Disney is lying to us.

[JIMINYCR]

So, I'm gonna complain about this the same way I complain about FP+. Sorry in advance to those who don't agree, but not everyone who visits WDW loves to plan every step we walk weeks in advance. Sometimes you wanna see how you feel about your next day at Disney. I can't tell you how many times we planned out the trip... MK on these two days, Epcot on another two, DHS on yet two others, and AK on the last remaining day, in whatever order. It's not so much the planning part, but the lack of flexibility. So, when I planned the vacation 2 months ago, I thought I wanted to do Epcot on the Day 2, but we decided to jump from MK to Epcot in the evening for dinner on Day 1, so now we want to do DHS on Day 2 and push Epcot back a day. That kind of spontaneity is no longer possible at WDW and still be able to experience most of the attractions.

A reservation system and FP+ make it IMPOSSIBLE to be spontaneous. What fun is that? It's a vacation that you're spending enough to purchase a car. The least they can do is allow you to enjoy it rather make it feel like work. For work I realize meetings are scheduled ahead of time, but even then you have to be flexible when your boss wants to meet tomorrow at 9am or whatever. Why is it for vacation you have to be on a strict schedule all the time. It sucks. It might be great for folks who are OCD about planning out every second of every day, but for many it makes it far less enjoyable. It's one of the reasons I haven't been back to WDW in years. Not that TWDC or anyone on these boards cares I haven't been back, but I'm sure there are at least 2 or 3 other people in this country who feel like I do.

I'm a planner and dont mind getting details in place in advance but still the feel of my vacation has changed dramatically with the restrictive policies Disneys required. I like having the ability to change my mind or alter whats going to be done day to day. We always got PH's for that very reason but even that has gotten restrictive to where on our last trip was the first time we didnt buy in because it wasnt worth the money paid out. Its my vacation and my time... I should have the option to spend it as I wish. Excessive crowding has caused this to happen over time and yes, Disney doesnt care. The moneys still flowing in but I'm sure more guests are coming away from their trips more unpleased than years ago. Its one thing when new guests didnt plan anything and get angry about missed details and guests who know how to plan miss out from being locked out.

 

[ElvisMickey]

I was at Epcot yesterday and it was packed it could not of been at 35% capacity. I would say it was 50+ so why are they still doing Park reservations?

Disney has lied to us since Bob Iger became CEO…

 

[Tay]

We went in February and it seemed crowded then. There were tons of kids too (considering it was a week day in February during a pandemic). In reality though, it wasn't. Full capacity is over packed so... I don't think I ever want to go during school breaks or summer ever again.

Same I’m never going in summer ever again.

 

[Tay]

Magic Kingdom was packed Wednesday. Disney is getting off on a technicality. Technically, they are right because none of the parks are ever packed to their true max capacity. However it’s so grimy to go off max capacity instead of pre pandemic average capacity and pretend like you’re limiting attendance to look good and not having enough staff.

I miss the days when you could just go to the parks and not have to plan like you’re going to a foreign country.

The additions haven’t kept up with the increase in attendance.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Am I seeing things or are most of the days in the park pass calendars green even when I look on a Friday for the next day? It sure looks like others are saying they are limiting based on max capacity, for example the Magic Kingdom’s max capacity is 100K.

COVID aside, the MOBS are BACK! Or so it seems…

 

[larryz]

Disney started lying to us when they said there was "magic" involved.

 

[JAB]

I understand what you are saying, but still disagree. I think that the definition of spontaneous is different for everyone. I stated my visiting in 1983. All that existed at the time was MK and EPCOT (just opened). That was pure spontaneity. You bought a ticket, mine was through a travel agent, went any day it was open, at any time. No such thing as a Fastpass. No such thing as ADR's You used the computer kiosks to make a dining reservation after you arrived. Plus all the quick dining establishments in each park where open. The ticket were called Passports which meant go to either park whenever you felt like it. Hope on the monorail to EPCOT and then return to MK if you wanted too. Actually you might have to because if you stayed offsite like I did, you had to return to wherever you had parked when you got there.

Even the paper FP's gave the same spontaneity as before except there were more parks and they were hard to get any really good ones unless you arrived at the crack of dawn and got to your favorite ride kiosk before it ran out. Then you were obligated to run back and forth to kiosks once your window time was done or you used it. It was more difficult to get into restaurants and that was probably because they started closing down the large quick service areas both in MK and EPCOT. So you did have to spend time finding whatever nourishment you could. Also the standby lines became a longer wait.

Then along came FP+ and ALL SPONTANEITY went out the window. So from that point on I had to plan which park by choosing my Fastpasses. Now they just ask what park first. No difference that I can see.

You missed my point.

I don't disagree that FP+ pushed many people to decide on their park days in advance, so I agree that, for you and the many others like you who chose their FP+ reservations in advance and didn't park hop (or only made FP+ reservations for their first park every day), they are essentially the same. However, my point was that just because that's true for you and others doesn't mean the assertion that Park Pass reservations are the same thing as having to choose parks to select FP+ is true for everyone.

• Park Pass is required for park entry; FP+ was not. This is a key difference; you didn't have to make FP+ reservations if you didn't want or need to. Just because guests could choose FP+ in advance doesn't mean everyone did. As I said, I know some people who refused to reserve FP+ because they didn't want to be "locked in" and wanted to go to whatever park they "felt like" on the day. Even if guests made FP+ reservations, they didn't have to go to that park. In addition, local APs could just pop into a park for shopping, dining, or a few rides without needing to make FP+ reservations. Now these same scenarios require people to make reservations that they didn't have to before.
• Park Pass forces you to visit your "chosen" park first; FP+ did not. Some guests would make afternoon FP+ reservations for headliner attractions at one park, and then rope drop the headliner attractions at a different park. Obviously, this one is currently not applicable since FP+ isn't available, but if FP comes back with Park Pass still in place as is, this won't be possible, and will definitely be a difference for those guests.
• Park Pass limits the number of reservations APs can make; FP+ did not. APs could make FP+ reservations 30 days in advance for whatever days as they wanted and they could still visit the parks in the meantime. With Park Pass, they are limited to three park reservations at a time, and if they made all three 30 days in advance as they could with FP+, they'd be locked out the parks for a month.
• Park Pass only allows APs staying at off-site resorts to reserve 3 days of their trip; FP+ allowed them to reserve 7 days.

(Edited to correct # of AP FP+ days)

 

[castlecake2.0]

The park isn't full. There are only a handful of days per year MK is at capacity. Disney hasn't staffed it appropriately because it costs them money, therefore artificially lowering capacity limits.

There’s a difference between fire code capacity and guest satisfaction capacity

 

[lazyboy97o]

There’s a difference between fire code capacity and guest satisfaction capacity

There is no fire code capacity for theme parks or any sort of campus.

 

[Lilofan]

There’s a difference between fire code capacity and guest satisfaction capacity

Buildings inspected by inspectors should have max capacity numbers.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Buildings inspected by inspectors should have max capacity numbers.

Why? Only certain types of spaces, mostly assembly spaces, have true maximum occupant loads.

 

[Lilofan]

Why? Only certain types of spaces, mostly assembly spaces, have true maximum occupant loads.

I'm referring to buildings ( ie restaurants ) .

 

[castlecake2.0]

There is no fire code capacity for theme parks or any sort of campus.

Sorry should have called it physical capacity

 

[castlecake2.0]

Buildings inspected by inspectors should have max capacity numbers.

I’m referring to park “capacity” for park passes not individual capacity for buildings within the park

 

[Lilofan]

I’m referring to park “capacity” for park passes not individual capacity for buildings within the park

Whatever the capacity on NYE but 10 years ago one could not even see the pavement in World Showcase in Epcot with every inch of space occupied by many and moving at a snail pace to get around with people everywhere. It was around 85 degrees that day too.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I believe they told us weeks ago they were increasing attendance. I could have sworn Bob Chapek said it in answer to a question. They didn't give a number but I agree they are at 50% or even a little higher. Come October 1, everyone expects real full capacity, what most would call full, not New Years Eve or 4th of July but extremely crowded.

Great…then they should do their job and manage crowds.

 

[Goofyernmost]

You missed my point.

I don't disagree that FP+ pushed many people to decide on their park days in advance, so I agree that, for you and the many others like you who chose their FP+ reservations in advance and didn't park hop (or only made FP+ reservations for their first park every day), they are essentially the same. However, my point was that just because that's true for you and others doesn't mean the assertion that Park Pass reservations are the same thing as having to choose parks to select FP+ is true for everyone.

• Park Pass is required for park entry; FP+ was not. This is a key difference; you didn't have to make FP+ reservations if you didn't want or need to. Just because guests could choose FP+ in advance doesn't mean everyone did. As I said, I know some people who refused to reserve FP+ because they didn't want to be "locked in" and wanted to go to whatever park they "felt like" on the day. Even if guests made FP+ reservations, they didn't have to go to that park. In addition, local APs could just pop into a park for shopping, dining, or a few rides without needing to make FP+ reservations. Now these same scenarios require people to make reservations that they didn't have to before.
• Park Pass forces you to visit your "chosen" park first; FP+ did not. Some guests would make afternoon FP+ reservations for headliner attractions at one park, and then rope drop the headliner attractions at a different park. Obviously, this one is currently not applicable since FP+ isn't available, but if FP comes back with Park Pass still in place as is, this won't be possible, and will definitely be a difference for those guests.
• Park Pass limits the number of reservations APs can make; FP+ did not. APs could make FP+ reservations 30 days in advance for whatever days as they wanted and they could still visit the parks in the meantime. With Park Pass, they are limited to three park reservations at a time, and if they made all three 30 days in advance as they could with FP+, they'd be locked out the parks for a month.
• Park Pass only allows APs staying at off-site resorts to reserve 3 days of their trip; FP+ allowed them to reserve all their days.

I don't see how they are going to stop people that wanted to go to MK with a paid ticket from going there without that blowing up in their faces. If I drove from NC to Florida to go to MK and didn't want an ADR or a FP how many times do you think I would come back to the place if they wouldn't let me in. I don't think that is how it can possibly work, it is way to complicated and anger inducing. They have made a number of bad decisions but this one would almost be able to be called nuclear. Hello Universal.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I don't see how they are going to stop people that wanted to go to MK with a paid ticket from going there without that blowing up in their faces. If I drove from NC to Florida to go to MK and didn't want an ADR or a FP how many times do you think I would come back to the place if they wouldn't let me in. I don't think that is how it can possibly work, it is way to complicated and anger inducing. They have made a number of bad decisions but this one would almost be able to be called nuclear. Hello Universal.

They stop people by not letting them enter. Their ticket does not display as valid. It doesn’t matter if it makes sense to you. That is the system that is in place and has been in place for over a year now.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I don't see how they are going to stop people that wanted to go to MK with a paid ticket from going there without that blowing up in their faces. If I drove from NC to Florida to go to MK and didn't want an ADR or a FP how many times do you think I would come back to the place if they wouldn't let me in. I don't think that is how it can possibly work, it is way to complicated and anger inducing. They have made a number of bad decisions but this one would almost be able to be called nuclear. Hello Universal.

That’s over…
You’re going to have to reserve and play that game

 

[Goofyernmost]

They stop people by not letting them enter. Their ticket does not display as valid. It doesn’t matter if it makes sense to you. That is the system that is in place and has been in place for over a year now.

I'm not thinking they should be different because I don't like it. Hell, I hardly go anymore anyway and actually have gotten to the point where I like Universal better. I'm just saying that if that is a management policy that is going to stay in place I might just change my long range opinion that they will take a long time before they become another Kodak. It's one thing to overcharge but to overcharge and then not give people what they paid for will not be a power for very long. It might not matter to Disney if it makes sense to me, but it matters to me and my money can easily go some other direction. Others who just think that they have to go there, deserve to waste their money.