News D23 Expo 2022

[Vegas Disney Fan]

But why would they want to stagnate at current capacity levels?

Think of it this way. You run a pizza shop and are at max capacity every night, 100 people.

Your biggest competitor announces a new location near yours. Any business owner would not be content saying "Oh well, we're full every night.". Instead their likely first though is to expand. Take it to 150 capacity.

That's exactly what Disney signaled they are doing with these expansions. MK is a money making machine for merchandise and food. And they figured out the formula. Right now it's at equilibrium, but if they add capacity and keep crowd levels the same, they are making more money. 30k guests spread over 25 acres versus 40k guests spread over 35 acres.

More attractions and space = more capacity at equilibrium for max profit per guest.

I generally agree but space is the limiting factor, if Main Street and the entrance can’t safely accommodate more people during the parades and at park close it doesn’t matter how many rides they add at the back of the park.

They’ve expanded the hub, added Main Street bypasses, added a second Ferry dock, added more bus stops… I think MK has simply reached safe capacity.

Epcot, AK, and HS are a different story, lots of capacity to expand still.

 

[Animator_Alex]

...and Galaxy's Edge. Wasn't Galaxy's Edge called the Potter Swatter? I was at IOA this weekend and Hagrid's coaster had a line of 150 minutes at one point and we are supposed to be in the off-season now.

Disney still hasn't successfully made a Potter killer yet. All the HP rides at Universal are leagues ahead of Disney. Hence why Hagrid has insane lines still.

 

[MisterPenguin]

What do you guys think is going to be announced in 2024? Can't wait.

It's never too early to begin speculating about these things.

I'm guessing they'll be announcing when TRON will open.

 

[EricsBiscuit]

This is for all the people who don't latch onto the whispers of an echo chamber as truth, and who aren't ready to believe the worst out of aggrieved schadenfreude, and who question sources and want facts:

Epic Universe is not a threat to WDW

Yeah, there are people who *believe* it. But there are people who *believe* the earth is flat. And repeating a belief over and over again is not the same as reality.

Don't get me wrong. I think EU will be great (hopefully, we don't want another F&F). It will be great for Universal, and it will be great for Disney.

But it doesn't have the ability to make a dent in WDW overall attendance, and most importantly for Disney execs: It won't make a significant dent in its profits. And the dent will be smoothed out in just a few years. WDW will still make billions of dollars each year.

EU is a park with 11 rides. You know what WDW fans call WDW parks with that many rides? "A half-day park." Will it give Universal guests an extra day in their parks and hotels? Yes... A day.

"But it will take away a day from WDW!!" Sure. Or, it will take away a day from Islands of Adventure or Universal Studios or SeaWorld.

Disney has been raising prices to reduce attendance to avoid overcrowding. It didn't work. They still haven't found the tipping point that will drive away guests. And so, the Park Reservation System established during pandemic distancing protocols is staying around. And how do I know this? Because two CEOs have said as much during quarterly business calls, during which, misleading their investors can result in huge fines and/or jail. But you know, the *believers* still believe they lie.

The *believers* say that Disney execs are "shaking in their boots!" Oh, really. And they know that... how? They don't. They have no inside contacts to the C Suite. Someone *presumes* they surely must be shaking in their boots and the echo chamber takes that as the gospel truth and repeats it over and over again... without any evidence.

In fact, our insiders here tell us Disney isn't worried. But the believers scoff at that because... because of what? They have no inside information to counter with. They're just presuming they're right because the echo chamber keeps saying it.

I know this little rant won't change the minds of the believers. But for all you rational folk out there, keep in mind that they don't have the facts to back them up.

People keep saying EU is not a threat but when your biggest competitor is spending billions of dollars on new expansions with no sign of slowing down (actually more like doubling down) that is a threat. When your organization is stagnating, as Disney is, it takes much less than you think to completely flip the table. Universal is quickly catching up and if Disney continues to show no signs of life then they stand to lose significant market share. There is such a thing as opportunity cost. It doesn’t matter if they still technically are growing if their market share is decreasing. It means they’re leaving money on the table! That’s not maximizing value for shareholders and it sure as hell isn’t maximizing value for guests.

 

[GimpYancIent]

People keep saying EU is not a threat but when your biggest competitor is spending billions of dollars on new expansions with no sign of slowing down (actually more like doubling down) that is a threat. When your organization is stagnating, as Disney is, it takes much less than you think to completely flip the table. Universal is quickly catching up and if Disney continues to show no signs of life then they stand to lose significant market share. There is such a thing as opportunity cost. It doesn’t matter if they still technically are growing if their market share is decreasing. It means they’re leaving money on the table! That’s not maximizing value for shareholders and it sure as hell isn’t maximizing value for guests.

The more folks emphasize, particularly in capital letters, that Epic Universe is not a threat. The more people attempt to downplay it. Wellllll simply put. All that these folks are doing is reenforcing the fact Epic Universe is a threat.

 

[MisterPenguin]

People keep saying EU is not a threat but when your biggest competitor is spending billions of dollars on new expansions with no sign of slowing down (actually more like doubling down) that is a threat. When your organization is stagnating, as Disney is, it takes much less than you think to completely flip the table. Universal is quickly catching up and if Disney continues to show no signs of life then they stand to lose significant market share. There is such a thing as opportunity cost. It doesn’t matter if they still technically are growing if their market share is decreasing. It means they’re leaving money on the table! That’s not maximizing value for shareholders and it sure as hell isn’t maximizing value for guests.

Completely flipping things and leaving money on the table are two completely things.

Disney is also spending billions of dollars investing in the parks. It's spread out so it doesn't look as impactful.

I'm not saying WDW is always spending the money wisely and in 'the right way' for a theme park, but it's kinda hard to ignore the major additions to all the parks (save DAK for some inexplicable reason).

 

[AEfx]

Completely flipping things and leaving money on the table are two completely things.

Disney is also spending billions of dollars investing in the parks. It's spread out so it doesn't look as impactful.

I'm not saying WDW is always spending the money wisely and in 'the right way' for a theme park, but it's kinda hard to ignore the major additions to all the parks (save DAK for some inexplicable reason).

I'm getting the funniest sense of deja vu - I remember when folks were all "Universal will always be the third-class citizen on the edge of town...Harry Potter isn't going to do anything for them" ROFL.

My, how things have changed in ten years. And, as we see from people refusing to see the inevitable - some things don't change, either LOL.

 

[Gringrinngghost]

What was missing from the Disney D23 Expo Boundless Future presentation​

What was missing from the Disney D23 Expo Boundless Future presentation

A look back at D23 Expo and what didn't make the cut for this year's Disney Parks presentation.

www.wdwmagic.com

They did in the roadmap confirm Fantastic by the end of the year.

 

[Jrb1979]

Completely flipping things and leaving money on the table are two completely things.

Disney is also spending billions of dollars investing in the parks. It's spread out so it doesn't look as impactful.

I'm not saying WDW is always spending the money wisely and in 'the right way' for a theme park, but it's kinda hard to ignore the major additions to all the parks (save DAK for some inexplicable reason).

The thing is after Tron and Tiana what major additions are coming? It's nothing anytime soon. They have a major capacity issue in the parks.

 

[MisterPenguin]

I'm getting the funniest sense of deja vu - I remember when folks were all "Universal will always be the third-class citizen on the edge of town...Harry Potter isn't going to do anything for them" ROFL.

My, how things have changed in ten years. And, as we see from people refusing to see the inevitable - some things don't change, either LOL.

Despite the existence of two HP lands, WDW is posting record profits and has to limit attendance with a Park Reservation System.

Uni got a larger slice of the pie, but the pie got a heck of a lot bigger. It's hard for WDW to shake in the their boots when the pile of gold props them up.

The real questions is: if there were to be a real, deep, painful recession, who'd keep the most customers when the pie shrinks?

 

[MisterPenguin]

The thing is after Tron and Tiana what major additions are coming? It's nothing anytime soon. They have a major capacity issue in the parks.

WDW has, to use Chapek's term, levers to pull: discounts, dining plans, removal of black out dates, increasing inventory of APs, etc...

Not to mention, with the use of a reservation system, they know exactly how much to cut back staff to reduce labor costs. It's all about the yield per person.

Also, what's Uni doing that will have opening in the next 3 years such that EU won't steal from a 'stagnating' IoA and USO?

Any, I wish EU luck. If they significantly impact WDWs attendance, then that means a less crowded park for me.

 

[DisneyDodo]

EU is a park with 11 rides. You know what WDW fans call WDW parks with that many rides? "A half-day park."

I agree with the larger point that EU is not a threat to Disney, but not with this comparison of EU to Disney’s half-day parks.

- EU’s projected 11 rides on opening day is more than DHS or DAK have ever had in their 24+ years of existence
- EU will have 11 brand new rides. Epcot, DHS, and DAK have lineups featuring a mixture of new rides and older ones in need of TLC
- EU is being built with expansion pads that Uni has concrete plans to fill in the near future. The Disney parks have expansion pads too, but Disney has shown that they can’t be counted on to fill them in a timely manner and that they just as frequently shutter existing attractions

 

[GimpYancIent]

WDW has, to use Chapek's term, levers to pull: discounts, dining plans, removal of black out dates, increasing inventory of APs, etc...

Not to mention, with the use of a reservation system, they know exactly how much to cut back staff to reduce labor costs. It's all about the yield per person.

Also, what's Uni doing that will have opening in the next 3 years such that EU won't steal from a 'stagnating' IoA and USO?

Any, I wish EU luck. If they significantly impact WDWs attendance, then that means a less crowded park for me.

Rest assured that Bob and friends are working diligently, at this very moment, to ensure UNI's success.

 

[Jrb1979]

WDW has, to use Chapek's term, levers to pull: discounts, dining plans, removal of black out dates, increasing inventory of APs, etc...

Not to mention, with the use of a reservation system, they know exactly how much to cut back staff to reduce labor costs. It's all about the yield per person.

Also, what's Uni doing that will have opening in the next 3 years such that EU won't steal from a 'stagnating' IoA and USO?

Any, I wish EU luck. If they significantly impact WDWs attendance, then that means a less crowded park for me.

That to me is a terrible way to run the parks. I don't think EU is going to take away attendance from the other Universal parks. I see it making Universal a multi day vacation more than it is now.

 

[J4546]

2023 is gonna be a good year for disneyparks imo. The timeline shows Tron, New ToonTown with MMRR, HK FrozenLand, and Tokyo FantasySprings all opening up in 2023 so thats 4 major additions opening up at 4 different parks at different parts of the world. Also I dont see ZootopiaLand on the graphic but that will prob open next year as well, so 5 major additions plus a few more smaller things like JoW, hatbox ghost, some meet n greets, shows.... Also the massive disney village expansion/renovation starts in 2023 and that will be a major plussing of that area....all in all not a bad 2023 on the horizon imo.

 

[scottb411]

I think the bigger point here is that what has historically separated Disney from Universal is the nostalgia of the brand and that their leadership cared about something more than the almighty dollar, or at least pretended to care pretty well. The D+ day Simpsons shorts and Rescue Rangers satire of Peter Pan and Flounder is all you need to know about how this current leadership views the work that animators created for the company over the years. Meanwhile, kids today may watch a 90's Disney movie a single time between Tik Tok's and Youtube. Disney is reaping the rewards of the 90's kids that grew up on Little Mermaid and Aladdin but there could be a day of reckoning 20-30 years from now with the current leadership in place.

 

[GimpYancIent]

2023 is gonna be a good year for disneyparks imo. The timeline shows Tron, New ToonTown with MMRR, HK FrozenLand, and Tokyo FantasySprings all opening up in 2023 so thats 4 major additions opening up at 4 different parks at different parts of the world. Also I dont see ZootopiaLand on the graphic but that will prob open next year as well, so 5 major additions plus a few more smaller things like JoW, hatbox ghost, some meet n greets, shows.... Also the massive disney village expansion/renovation starts in 2023 and that will be a major plussing of that area....all in all not a bad 2023 on the horizon imo.

If and when the laundry list of attractions etc. become operational. Construction walls, advertisements, colorful art renderings, teasers and graphics are not reasons to go to the parks. When there are actual attractions to see and ride then there will be real interest.

 

["El Gran Magnifico"]

That to me is a terrible way to run the parks. I don't think EU is going to take away attendance from the other Universal parks. I see it making Universal a multi day vacation more than it is now.

Already is. I just stayed for 5 nights. The beauty for me is it’s all at my own pace.

I got the AP where express kicks in at 4. So mornings at the pool, hanging around the resort, resort hopping, Citi Walk etc.

Into a park at around 1. Things like Bourn, Poseidon, maybe a Hagrids or Veloci line. A decent lunch. Then:

Ride, Ride, Ride, Ride, Hogwarts, Ride, Ride, Ride, Ride, Ride. Dinner.

 

[Joel]

This is for all the people who don't latch onto the whispers of an echo chamber as truth, and who aren't ready to believe the worst out of aggrieved schadenfreude, and who question sources and want facts:

Epic Universe is not a threat to WDW

Yeah, there are people who *believe* it. But there are people who *believe* the earth is flat. And repeating a belief over and over again is not the same as reality.

Don't get me wrong. I think EU will be great (hopefully, we don't want another F&F). It will be great for Universal, and it will be great for Disney.

But it doesn't have the ability to make a dent in WDW overall attendance, and most importantly for Disney execs: It won't make a significant dent in its profits. And the dent will be smoothed out in just a few years. WDW will still make billions of dollars each year.

EU is a park with 11 rides. You know what WDW fans call WDW parks with that many rides? "A half-day park." Will it give Universal guests an extra day in their parks and hotels? Yes... A day.

"But it will take away a day from WDW!!" Sure. Or, it will take away a day from Islands of Adventure or Universal Studios or SeaWorld.

Disney has been raising prices to reduce attendance to avoid overcrowding. It didn't work. They still haven't found the tipping point that will drive away guests. And so, the Park Reservation System established during pandemic distancing protocols is staying around. And how do I know this? Because two CEOs have said as much during quarterly business calls, during which, misleading their investors can result in huge fines and/or jail. But you know, the *believers* still believe they lie.

The *believers* say that Disney execs are "shaking in their boots!" Oh, really. And they know that... how? They don't. They have no inside contacts to the C Suite. Someone *presumes* they surely must be shaking in their boots and the echo chamber takes that as the gospel truth and repeats it over and over again... without any evidence.

In fact, our insiders here tell us Disney isn't worried. But the believers scoff at that because... because of what? They have no inside information to counter with. They're just presuming they're right because the echo chamber keeps saying it.

I know this little rant won't change the minds of the believers. But for all you rational folk out there, keep in mind that they don't have the facts to back them up.

Sorry, I don't necessarily disagree, but this is all I could think of while reading this:

 

[EricsBiscuit]

Completely flipping things and leaving money on the table are two completely things.

Disney is also spending billions of dollars investing in the parks. It's spread out so it doesn't look as impactful.

I'm not saying WDW is always spending the money wisely and in 'the right way' for a theme park, but it's kinda hard to ignore the major additions to all the parks (save DAK for some inexplicable reason).

When your bureaucracy is so bloated that one simple e ticket costs half a billion dollars meanwhile your competitor is building a whole new park chalk full of e tickets, shops, restaurants, hotels, etc for “only” a couple billion and in less time, there is a problem. Disney will find themselves unable to keep up if they don’t totally reshape their organization.