Crowds are down? Curious about the claims . . .

[21stamps]

Normally, yes, that is true.

I think that the reduction in crowds will lead to further cuts, myself, as the execs will how to show, now, that they're dealing with fewer people and, thus, can make the cuts so it looks good on the bottom line. I have a hard time believing that anyone in charge will say, "We've cut all we can from back when the place was packed."

I think there's only a short window for this, once other economies start bouncing back then the crowds will rise again. The pricing may help eliminate some.

 

[SorcererMC]

Lower crowds are great for visitors, less so for people who might be concerned about the local economy and cuts/layoffs.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Lower crowds are great for visitors, less so for people who might be concerned about the local economy and cuts/layoffs.

The question is, are the crowd reductions small enough to be offset by the enormous price increases? If not, we may be upset at the long-term implications. We will know more in October.

 

[gmajew]

Did both companies not raise there single day park tickets? Is this just not what has continued to happen to both Universal and Orlando for the past few years..... I am guessing that the shortfall in attendance is locals and the foreign groups more then anything...

My trip two weeks ago I did not see the normal level of High school kids running around at Universal or WDW.... Was the biggest thing we noticed while on the properties... In years past Friday and Saturday night for sure was filled with these kids in big groups running around....

I also know my sons soccer team cancelled a trip to WDW this year for a tournament at Wide World of Sports because travel cost were to much for the entire team to eat. To many of the team members parents are working min hours and barely a float this year with the cuts in hours at there jobs.

 

[SorcererMC]

The question is, are the crowd reductions small enough to be offset by the enormous price increases? If not, we may be upset at the long-term implications. We will know more in October.

I would be surprised if it was the case that the higher price increases will adequately compensate for lower crowds, b/c literally all of their main consumer segments are being hit, a perfect storm. Re: higher pricing strategy/tiered pricing, I think that TWDC implemented it to serve at least two goals - spread out crowds from MK to the other parks, while maintaining or increasing the higher income bracket intl tourists (which they knew was softening as of 2Q2016 earnings call). If higher pricing has decreased the avg middle class US tourist levels, they will just offer more discounts to draw them back.

Edit: next earnings call is Aug 2.

 

[Disney.Mike]

I hope this is blowback on the overbearing harrasment...I mean security policies they have put in place...

One can dream

 

[donsullivan]

.........
Edit: next earnings call is Aug 2.

July 4th weekend numbers would not likely be included in that financial report/call since I believe the fiscal quarter ended on Friday 7/1. It would not surprise me if most if not all dialog about parks & resorts focuses on the Shanghai Opening and what impact that had on current quarter earnings as well as the forecast on it's impact for the future.

 

[deeevo]

I just think it is a perfect storm. Increased pricing on not just tickets but food, merchandise, parking and special events has really made it's way into the mainstream media along with the cut backs in the parks that has effected the overall WDW experience. Then combine that with the Orlando shooting and the stupid alligator it is a perfect storm. I don't think Disney exes are panicking but I do want them to worry because they need to realize that just like in pro sports. If you put a crappy team on the field and expect the fans to show up and pay $200 a ticket and buy $10 beers you will fail as an organization.

 

[Sonconato]

So how was the crowd at Animal Kingdom during the 4th of July last night. I know AK is the only park that doesn't use fireworks but did they do something special for the Jungle Book show?

I posted a couple of photos from Harambe Village which was from July 4th around 7 pm and the crowds were very low as you can see (go back to page 9). We went to the 6:00 Festival of the Lion King and it was only 50% filled. We had zero wait time for Kilimanjaro Safaris because there was no line. We didn't stay long enough to watch the Jungle Book show so I can't comment on that. I'm sure it would have been awesome to see since there were so few people. When we arrived at the park, it was around 5:00 pm and they only parked a couple of additional rows behind us from that point. Only about 60-65% of the parking was ever used, including CM parking. When we left around 3 hours later, at least half of the cars were gone. So to answer your question, I don't know if there was anything special done for the 4th but with the crowds this low, there is nothing that would be a negative. That is something to celebrate in of itself!

 

[71jason]

MK didn't even get close to capacity yesterday.

Had Starbucks with a front line manager this morning--first time in 15 years no single park went to any phased closing on July 4.

Facebook reports of gaps of viewing space around lagoon at EPCOT last night.

 

[rob0519]

I just think it is a perfect storm. Increased pricing on not just tickets but food, merchandise, parking and special events has really made it's way into the mainstream media along with the cut backs in the parks that has effected the overall WDW experience. Then combine that with the Orlando shooting and the stupid alligator it is a perfect storm. I don't think Disney exes are panicking but I do want them to worry because they need to realize that just like in pro sports. If you put a crappy team on the field and expect the fans to show up and pay $200 a ticket and buy $10 beers you will fail as an organization.

Disney is not like most sports franchises. Disney has a cult like following, just like say the Chicago Cubs. The Cubs put horrible teams on the field for decades since the 70s and still drew two to three million plus fans. Disney however is a several thousand dollar expense to a family as opposed to several hundred for a single ball game. With all the external pressures on attendance I would think the Management Team is preparing some sort of response if attendance continues to remain lower than anticipated.

 

[21stamps]

I think people are severely underestimating what is going on in the rest of the world. If you look outside of WDW foreign tourism is down in all of Florida.

I hope this is blowback on the overbearing harrasment...I mean security policies they have put in place...

One can dream

All amusement parks have extra security this year. We went to our local one opening day in April- no security. A month later and ever since- screening stations set up all around the exterior. Searched and wands before getting near the turnstiles.

Did both companies not raise there single day park tickets? Is this just not what has continued to happen to both Universal and Orlando for the past few years..... I am guessing that the shortfall in attendance is locals and the foreign groups more then anything...

My trip two weeks ago I did not see the normal level of High school kids running around at Universal or WDW.... Was the biggest thing we noticed while on the properties... In years past Friday and Saturday night for sure was filled with these kids in big groups running around....

I also know my sons soccer team cancelled a trip to WDW this year for a tournament at Wide World of Sports because travel cost were to much for the entire team to eat. To many of the team members parents are working min hours and barely a float this year with the cuts in hours at there jobs.

Yes they both did. I still don't think that the price hikes are the majority of lack of attendance people are speaking of. Some, sure. The price raises hopefully do lower crowds a bit, but I think it's the international guests who are the majority not attending.

 

[21stamps]

Disney is not like most sports franchises. Disney has a cult like following, just like say the Chicago Cubs. The Cubs put horrible teams on the field for decades since the 70s and still drew two to three million plus fans. Disney however is a several thousand dollar expense to a family as opposed to several hundred for a single ball game. With all the external pressures on attendance I would think the Management Team is preparing some sort of response if attendance continues to remain lower than anticipated.

I would like a response of a nice discount my week!lol. But that week it looks like most rooms are sold out, so I highly doubt I'll be so lucky.

 

[JassiSidhu2000]

Looking at wait times for the 5th July - crowds are down massively.

What's happening at Disney ? This has to be the worst holiday for them in a long time.

 

[SorcererMC]

With all the external pressures on attendance I would think the Management Team is preparing some sort of response if attendance continues to remain lower than anticipated.

More room discounts and upcharge events? More cupcakes? Ok, I'm being sarcastic here, but I think that their options are going to be somewhat limited in terms of how they can counteract what is happening (and livestreams probably won't cut it).

I'm actually very curious to see how they respond. I think if they don't address some of these issues in a more public fashion (anathema, I know), it could be to their detriment. I'm also wondering how much of Disney's loss will be Universal's gain.

 

[rob0519]

I would like a response of a nice discount my week!lol. But that week it looks like most rooms are sold out, so I highly doubt I'll be so lucky.

I would like to see some discounts for September or October, but I'm not optimistic. I don't think the financials are bad enough for discounting lodging, yet.

 

[deeevo]

Disney is not like most sports franchises. Disney has a cult like following, just like say the Chicago Cubs. The Cubs put horrible teams on the field for decades since the 70s and still drew two to three million plus fans. Disney however is a several thousand dollar expense to a family as opposed to several hundred for a single ball game. With all the external pressures on attendance I would think the Management Team is preparing some sort of response if attendance continues to remain lower than anticipated.

Good analogy using the Cubs as they do have a cult following but people invest a heck of a lot more money in there favorite sports teams than even most crazed Disney fans. A family may drop 3K a year on a trip to Disney but few do that every year over and over. Season ticket packages are the bread and butter of any franchise and I know many people that drop 5K on season tickets year after year.

 

[21stamps]

More room discounts and upcharge events? More cupcakes? Ok, I'm being sarcastic here, but I think that their options are going to be somewhat limited in terms of how they can counteract what is happening (and livestreams probably won't cut it).

I'm actually very curious to see how they respond. I think if they don't address some of these issues in a more public fashion (anathema, I know), it could be to their detriment. I'm also wondering how much of Disney's loss will be Universal's gain.

I just decided to add a Universal/IoA day to our trip. Looked at a few different options, and 2 nights there didn't come out to that much less than Disney. I ended up deciding to just do one day and not stay at a resort, so now it's more than 3x the price of one more day at WDW.

 

[21stamps]

Good analogy using the Cubs as they do have a cult following but people invest a heck of a lot more money in there favorite sports teams than even most crazed Disney fans. A family may drop 3K a year on a trip to Disney but few do that every year over and over. Season ticket packages are the bread and butter of any franchise and I know many people that drop 5K on season tickets year after year.

I would love to know actual stats on this. I would think the average Disney vacay is $5k to people going for a week annually.
I don't have facts to base that on, outside of mine and other's experience.

 

[21stamps]

I would like to see some discounts for September or October, but I'm not optimistic. I don't think the financials are bad enough for discounting lodging, yet.

That and like I said, it doesn't seem to be having an impact on the resorts. I couldn't go in June bc the one I wanted was sold out the 2 different weeks I could make it. For our December trip I booked in March and I think it basically sold out within a week of me booking.