Disney confirms 'Frozen' makeover coming to Epcot's Norway Pavilion

[Phicinfan]

The majority usually doesn't means the smartest or the best.

Since the Majority sometimes just go "with the flow" like sheep.
The "mob" mentality as been tested and proven many times.
You can also skew the opinion of people by generating fake hype. Just like Apple and many companies do.
A fine example, is the skew, lie and blatant manipulation of the "surveys".

They can claim anytime that they have 99% Customer Satisfaction.
It still doesn't means its true... as they can filter (and have done so) the negative output.

So if no one speaks, it means they are sheep? As opposed to happy and satisfied. I think you are wrong here.

Really? then why are you here?
why are you using so much effort into defending TWDC?

• Are you a lifestyler?
  
• Do you own Disney Stock?
• Are you a tour operator?
• Are you a CM or Manager at Disney Parks?
• Or are you related to the Disney Blogger/Internet Marketing Team?

Because the majority of the times we've seen such behaviour (aka, mindless defending) was always one of the above points I just mentioned.

I am a huge fan, not a lifestyler per say
I DO own Disney stock
Nope, work in Engineering world
Nope
Nope, no relationship to any blogger, or marketing team....calls em as I see em.

Ah, there is the rub. The assumption that anyone who likes what is going on is mindless. Maybe you are stuck in the mud and lost in time? Or just stupid? Doesn't feel great to be pigeon holed does it?

All I can do is tell you what is.

And to add in response to some....
yes, I realize the "expansion" in MK was not all expansion - so what, what they did was take an outdated ride out and create a new one, added a new ride, reformatted and beautified the area, and then revamped the kids area. All a net gain in my opinion.

AK - with expansion work(not just Avatar but discovery Island as well) and expanding hours and adding a night show I do think expansion is the right term.

DTD - like it or not it IS expansion and revamp both. With key new additions(parking garages especially).

DHS - Yes this is all speculative, and I have to agree I may be jumping the gun here. However, considering the directions we have been seeing lately, and I stress lately, I cannot believe they will just close all these attractions now and let sit for years and years with no change.

Epcot - I have to claim some naivety here. I am not an Epcot fan, I have visited it for the last 6 years, but not a real fan. Short of addition of Soarin and update for Test track what new things have happened there?

Yes, I will be the first to say Disney dropped the ball, and let the parks especially in Florida fall. I am hoping beyond hope that is changing. That investments in parks in both DL and WDW and others means they are going to keep parks more up to date and vibrant. But that change can't come quickly, due to amount of work to be done.
I am a HUGE fan of DHS, and I can't wait to see if some of the rumors are true, and they will invest in the Star Wars changes and expansion of Pixar area to start. I am also hoping for a full revamp eventually of the GMR, to better reflect some historical Disney movies. I also think eventually, there will be Marvel things in the park, but realize contractually that is an issue right now.

Again, I get WS was not meant to be MK, nor any other park. I also get why those who love WS want this not to have happened. I also understand why some feel this is a rushed ride and just stuck somewhere, and thus won't be best quality. I get it. I just don't agree with it. I like change, I don't like status quo, status quo means stagnation, which most here feel has been happening in the parks. Adding some links to Disney IP to WS to help draw,and then hopefully give impetus to expand and add to Epcot can be a win/win.

 

[Mawg]

Although I'm not a fan of this makeover, I'm still anxious to see some concept art for the ride. Has anyone seen anything yet?

 

[Mike S]

So if no one speaks, it means they are sheep? As opposed to happy and satisfied. I think you are wrong here.



I am a huge fan, not a lifestyler per say
I DO own Disney stock
Nope, work in Engineering world
Nope
Nope, no relationship to any blogger, or marketing team....calls em as I see em.

Ah, there is the rub. The assumption that anyone who likes what is going on is mindless. Maybe you are stuck in the mud and lost in time? Or just stupid? Doesn't feel great to be pigeon holed does it?

All I can do is tell you what is.

And to add in response to some....
yes, I realize the "expansion" in MK was not all expansion - so what, what they did was take an outdated ride out and create a new one, added a new ride, reformatted and beautified the area, and then revamped the kids area. All a net gain in my opinion.

AK - with expansion work(not just Avatar but discovery Island as well) and expanding hours and adding a night show I do think expansion is the right term.

DTD - like it or not it IS expansion and revamp both. With key new additions(parking garages especially).

DHS - Yes this is all speculative, and I have to agree I may be jumping the gun here. However, considering the directions we have been seeing lately, and I stress lately, I cannot believe they will just close all these attractions now and let sit for years and years with no change.

Epcot - I have to claim some naivety here. I am not an Epcot fan, I have visited it for the last 6 years, but not a real fan. Short of addition of Soarin and update for Test track what new things have happened there?

Yes, I will be the first to say Disney dropped the ball, and let the parks especially in Florida fall. I am hoping beyond hope that is changing. That investments in parks in both DL and WDW and others means they are going to keep parks more up to date and vibrant. But that change can't come quickly, due to amount of work to be done.
I am a HUGE fan of DHS, and I can't wait to see if some of the rumors are true, and they will invest in the Star Wars changes and expansion of Pixar area to start. I am also hoping for a full revamp eventually of the GMR, to better reflect some historical Disney movies. I also think eventually, there will be Marvel things in the park, but realize contractually that is an issue right now.

Again, I get WS was not meant to be MK, nor any other park. I also get why those who love WS want this not to have happened. I also understand why some feel this is a rushed ride and just stuck somewhere, and thus won't be best quality. I get it. I just don't agree with it. I like change, I don't like status quo, status quo means stagnation, which most here feel has been happening in the parks. Adding some links to Disney IP to WS to help draw,and then hopefully give impetus to expand and add to Epcot can be a win/win.

Updating Maelstrom would've been change. So would adding a new country, or new rides in the existing countries. They did not in any way have to make this much of a thematic change to make children more interested in WS. It's just lazy.

 

[wm49rs]

So if no one speaks, it means they are sheep? As opposed to happy and satisfied. I think you are wrong here.



I am a huge fan, not a lifestyler per say
I DO own Disney stock
Nope, work in Engineering world
Nope
Nope, no relationship to any blogger, or marketing team....calls em as I see em.

Ah, there is the rub. The assumption that anyone who likes what is going on is mindless. Maybe you are stuck in the mud and lost in time? Or just stupid? Doesn't feel great to be pigeon holed does it?

All I can do is tell you what is.

And to add in response to some....
yes, I realize the "expansion" in MK was not all expansion - so what, what they did was take an outdated ride out and create a new one, added a new ride, reformatted and beautified the area, and then revamped the kids area. All a net gain in my opinion.

AK - with expansion work(not just Avatar but discovery Island as well) and expanding hours and adding a night show I do think expansion is the right term.

DTD - like it or not it IS expansion and revamp both. With key new additions(parking garages especially).

DHS - Yes this is all speculative, and I have to agree I may be jumping the gun here. However, considering the directions we have been seeing lately, and I stress lately, I cannot believe they will just close all these attractions now and let sit for years and years with no change.

Epcot - I have to claim some naivety here. I am not an Epcot fan, I have visited it for the last 6 years, but not a real fan. Short of addition of Soarin and update for Test track what new things have happened there?

Yes, I will be the first to say Disney dropped the ball, and let the parks especially in Florida fall. I am hoping beyond hope that is changing. That investments in parks in both DL and WDW and others means they are going to keep parks more up to date and vibrant. But that change can't come quickly, due to amount of work to be done.
I am a HUGE fan of DHS, and I can't wait to see if some of the rumors are true, and they will invest in the Star Wars changes and expansion of Pixar area to start. I am also hoping for a full revamp eventually of the GMR, to better reflect some historical Disney movies. I also think eventually, there will be Marvel things in the park, but realize contractually that is an issue right now.

Again, I get WS was not meant to be MK, nor any other park. I also get why those who love WS want this not to have happened. I also understand why some feel this is a rushed ride and just stuck somewhere, and thus won't be best quality. I get it. I just don't agree with it. I like change, I don't like status quo, status quo means stagnation, which most here feel has been happening in the parks. Adding some links to Disney IP to WS to help draw,and then hopefully give impetus to expand and add to Epcot can be a win/win.

How about adding some non-Disney IPs to the WS? As in the form of a new country or two....

 

[H2O_Mouse-Ears]

How about adding some non-Disney IPs to the WS? As in the form of a new country or two....

Purely out of curiosity, which countries do you have in mind?

 

[wm49rs]

Purely out of curiosity, which countries do you have in mind?

I'm not going into an Imagineering discussion, simply because it's all proverbially been said before. But there's a plethora of both space and candidates out there....

 

[SnarkyMonkey]

Updating Maelstrom would've been change. So would adding a new country, or new rides in the existing countries. They did not in any way have to make this much of a thematic change to make children more interested in WS. It's just lazy.

Why do people keep saying this? I really don't think the motivator for changing Maelstrom into a Frozen ride had anything to do with making WS more interesting to children.

I think they had a super big movie on their hands and wanted to incorporate its theming into the parks because they knew such an attraction would be quite popular. They looked around and decided the the Norway Pavilion would be a location to do such a thing because Norway inspired the movie and the pavilion already had a less popular attraction that could use some revamping anyway.

Now, you might disagree with their choice of location. You might have other ideas. But, regardless, they are Disney and they get to choose and this is what they've chosen.

 

[Mike S]

Why do people keep saying this? I really don't think the motivator for changing Maelstrom into a Frozen ride had anything to do with making WS more interesting to children.

I think they had a super big movie on their hands and wanted to incorporate its theming into the parks because they knew such an attraction would be quite popular. They looked around and decided the the Norway Pavilion would be a location to do such a thing because Norway inspired the movie and the pavilion already had a less popular attraction that could use some revamping anyway.

Now, you might disagree with their choice of location. You might have other ideas. But, regardless, they are Disney and they get to choose and this is what they've chosen.

Because it's one of the main points brought up in defense of this project. "It will attract more families to World Showcase so everything is ok!!!" My point is that the same goal could be reached through other more thematically fitting means.

 

[ABQ]

I agree @Mike S , though I think the more appropriate phrase would be it will reallocate (isn't that one big thing TWDC wanted to measure and control out of NextGen?) more families from Magic Kingdom to World Showcase. Which, though I wouldn't mind that so much as a net effect, I'd still rather the cause for the reallocation was more thematically fitting, as you put it.

 

[Cesar R M]

So if no one speaks, it means they are sheep? As opposed to happy and satisfied. I think you are wrong here.



I am a huge fan, not a lifestyler per say
I DO own Disney stock
Nope, work in Engineering world
Nope
Nope, no relationship to any blogger, or marketing team....calls em as I see em.

Ah, there is the rub. The assumption that anyone who likes what is going on is mindless. Maybe you are stuck in the mud and lost in time? Or just stupid? Doesn't feel great to be pigeon holed does it?

All I can do is tell you what is.

And to add in response to some....
yes, I realize the "expansion" in MK was not all expansion - so what, what they did was take an outdated ride out and create a new one, added a new ride, reformatted and beautified the area, and then revamped the kids area. All a net gain in my opinion.

AK - with expansion work(not just Avatar but discovery Island as well) and expanding hours and adding a night show I do think expansion is the right term.

DTD - like it or not it IS expansion and revamp both. With key new additions(parking garages especially).

DHS - Yes this is all speculative, and I have to agree I may be jumping the gun here. However, considering the directions we have been seeing lately, and I stress lately, I cannot believe they will just close all these attractions now and let sit for years and years with no change.

Epcot - I have to claim some naivety here. I am not an Epcot fan, I have visited it for the last 6 years, but not a real fan. Short of addition of Soarin and update for Test track what new things have happened there?

Yes, I will be the first to say Disney dropped the ball, and let the parks especially in Florida fall. I am hoping beyond hope that is changing. That investments in parks in both DL and WDW and others means they are going to keep parks more up to date and vibrant. But that change can't come quickly, due to amount of work to be done.
I am a HUGE fan of DHS, and I can't wait to see if some of the rumors are true, and they will invest in the Star Wars changes and expansion of Pixar area to start. I am also hoping for a full revamp eventually of the GMR, to better reflect some historical Disney movies. I also think eventually, there will be Marvel things in the park, but realize contractually that is an issue right now.

Again, I get WS was not meant to be MK, nor any other park. I also get why those who love WS want this not to have happened. I also understand why some feel this is a rushed ride and just stuck somewhere, and thus won't be best quality. I get it. I just don't agree with it. I like change, I don't like status quo, status quo means stagnation, which most here feel has been happening in the parks. Adding some links to Disney IP to WS to help draw,and then hopefully give impetus to expand and add to Epcot can be a win/win.

You instantly lost points for 3 something very important parts:
A)You instantly went into the defensive.
B) yet didn't get my comment.
C) You outright went to insult me like a spoiled child.

To explain:
There is a HUGE difference between "happy and satisfied" and rabid fanboyism.

The happy and Satisfied will say how they were happy with X thing and they will say they got something good.

Rabid fanboyism in the other hand.. (or a lifestyler); will ramble, attack, lie, disregard and ignore ANYTHING WRONG that happens with their favourite product/company (regardless if the place is falling apart or the product was beyond mediocre). And will defend the product/company like their life depended on it.
Also in some cases.. they HAVE to do this, because they are PAID (or they get POINTS) by the company they defend(like some bloggers who get free stuff).

one is logical, the other is completely bonkers illogical and bat crazy insane.
and trust me, we've had plenty of the second type.

Also, thanks for confirming you own Disney Stock.

 

[Cesar R M]

because Norway inspired the movie and the pavilion already

This conversation as been done ad-nauseam.
Inspired does not means "based on".
There is a huge thing in something inspired (100% fictitious), and "based on" (some fiction, some culture but might have real locations or persons)

 

[Magenta Panther]

How about adding some non-Disney IPs to the WS? As in the form of a new country or two....

I vote for Ireland!

 

[tribbleorlfl]

Since so many people have begun to claim "this will get children interested in Norway", I feel the need to ask how they expect that conversation to go down without confusing the child? What kid is gonna ask anything about Norway when they are in a fantasy world of Arrendelle? You would have to force upon them the fact that they are in a pavilion designed to resemble Norway which is what Arrendelle was 'inspired' by. So while your kid is wetting their pants with excitement about seeing Anna and Elsa they are supposed to soak up knowledge you force upon them that is also somewhat confusing to them. Or you could tell them while your waiting in line for an hour to ride the new ride... because that is a great time to teach your kid a history lesson. /sarcasm

Any kid that visits the Norway pavilion will want to visit Arrendelle, not Norway, but even if you do take them to Norway, now they will be expecting to see ice castles, princesses and snow monsters....because thats what they saw in the (Frozen) Norway ride at Disney World .

The same exact argument would have applied to the original Maelstrom, though. Children rode that thing for 25 years and were given the impression Vikings were friendly explorers, polar bears are the national animal and Norway is locked in a perpetual battle with trolls. The only aspect of Maelstrom that had any revelance to the real Norway was the oil rig in the North Sea. Or perhaps the "Spirit of Norway" film most people skipped.

The simple fact is, contrary to what many in this thread falsely believe, WS has NEVER been more than an over-glorified shopping mall. The various pavilions give a sanitized, cursory peak into their respective cultures at best, and at worst, simply serve as a window dressing for F&B and retail. While WS is certainly unique, the notion it is some unsullied, sacred cultural institution is flawed, and if anyone (child or adult) walks away from there believing all they need to know about a nation and its culture from, I feel sorry for them.

 

[DisDan]

The same exact argument would have applied to the original Maelstrom, though. Children rode that thing for 25 years and were given the impression Vikings were friendly explorers, polar bears are the national animal and Norway is locked in a perpetual battle with trolls. The only aspect of Maelstrom that had any revelance to the real Norway was the oil rig in the North Sea. Or perhaps the "Spirit of Norway" film most people skipped.

The simple fact is, contrary to what many in this thread falsely believe, WS has NEVER been more than an over-glorified shopping mall. The various pavilions give a sanitized, cursory peak into their respective cultures at best, and at worst, simply serve as a window dressing for F&B and retail. While WS is certainly unique, the notion it is some unsullied, sacred cultural institution is flawed, and if anyone (child or adult) walks away from there believing all they need to know about a nation and its culture from, I feel sorry for them.

Thanks, these are my thoughts as well.

 

[H2O_Mouse-Ears]

The same exact argument would have applied to the original Maelstrom, though. Children rode that thing for 25 years and were given the impression Vikings were friendly explorers, polar bears are the national animal and Norway is locked in a perpetual battle with trolls. The only aspect of Maelstrom that had any revelance to the real Norway was the oil rig in the North Sea. Or perhaps the "Spirit of Norway" film most people skipped.

The simple fact is, contrary to what many in this thread falsely believe, WS has NEVER been more than an over-glorified shopping mall. The various pavilions give a sanitized, cursory peak into their respective cultures at best, and at worst, simply serve as a window dressing for F&B and retail. While WS is certainly unique, the notion it is some unsullied, sacred cultural institution is flawed, and if anyone (child or adult) walks away from there believing all they need to know about a nation and its culture from, I feel sorry for them.

I think the main issue at hand is whether or not WS should be character-free more than anything else.

 

[wdisney9000]

They looked around and decided the the Norway Pavilion would be a location to do such a thing

"They looked around and decided Norway"???? That implies that they looked in more than one place. So where was else did they look and then pass on which led them to go with Norway?

because Norway inspired the movie and the pavilion already had a less popular attraction that could use some revamping anyway.

And yet again...Frozen was inspired by Norway? Did you know Disney ALSO sent teams to Wyoming and Canada to study various things including snow and ice and lighting effects (all major components in the movie). The same way Disney sent teams to other locations like Quebec and Wyoming to study things, they also sent a team to Norway to study mountains and buildings. So I guess they could have put the ride in America or Canada pavilion as well because they were just as inspirational to the film.

Jennifer Lee was not thinking about Norway in any way when she wrote her screenplay. Disney simply sent a team of people there later. The "inspired by Norway" logic is just another way to excuse the true meaning behind this overlay. Disney wanted to do the cheapest thing possible...thats all. They rely on the social media and fans who will defend anything they do to take care of the rest. The days of Disney actually creating anything amazing for WDW were dead and anything recently done (FLE, Avatar Land) were largely due in part to Universal stepping it up. Disney fans should be thankful that Uni created Hogsmeade and DA. Without them, the only thing WDW would have probly given us is magic bands.

 

[SnarkyMonkey]

Also in some cases.. they HAVE to do this, because they are PAID (or they get POINTS) by the company they defend(like some bloggers who get free stuff).

Wait! You're saying I could be getting paid for this?! Silly me, giving away all this Disney love for free like a chump.

This conversation as been done ad-nauseam.
Inspired does not means "based on".
There is a huge thing in something inspired (100% fictitious), and "based on" (some fiction, some culture but might have real locations or persons)

I wasn't trying to revisit that conversation. I know that you and others do not see any connection whatsoever between Frozen and Norway. I accept that and have no reason to debate that with you again. My point was that Disney saw some sort of connection when they chose Norway as the location for this Frozen attraction.

 

[wdisney9000]

The same exact argument would have applied to the original Maelstrom, though. Children rode that thing for 25 years and were given the impression Vikings were friendly explorers, polar bears are the national animal and Norway is locked in a perpetual battle with trolls. The only aspect of Maelstrom that had any revelance to the real Norway was the oil rig in the North Sea. Or perhaps the "Spirit of Norway" film most people skipped.

The simple fact is, contrary to what many in this thread falsely believe, WS has NEVER been more than an over-glorified shopping mall. The various pavilions give a sanitized, cursory peak into their respective cultures at best, and at worst, simply serve as a window dressing for F&B and retail. While WS is certainly unique, the notion it is some unsullied, sacred cultural institution is flawed, and if anyone (child or adult) walks away from there believing all they need to know about a nation and its culture from, I feel sorry for them.

I dont think WS was ever intended to be an educational journey through countries. Its a "showcase" to display a culture and its history. All of the pavilions are stereotypical representations of their countries. Pick any pavilion and you can apply what you said about Norway. Germany isnt actual beer stands, buffets, and candy shops. Mexico isnt tequila bars and dining with volcanoes in the distance. You dont see fife and drum corps in the USA. But at least these stereo types were truly "inspired" by the culture, not an animated film.

I agree that anyone who walks away from one of the pavilions feeling they know everything they need to know about that country is just plain wrong. And yes, they are window dressings for F&B/retail sales but they have a cohesive theme. Many people have walked around WS and not bought anything. Its a great environment to be in. Its different than MK, HS, and AK. The more they add fantasy to it, it just blurs the lines. I sincerely respect your views and your post was based in reality and not just grasping at straws to explain why Frozen is great. I thank your sir, for making a valid rebuttal.

 

[Cesar R M]

Wait! You're saying I could be getting paid for this?! Silly me, giving away all this Disney love for free like a chump.

You can always start.
Create a youtube channel and your own blog.. then open your wallet to TWDC.
If a "mommy blogger" of less than 100 views can get such support from TWDC.. I'm pretty sure that other people can get in too(and probably with way better results).

 

[wm49rs]

Wait! You're saying I could be getting paid for this?! Silly me, giving away all this Disney love for free like a chump.



I wasn't trying to revisit that conversation. I know that you and others do not see any connection whatsoever between Frozen and Norway. I accept that and have no reason to debate that with you again. My point was that Disney saw some sort of connection when they chose Norway as the location for this Frozen attraction.

Many understand Frozen was inspired by Norway. They just don't agree turning the pavilion of a real country into a fictional one....