Disney Giveth, and Disney Taketh Away

[sweetpee_1993]

You have every right to do this and I am sure if enough people people did the missing revenue would be felt, but most people are not going to stop going. Not trying to pick a fight so please don't get upset, but the tag at the bottom of your post shows Pop+DCL in May 2012 and and WL+DCL+YC in 2011 so is this a recent decision based on things that happened this summer (price increases, EMH cutbacks) or issues with your recent trips there.

Actually, I do really like Primeval Whirl & used to love it at night all lit up. I was never allowed to go to fairs & carnivals as a kid so even the off-shelf rides are just ducky with me.

Yep, you sure do see a whole lot of WDW in my signature. Last Sept we spent 11 days total on property plus the 3-day cruise. Boy, if my eyes weren't open before that they sure are now! The Disney Dream spanked WDW in terms of quality, value, & show. Every day spent at WDW post-cruise we were wishing we were back onboard. This past May we had planned for my 2 teens & me to make the 14+ hour drive & hubby fly in to meet us. I fought tooth & nail to stay off-property. Hubby insisted we stay on so I would not need to get back out & do anymore driving to pick him up from the airport. I also pushed with all my might to *not* eat at WDW restaurants. I was out-voted. Hubby pitched a pretty good fit about not buying 3 1-day tix since his pass was still valid so we could go in 1 of the 4 parks. I won that battle. We did go to TL for the first time instead which I think was much better use of less money. I did also have a small victory in booking a cheap, standard room at Pop vs the deluxes we've splurged for in the past. Guess what? Good ol' Pop was probly the cleanest, best kept room we've arrived to in quite a few trips. Ain't that a stinker?

Now, that said, normally right now we'd be looking at 2 more trips in the works for the future. I actually have a total of 4 vacations/trips planned right now that altogether will generate prob'ly $17k+ in cost. Wanna know how many of those include WDW? 0, zip, nadda. Aaaand, I've gotten pretty savvy at skirting the little tip toes onto WDW property in & around these upcoming trips.

Just this past month the old man tried to pitch a long WDW weekend to me in Sept for our anniversary. My reply? I'd rather go to Sea World, on a cruise, to San Antonio, or even just stay home & save the $$. Thankfully, he booked us a cruise. We'll be going from the airport to the port & back. No WDW.

So, yeah, that's a whole lotta $$ TDO ain't gettin their paws on. The best part for me is knowing I'm saying what I mean, meaning what I say, & doing something to stand behind my word.

So, nah, you aren't bothering me at all.

 

[flynnibus]

Disney Cruise Line may be WDW's biggest problem. Because going on it will remind people how Disney USED to be and makes most of WDW stick out like a sore thumb.

 

[Beholder]

Some of the posts on here got me thinking about an aspect I haven't seen mentioned yet. If it has, forgive me. Some people say don't go, speak with your wallet. That is actually the only way TDO or ANY business will listen, BUT, Disney has a built in counter for this type of thinking. Families with young children who've "always done the Disney thing" will take their children, no matter what. The argument for themselves will be "Susie will only be 5 once, or John will only be 7 once, or this may be Grandma's and Grandpa's only chance to go with the grand kids.". The whole "making memories" thing creates this sense of urgency in people. We have to go! Our kids are growing so fast!

And of course little Susie and John will only be 5 and 6 and 7 and 8 and 9 and... You get the point. Can't miss out on the memories. I know. I'm guilty.

 

[GoofGoof]

Some of the posts on here got me thinking about an aspect I haven't seen mentioned yet. If it has, forgive me. Some people say don't go, speak with your wallet. That is actually the only way TDO or ANY business will listen, BUT, Disney has a built in counter for this type of thinking. Families with young children who've "always done the Disney thing" will take their children, no matter what. The argument for themselves will be "Susie will only be 5 once, or John will only be 7 once, or this may be Grandma's and Grandpa's only chance to go with the grand kids.". The whole "making memories" thing creates this sense of urgency in people. We have to go! Our kids are growing so fast!

And of course little Susie and John will only be 5 and 6 and 7 and 8 and 9 and... You get the point. Can't miss out on the memories. I know. I'm guilty.

It's not just families with kids who are blindly loyal. It's young people, older people, married couples with no kids. Although there is a small vocal group here who go a lot and find all of the issues on this thread the vast majorirty of guests at WDW are just tourists on vacation who probably have no interest in sending management a message.

 

[sweetpee_1993]

Ya, but I been following her threads because she is from Texas, I think she actually avoids the parks and does the waterparks now and the cruise, that is what she means by better quality disney experiences. And you are probably correct about what "most" people do as far as taking action with their pocketbook, but the point I buy into is "owning" your choice. It may not change a thing out there in the great big scheme of events, except to know who you see in the mirror is exactly who you want to see looking back.

Yeah, I've swallowed the "takeths" long enough to have my fill. Last Sept when we got off the Dream & went to the YC, I spent 6 nights paying roughly $350/night (after 40% discount) wishing I was somewhere else. Food at roughly $300/day (after TiW discount), passes, incidentals...it was a lot of money to learn where my heart was not. Since then I'm fighting tooth & nail to stop paying to be disappointed or wish I was somewhere else. Believe me, I catch a lot of flack from my brother who thinks WDW is just ducky. Hubby & sons don't disagree with me on any of it but they'd like to still have a little taste here & there.

No, I'm not a casual guest. I've grown up on WDW. I lived in Orlando from 6 to 16 years old. I've seen WDW in her glory and I've seen the shadow of herself she is now. I definitely don't see spending the big bucks my hubby works so hard to earn & I work so hard to save & stretch to be let down. I'm happy to take a break, see some other Disney, & hope for better days in the future.

 

[sweetpee_1993]

Disney Cruise Line may be WDW's biggest problem. Because going on it will remind people how Disney USED to be and makes most of WDW stick out like a sore thumb.

It DOES! Being on the Disney cruises reminds me of the level of service WDW used to have. I had forgotten how great service could be.

 

[Beholder]

It's not just families with kids who are blindly loyal. It's young people, older people, married couples with no kids. Although there is a small vocal group here who go a lot and find all of the issues on this thread the vast majorirty of guests at WDW are just tourists on vacation
who probably have no interest in sending
management a message.

You're right. I was just speculating that families with young children may be a bit more susceptible to that line of thinking. Especially combined with Disney's type of advertising. Out of all demographics, they MAY be the least likely to "send Disney a message".

 

[jlsHouston]

You're right. I was just speculating that families with young children may be a bit more susceptible to that line of thinking. Especially combined with Disney's type of advertising. Out of all demographics, they MAY be the least likely to "send Disney a message".

uh huh... I took my kids 3 times to disneyland, but never really felt the pull to repeat a disney experience until this little wanna be Belle showed up ? She was 6 and my grandson 4 when I made my way to the world with them in tow.....I hear what everyone is saying about the takeths have been exceeding the giveths and the level of service over the years can't really compare these day, but for me right now the magic is there in those parks with my happy little travel companions, I love this resort hopping I am doing, I love the rides and the restaurants and the garden thing at Epcot that was going on this past easter and the foodie thing in October. And I am glad I found a forum full of people who know about magic and have great insights and experiences to share.

 

[RSoxNo1]

I personally think the $10 no show fee is a plus. It is hard to get some of those ADRs even with it. If there was no punishment for not showing up It would be even harder.

Yeah, this is probably something I should remove. The end result of this is a positive, but it's not the best case scenario. I maintain that we would be much better off without a Dining Plan at all and the removal of the $10 fee. Food quality would be better, the ridiculous demand based on false reservations would go away, and you could actually walk into good restaurants like you can in Disneyland.

And I do notice some of the additions, wi-fi,
refrigerators, new "expansions", so that's great.

Just fix what you already have and keep it
operating.

But, a bad day at Disney is still better than good
day at 90% anywhere else.

Disney should not be credited by giving guests free Wi-Fi, they are at least 5 years too late for that. Honestly all of these amenities should have been at the moderate and above resorts 10 years ago.

Commending them for maintaining a premium product with routine maintenance is also a stretch.

Having said all that, your overall point is well taken. Despite all this crap, we still like quite a bit of what's there - but familiarity breeds contempt and I really don't think these complaints are unwarranted.

Let me clarify my point calling these things petty. When taken as a whole group this list shows a pattern of cost cutting and a general decline in attention to detail. That I am not disputing although like you said they are still above a 90 just not A+ anymore. My point was really in reference to someone saying they may not bother to go because of these issues. In my opinion other than major ride issues like Splash AAs and Yeti the other things are minor and would probably not even be noticed by someone who was never there. I picked the napkins as an example since to me that is the most obvious example of something most people would not miss. Splash is probably my favorite ride but even if it was closed completely I would still go to WDW.

There was a 200 page thread here about the Lights of Winter where people were saying that they're cancelling vacations because of it. I didn't get it. But the combination of all of these things when combined with a lack of major attraction additions, and five dollaring (the new Disney-term for nickle and diming).

 

[HenryMystic]

Yeah, this is probably something I should remove. The end result of this is a positive, but it's not the best case scenario. I maintain that we would be much better off without a Dining Plan at all and the removal of the $10 fee. Food quality would be better, the ridiculous demand based on false reservations would go away, and you could actually walk into good restaurants like you can in Disneyland.

It's a matter of Disney correcting problems they created to begin with. Fastpass times should have always been enforced (if we must have FP to begin with.) The dining plan created a monster that now requires a no-show fee. It's definitely good that they are seemingly making an effort to correct some of these problems, but they've conditioned guests to expect certain abuses and will have difficulty weening them off said abuses.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Should NEVER have been allowed in the first place. (15 min grace period and that's it)
Note: This is an Opinion

I totally disagree with this. Until you can schedule your return time from available options you should be able to return late.

What about the Tom Sawyer paint brush hunt being removed???

Good call, I've added this.

True and I am sad I missed this one, it pre dates my arrival to the world... maybe I should bring some paint brushes with me and drop them around the island and see if that big hint will cause disney to bring this little secret back. Why did they do away with it? Does anyone know? Does anyone have a pic of what the paintbrush looked like?

I suggested that people do this exact thing, I really think it would be a nice passive aggressive approach to these things.

It seems to me that one of the problem with the whole declining by degrees is that all things are prioritized, and the bigger, or more complex WDW gets, the further down the list some things move. Of course, I have know idea if this is the case, just conjecture, but as WDW grows (DVC's, next gen, future "expansions", etc), it's as if some of the more basic components get less attention. It's almost like urban sprawl. Less attention/focus placed on the old neighborhood, while the shiny new neighborhood gets the all the love. This is all total speculation on my part, but I've seen it within my own company. New projects get the funding, the focus of resources, the older, established programs just tread water. I know there's a lot more to it than this, but it may be part of the problem.

This is a huge problem though, yes we want the big things but not at the cost of the little things.

EMH nights at DAK could be much ore than Everest & Dinosaur. All of Dinoland can function. Nemo & FotLK can still operate. Characters can still greet guests. Shops can still offer shopping. Restaurants can still serve food. That's just another of TDO's lame excuses to cut offerings...but NOT the prices.

Everything but the Animal based attractions were actually open. It's just that preferences of the majority is only to visit Dinosaur and Everest. That's partially their fault, but also partially Disney's fault for not having a deeper attraction lineup at the park.

Entertainment cuts:
World Showcase "sidekicks" cut 08ish
Flynn rider cut last year
Two rounds of cuts at Ak last twelve months
MK EMH character cuts last summer
DHS cuts of Einsteins/Jojo/Up groupings down to one per location
DHS citizens of Hollywood cuts
"holiday pricing" for character meals
LTT characters

Forgive me, but I'm going to need you to elaborate on pretty much everything on here except Flynn Rider. I think most of this can be lumped into overall character meet and greet cuts - is that fair?

I'm not. Like I said, many things at WDW need to change. Most of the gripes that come up in every one of these threads are not among them and really shouldn't be our focus.

Would you really rather have printed napkins than a functioning Yeti?

All I'm saying is that battles need to be chosen.

I don't think battles should have to be chosen. The broken Yeti is inexcusable and eliminating the napkins was an unnecessary budget cut that does nothing more than increasing profits at the cost of lowering the value of the product. No, the napkins aren't enough to cancel a trip, but the point of this thread is to track these issues so that they are actually quantifiable. I think the majority of people are unaware of these issues, but together as a forum we can identify them, speak out against them and act out (by not going to the parks or complaining at guest relations).

no offense to anyone but you all drive me crazy...the napkins being blank(the world will now end)is because the manufacturer messed up they were printed when I was there yesterday...and yes there are problems but some things just cant be perfect all the time...I still love Disney and going to the parks and nothing will ever change my mind

That's great to know. Can anyone else verify this? The only other person reporting this was a crazy a teenager that has since been banned.

Add the decaying broken Roger Rabbit silhouette in the window to this list!

I believe someone said that was a permanent change as well because of some loss of rights. I don't really remember.

Also: An an unrelated note, What's wrong with the Poly Torches? They were functioning on my last visit a few weeks ago.

I think you're right. Someone mentioned it, but I didn't think this was still missing.

 

[RSoxNo1]

And no, the world will not end until December 21st.

I'm not convinced. We don't have Dick Clark to ring in the New Year... Well Played Mayans, Well Played.

 

[WDW1974]

I've still got some unexpired tickets from the 90's. They were built in hopper tickets, before they charged extra for that privilege. I wonder if they would still qualify as hoppers today?

Yes. They are good for whatever they would have been good for back then ... in other words, if they're pre-98, then don't expect them to get you into DAK (although Guest Relations might allow it as a courtesy). But a hopper when bought doesn't change just because Disney came out with a new ticketing structure in 2004.

 

[WDW1974]

Disney Cruise Line may be WDW's biggest problem. Because going on it will remind people how Disney USED to be and makes most of WDW stick out like a sore thumb.

THIS!!!

Because I will bet anything that more WDW regulars will try a cruise versus trying DL or (Walt forbid) one of the international Disney outposts.

 

[flynnibus]

Yes. They are good for whatever they would have been good for back then ... in other words, if they're pre-98, then don't expect them to get you into DAK (although Guest Relations might allow it as a courtesy). But a hopper when bought doesn't change just because Disney came out with a new ticketing structure in 2004.

Every time I've swapped tickets - If I had a multi park pass - I get a park hopper. And obviously today they have no way to give you a ticket that is just MK+EPCOT so you get a park hopper.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Actually, I do really like Primeval Whirl & used to love it at night all lit up. I was never allowed to go to fairs & carnivals as a kid so even the off-shelf rides are just ducky with me.

I think I would have to be lit up to enjoy Primeval Whirl.

Yeah, I've swallowed the "takeths" long enough to have my fill. Last Sept when we got off the Dream & went to the YC, I spent 6 nights paying roughly $350/night (after 40% discount) wishing I was somewhere else. Food at roughly $300/day (after TiW discount), passes, incidentals...it was a lot of money to learn where my heart was not. Since then I'm fighting tooth & nail to stop paying to be disappointed or wish I was somewhere else. Believe me, I catch a lot of flack from my brother who thinks WDW is just ducky. Hubby & sons don't disagree with me on any of it but they'd like to still have a little taste here & there.

No, I'm not a casual guest. I've grown up on WDW. I lived in Orlando from 6 to 16 years old. I've seen WDW in her glory and I've seen the shadow of herself she is now. I definitely don't see spending the big bucks my hubby works so hard to earn & I work so hard to save & stretch to be let down. I'm happy to take a break, see some other Disney, & hope for better days in the future.

I've been trying to convince more and more people to go west. Manifest Destiny. Give Disneyland a try.

It's a matter of Disney correcting problems they created to begin with. Fastpass times should have always been enforced (if we must have FP to begin with.) The dining plan created a monster that now requires a no-show fee. It's definitely good that they are seemingly making an effort to correct some of these problems, but they've conditioned guests to expect certain abuses and will have difficulty weening them off said abuses.

The Fastpass system wasn't broken to the point where the end times needed to be enforced. It was an unofficial policy to accept late returns because it resulted in more satisfied guests that were pleasantly surprised when they could return late. As I've said before, I don't mind the enforcements if you get to choose your return time - then it's on you. You get to choose from available dining times, the same should be true of Fastpasses. I've been suggesting this long since the hints of Next Gen. Of course, they could just screw this up even more by allowing guests to reserve ride times before entering the park.

 

[WDW1974]

Every time I've swapped tickets - If I had a multi park pass - I get a park hopper. And obviously today they have no way to give you a ticket that is just MK+EPCOT so you get a park hopper.

I've been told that they aren't supposed to do that, BUT that what you say actually happens because of the way their ticketing system is programmed ... you can't do MK and EPCOT really, but what they are supposed to do is give you one day tickets for that day only for the two parks.

That doesn't really happen much from what I have heard.

 

[ellie-badge]

The "temporary" addition of Captain EO.

I like Captain EO, and I'm glad I got to watch it on my last few trips from two-ish years ago, but the MJ hype is pretty much gone at this point. It was basically an excuse to ax a fifteen-year-old film with "something new, but not really."

 

[RSoxNo1]

Ellie, Something like Captain EO really doesn't belong on this list. It doesn't mean you're wrong but it wasn't a cut, it's something that should be replaced.

 

[Beholder]

@RSoxNo1 I think I'd enjoy Primeval Whirl if IT were lit up!