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Disney and Universal: Two very different paths
- Thread starter mgf
- Start date
flynnibus
Premium Member
There are simple laws of nature in play here...
If Amazon's webpage sucked.. it looses business and it dies
If Disney's webpage sucked.. people still came anyways. Hence the business doesn't make something like the website it's most critical task. You pay it lipservice, you invest in it... but you don't treat it like your lifeblood.
Businesses that tend to excel at tasks like this are because they honestly believe if they didn't.. it hurts them.
Its like the pig vs the chicken.. and the definition of commitment.
ford91exploder
Resident Curmudgeon
The 'New Disney' makes me think of a line from T.H. White's 'The Once and Future King' when Merlin turns Wart into an ant the sign over the Anthill entrance states 'What is not Forbidden is Compulsory' yes indeed welcome to the 'New Disney' - be seeing you...
ford91exploder
Resident Curmudgeon
Well Said!
ford91exploder
Resident Curmudgeon
I've made a career out of cleaning up similar IT Disasters when no one else can fix it I get the call, It's amazing how similar IT disasters are to the slow moving train wreck MDE is turning out to be.
nor'easter
Well-Known Member
That they have adopted the Walmart model.
ford91exploder
Resident Curmudgeon
Exactly, However Walt was definitely in the souvenir business - he patented the coonskin cap!, I suspect he would have liked the pins at least the earlier ones which were unique and high quality and affordable by all customers. i suspect Walt would have hated the cheap plastic merch sold EVERYWHERE though as it cheapens the brand and makes it harder to market as a premium brand.
At really it's not even worth trying to talk to you guys anymore because so many of you are so closed minded, just because MM+ made my families vacation more enjoyable and I don't have any problem with it doesn't mean i'm shilling for Disney. Here's the last thing i'll say on this topic: there is the 1% crowd (if that) that are hardcore Disney followers and seem to have a problem with everything Disney does, and then there is the great majority of the general public. Why would Disney spend so much money researching and surveying their customers, and then develop MM+ and better managed M&Gs if nobody wanted it?
1023
Provocateur, Rancanteur, Plaisanter, du Jour
Quoting @ford91exploder and lumping many of us into the "closed minded" bin isn't really productive or accurate. I for one have stated in many places my own personal concerns with the My Magic Plus and it's accompaniment. That hardly makes me "closed minded". In fact, I have also stated on many threads that I am going into my upcoming vacation with an open mind and a closed mouth.
As far as the 1% crowd comment, I have observed that the really invested Disney fan is just that. They have put a lot of themselves in their love for Disney. Speaking for myself, I can say this is true emotionally and financially. Being close to Disneyland and visiting it often for all my years, I know when the "good" and the "bad" times are. As such, I have seen WDW head into and get stuck in the mire of "bad" for the last 10 years. So, any of the "doom and gloom" characterized comments that I have made are tempered with an understanding of how things should be.
Finally, many moons ago when the new MDE app was released to the public, I downloaded it prior to a visit to Walt Disney World. To me it seemed like the map features, the accurate wait times, and the restaurants reservation system would be uber helpful. When I was touring there, I was asked to participate in a survey based on the fact that I had already downloaded this new app. I was pulled into the area of the Tomorrowland Terrace and sat down with a survey administrator. They asked me to keep the context of their questions under my hat and not talk about anything they asked me.
All of the questions I was asked were about a ride reservation system. I answered every question positively. When asked about park hopping and a ride reservation system, I answered that would be must for me. Consider the fact that this was an interview type survey. I was pre-interviewed before I sat down with the "ultimate survey master". It took the better part of 45 minutes. They offered me a Gift Card for taking the time away from my vacation. They did take this very seriously. The problem is, they clearly didn't ask the right questions.
Anyway, I don't like having to pre-plan so far in advance. I don't like the limitation placed on FP+. I am not convinced that they "tested" this using "real world" scenarios for guests. I know they didn't ask the right questions before pursuing this venture. I will, however, wait and see it for myself shortly.
*1023*
Lexxweb
Active Member
Way to take what I'm saying out of context. I'm not saying stop praising Universal..period. Which is what you're trying to make it out to be. You'd make a fantastic journalist.
I'm saying stop praising them for what they're doing right now. It's foolish. It's like praising a student for doing their make-up work after missing school for a week.
I'm not saying YOU think Disney is going to die out due to Universal's new additions, I'm responding to this site in general. Lots of people are going overboard on this subject which is why there's a 20+ page thread on this subject.
I'm just trying to get everyone to stop acting like one is better than the other. It's obnoxious. I'm sounding more pro-Disney right now because I feel like they need the defense, but I'm not pro or anti either company. They're both fantastic, I just don't see why everyone is against what Disney is doing right now.
If you don't like MyMagic+, My Disney Experience App and Magic Bands...don't use it? It's simple, at least I think so.
You don't like where the company is spending their money? Tough. You still have four fun parks, go have a good time. Enjoy what they've created. I think Future World at EPCOT needs a refurb, but why focus on that? It's not my job. I'll enjoy what you give me and try to understand it and run with it then get frustrated over an executives decision.
Lexxweb
Active Member
...no. I'm saying there's A LOT to do at WDW. You misread my post. There's A LOT for the wrist bands to do at WDW, but not at SeaWorld.
SeaWorld is a one-day park. Nobody is visiting their resort for multiple days and staying at an on-site hotel and traveling in large groups for multiple days, yadda yadda. Not to mention SeaWorld isn't the type of place where people go crazy for skipping lines. It doesn't have a hot Fastpass/Express demand like Disney/Universal.
It's a system that makes sense for something large and complex like Disney. SeaWorld operates very simply by just going in, seeing what you want to see and leaving. At most there's only two attractions you'd like to skip a line for. Granted, there's really only two attractions that get any type of a line.
It's not necessary for SeaWorld.
Captain Chaos
Well-Known Member
What you actually say and what you actually mean are two different things... So, again, you want people to stop praising Universal (YOUR ACTUAL WORDS) for adding things to grow their business and give guests to their theme parks something new and exciting... That is what YOU said... No mincing of your words... Not taking anything out of context... You clearly stated we should stop praising Universal for adding new hotels and more attractions... I want to make sure we understand your wishy washy view... Should we praise Universal for growing and expanding their business or not? You said we shouldn't then said we should... Well, which is it? Can't have it both ways..
What Universal is doing now is GROWING their business... Something previous management failed to do... You are trying to make an argument and sounding silly... If Universal stood pat and did nothing, we should praise that? If Universal did not get the Potter rights and opened Wizarding World, and made tons of cash, and died out in 5 years, would that be worthy of praise? We praise them now for what they are doing now...
I know, we'll should praising E ticket bathrooms, DVC carts, hotel rooms, meet and gropes and no attractions at Disney...
ToTBellHop
Well-Known Member
Am I the only one who can't stomach reading posts with more than one paragraph? My eyes glaze over. Good thing that doesn't happen when I'm reading my students' papers...
Lexxweb
Active Member
Maybe praise isn't the right word? I think we can be excited and happy for them but putting them on a pedestal is giving too much credit. That's what I'm trying to say.
You also can't cut me off at "Stop praising Universal" because there's a lot more I'm trying to say after that and I feel like you're trying to avoid my point by making me look stupid, which is wrong.
It's an exciting time for Universal but I don't think we should give them so much credit, a lot of what they're doing is selling out. Horror Nights is mainly all properties Universal doesn't own, the event is a shell of what it once was. It's same scarezones new name, same houses new name. There's no creativity.
Transformers wasn't unique to USF, although I did enjoy it, it's also a non-Universal property. As is Harry Potter. Universal seems to try and create things they can advertise and pull people in by the masses by any means necessary, but none of it is really original. Sure it takes creativity to pull off something that looks pretty like Potter but it was something they had to get the rights to. I miss the days of Kong, JAWS, Quake, Future. All really original concepts for a theme park that even Disney couldn't compete with because they didn't have anything like it.
I'm not saying I want those older attractions still around I just wish Universal tackled all new attractions with the same innovative ideas as when they first started and bonus points if Universal Studios actually showcased Universal Studios.
I refuse to put them on a pedestal because they finally have money to spend and they're spending it on other properties. They're becoming a showcase for other people's great ideas. They should just drop the Universal name at this point and rebrand entirely since it's not Universal's Studio.
I'm glad they're finally adding stuff I just wish it wasn't the stuff they're adding. I'm torn. I refuse to put them on a pedestal because in my eyes they don't care about the guests, they're just doing what they have to do to play catch up on Disney.
Again, I'm torn. Part of me is excited to see new stuff and if it interests you, you should be excited, too. I just can't look at them in such a high-light anymore because what they're doing isn't genuine. It doesn't show compassion.
Here's where we have a disagreement because you'll say the same thing about MyMagic+ -- about how it's all a corporate scheme yadda yadda. It might be true, but at least Disney created it. At least someone tried, regardless of motive. Speaking as someone who has played with the Magic Bands and with the App I like it for myself. So I see it as, Disney created something that works for me and Disney created it. That makes me happy. I feel like Disney cared even if they really didn't. Universal I know doesn't and I can't look at them the same way I once did. So I won't PRAISE them or put them on a pedestal like everyone else around here, even though, quite contradictory, I'll be there on opening day for one of their new attractions. More than likely it's because there's apart of me hoping to be wrong.
You seem like a very educated person and I mean that will all sincerity, I think we have two different viewpoints and I don't think either of us will see each others side. I respect your opinion, but I'm not going to continue in a conversation that's ultimately useless. It's the internet. Let's move on.
Thanks for your input, have a great day-
BryceM
Well-Known Member
Oh, okay. I was just wondering if you were also referring to IOA as well, but clearly you weren't. Sorry!
ford91exploder
Resident Curmudgeon
'Better Managed' meet and greet if that is not a corporate term well...,
I have NO FAITH in Disney's IT systems and based on personal experience when LILO was rolled out with no testing half of a 10 Day DVC trip vanished and since it was the Christmas season there was no inventory because LILO sold the second half of my trip twice (it was over a weekend and apparently the geniuses designing the system could not deal with a trip which spanned two weeks) and no it was not a split stay
I had the reservation in hand but manager of resort could do nothing for me, He could not even comp points because system barfed when he tried it. All the CM's involved their best but TWDC corporate did everything possible to frustrate the possibility of satisfying this PAYING customer, Manager was able to add a couple days for us but that was all he could do. Fortunately flying with Southwest so I was not faced with a few hundred dollars in change fees.
Based on my PERSONAL experience with Disney's incompetence with core IT systems like hotel reservations which are well understood and widely deployed, Why should a DVC member with hundreds of points be thrilled with Disney blowing 1+Billion on a new all singing all dancing IT system when they cannot even get well understood systems done correctly.
Disney has to SHOW ME that it works because in the past Disney's IT 'investments' have had a net negative effect on my Disney experience.
And while Disney builds 'Themed Bathrooms' and blathers on about Avatar which is now 2 years from it's announcement date, Disney's competition is FINISHING their HPL v2.0 which was announced about the same time.
Disney right now is as they say in Texas, ALL HAT AND NO CATTLE. And no I don't visit UNI because thrill rides are not my thing I get enough adrenaline in my day job.
Bottom line: Disney now has even greater competition in Orlando. Not exactly new news. What we are seeing right now is the Harry Potter effect. Rowling's demands were considered unreasonable, so Disney walked away. That was a sad day, but perhaps inevitable. Disney will not let the tail of Rowling wag the dog of Disney. Maybe they should have; maybe not. But now, years later, we're seeing Disney type guests spending a day or two at Universal, which without Harry Potter, they never would have.
The NFL season just started, so let's analogize: Harry Potter is like a pro bowl quarterback. IF you don't have that great QB, there's not much you can do other than tout your other players, the coaching, etc . . . Landing Harry Potter would have been like drafting a perennial pro bowl quarterback. Disney didn't go along with that, so they're touting their current offerings, their history, etc . . ., just like a team with a mediocre new QB touts their coaches, their defense, and their running game. But it's not as if Disney is glorifying the new spigot on the Gatorade container.
Disney has great stuff, but HP is hard to match in many ways as far as new buzz is concerned. Disney's new stuff is very good, but HP is the big new thing of the last decade. Will Disney create some great new buzz of its own? I sure hope so. Will marvel super heroes invade the parks? I sure hope so. Will they ever match HP as far as buzz and excitement are concerned? Some day, but right now, the new buzz is primarily HP. That will fade eventually, but Disney cannot be lame in it's attempts to fight back.
So here's the question as I see it: Is Disney extolling the virtues of their Gatorade spigots while the competition's star quarterback is throwing touchdown passes, or are they strengthening the organization in order to ink a star quarterback for next year?
The NFL season just started, so let's analogize: Harry Potter is like a pro bowl quarterback. IF you don't have that great QB, there's not much you can do other than tout your other players, the coaching, etc . . . Landing Harry Potter would have been like drafting a perennial pro bowl quarterback. Disney didn't go along with that, so they're touting their current offerings, their history, etc . . ., just like a team with a mediocre new QB touts their coaches, their defense, and their running game. But it's not as if Disney is glorifying the new spigot on the Gatorade container.
Disney has great stuff, but HP is hard to match in many ways as far as new buzz is concerned. Disney's new stuff is very good, but HP is the big new thing of the last decade. Will Disney create some great new buzz of its own? I sure hope so. Will marvel super heroes invade the parks? I sure hope so. Will they ever match HP as far as buzz and excitement are concerned? Some day, but right now, the new buzz is primarily HP. That will fade eventually, but Disney cannot be lame in it's attempts to fight back.
So here's the question as I see it: Is Disney extolling the virtues of their Gatorade spigots while the competition's star quarterback is throwing touchdown passes, or are they strengthening the organization in order to ink a star quarterback for next year?
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yeti
Well-Known Member
Pretty sure there's enough evidence to go around that the substitute for point of sale will be a POS.
willtravel
Well-Known Member
I don't think WDW is going to do anything. They would have done it by now. OH I forgot they bought back stocks and did counter with FLE and My Magic +. That cannot compete with HP. I don't know even if SW expansion can compete with HP. Unless WDW really opens up the wallet and does it right. I think if Marvel super heros was going to be the answer that too would have been started. And Avatar, I also really doubt now.
I was just at the grocery and talking to a couple about WDW who has not been to WDW for awhile. They said they wanted to go to UNI to see HP......I think it's two differrnt kind of parks catering to different age groups and tastes.
Unfortunately my favorite park Epcot is going to hell. I can stomach HS and AK as is but Epcot...........
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WondersOfLife
Blink, blink. Breathe, breathe. Day in, day out.
I am a theme park fan. But I am also a Disney fan at heart.
But I must say I'm impressed at what Universal's doing recently. I tip my hat to them.
I'm sorry but I don't see how the Fantasyland expansion gained some of their visitors back compared to Harry & Transformers. But (sadly) Avatar will most likely fix that problem.
I enjoy the upgrades Disney makes with classic attractions more than Universal adding new attractions though. But that's not the same for audiences outside the forums. Or at least with the people that I live around. They want to see new things, not the same things twice. Unless it's a thrill ride.
I don't even know where I'm going with this post. So I'm leaving with just a compliment for Universal. Peacies :3
But I must say I'm impressed at what Universal's doing recently. I tip my hat to them.
I'm sorry but I don't see how the Fantasyland expansion gained some of their visitors back compared to Harry & Transformers. But (sadly) Avatar will most likely fix that problem.
I enjoy the upgrades Disney makes with classic attractions more than Universal adding new attractions though. But that's not the same for audiences outside the forums. Or at least with the people that I live around. They want to see new things, not the same things twice. Unless it's a thrill ride.
I don't even know where I'm going with this post. So I'm leaving with just a compliment for Universal. Peacies :3