Interesting. The woman says there was no malicious contact between her and the complainant. This will make for interesting reading when the court record comes out. Hard to believe there's no video available on this...
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Disney guest chokes girl who was blocking view of fireworks, deputies say
- Thread starter Dead2009
- Start date
Otterhead
Well-Known Member
And when they choose to ignore actual facts in favor of doom and gloom? That's when I wonder why some folks are on a message board called WDWMagic. But hey, everyone's gotta have a hobby.
You can reply to this to get your 1,000th message.
12 acres does not a "massive" expansion make when all you're doing is tearing old stuff down and replacing it with new stuff.
Nubs70
Well-Known Member
Since WDW is a resort complex with theme parks,
Why not limit attendance to resort guests only?
Build resort capacity in ratio to available park capacity, say 1.13 to 1.
This would guarantee maximum desired hotel occupancy and a more enjoyable park experience.
draybook
Well-Known Member
My guess is because this isn't North Korea and we don't have to just "go with the flow" on public forums? It's okay to have a negative outlook on the parks. It's okay to feel the same way about the company as a whole. It's okay to think that the product they're putting out isn't on par with past offerings. My guess is that those of us who people like you deem as the doom and gloomers will still be a part of those park attendance figures, but even constructive criticism should be valued by any brand out there.
21stamps
Well-Known Member
Right.
I hate the term ROI when it comes to a vacation.
It just doesn't make sense to me.
Nubs70
Well-Known Member
If one considers a WDW trip an investment, the expected experience must reach a level of satisfaction to justify the price point.
A better term would be ROE, return on expense.
Otterhead
Well-Known Member
Tearing down an arena show and a parking lot to be replaced with a billion-plus-dollar expansion with multiple E-tickets, restaurants, and a shopping district isn't a large improvement in your eyes? Ok, duly noted. Then again, you just admitted you're here to troll, so hey, again, have fun.
21stamps
Well-Known Member
Expense is a much better term. A vacation is not an investment.
Even with the correct wording though, I don't understand why someone would chose to take on an expense if they are unhappy with the place where they will be spending their money.lol
Nubs70
Well-Known Member
WDW markets a vacation as an experience. When evaluating a potential vacation versus the expense, an expectation is developed, a return on expense.
If the expense does not meet the expectation derived from WDW marketing, guest satisfaction is not met. This leads to once and done customers and bad "word of mouth".
I would love to create an advertisement based on the entire life cycle of a WDW vacation. From trip decision making to 180 ADR planning, to 60 day FP planning, to day of FP planning, to bus lines, to security theater, to ECV encounters, to stroller brigades. Kind of like the experience you have outlined in parts of your trip report.
21stamps
Well-Known Member
Not sure which report or which part of them you are referring to..but the WDW trip planning life cycle is definitely a strange one.lol
What I've found though, it that most of our stress and disappointment is self inflicted. ADRs do not need to be made at 180 days, there are only a few FP's that need to be done at 60 days..and not everything needs to be scheduled hour by hour. I think we have done that to ourselves, Disney didn't do it to us.
I've never looked at WDW as a complete bubble, not as a child and not now. I've also never gone to WDW and tried to "get my money's worth" by being at the parks non stop. When I was a kid we spent time at the resort we were staying at..and the parks. I've always done the same on adult trips, and then mother trips.
When something disappointing happens- i.e. A multi hour lunch at Garden Grill and running too close to the Candlelight Processional time., it's frustrating, very much so. However, it doesn't overshadow the trip.. I'm still there, with my family, and we go about our day. I can't imagine a trip where I could say that Disney was responsible for not feeling like the expense was "worth it". There is so much to do there, if one thing falls thru, do something else. If you have a bad Captain on the Jungle Cruise.. laugh it off. Life happens. You're still at Disney World
In 2015 we did a week in Key West in conjunction with a WDW trip. That week was way more expensive than if I would have just spent a week at a less expensive "deluxe resort" at Disney. It rained and stormed every day. Ruining most of our plans. That was by far the most Opposite of Planned trip that I've ever been on in my life. Even that trip, where I shed a few tears, was still "worth the expense", because I was determined to have a good time, so we did.
I think people expect too much with Walt Disney World. That might sound odd, but I feel it's true. Best laid plans will not always work. We must all be flexible sometimes.
GoofGoof
Premium Member
I've never had a trip to WDW where I felt I didn't get my money's worth. If/when that day comes, I'm out. I won't look back either. There's a lot of ways to spend vacation time and money so if the mouse starts to fail me I can move on. I can't really understand the people who say the value isn't there or they have soured on WDW but then they still go back...repeatedly. Life is too short to spend your limited free time (and money) doing something that's no longer enjoyable.
That was a little bit of a tangent. To your original point, I don't do the rope drop to close plan either. I avoid parks with EMHs and enjoy the parks at a slower pace. Some people enjoy the all out pace and cramming in every hour with activity. To each their own. I do think it's easier for us (as regular visitors) to go at a slower pace. You know you'll be back again so if you skip something you just catch it next time. We also know how to work the system a little better than the average guest. Most people are not aware that you can eat without ADRs and without knowing where to go you could end up hungry and frustrated. I personally think FP+ works pretty well for my style, but I can understand how the theme park commandos who spent the day running and pulling FP tickets hate the system as well as less frequent guests who fail to book the right FPs and end up frustrated. The parks were a lot less complicated before FP and DDP with ADRs in general, but now that those systems exist you have 3 choices
- Don't go
- Go and be spontaneous knowing you will have to skip some things and have limited choices for meals
- Plan ahead
21stamps
Well-Known Member
I just checked ticket prices right now- $74 per day for an adult 5 day. $58 per day for a 7 day.
You can stay at a nice moderate for less than $200 per night. With free transportation around the property and to/from the airport.
The food is not any more overpriced than most vacation spots, and actually lower priced compared to a few.
I'm not saying that Disney is an inexpensive vacation, it isn't. But it is comparable to a lot of other vacation destinations once you add in all of the activities you would be doing elsewhere, even less than a lot of them. I don't know of many vacations that I can take where my days would be full of activities and entertainment and still average out to $58pp or less per day.. and where I won't need to pay for a rental car, transfers, or a taxi/Uber. Add that all together, and it's not really so bad once you compare.
You can stay at a nice moderate for less than $200 per night. With free transportation around the property and to/from the airport.
The food is not any more overpriced than most vacation spots, and actually lower priced compared to a few.
I'm not saying that Disney is an inexpensive vacation, it isn't. But it is comparable to a lot of other vacation destinations once you add in all of the activities you would be doing elsewhere, even less than a lot of them. I don't know of many vacations that I can take where my days would be full of activities and entertainment and still average out to $58pp or less per day.. and where I won't need to pay for a rental car, transfers, or a taxi/Uber. Add that all together, and it's not really so bad once you compare.
21stamps
Well-Known Member
I've only had one trip planned more than 65 days in advance...and all adult only trips were booked in less than 30 days in advance.
The one trip that I did have the opportunity to make reservations at 180, I ended up needing to change my dates at 60 days out lol. There was one meal, and one dessert party that I couldn't get.. the rest of it I was able to. I won't pretend that it was fun trying to get the reservations.. I checked constantly all day long..and luckily I have a neighbor who actually enjoys Disney Planning (I don't) so she had my MDE password and helped as well.
Lucky for me- a large number of the reservations made at 180 end up getting cancelled by the people who originally made them
Laketravis
Well-Known Member
How 'bout them fireworks, huh?
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
True but that only applies to the first time visitor. Anyone that goes after they have been are, or should be, taking responsibility for it themselves. I don't really think you will hear to much negativity other then frustration on how big and sometimes complicated it is. Anyone that continues to go even after they have an experience that they deem to be a lousy ROI, really need to ask themselves why. Surely, you don't want to go and spend a lot of money that you know will not be worth it, do you? And if you do.. then why?
Your word was "massive"...
I'm sensing that anyone who doesn't agree with you is a "troll." You'll probably want to put me on your ignore list, then. I won't mind.
As for ROI vs ROE, I like the term "investment" since it's a huge investment of my time to plan a trip to WDW, as well as an investment of significant money to travel there, stay in their hotels, buy their park tickets, eat their food and watch their fireworks, the return on which I measure in vacation value.
WDW is still a great destination for those for whom money is no object. Budget vacationers can still find bargains if they're choosy and flexible. Just this past week I got an offer in the mail for 30% discounts on "select" WDW resort hotels, valid most days from the end of May thru the end of August. 30% is a pretty hefty discount -- not quite as good as the military discount they offer, but still very good.
But I agree with those who say higher expectations on vacationers' ROI (or ROE for those who want to use that term) are likely a cause of many disgruntled vacationers, who, with the heat and humidity, being tired from walking about all day, thirsty, and maybe even hungry, are prone to snap at the slightest provocation. Given all that, I'd say WDW is quite an amazing place since there aren't hundreds of such assaults reported every day!
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Otterhead
Well-Known Member
Not true, actually. Only people who admit that the reason they're here is to respond negatively to positive-sounding posts to "balance the tone out" and bring the place down, which is what you said in this thread. That's literally the definition of a troll. I don't have any respect for trolls.
draybook
Well-Known Member
Seriously, are you kidding us? Disney didn't make us book ADRs 180 days in advance? They didn't make us plan FPs in advance? We expect too much? Have you ever SEEN a Disney World commercial? They conveniently leave out the long waits, high cost of food, crowds, meltdowns of children, broken modes of transportation, etc. What we expect of them are the high expectations that the company set the bar at. Just because they may or may not be living up to those standards holds no responsibility on the consumer. As to the planning, it sure as heck wasn't my idea to have to plan my meals 6 months in advance. Granted, I'm easy going, but my wife and daughter are picky. Planning their meals 6 months in advance is NOT my choice. That's ALL Disney. Anyways, good day to you folks, time for work.