News Disney offers to pay union members at least $15 by 2021

[Nubs70]

Every dow 30, second largest media company on earth, who gets 35% and rising of PROFIT (not revenue) from 3 amusement park compounds in a 7.5 billion person world?

Yes

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Yes

Well...they all think that Wharton knows best..

But the rat always has something to say about that. Family business at heart.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Folks, she doesn't average 1000 posts a month for nothing. Dynamite drop in here.

I post to kill time...it’s a problem - no argument...

But I’ll never get patronizing, “mom and dad” type quips that are devoid of meaning. It’s usually just ends up being a Disney defense without thought (though not here). But make an argument or supply a fact, or advice, or encouragement...something...

 

[Nubs70]

Well...they all think that Wharton knows best..

But the rat always has something to say about that. Family business at heart.

I have worked for many different companies both large and small. All use NPV for project justification but with constraints that are unique to their specific business circumstance. NPV is a basic to the realm of finance as flow is to thermodynamics, length is to engineering, density is to volume, etc.

 

[Katie G]

Before you posted a total fallacy regarding this. Now you are posting a half truth.

Automation is coming. It has NOTHING to do with starting hourly wage for CMs.



Essentially your argument is.....

This one thing sucks. So this other thing should suck also. It’s only fair!

Interesting how that argument only works one way though.

Essentially my argument is.....
Consider the market of Central Florida. You have people who are actually skilled or further educated than the CM who are asking for this pay increase. And if the CM get that pay increase, they will be just shy of those skilled workers but without skill. Market conditions matter.
If the entire market "sucks" then the cost of living in the area must be able to match. I managed to live on far less starting pay than the CM are making now, working part time, in Miami of all places (higher cost of living than Orlando). Then I got a degree and skills and moved on from starting pay. Its possible to live at that level but not luxurious. People make decisions with how they spend their money then complain that they don't make enough to do all the things everyone else does. Make better choices and work to improve your conditions. You shouldn't be at starting pay forever.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I have worked for many different companies both large and small. All use NPV for project justification but with constraints that are unique to their specific business circumstance. NPV is a basic to the realm of finance as flow is to thermodynamics, length is to engineering, density is to volume, etc.

You’ve worked for many Disney’s? Selling emotion and non tangible products more than consumer goods?

 

[21stamps]

You’ve worked for many Disney’s? Selling emotion and non tangible products more than consumer goods?

You just described every Timeshare sale (which is a much greater intangible at the point of sale) and most Vacation destinations, and a whole wide range of companies providing many items for purchase.

To add, I don’t think Disney should even be in the intangible category. You’re paying for a room for specific dates where you will sleep, you’re paying for a meal that you will eat, you’re paying for park tickets that allow you entry into a park with listed attractions for specific dates. Those are not intangibles at the point of sale.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

This is true....

It’s more the parks that make them unique, however. The only other reasonable comparison is Comcast...but they make their profits off more things than Disney does.

 

[ford91exploder]

Here’s the rub with CM = Entry Level being a disney cm in most cases is actually a customer service job. Its not stacking boxes its making a customers day a great experience.

Yet increasingly disney hires people whose only qualification is they have a pulse and at their current pay scale thats the only applicant that they will get. Then add the indentured servants from the CP. And the taxpayer subsidized hires from the carribean for mousekeepers under the H1a visa program. Not the ideal mix of labor. Its easy to see why some of the best interactions come from new CP’ers who havent been ground down by the system. As CP’ers are self selected at least initially to believe in the Disney magic.

 

[ford91exploder]

Essentially my argument is.....
Consider the market of Central Florida. You have people who are actually skilled or further educated than the CM who are asking for this pay increase. And if the CM get that pay increase, they will be just shy of those skilled workers but without skill. Market conditions matter.
If the entire market "sucks" then the cost of living in the area must be able to match. I managed to live on far less starting pay than the CM are making now, working part time, in Miami of all places (higher cost of living than Orlando). Then I got a degree and skills and moved on from starting pay. Its possible to live at that level but not luxurious. People make decisions with how they spend their money then complain that they don't make enough to do all the things everyone else does. Make better choices and work to improve your conditions. You shouldn't be at starting pay forever.

Unless of course the government keeps IMPORTING labor which distorts the supply and demand process by having a infinitely elastic labor pool thereby causing wages to become inelastic. It's THIS mechanism which keeps people at minimum wage for far longer than intended as minimum wage was intended to be a 'training' wage for teens and other first time entrants into the labor markets.

Now with millions of immigrants flooding in the minimum wage in many cases has become a wage ceiling as well no matter how skilled the workers become because if you can fill a position for minimum wage irrespective of skill - well as a business person you are going to do that especially in a public company.

 

[larryz]

You just described every Timeshare sale (which is a much greater intangible at the point of sale) and most Vacation destinations, and a whole wide range of companies providing many items for purchase.

To add, I don’t think Disney should even be in the intangible category. You’re paying for a room for specific dates where you will sleep, you’re paying for a meal that you will eat, you’re paying for park tickets that allow you entry into a park with listed attractions for specific dates. Those are not intangibles at the point of sale.

Correct. The room, the meals, the entry to parks... that's all tangible.

It's the long-term value that's intangible.

 

[21stamps]

Correct. The room, the meals, the entry to parks... that's all tangible.

It's the long-term value that's intangible.

The wording bothered me.. there are many intangible assets, Disney is not “selling an emotional and intangible product more than consumer goods”. There is a certain intangible/emotion involved, as I said, but this exists with many vacations and other forms of entertainment when purchased by a consumer.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The wording bothered me.. there are many intangible assets, Disney is not “selling an emotional and intangible product more than consumer goods”. There is a certain intangible/emotion involved, as I said, but this exists with many vacations and other forms of entertainment when purchased by a consumer.

I understand you don’t like the wording...but the intangible determines the prices they can charge. It’s 90% emotional.

Mine train is not worth the cost...nor is soarin...nor is a character buffet.

Just ask anyone who will pay whatever to get the “wow” factor...you’ll see...it’s a mental thing

 

[21stamps]

I understand you don’t like the wording...but the intangible determines the prices they can charge. It’s 90% emotional.

Mine train is not worth the cost...nor is soarin...nor is a character buffet.

Just ask anyone who will pay whatever to get the “wow” factor...you’ll see...it’s a mental thing

I don’t like incorrect wording attempting to make a point based on a false statement.

There is an intangible element to almost every decision.. hence why marketing campaigns are so huge. That doesn’t make the item sold an intangible more than a tangible good.

You attempted to do the following,
Claim it’s an intangible sale (which I’d agree with to a degree at the point of a DVC sale, but not a vacation package sale).
Claim that this makes them different than all other companies.

It doesn’t make them different, it’s what almost all vacation companies are doing, and have always done. Again, hence marketing campaigns.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I don’t like incorrect wording attempting to make a point based on a false statement.

There is an intangible element to almost every decision.. hence why marketing campaigns are so huge. That doesn’t make the item sold an intangible more than a tangible good.

You attempted to do the following,
Claim it’s an intangible sale (which I’d agree with to a degree at the point of a DVC sale, but not a vacation package sale).
Claim that this makes them different than all other companies.

It doesn’t make them different, it’s what almost all vacation companies are doing, and have always done. Again, hence marketing campaigns.

There’s a significant degree of intangible in the sale of every disney “product”....as opposed to little at Macy’s or a Chevy dealership...

I’ll clarify that if it needs clarifying.

But still, don’t you know anyone who just gets the “wow” factor? Their eyes light up and the brain goes to a happy place...

And you can’t put a tangible value/price on that...so it’s limitless. People should pay as much as they can dig out under the couch cushions for that....
And that’s the magic, any old employees at any old pay can deliver that...it all makes sense.

 

[21stamps]

There’s a significant degree of intangible in the sale of every disney “product”....as opposed to little at Macy’s or a Chevy dealership...

I’ll clarify that if it needs clarifying.

But still, don’t you know anyone who just gets the “wow” factor? Their eyes light up and the brain goes to a happy place...

And you can’t put a tangible value/price on that...so it’s limitless. People should pay as much as they can dig out under the couch cushions for that....
And that’s the magic, any old employees at any old pay can deliver that...it all makes sense.

This is what you asked of Nubs-

You’ve worked for many Disney’s? Selling emotion and non tangible products more than consumer goods?

3rd try at addressing the errors in your statement/questions.

1 - As I said, almost every vacation product has an emotion/intangible aspect to it. Disney is not unique in being a company who plays to emotion on their marketing.

2 - doing so does not equal “selling intangible products.”

I’ll add something here.. go look up a commercial of anything you choose, a vacation destination, a hotel, a tour, a day at any park. All of these will filled with intangibles. I know you like to use a lot of words and pretend that no one else has as much knowledge of any subject as you claim to have, but try to realize that we’re all adults, with life, educational, and professional experiences. Most adults are able to recognize that Disney is not alone in many things that they do, including the emotional/intangible asset. You can find it everywhere. This is the beauty of marketing.

 

[eliza61nyc]

And the company you work for allows you to just call sick without any ramifications to you at all? You can just call sick whenever you want? Hey you're sick it shouldn't count against you? The fact of the matter under Disney's current contract you can call sick once a month for 11 consecutive months, and as long as you skip that 12-month, you're going to be just fine without any actual reprimand coming to you. That seems more than generous.

Absolutely. I get 15 sick days a year, I use them or lose them. Yes I can call in any day sick. Now if I use 7 days of sick time in a row on the 8th day I go on short term disability. We can use our sick time for family members also, that way moms can use their sick days to take kiddies to doctors appointments.

I wish my company would reprimand someone for using their sick days. lol. but I will say that is exactly the reason why I stayed in college after working at the 34th street Macy's and walmart. customer service jobs are the worst paid, worst treated employees on the planet.

So I won't get into the current argument, let me just say that dealing with John q. public is no picinic and that I firmly believe in you get what you paid for. pay a person poverty wages, then you get someone who gives that type of effort.

 

[kong1802]

I understand that, there are people in a bad place, and it’s sad. This is why I used “perfect world”... emotions can’t overrun logic though.
People have to look at the big picture. The more money that a company must spend on payroll, especially for unskilled positions, the less people who will have a job.
It doesn’t just impact the lowest level, it raises everyone above them as well.

Wait a minute...

The person who says no one should complain about paying more for a good or service is now complaining for a company (who hasn't asked them to, just is doing it in their free time) about the company having to pay more for a service......... Didn't realize it was a one way street....

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

This is what you asked of Nubs-



3rd try at addressing the errors in your statement/questions.

1 - As I said, almost every vacation product has an emotion/intangible aspect to it. Disney is not unique in being a company who plays to emotion on their marketing.

2 - doing so does not equal “selling intangible products.”

What aren’t you understanding here?

I’m saying disney is unique in selling goods with a heavy amount of emotional appeal. That is why they can charge what they do for product that would not be comparable in prices without that legacy and attachment.

And why many of us caution: “don’t push it”. A cracked damn is as viable as a broken one...failure is inevitable.

But what about the “wow” factor?!? Isn’t that the emotional, non-tangible perspective?

Or do you climb up the forced perspective storefronts on Main Street USA and lick the paint for a snack...tangibly?

Or is it emotional? Can’t put a price on that...just can’t.

 

[WDWTrojan]

There are exceptions, but I typically have much more pleasant interactions with the CPs than the full timers.

There are certainly some great CPs and some awfully bitter FTs. The issue is that the cyclical nature of the CP program leaves little room for truly passionate, highly skilled lifers who really deliver the magic for many years. Additionally, for every great CP you meet, there's at least two on their way out the door who are over it.