. People don’t seem to realize that when Iger says that the company isn’t concerned about Epic, it is because they weren’t caught with their pants down. Epic Universe was by far very much telegraphed since they owned all that property before Vivendi sold it when they were fiscally hurting and when the park was on one of its many close calls of bankruptcy in 2003.
So, this move was entirely telegraphed. The end game for Universal is to buy back all the land so they can own I-Drive. I recall having these discussions at Bayside Diner before a media event two years before Epic Universe was announced. A little fun bonus fact: Epic Universe was originally called Universal’s Fantastic Worlds, with Universal’s Epic Universe being planned for the overarching property moniker, but as we are all aware, Warner Bros. at the time sued them to prohibit the name. Mind you as well; we did see a Fantastic Worlds logo in 2018 on a slide that said “Universal Orlando Resort - The Next Step,” with their plans that were leaked nearly nine months before the official announcement on August 1st, 2019 – with the name originally being trademarked in June of 2018.
So, the Walt Disney Company and many of the industry insiders had known about Epic Universe over a year before Universal had even announced it and what was expected. And I can assure you that Disney has been planning their rebuttals for years. Has anyone ever wondered why they had started gaging guests' interest with the blue sky concepts at D23? Or why do we have yet to present a blue sky concept in this setting that was not specifically for Orlando? Disney is playing the long game, and they have the benefit of doing it all in a clandestine nature since they won’t have to acquire land for it.
Now, I am sure someone will say that I am hitting the copium hard, but that isn’t the case. Nobody flipped out to this scale when Universal announced Volcano Bay, but suddenly, a new theme park came into Orlando, and now it’s a problem. Disney’s bread and butter down here is Magic Kingdom, which will very likely expand with the Beyond Frontierland concept because the park has an issue with insufficient capacity. Animal Kingdom is also still a half-day park, and Pandora didn’t alleviate that concern, nor does it have nightly entertainment. So, they plan to fix these two before moving to a fifth gate.
Moving forward to Universal Orlando, by 2027, Universal Studios Florida should look like the middle of Epcot with the amount of walls. The attractions on the short list of being removed soon are Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It, Fast and the Furious: Supercharged, The Simpsons Ride (and all of Springfield), and Men in Black: Alien Attack. Simpson’s contract is rapidly approaching its close by 2027, and the Ride system is original to the park as it hasn’t changed in 30+ years. It’s expected that when The Simpsons closes, Springfield/Fast Food Blvd to the arena that they now use for Nightmare Fuel at Halloween Horror Nights will be finally redone, including Men in Black. Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It is expected to close as early as Q1 of 2025 due to many factors, including the sheer cost of money they've sunk into the ride. El Toro Ryan discusses about the issues with the ride here.
Fast and the Furious: Supercharged, its closure I don’t immediately have a timetable for, but it anticipated that Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It would be replaced with a new rollercoaster that would possibly be Fast in the Furious themed. There have been talks of replacing the current Fast in the Furious building with a Rollercoaster à la Penguin Trek at SeaWorld Orlando. Universal still has the Lost Continent in Islands of Adventure, which badly needs to be redone and has been abandoned. They also made a poor attempt at removing Poseidon’s Fury signage; they only covered up Poseidon’s Fury but never covered up the tagline “Escape from the Lost City.” This does not go into other general improvements they need to make, which will be happening down the line.
Overall, in the short term, Disney will feel an effect that will be guaranteed, and they have lost some Cast for Universal already, but that is to be expected as it looks good on a resume that you helped open a new theme park. Disney is well underway with its plans to provide a rebuttal for Epic Universe beyond what has been teased. If anything, the true unexpected thing from all of this is SeaWorld trying to throw their hat into the ring with both forthcoming hotels, one of which is taking out parking for their employees. That said, if we go back to 2023 comments about Walt Disney World adding 13,000 new jobs for Walt Disney World, as I have previously stated, Universal’s workforce is about 28,000 people. So he’ll need to do a lot of expansion to hit that 13,000-person goal.
Lastly, It also doesn’t help that Universal Creative & Walt Disney Imagineering are very much the same in terms of who they employ for a project. The best way I can describe it is with this joke: These two are so inbred they make a family tree in Alabama blush.
First and foremost, Disney, such as NBC Universal did with Epic Universe, would not haphazardly announce any significant projects, such as a new park, in an investor call. They would want to make a spectacle out of it, and in this game, spectacle wins. That is why it’s unlikely to see any proper response to the new park until after it opens to take the oxygen out of the room., especially a fifth gate.
Now, with the pleasantries aside, let me explain. People don’t seem to realize that when Iger says that the company isn’t concerned about Epic, it is because they weren’t caught with their pants down. Epic Universe was by far very much telegraphed since they owned all that property before Vivendi sold it when they were fiscally hurting and when the park was on one of its many close calls of bankruptcy in 2003.
So, this move was entirely telegraphed. The end game for Universal is to buy back all the land so they can own I-Drive. I recall having these discussions at Bayside Diner before a media event two years before Epic Universe was announced. A little fun bonus fact: Epic Universe was originally called Universal’s Fantastic Worlds, with Universal’s Epic Universe being planned for the overarching property moniker, but as we are all aware, Warner Bros. at the time sued them to prohibit the name. Mind you as well; we did see a Fantastic Worlds logo in 2018 on a slide that said “Universal Orlando Resort - The Next Step,” with their plans that were leaked nearly nine months before the official announcement on August 1st, 2019 – with the name originally being trademarked in June of 2018.
So, the Walt Disney Company and many of the industry insiders had known about Epic Universe over a year before Universal had even announced it and what was expected. And I can assure you that Disney has been planning their rebuttals for years. Has anyone ever wondered why they had started gaging guests' interest with the blue sky concepts at D23? Or why do we have yet to present a blue sky concept in this setting that was not specifically for Orlando? Disney is playing the long game, and they have the benefit of doing it all in a clandestine nature since they won’t have to acquire land for it.
Now, I am sure someone will say that I am hitting the copium hard, but that isn’t the case. Nobody flipped out to this scale when Universal announced Volcano Bay, but suddenly, a new theme park came into Orlando, and now it’s a problem. Disney’s bread and butter down here is Magic Kingdom, which will very likely expand with the Beyond Frontierland concept because the park has an issue with insufficient capacity. Animal Kingdom is also still a half-day park, and Pandora didn’t alleviate that concern, nor does it have nightly entertainment. So, they plan to fix these two before moving to a fifth gate.
Moving forward to Universal Orlando, by 2027, Universal Studios Florida should look like the middle of Epcot with the amount of walls. The attractions on the short list of being removed soon are Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It, Fast and the Furious: Supercharged, The Simpsons Ride (and all of Springfield), and Men in Black: Alien Attack. Simpson’s contract is rapidly approaching its close by 2027, and the Ride system is original to the park as it hasn’t changed in 30+ years. It’s expected that when The Simpsons closes, Springfield/Fast Food Blvd to the arena that they now use for Nightmare Fuel at Halloween Horror Nights will be finally redone, including Men in Black. Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It is expected to close as early as Q1 of 2025 due to many factors, including the sheer cost of money they've sunk into the ride. El Toro Ryan discusses about the issues with the ride here.
Fast and the Furious: Supercharged, its closure I don’t immediately have a timetable for, but it anticipated that Hollywood Rip Ride Rock It would be replaced with a new rollercoaster that would possibly be Fast in the Furious themed. There have been talks of replacing the current Fast in the Furious building with a Rollercoaster à la Penguin Trek at SeaWorld Orlando. Universal still has the Lost Continent in Islands of Adventure, which badly needs to be redone and has been abandoned. They also made a poor attempt at removing Poseidon’s Fury signage; they only covered up Poseidon’s Fury but never covered up the tagline “Escape from the Lost City.” This does not go into other general improvements they need to make, which will be happening down the line.
Overall, in the short term, Disney will feel an effect that will be guaranteed, and they have lost some Cast for Universal already, but that is to be expected as it looks good on a resume that you helped open a new theme park. Disney is well underway with its plans to provide a rebuttal for Epic Universe beyond what has been teased. If anything, the true unexpected thing from all of this is SeaWorld trying to throw their hat into the ring with both forthcoming hotels, one of which is taking out parking for their employees. That said, if we go back to 2023 comments about Walt Disney World adding 13,000 new jobs for Walt Disney World, as I have previously stated, Universal’s workforce is about 28,000 people. So he’ll need to do a lot of expansion to hit that 13,000-person goal.
Lastly, It also doesn’t help that Universal Creative & Walt Disney Imagineering are very much the same in terms of who they employ for a project. The best way I can describe it is with this joke: These two are so inbred they make a family tree in Alabama blush.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
…a lot to unpack on that one.
eddie104
Well-Known Member
Some of things you said regarding Universal are not true regarding closures.
MIB and Supercharged are not going anywhere anytime soon.
Poseidon's Fury already has a replacement in development but it’s not ready yet due to them trying to choose a ride system.
All this info can be found on the IU forums from notable insiders.
Rich Brownn
Well-Known Member
Disney has gone from being proactive to reactive to Universal. of course they will respond to Epic... eventually. But we've already seen what a delayed response can do coupled with greed - IOA outdrew 3 of Disney parks last year and even USF outdrew 2 of them... something unthinkable a few years ago
Gringrinngghost
Well-Known Member
Funny thing is, I’ve been hearing the opposite and have had private discussions on both MIB and Supercharged. Both with current TMs and with some of those insiders that are on IU.
Secondly, in the case of Posideon’s Fury, if you notice I’ve never said anything outside of them for now abandoning the area, which is factually true. They initially were to close both Sinbad and Poseidon for Zelda. Well, Sinbad’s theater is also abandoned for all intents and purposes when they don’t need an extended queue for Hagrids.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
They will be in the mid 30’s - Minimum - in market share by next year
That’s unthinkable and no way to spin that as a “good” number by any part of the Disney fan’s imagination
Eric Graham
Well-Known Member
Probably nothing to do with a lower inflation report...maybe
DisneyHead123
Well-Known Member
My thought is this - any way you slice it, Universal is going to have a shiny new park with an emphasis on immersive theming.
Say Disney had rushed out to build some shiny new lands the second they heard about this. What would that accomplish in the long run? Would it keep people from going to Universal’s new park? No. Once EU is built, it will be a competitive force to contend with moving forward.
I’m all for market forces leading to better products, so I’m glad for this development overall. But my take is that a theme park is not like an Xbox or a trendy toy where you rush to be the It Item in time for the holiday season. These kinds of investments are by nature going to move more slowly - an idea that is somewhat anathema to people who are used to our super fast paced world, but there’s no getting around that with that level of construction involved. Any game in such an arena is going to be by definition a long game, at least at our current rate of construction. If Disney builds Beyond Big Thunder, is Universal then being foolish if they don’t rush out and build yet another new land before it opens? Should Universal be building cruise ships to compete with Disney’s additions? Etc.
I’m not uncritical of Disney by any means. But in this particular instance, I actually don’t know that rushing into some kind of tit for tat build-off would make any sense. They’ve been focused on building rides that appeal to older kids and boys for awhile now, doing the slow(ish) and steady thing to build up their offerings.
Say Disney had rushed out to build some shiny new lands the second they heard about this. What would that accomplish in the long run? Would it keep people from going to Universal’s new park? No. Once EU is built, it will be a competitive force to contend with moving forward.
I’m all for market forces leading to better products, so I’m glad for this development overall. But my take is that a theme park is not like an Xbox or a trendy toy where you rush to be the It Item in time for the holiday season. These kinds of investments are by nature going to move more slowly - an idea that is somewhat anathema to people who are used to our super fast paced world, but there’s no getting around that with that level of construction involved. Any game in such an arena is going to be by definition a long game, at least at our current rate of construction. If Disney builds Beyond Big Thunder, is Universal then being foolish if they don’t rush out and build yet another new land before it opens? Should Universal be building cruise ships to compete with Disney’s additions? Etc.
I’m not uncritical of Disney by any means. But in this particular instance, I actually don’t know that rushing into some kind of tit for tat build-off would make any sense. They’ve been focused on building rides that appeal to older kids and boys for awhile now, doing the slow(ish) and steady thing to build up their offerings.
Advisable Joseph
Well-Known Member
Emphasis mine.
Bob Iger says Disney shouldn’t be stressed out by Universal’s Epic Universe
Disney's CEO Bob Iger spoke Wednesday at an investor conference.
floridapolitics.com
And recall this coversation:
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Advisable Joseph
Well-Known Member
eddie104
Well-Known Member
Disney is not gonna rapidly loose market share once Epic opens as some have claimed on here.
They are an entrenched well know brand with a huge following despite their blunders.
I think a lot of us forget that Universal being this competitive is still a relatively new phenomenon.
Maybe in the last decade or so since Potter opened has there been talk of a response to that land. Galaxy’s Edge was the answer but it wasn’t as successful imo.
Comcast has decided to go all in on their parks division lately so now here we are with the current discussions.
They are an entrenched well know brand with a huge following despite their blunders.
I think a lot of us forget that Universal being this competitive is still a relatively new phenomenon.
Maybe in the last decade or so since Potter opened has there been talk of a response to that land. Galaxy’s Edge was the answer but it wasn’t as successful imo.
Comcast has decided to go all in on their parks division lately so now here we are with the current discussions.